[apple-crop-2] The inventor of the "Darwin" thinning machine passed away

[Vincent Philion]

I imagine some of you knew Hermann Gessler from Friedrichshafen. He is best 
known for Darwin, but his garage was full of great inventions. I was very sad 
this evening to learn that he passed away in a ULO apple storage incident

Vincent Philion



De: Peter Triloff 
mailto:peter.tril...@lindavino.de>>
Objet: Rép : Easter is not resurrection this year. Will we meet again soon?
Date: 6 avril 2021 à 19:16:28 HAE
À: Vincent Philion 
mailto:vincent.phil...@irda.qc.ca>>


Hi Vincent,

… There are also some bad news because Hermann Gessler, the inventor of « 
Elise" and "Darwin" passed away 10 days ago; he suffocated while taking a fruit 
sample through the window of an ULO store. He suffered from a slipped disc and 
the idea is that he probably couldn´t move for a few moments because of some 
pain, breathing the storage atmosphere...

___
apple-crop mailing list
apple-crop@virtualorchard.com
http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop

Re: [apple-crop-2] still viable?

[Vincent Philion]

It would need a major reboot.

Vincent Philion

Le 1 févr. 2021 à 10:30, Harold Schooley  a écrit :


Good question Evan. Been wondering the same thing myself.
Harold Schooley

From: apple-crop-boun...@virtualorchard.com 
[mailto:apple-crop-boun...@virtualorchard.com] On Behalf Of Evan B. Milburn
Sent: February-01-21 7:38 AM
To: apple crop
Subject: [apple-crop-2] still viable?

Is anyone still using apple crop or has every one going else where?  I have not 
seen anything on it for months.
___
apple-crop mailing list
apple-crop@virtualorchard.com
http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop
___
apple-crop mailing list
apple-crop@virtualorchard.com
http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop

Re: [apple-crop-2] What to do when fireblight hits tall spindle

[Vincent Philion]

Seems my previous attempt never reached the listserv:


I entirely agree with Kari (Hi Kari!),

The Terminal bud is the best solution for stopping fire blight. Once growth 
stops, you don’t have to worry about hail or anything else.

So at this point, I would also recommend waiting after harvest. You could 
consider keeping your picking staff an extra few days to clean up the fire 
blight if that’s possible.

When trees are actively growing, different story:

Quick Pruning is extremely useful when the first symptoms appear. We consider 
cleaning shears a hassle. It just slows down operations without measurable 
benefit.

Making sure pruning crews are aware that they CAN spread the disease if they 
are careless is much more useful than sterilizing.




Vincent Philion, agr., M.Sc.
Microbiologiste/Phytopathologiste (pomiculture)

Institut de recherche et de développement en agro-environnement
Research and Development Institute for the Agri-Environment

www.irda.qc.ca<http://www.irda.qc.ca/>

Centre de recherche
335, Rang des Vingt-Cinq Est
Saint-Bruno-de-Montarville (Québec)  J3V 0G7

vincent.phil...@irda.qc.ca<mailto:vincent.phil...@irda.qc.ca>

Bureau: 450 653-7368 poste 350
Cellulaire: 514-623-8275
Skype: VENTURIA
Télécopie: 450 653-1927

Verger expérimental
330, Rang des vingt-cinq Est
Saint-Bruno-de-Montarville (Québec)  J3V 4P6
Téléphone et télécopieur : 450 653-8375
Local pesticide: 450-653-7608

Fiers héritiers du travail des frères Saint-Gabriel: 
http://arboretum8gabrielis.wordpress.com<http://arboretum8gabrielis.wordpress.com/>




___
apple-crop mailing list
apple-crop@virtualorchard.com
http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop

Re: [apple-crop-2] What to do when fireblight hits tall spindle

[Vincent Philion]

I entirely agree with Kari (Hi Kari!),

The Terminal bud is the best solution for stopping fire blight. Once growth 
stops, you don’t have to worry about hail or anything else.

So at this point, I would also recommend waiting after harvest. You could 
consider keeping your picking staff an extra few days to clean up the fire 
blight if that’s possible.

When trees are actively growing, different story:

Quick Pruning is extremely useful when the first symptoms appear. We consider 
cleaning shears a hassle. It just slows down operations without measurable 
benefit.

Making sure pruning crews are aware that they CAN spread the disease if they 
are careless is much more useful than sterilizing.




