So which components (obviously used by the majority of Arch users) do
currently have or will soon have hardcoded! dependencies to systemd?
udev.
Upstream, Gnome has considered it.
You know why, because according to heise some of their longterm devs
have left leaving more than half the
On Tuesday 28 Aug 2012 11:16:38 Kevin Chadwick wrote:
You know why, because according to heise some of their longterm devs
have left leaving more than half the devs being RedHat employees.
p.s. I have nothing against RedHat, I value they're work, mostly the
work which goes unnoticed.
On Tue, 2012-08-28 at 16:43 +0530, Jayesh Badwaik wrote:
On Tuesday 28 Aug 2012 11:16:38 Kevin Chadwick wrote:
You know why, because according to heise some of their longterm devs
have left leaving more than half the devs being RedHat employees.
p.s. I have nothing against RedHat, I
On Wed, Aug 22, 2012 at 10:13:33AM +0200, Kwpolska wrote:
Huh? I've never seen any complaints about udev before you.
udev is kinda crufty. And it really doesn't belong inside
the same monolithic program that manages startup and file-
system mounting.
On Thu, Aug 23, 2012 at 04:45:34PM +0200, Jakob Herrmann wrote:
So which components (obviously used by the majority of Arch users) do
currently have or will soon have hardcoded! dependencies to systemd?
udev.
Upstream, Gnome has considered it.
I think these discussions will not change the result for Arch. Sooner
or later Arch will have to seperate its way from its KISS philosophy.
While the main approach of Arch is to use vanilla software, as
possible; Arch devs have to follow upstream decisions and at some
point Arch and other distros
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\begin{quote}
While the main approach of Arch is to use vanilla software, as
possible; Arch devs have to follow upstream decisions and at some
point Arch and other distros fall into software those hide things from
end users. I think most of the main
On Wed, Aug 22, 2012 at 2:54 AM, Felipe Contreras
felipe.contre...@gmail.com wrote:
We, is me and the people that don't like the systemd+udev beast, and
they are a lot.
Huh? I've never seen any complaints about udev before you. Mind you,
udev is around since 2003. It was merged into
We, is me and the people that don't like the systemd+udev beast, and
they are a lot.
Huh? I've never seen any complaints about udev before you. Mind you,
udev is around since 2003.
Actually it's completely different to back in 2003 because of huge
amounts of complaints. Check lwn.net
Op 22 aug. 2012 10:59 schreef Kevin Chadwick ma1l1i...@yahoo.co.uk het
volgende:
We, is me and the people that don't like the systemd+udev beast, and
they are a lot.
Huh? I've never seen any complaints about udev before you. Mind you,
udev is around since 2003.
Actually it's
Kevin, you seem to be fairly advanced user. How about creating a vm with
Arch and getting an alternative to udev running?
Seems is probably the right word. We are all fools fiddling in the dark
to some degree with different ground covered. Some of us have more
powerful torches and some keep to
On Wed, Aug 22, 2012 at 6:22 AM, Leon Feng rainofch...@gmail.com wrote:
2012/8/22 Felipe Contreras felipe.contre...@gmail.com:
Maybe, maybe not, but is it the right choice *now*? That's the question.
Some upstream package are start to require systemd support. Udev,
Polkit is just an example.
On Wed, Aug 22, 2012 at 12:16 PM, Guus Snijders gsnijd...@gmail.com wrote:
Op 22 aug. 2012 10:59 schreef Kevin Chadwick ma1l1i...@yahoo.co.uk het
volgende:
Kevin, you seem to be fairly advanced user. How about creating a vm with
Arch and getting an alternative to udev running?
I do this all
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Hi,
\begin{quote{}
Add as the poll shows: More Arch users(80%) agree with upstream for
this change.
\end{quote}
Source?...And which poll? I don't remember that some has been opened.
Cheers,
Jakob
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On 08/22/2012 10:46 AM, Jakob Herrmann wrote:
Hi,
\begin{quote{}
Add as the poll shows: More Arch users(80%) agree with upstream for
this change.
\end{quote}
Source?...And which poll? I don't remember that some has been opened.