Vincent Philion, agr., M.Sc.
Microbiologiste/Phytopathologiste (pomiculture)

Institut de recherche et de développement en agro-environnement
Research and Development Institute for the Agri-Environment

www.irda.qc.ca<http://www.irda.qc.ca>

Centre de recherche
335, Rang des Vingt-Cinq Est
Saint-Bruno-de-Montarville (Québec)  J3V 0G7

vincent.phil...@irda.qc.ca<mailto:vincent.phil...@irda.qc.ca>

Bureau: 450 653-7368 poste 350
Cellulaire: 514-623-8275
Skype: VENTURIA
Télécopie: 450 653-1927

Verger expérimental
330, Rang des vingt-cinq Est
Saint-Bruno-de-Montarville (Québec)  J3V 4P6
Téléphone et télécopieur : 450 653-8375
Local pesticide: 450-653-7608

Fiers héritiers du travail des frères Saint-Gabriel: 
http://arboretum8gabrielis.wordpress.com




___
apple-crop mailing list
apple-crop@virtualorchard.com
http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop

[Apple-Crop] Pierre Philion past away...

[Vincent Philion]

Many people in the apple production community knew him:

Pierre Philion, agronomist, died at 77, on Friday, September 1, 2017.

Growing apples was his life. He left us a few days before harvest, like mature 
fruit waiting to be picked. In our family, the apple production cycle dictated 
our lives. This time won’t be any different. We will spend the harvest time 
with him close to our hearts, before a last goodbye. 

Funerals will be held after the apple season at the catholic church of his 
hometown of Hemmingford, Québec on Saturday, October 14. The family will be 
present at 9h30, ahead of the ceremony at 11h00. 



___
apple-crop mailing list
apple-crop@virtualorchard.com
http://virtualorchard.com/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop

Re: [Apple-Crop] Shopping list: Looking for insight on flyspeck, fire blight, pheromone trap thresholds

[Vincent Philion]

Hi!

Won’t answer about SBFS, but hopefully someone will. ;-)

My 2 cents for other disease stuff:

2) Fire blight
 Why is Regulaid specified as a penetrant adjuvant for use with 
streptomycin applications during bloom?  Does it have unique characteristics 
that make it better for this purpose than other penetrants such as LI700?

We don’t have Regulaid, but I can tell you substituting for LI700 doesn’t work 
for Kasumin. Never tried with Strep.

We had reduced efficacy when LI700 was mixed with Kasumin.


 If grower is applying captan at same time, has much strep efficacy is lost 
by not adding the penetrant to the mix to avoid captan phytotoxicity?

It’s interesting you mix strep with fungicides considering this should reduce 
strep efficacy:

Goodman, Robert N., 1964: Compatibility of streptomycin with some fungicides 
and insecticides. Plant Dis Reporter: 180-181


 If there is none or even minimal active fire blight in the orchard, is 
there reason to spray strep after hail damage?

I see none whatsoever.

 My take on it has been to not bother as long as you are just cutting fire 
blight out, and that it is more important to remove fire blight as soon as 
possible.

I didn’t change my opinion since we wrote that about 10 years ago. But this 
question keeps coming back.

Toussaint, V., et V. Philion. 2007. Natural Epidemic of Fire Blight in a Newly 
Planted Orchard and Effect of Pruning on Disease Development. In XI 
International Workshop on Fire Blight 793, 313‑320. ISHS.

Do we all agree that strep provides protection for a flower for about 2-3 
days?

Yes. But since the flower has a finite life and gets more difficult to colonize 
as it ages, there is no point in respraying the same flower.

  Though I can imagine scenario with temps around 90F where a single cohort of 
flowers could be vulnerable to a second fire blight infection period after 
receiving a strep application.

I can’t. Show me how this is possible!

Bye for now,

Vincent Philion, agr.






___
apple-crop mailing list
apple-crop@virtualorchard.com
http://virtualorchard.com/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop

Re: [Apple-Crop] More on FB

[Vincent Philion]

Hi!

I have no idea about the effect of copper content in soil on FB management. 
That’s a new one for me. I tried to look it up, but couldn’t find anything. 

For FB, removing “any” stress is not a silver bullet though. As mentioned in 
previous posts, some water stress can save your trees when FB strikes.