Cheers,
Jakob
It was a poll started by a member in
Op 22 aug. 2012 14:07 schreef Felipe Contreras felipe.contre...@gmail.com
het volgende:
On Wed, Aug 22, 2012 at 12:16 PM, Guus Snijders gsnijd...@gmail.com
wrote:
Op 22 aug. 2012 10:59 schreef Kevin Chadwick ma1l1i...@yahoo.co.uk
het
volgende:
How about creating a vm with
Arch and
I do this all the time with buildroot; udev is a choice, and I often
have trouble compiling it because it depends on so many things, like
specific kernel configurations, and certain toolchain options. The
fact of the matter is that udev doesn't do much for me,
CONFIG_DEVTMPFS=y and
On Fri, Aug 17, 2012 at 11:08 AM, C Anthony Risinger anth...@xtfx.me wrote:
no flexibility is lost by moving to systemd, and really, much more
gained: wider userbase, wider testbase, simple units to write, simple
units to read, loosely coupled ordering, implicit dependencies, Grand
Unified
On Thu, Aug 16, 2012 at 11:22 PM, Myra Nelson myra.nel...@hughes.net wrote:
Even with udev moving into systemd, an individual on the systemd mailing list
has already stated his desire to finally be rid of udev altogether. He
considers it an
abomination.
Who is this member? It seems I joined
On 22.08.2012 01:56, Felipe Contreras wrote:
On Thu, Aug 16, 2012 at 11:22 PM, Myra Nelson myra.nel...@hughes.net wrote:
Even with udev moving into systemd, an individual on the systemd mailing list
has already stated his desire to finally be rid of udev altogether. He
considers it an
On Wed, Aug 22, 2012 at 7:56 AM, Felipe Contreras
felipe.contre...@gmail.com wrote:
On Thu, Aug 16, 2012 at 11:22 PM, Myra Nelson myra.nel...@hughes.net wrote:
Even with udev moving into systemd, an individual on the systemd mailing list
has already stated his desire to finally be rid of udev
On Wed, Aug 22, 2012 at 2:30 AM, Oon-Ee Ng ngoonee.t...@gmail.com wrote:
On Wed, Aug 22, 2012 at 7:56 AM, Felipe Contreras
felipe.contre...@gmail.com wrote:
On Thu, Aug 16, 2012 at 11:22 PM, Myra Nelson myra.nel...@hughes.net wrote:
Even with udev moving into systemd, an individual on the
2012/8/22 Felipe Contreras felipe.contre...@gmail.com:
On Fri, Aug 17, 2012 at 11:08 AM, C Anthony Risinger anth...@xtfx.me wrote:
no flexibility is lost by moving to systemd, and really, much more
gained: wider userbase, wider testbase, simple units to write, simple
units to read, loosely
On Tue, Aug 21, 2012 at 6:56 PM, Felipe Contreras
felipe.contre...@gmail.com wrote:
On Thu, Aug 16, 2012 at 11:22 PM, Myra Nelson myra.nel...@hughes.net wrote:
Even with udev moving into systemd, an individual on the systemd mailing list
has already stated his desire to finally be rid of udev
On 17/08/2012 8:34 AM, Stephen E. Baker wrote:
The other issue I hit was that it didn't like one of my fstab entries,
for a loop back file system in my home partition that I use to fake
a small drive for one of my old wine games. This error caused it to
boot to a
root console where I could see
On Sat, Aug 18, 2012 at 2:37 AM, Rémy Oudompheng
remyoudomph...@gmail.comwrote:
On 2012/8/17 Myra Nelson myra.nel...@hughes.net wrote:
On Thu, Aug 16, 2012 at 4:34 PM, Nicholas MIller nick.k...@gmail.com
wrote:
That seems to be one of the more well thought out (not pro), responces
to
+According to Leon Feng:
Systemd support shortform service name now. See the wiki page:
https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/Systemd#Using_Units
For now, this only seems to work for starting, stopping and reloading
services. Unfortunately it doesn't yet seem to work for enabling or
On 2012/8/17 Myra Nelson myra.nel...@hughes.net wrote:
On Thu, Aug 16, 2012 at 4:34 PM, Nicholas MIller nick.k...@gmail.comwrote:
That seems to be one of the more well thought out (not pro), responces to
systemd,
Thank you. My intent was to start an intelligent discussion. The rants and
On Thu, 16 Aug 2012 16:22:56 -0500
Myra Nelson myra.nel...@hughes.net wrote:
snip
I agree. I have read all the current threads and the few words which struck me
with greatest force were in a post from Marti Raudsepp, where he said that an
advantage of systemd is ... less fragmentation between
On Fri, Aug 17, 2012 at 2:57 AM, Geoff capstho...@yahoo.co.uk wrote:
On Thu, 16 Aug 2012 16:22:56 -0500
Myra Nelson myra.nel...@hughes.net wrote:
snip
I agree. I have read all the current threads and the few words which struck
me
with greatest force were in a post from Marti Raudsepp,
On Thu, Aug 16, 2012 at 10:22 PM, Myra Nelson myra.nel...@hughes.net wrote:
of lib and lib64 to /usr/lib, I'm basically ambivalent. I still don't like
not being able to put /usr on a separate partition, I know there's a
mkinitcpio hook to cover that, but I can see the logic in cleaning up the
2012/8/17 Geoff capstho...@yahoo.co.uk:
On Thu, 16 Aug 2012 16:22:56 -0500
Myra Nelson myra.nel...@hughes.net wrote:
snip
I agree. I have read all the current threads and the few words which struck
me
with greatest force were in a post from Marti Raudsepp, where he said that an
I used to have seperate /usr partition, previous year, I didn't remember
details but
there was a bug that force me to reinstall my sytem without a sperate /usr
partition.
On Fri, Aug 17, 2012 at 10:14:58AM +0100, mike cloaked wrote:
On Thu, Aug 16, 2012 at 10:22 PM, Myra Nelson
On Thu, Aug 16, 2012 at 10:22 PM, Myra Nelson myra.nel...@hughes.net wrote:
There has been much ado on the arch-general mailing list about the move to
systemd. I participated in part of it, but like others finally tired of
seeing a dead horse kicked over and over and over. So much so that the
On 17 August 2012 11:31, mike cloaked mike.cloa...@gmail.com wrote:
On Thu, Aug 16, 2012 at 10:22 PM, Myra Nelson myra.nel...@hughes.net wrote:
There has been much ado on the arch-general mailing list about the move to
systemd. I participated in part of it, but like others finally tired of
On Fri, Aug 17, 2012 at 10:31 AM, mike cloaked mike.cloa...@gmail.com wrote:
most of which are systems using systemd. Given that so many machines
are currently running systemd it can't be all that bad! This is of
How many machines are currently running Windows*?
Jorge Almeida
2012/8/17 mike cloaked mike.cloa...@gmail.com:
On Thu, Aug 16, 2012 at 10:22 PM, Myra Nelson myra.nel...@hughes.net wrote:
There has been much ado on the arch-general mailing list about the move to
systemd. I participated in part of it, but like others finally tired of
seeing a dead horse
On Fri, Aug 17, 2012 at 04:08:32AM -0500, C Anthony Risinger wrote:
no flexibility is lost by moving to systemd, and really, much more
gained: wider userbase, wider testbase, simple units to write, simple
units to read, loosely coupled ordering, implicit dependencies, Grand
Unified logging
On Fri, 17 Aug 2012 09:57:51 +
Fons Adriaensen f...@linuxaudio.org wrote:
snip
+1 to every word. I ran LFS for three years, partly because I wanted to learn
and partly to avoid the issues you mention. I left only because at that point in
my life it was too time-consuming and Arch offered an
On Fri, 17 Aug 2012 04:08:32 -0500
C Anthony Risinger anth...@xtfx.me wrote:
snip
the boot process isn't really that interesting (once you
know/understand it anyway ... if not i encourage you to explor ;-) --
every distro pretty much does it the same way, but pointlessly
independent, thus
On Fri, Aug 17, 2012 at 12:18 PM, Geoff capstho...@yahoo.co.uk wrote:
On Fri, 17 Aug 2012 04:08:32 -0500
C Anthony Risinger anth...@xtfx.me wrote:
snip
the boot process isn't really that interesting (once you
know/understand it anyway ... if not i encourage you to explor ;-) --
every
But if it takes you where you don't want to go, it can be forked. It has
happened before with bigger projects.