Vincent

> Le 22 mai 2017 à 08:37, lee elliott  a écrit :
> 
> I have been adding copper (Kocide) to my glysofate tank when spraying weeds 
> in an effort to get more copper into the soil, Kocide is cheap, water 
> soluable, Every time I have done leaf anayisis copper is way deficient in the 
> leaf, I think this defieciancy makes the tree more suceptable to FB, do the 
> experts think this may work? It cant hurt anything, This is midwest soil, is 
> copper short in other area too?, I have learned that removing any stress from 
> the tree will get you success, Lee Elliott Upstart Nursery, Winchester, 
> Illinois
> ___
> apple-crop mailing list
> apple-crop@virtualorchard.com
> http://virtualorchard.com/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop

___
apple-crop mailing list
apple-crop@virtualorchard.com
http://virtualorchard.com/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop

Re: [Apple-Crop] Ideas on FB

[Vincent Philion]

Strep works very well for blossom blight, until abuse brings it down 
(resistance). Sticking to bloom sprays and making sure it’s applied only when 
it’s needed is key. 

> sceptical that these antobiotic sprays work at all, only good for the blooms 
> and chemical dealers,


___
apple-crop mailing list
apple-crop@virtualorchard.com
http://virtualorchard.com/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop

Re: [Apple-Crop] Ideas on FB

[Vincent Philion]

Hi!

it would be interesting to define “cool” in the southern California context. ;-)

Temperature in the mid-90 (35 ℃ for the rest of the planet) (or more) clearly 
isn’t favorable for blight. Flowers age faster at that temperature, while the 
bacteria is slowed down.

Plus, if the trees are under water stress the bacteria can’t progress normally.

Your “cool” is our “warm” and that’s why we struggle with FB, but also scab and 
CM.

Vincent
 


> Le 22 mai 2017 à 00:29, kuffelcr...@kuffelcreek.com a écrit :
> 
> A long, cool spring here in Southern California allowed quite a few FB
> strikes, three days in the low to mid-90's stopped it in its tracks. 
> Formerly limp shoots with sticky ooze and now crispy and dry, and pruned
> stumps do not get re-infection.  That's all I'll see of it until next
> spring, weeks of 100+ weather and 5% humidity sees to that.  Unfortunately
> it doesn't slow down the CM a bit, which is my next nemesis on the
> calendar.
> 
> Kevin Hauser
> Kuffel Creek Apple Nursery
> Riverside, California
> Nakifuma, Uganda
> 
> On Mon, 22 May 2017 02:45:06 + (UTC), lee elliott 
> wrote:
>> For the first year ever I havent seen any FB here is western Illinois,
>> could it be th 86 degree days we had burned it out, I believe FB burns
> out
>> after a few hot days, some dont believe this but experience has taught
> me
>> it is true, Shoot bligt and root sucker blight has allways been a
> problem,
>> I am sceptical that these antobiotic sprays work at all, only good for
> the
>> blooms and chemical dealers, Copper does work well on young hursery and
>> non-bearing trees that get shoot blight where your not woried about
> fruit
>> finish, My person opiniion, low soil levels of copper, (do a leaf
> anayisis)
>> make the tree stressed and contribute to FB. Just my 2 cents worth, Lee
>> Elliott, Upstart Nursery, Winchester Illinois
>> ___
>> apple-crop mailing list
>> apple-crop@virtualorchard.com
>> http://virtualorchard.com/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop
> ___
> apple-crop mailing list
> apple-crop@virtualorchard.com
> http://virtualorchard.com/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop

___
apple-crop mailing list
apple-crop@virtualorchard.com
http://virtualorchard.com/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop

Re: [Apple-Crop] Fireblight

[Vincent Philion]

Hi!

Once a flower opens, it needs to get contaminated by an insect and then the 
population needs to multiply to 100,000 before wetting, otherwise the infection 
is a dud.

That takes 36 hrs when the conditions are perfect for the bacteria (28°C, 
82°F), and considerably longer when the temperature is cooler.

In other words, spraying the day before the infection is never a problem.

In most (if not all) scenarios, sprays every 48 hours covers all the risk.

Of course, longer intervals are quite sufficient when the temperature is 
cooler. Optimizing spray frequency was our goal when we designed RIMpro.

Vincent


Le 21 mai 2017 à 15:52, Arthur Kelly 
> a écrit :

Thanks, I was more wondering how close to try and get to the infection period 
due sometime tomorrow morning.  We are mostly
in bloom with some varieties nearly complete petal fall and others (honeycrisp) 
at full bloom.  There are very few flowers still to open and I expect that this 
will be the only strep spray necessary.  The forecast is slight chance of 
showers daily going forward.

Sent from my iPhone

___
apple-crop mailing list
apple-crop@virtualorchard.com
http://virtualorchard.com/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop

Re: [Apple-Crop] Fireblight

[Vincent Philion]

Hi all,

My two cents:

Although streptomycin is degraded by light, this doesn’t really matter: For two 
to four days, the antibiotic keeps bacterial population at low levels on 
sprayed flowers.

Once it’s degraded, the flower is also 2 to 4 days older and there is simply 
not enough time left for the bacteria to multiply back to detrimental levels 
and infect.

Pusey demonstrated quite well that as flower age, they carry less bacteria and 
become increasingly more difficult to infect.

Bottom line: Opened flowers that are sprayed stay protected for the life of 
that flower.

As Quan underlined, you should mostly concentrate on flowers unopened at 
spraying time:

1) How many flowers weren’t open on the last strep spray?

2) Will the weather for these flowers be conducive for bacteria multiplication 
and infection?

If so, then you need to consider additional sprays for unsprayed flowers.

Trapman and myself developed RIMpro-Erwinia to help manage which flowers are at 
risk and at need for a spray. This model is very different from Cougar and 
Maryblyt and is proving more reliable.


Vincent Philion, agr., M.Sc.
Microbiologiste/Phytopathologiste (pomiculture)

Institut de recherche et de développement en agro-environnement
Research and Development Institute for the Agri-Environment

www.irda.qc.ca<http://www.irda.qc.ca/>
___
apple-crop mailing list
apple-crop@virtualorchard.com
http://virtualorchard.com/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop

Re: [Apple-Crop] Cueva/Double Nickel

[Vincent Philion]

If we “must" continue this:

> Our injury results seem to follow the acute toxicity/exposure phenomenon, 
> whereby injury is higher when the concentration is higher not more dilute. 
> This is not unlike when one is exposed to a toxin in water, air, or direct 
> contact. 

In orchard trials, reducing volume and maintaining coverage requires adequate 
spraying technology. i/e Not a gun.

What does your spray deposit look like in your trials?

Copper ions in large droplets (or high volume) react with leaf tissue until the 
water evaporates. 

Small droplets evaporate quicker and reduce the toxicity.

This is something you can’t see if you paint the trees with a film of water 
using a gun. 

When you attempt to reduce volume using the same gun, all you do is apply 
“less” droplets… But they are still slow drying big droplets. 


So you are likely to conclude more concentrated material is more toxic… This is 
not surprising, right? 

But not so relevant to orchard spraying with small droplets.

Conclusions drawn from trials performed with guns using large droplets are not 
always directly  applicable with airblast sprayers.

it’s Happy hour time = Drinking 2 beers or one glass of wine is the same for 
the alcool test, right?

But beer “rental” is shorter than for wine because that excess volume can’t 
stay in your bladder so long. So for a given metabolic rate I’m betting alcohol 
in your blood is higher with beer. i/e beer would get you hammered quicker than 
wine. I could be wrong, but at least it’s cheaper.

Point is: concentration vs volume is not so straightforward and spray 
application technology can greatly impact results.

caveat emptor.


Vincent


 







___
apple-crop mailing list
apple-crop@virtualorchard.com
http://virtualorchard.com/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop

Re: [Apple-Crop] Cueva/Double Nickel

[Vincent Philion]

Hi Kerik,

It would certainly be interesting to understand why results differ so greatly.

It’s unfortunate that companies insist on high volume spraying. Aside from the 
russeting issue, there are many good reasons to reduce spray volume (in 
relation to tree size). It’s also unfortunate most trials are done with a 
handgun (and no air assist?), resulting in a droplet spectrum size and spray 
distribution very different from what growers actually use.

In any case, the good news is your results imply that Cueva is very safe to 
use, even at high volume. Were you running oxychloride with a similar copper 
concentration alongside Cueva?