That's true but no one can do that on a whim and apparently (Redhat
Dev) the code is rediculously hard to follow and review. I believe the
ones who would do that will likely just start
On Fri, Aug 17, 2012 at 04:08:32AM -0500, C Anthony Risinger wrote:
initiatives like this are not removing choice
... Kinda.
This initiative doesn't remove choice. It is a natural consequence
of the greater linux ecosystem choosing to abandon some choices.
Am convinced that moving to systemd
On 17/08/2012 5:47 AM, Thomas Rand wrote:
Thank you for starting a thread that (crosses fingers) will stay rant
free intelligent.
After reading all the who-har in the other's I decided to install
systemd on my lappy TBH was very pleased with the result. That being
that the install itself was
On Fri, 17 Aug 2012 14:03:17 +0200
Rodrigo Rivas rodrigorivasco...@gmail.com wrote:
snip
Some people fear that if you use it you will be giving something to that
unknown project behind systemd.
But if it takes you where you don't want to go, it can be forked. It has
happened before with
On Fri, Aug 17, 2012 at 12:23 PM, te...@broletto.org te...@broletto.org wrote:
most of which are systems using systemd. Given that so many machines
are currently running systemd it can't be all that bad! This is of
How many machines are currently running Windows*?
Surely that is not
On Fri, Aug 17, 2012 at 4:08 AM, C Anthony Risinger anth...@xtfx.me wrote:
On Fri, Aug 17, 2012 at 2:57 AM, Geoff capstho...@yahoo.co.uk wrote:
On Thu, 16 Aug 2012 16:22:56 -0500
Myra Nelson myra.nel...@hughes.net wrote:
snip
I agree. I have read all the current threads and the few
On Fri, Aug 17, 2012 at 10:14 AM, mike cloaked mike.cloa...@gmail.com wrote:
On Thu, Aug 16, 2012 at 10:22 PM, Myra Nelson myra.nel...@hughes.net wrote:
of lib and lib64 to /usr/lib, I'm basically ambivalent. I still don't like
not being able to put /usr on a separate partition, I know there's
https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/Systemd#Arch_integration
Warning: /usr must be mounted and available at bootup (this is not
particular to systemd). If your /usr is on a separate partition, you
will need to make accommodations to mount it from the initramfs and
unmount it from a pivoted
I made the move to systemd on my flash drive install 2 days ago, and I
have to say I am impressed. The only extra thing I needed to do was to
write a unit file for espeakup, since there isn't yet a unit in the
package or in systemd-arch-units. Writing the new .service file was
extremely quick
2012/8/18 Kyle k...@gmx.ca:
I made the move to systemd on my flash drive install 2 days ago, and I have
to say I am impressed. The only extra thing I needed to do was to write a
unit file for espeakup, since there isn't yet a unit in the package or in
systemd-arch-units. Writing the new
There has been much ado on the arch-general mailing list about the move to
systemd. I participated in part of it, but like others finally tired of
seeing a dead horse kicked over and over and over. So much so that the
last dev who really paid attention to the list said goodbye. Yet the free
for
On Thu, Aug 16, 2012 at 4:22 PM, Myra Nelson myra.nel...@hughes.net wrote:
There has been much ado on the arch-general mailing list about the move to
systemd. I participated in part of it, but like others finally tired of
seeing a dead horse kicked over and over and over. So much so that the
On Thu, Aug 16, 2012 at 4:34 PM, Nicholas MIller nick.k...@gmail.comwrote:
On Thu, Aug 16, 2012 at 4:22 PM, Myra Nelson myra.nel...@hughes.net
wrote:
There has been much ado on the arch-general mailing list about the move
to
systemd. I participated in part of it, but like others finally
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