Vincent


Le 1 mai 2017 à 09:59, Kerik D. Cox 
<kd...@cornell.edu<mailto:kd...@cornell.edu>> a écrit :

Hi Vincent,

I'm sorry that our trials resulted in the opposite expectation. Most of the 
company protocols ask me to apply their products at 100 gal/A. I guess they 
were hoping to increase the chance of showing product injury at my field days. 
I thought it was a more universal tree row volume for apples, my mistake. The 
field crews at Geneva and Ithaca sprays everything at 100 gal/A. I guess it's 
an underhanded attempt to potentially injure our plots with copper. With all my 
dilute handgun applications, I'm surprised that I don't have potatoes. I guess 
I keep getting lucky.

Best,
Kerik
Hi Kerik,

I don’t know how much experience you actually have with airblast sprayer trials 
varying volume, but this is something we do routinely.

Evidence of copper injury with high volume sprays dates back (at least) to 
1972. Look it up. Classic experiments demonstrate the same amount of copper can 
defoliate plants or result in no injury, just by varying volume.

Let’s say I have a hard time “swallowing” your aspirin  analogy…! Let’s stick 
to apples, OK?

The fact that labels require you to apply large volumes of water doesn’t make 
it a sound or sensible advice.

Most likely, the labels reflect the trial conditions. And most trials in the 
USA are run with high volume….!

Vincent


Le 1 mai 2017 à 08:31, Kerik D. Cox 
<kd...@cornell.edu<mailto:kd...@cornell.edu>> a écrit :

Hi Vincent,

We've found that concentration is potentially more damaging with copper than 
higher volumes as the both 50gal and 100gal get the same amount of copper. It's 
like taking powdered aspirin with half the recommended amount of water. Also, 
many labels in the US actually require that certain products be applied in a 
minimum of 100 gal/A. If were potentially injurious to apply at 100 gal/A, I 
assure you that no company would include any such statements on label. 
Actually, they would, without a doubt, put statements saying that the product 
should not be applied at 100 gal/A or injury would occur. Excess water seems to 
just roll off the trees in our  experiments.

Best,
Kerik
I hope you meant a Low volume of water. High volume = slow drying = russeting. 
This is very easy to demonstrate. We do it as a "control" in plots. We always 
have copper induced russeting at 500 L/ha and none at 225 L/ha.

Vincent Philion, agr., M.Sc.

Le 1 mai 2017 à 08:05, Two Onion Farm 
<far...@twoonionfarm.com<mailto:far...@twoonionfarm.com>> a écrit :


Kerik Cox at Cornell has done trials with this combination for cedar apple 
rust, summer fungal diseases, and fireblight and has had good results.

We started using the combination in our organic orchard last year and did not 
see any problems with fruit russeting.  Kerik did caution me to use a high 
volume of water to avoid toxicity from the copper (100 gallons per acre vs our 
normal 50 in our high density orchard).   We have used 2 qts/acre Cueva + 2 
lbs/acre 2ble nickel.

Kerik also suggested that the 2ble nickel might be unnecessary and that cueva 
alone might be sufficient, but that may be theoretical at this point.  The 2ble 
nickel does add a lot of cost.

Chris

Chris & Juli McGuire
Two Onion Farm
www.twoonionfarm.com<http://www.twoonionfarm.com/>
19638 Cottage Inn Road
Belmont, WI 53510
(608) 762-5335
far...@twoonionfarm.com<mailto:far...@twoonionfarm.com>

On 5/1/2017 6:43 AM, maurice tougas wrote:
A couple years ago I recall discussion regarding the use of Cueva/Double Nickel 
combination as an alternative and/or rotation with strep for fireblight 
management. Is anyone aware of further research regarding this combination esp 
as to regards to crop safety and efficacy ?

Mo Tougas

--
Maurice Tougas
Tougas Family Farm
Northborough,MA 01532
508-450-0844



___
apple-crop mailing list
apple-crop@virtualorchard.com<mailto:apple-crop@virtualorchard.com>
http://virtualorchard.com/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop


___
apple-crop mailing list
apple-crop@virtualorchard.com<mailto:apple-crop@virtualorchard.com>
http://virtualorchard.com/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop



___

Re: [Apple-Crop] Cueva/Double Nickel

[Vincent Philion]

Hi Kerik,

I don’t know how much experience you actually have with airblast sprayer trials 
varying volume, but this is something we do routinely.

Evidence of copper injury with high volume sprays dates back (at least) to 
1972. Look it up. Classic experiments demonstrate the same amount of copper can 
defoliate plants or result in no injury, just by varying volume.

Let’s say I have a hard time “swallowing” your aspirin  analogy…! Let’s stick 
to apples, OK?

The fact that labels require you to apply large volumes of water doesn’t make 
it a sound or sensible advice.

Most likely, the labels reflect the trial conditions. And most trials in the 
USA are run with high volume….!

Vincent


Le 1 mai 2017 à 08:31, Kerik D. Cox 
<kd...@cornell.edu<mailto:kd...@cornell.edu>> a écrit :

Hi Vincent,

We've found that concentration is potentially more damaging with copper than 
higher volumes as the both 50gal and 100gal get the same amount of copper. It's 
like taking powdered aspirin with half the recommended amount of water. Also, 
many labels in the US actually require that certain products be applied in a 
minimum of 100 gal/A. If were potentially injurious to apply at 100 gal/A, I 
assure you that no company would include any such statements on label. 
Actually, they would, without a doubt, put statements saying that the product 
should not be applied at 100 gal/A or injury would occur. Excess water seems to 
just roll off the trees in our  experiments.

Best,
Kerik
I hope you meant a Low volume of water. High volume = slow drying = russeting. 
This is very easy to demonstrate. We do it as a "control" in plots. We always 
have copper induced russeting at 500 L/ha and none at 225 L/ha.

Vincent Philion, agr., M.Sc.

Le 1 mai 2017 à 08:05, Two Onion Farm 
<far...@twoonionfarm.com<mailto:far...@twoonionfarm.com>> a écrit :


Kerik Cox at Cornell has done trials with this combination for cedar apple 
rust, summer fungal diseases, and fireblight and has had good results.

We started using the combination in our organic orchard last year and did not 
see any problems with fruit russeting.  Kerik did caution me to use a high 
volume of water to avoid toxicity from the copper (100 gallons per acre vs our 
normal 50 in our high density orchard).   We have used 2 qts/acre Cueva + 2 
lbs/acre 2ble nickel.

Kerik also suggested that the 2ble nickel might be unnecessary and that cueva 
alone might be sufficient, but that may be theoretical at this point.  The 2ble 
nickel does add a lot of cost.

Chris

Chris & Juli McGuire
Two Onion Farm
www.twoonionfarm.com<http://www.twoonionfarm.com/>
19638 Cottage Inn Road
Belmont, WI 53510
(608) 762-5335
far...@twoonionfarm.com<mailto:far...@twoonionfarm.com>

On 5/1/2017 6:43 AM, maurice tougas wrote:
A couple years ago I recall discussion regarding the use of Cueva/Double Nickel 
combination as an alternative and/or rotation with strep for fireblight 
management. Is anyone aware of further research regarding this combination esp 
as to regards to crop safety and efficacy ?

Mo Tougas

--
Maurice Tougas
Tougas Family Farm
Northborough,MA 01532
508-450-0844



___
apple-crop mailing list
apple-crop@virtualorchard.com<mailto:apple-crop@virtualorchard.com>
http://virtualorchard.com/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop


___
apple-crop mailing list
apple-crop@virtualorchard.com<mailto:apple-crop@virtualorchard.com>
http://virtualorchard.com/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop



___
apple-crop mailing list
apple-crop@virtualorchard.com<mailto:apple-crop@virtualorchard.com>
http://virtualorchard.com/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop




--
Kerik D.  Cox, Ph.D., Associate Professor
Plant Pathology and Plant-Microbe Biology Section
School of Integrative Plant Science
Cornell University
221 Barton Lab
NYSAES
630 West North Street
Geneva, NY 14456 USA

E-mail: kd...@cornell.edu<mailto:kd...@cornell.edu>
Faculty Office: (315) 787-2401
Fruit Pathology Lab: (315) 787-2402
FAX: (315) 787-2389


___
apple-crop mailing list
apple-crop@virtualorchard.com<mailto:apple-crop@virtualorchard.com>
http://virtualorchard.com/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop

___
apple-crop mailing list
apple-crop@virtualorchard.com
http://virtualorchard.com/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop

Re: [Apple-Crop] Cueva/Double Nickel

[Vincent Philion]

On the topic of copper: you don't need to spend extra for Cueva. Use of 
standard oxychloride at a low dose is just as good in most instances.

Vincent Philion, agr., M.Sc.

Le 1 mai 2017 à 08:05, Two Onion Farm 
<far...@twoonionfarm.com<mailto:far...@twoonionfarm.com>> a écrit :


Kerik Cox at Cornell has done trials with this combination for cedar apple 
rust, summer fungal diseases, and fireblight and has had good results.

We started using the combination in our organic orchard last year and did not 
see any problems with fruit russeting.  Kerik did caution me to use a high 
volume of water to avoid toxicity from the copper (100 gallons per acre vs our 
normal 50 in our high density orchard).   We have used 2 qts/acre Cueva + 2 
lbs/acre 2ble nickel.

Kerik also suggested that the 2ble nickel might be unnecessary and that cueva 
alone might be sufficient, but that may be theoretical at this point.  The 2ble 
nickel does add a lot of cost.

Chris

Chris & Juli McGuire
Two Onion Farm
www.twoonionfarm.com<http://www.twoonionfarm.com/>
19638 Cottage Inn Road
Belmont, WI 53510
(608) 762-5335
far...@twoonionfarm.com<mailto:far...@twoonionfarm.com>

On 5/1/2017 6:43 AM, maurice tougas wrote:
A couple years ago I recall discussion regarding the use of Cueva/Double Nickel 
combination as an alternative and/or rotation with strep for fireblight 
management. Is anyone aware of further research regarding this combination esp 
as to regards to crop safety and efficacy ?

Mo Tougas

--
Maurice Tougas
Tougas Family Farm
Northborough,MA 01532
508-450-0844



___
apple-crop mailing list
apple-crop@virtualorchard.com<mailto:apple-crop@virtualorchard.com>
http://virtualorchard.com/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop


___
apple-crop mailing list
apple-crop@virtualorchard.com<mailto:apple-crop@virtualorchard.com>
http://virtualorchard.com/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop
___
apple-crop mailing list
apple-crop@virtualorchard.com
http://virtualorchard.com/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop

Re: [Apple-Crop] Cueva/Double Nickel

[Vincent Philion]

I hope you meant a Low volume of water. High volume = slow drying = russeting. 
This is very easy to demonstrate. We do it as a "control" in plots. We always 
have copper induced russeting at 500 L/ha and none at 225 L/ha.

Vincent Philion, agr., M.Sc.

Le 1 mai 2017 à 08:05, Two Onion Farm 
<far...@twoonionfarm.com<mailto:far...@twoonionfarm.com>> a écrit :


Kerik Cox at Cornell has done trials with this combination for cedar apple 
rust, summer fungal diseases, and fireblight and has had good results.

We started using the combination in our organic orchard last year and did not 
see any problems with fruit russeting.  Kerik did caution me to use a high 
volume of water to avoid toxicity from the copper (100 gallons per acre vs our 
normal 50 in our high density orchard).   We have used 2 qts/acre Cueva + 2 
lbs/acre 2ble nickel.

Kerik also suggested that the 2ble nickel might be unnecessary and that cueva 
alone might be sufficient, but that may be theoretical at this point.  The 2ble 
nickel does add a lot of cost.

Chris

Chris & Juli McGuire
Two Onion Farm
www.twoonionfarm.com<http://www.twoonionfarm.com/>
19638 Cottage Inn Road
Belmont, WI 53510
(608) 762-5335
far...@twoonionfarm.com<mailto:far...@twoonionfarm.com>

On 5/1/2017 6:43 AM, maurice tougas wrote:
A couple years ago I recall discussion regarding the use of Cueva/Double Nickel 
combination as an alternative and/or rotation with strep for fireblight 
management. Is anyone aware of further research regarding this combination esp 
as to regards to crop safety and efficacy ?

Mo Tougas

--
Maurice Tougas
Tougas Family Farm
Northborough,MA 01532
508-450-0844



___
apple-crop mailing list
apple-crop@virtualorchard.com<mailto:apple-crop@virtualorchard.com>
http://virtualorchard.com/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop


___
apple-crop mailing list
apple-crop@virtualorchard.com<mailto:apple-crop@virtualorchard.com>
http://virtualorchard.com/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop
___
apple-crop mailing list
apple-crop@virtualorchard.com
http://virtualorchard.com/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop

Re: [Apple-Crop] Serenade

[Vincent Philion]

Ok, more seriously: Serenade does have some efficacy against FB and a number of 
diseases. But I really wonder on the return on money spent on it compared to 
anything else we spray. Maybe I'm wrong. 

Vincent Philion, agr., M.Sc.

> Le 2 avr. 2017 à 13:13, Kim Logan <kelke...@gmail.com> a écrit :
> 
> Have been using serenaded and strep during bloom for a couple of years and 
> haven't had any fire blight. Don't know if it works or not though.
> 
> On April 2, 2017, at 11:58, Vincent Philion <vincent.phil...@irda.qc.ca> 
> wrote:
> 
> Does anyone have any positive experience with Serenade on anything?
> 
> Vincent Philion, agr., M.Sc.
> 
>> Le 2 avr. 2017 à 12:49, Daniel Cooley <dcoo...@umass.edu> a écrit :
>> 
>> Norm Lalancette did some tests on peaches. It didn’t work.
>> 
>> Dan
>> 
>> 
>>> On Mar 31, 2017, at 5:42 PM, Arthur Kelly <kellyorcha...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> 
>>> Does anyone have any experience with Serenade for brown rot?
>>> 
>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>> ___
>>> apple-crop mailing list
>>> apple-crop@virtualorchard.com
>>> http://virtualorchard.com/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop
>> 
>> ___
>> apple-crop mailing list
>> apple-crop@virtualorchard.com
>> http://virtualorchard.com/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop
> ___
> apple-crop mailing list
> apple-crop@virtualorchard.com
> http://virtualorchard.com/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop
> ___
> apple-crop mailing list
> apple-crop@virtualorchard.com
> http://virtualorchard.com/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop
___
apple-crop mailing list
apple-crop@virtualorchard.com
http://virtualorchard.com/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop

Re: [Apple-Crop] Serenade

[Vincent Philion]

... strep is great against FB. no doubt. 

Vincent Philion, agr., M.Sc.

> Le 2 avr. 2017 à 13:13, Kim Logan <kelke...@gmail.com> a écrit :
> 
> Have been using serenaded and strep during bloom for a couple of years and 
> haven't had any fire blight. Don't know if it works or not though.
> 
> On April 2, 2017, at 11:58, Vincent Philion <vincent.phil...@irda.qc.ca> 
> wrote:
> 
> Does anyone have any positive experience with Serenade on anything?
> 
> Vincent Philion, agr., M.Sc.
> 
>> Le 2 avr. 2017 à 12:49, Daniel Cooley <dcoo...@umass.edu> a écrit :
>> 
>> Norm Lalancette did some tests on peaches. It didn’t work.
>> 
>> Dan
>> 
>> 
>>> On Mar 31, 2017, at 5:42 PM, Arthur Kelly <kellyorcha...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> 
>>> Does anyone have any experience with Serenade for brown rot?
>>> 
>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>> ___
>>> apple-crop mailing list
>>> apple-crop@virtualorchard.com
>>> http://virtualorchard.com/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop
>> 
>> ___
>> apple-crop mailing list
>> apple-crop@virtualorchard.com
>> http://virtualorchard.com/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop
> ___
> apple-crop mailing list
> apple-crop@virtualorchard.com
> http://virtualorchard.com/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop
> ___
> apple-crop mailing list
> apple-crop@virtualorchard.com
> http://virtualorchard.com/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop
___
apple-crop mailing list
apple-crop@virtualorchard.com
http://virtualorchard.com/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop

Re: [Apple-Crop] Serenade

[Vincent Philion]

Does anyone have any positive experience with Serenade on anything?

Vincent Philion, agr., M.Sc.

> Le 2 avr. 2017 à 12:49, Daniel Cooley <dcoo...@umass.edu> a écrit :
> 
> Norm Lalancette did some tests on peaches. It didn’t work.
> 
> Dan
> 
> 
>> On Mar 31, 2017, at 5:42 PM, Arthur Kelly <kellyorcha...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> 
>> Does anyone have any experience with Serenade for brown rot?
>> 
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> ___
>> apple-crop mailing list
>> apple-crop@virtualorchard.com
>> http://virtualorchard.com/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop
> 
> ___
> apple-crop mailing list
> apple-crop@virtualorchard.com
> http://virtualorchard.com/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop
___
apple-crop mailing list
apple-crop@virtualorchard.com
http://virtualorchard.com/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop