Re: Does HLASM use NOTE and POINT on UNIX files?

2022-03-31 Thread Schmitt, Michael
All I know is it was an IBM minicomputer, and there was no IT department running it. -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Assembler List On Behalf Of dave.g4...@gmail.com Sent: Thursday, March 31, 2022 12:06 PM To: ASSEMBLER-LIST@LISTSERV.UGA.EDU Subject: Re: Does HLASM use NOTE and P

Re: Does HLASM use NOTE and POINT on UNIX files?

2022-03-31 Thread Seymour J Metz
Cards, no, but TOS supports libraries on tape. Is anybody running TOS under Hercules or similar? -- Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz http://mason.gmu.edu/~smetz3 From: IBM Mainframe Assembler List [ASSEMBLER-LIST@LISTSERV.UGA.EDU] on behalf of Charles Mills [ch

Re: Does HLASM use NOTE and POINT on UNIX files?

2022-03-31 Thread Seymour J Metz
Which assembler. There was everything from BAL on BPS to Assembler (F) on OS. For DOS and OS, libraries were on DASD; for TOS they were on tape. Nothing supported COPY from cards. -- Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz http://mason.gmu.edu/~smetz3 From: IBM Mainfr

Re: Does HLASM use NOTE and POINT on UNIX files?

2022-03-31 Thread Dave Clark
"IBM Mainframe Assembler List" wrote on 03/31/2022 12:57:38 PM: > Good point. Maybe it was a System/36? The docs say System/36 became available in 1983 and was a flat-file system. The docs say System/38 became available in 1979 and was a built-in relational database system. That see

Re: Does HLASM use NOTE and POINT on UNIX files?

2022-03-31 Thread dave . g4ugm
> -Original Message- > From: IBM Mainframe Assembler List l...@listserv.uga.edu> On Behalf Of Schmitt, Michael > Sent: 31 March 2022 17:58 > To: ASSEMBLER-LIST@LISTSERV.UGA.EDU > Subject: Re: Does HLASM use NOTE and POINT on UNIX files? > > Good point. Maybe it was a System/36? I would h

Re: Does HLASM use NOTE and POINT on UNIX files?

2022-03-31 Thread Seymour J Metz
In the early 1960s disk drive were expensive and small; running from tape was the norm. By the time IBM shipped S/360, disk was much more affordable. I never ran into a TOS shop/ -- Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz http://mason.gmu.edu/~smetz3 From: IBM Mainfra

Re: Does HLASM use NOTE and POINT on UNIX files?

2022-03-31 Thread Seymour J Metz
The only change in PGM= is APF. JOBLIB, STEPLIB and SYSLIB used to be strictly PDS; no PDSE or Unix paths. For MFT and MVT there were multiple reader procs, and for MVT there was also the ASB reader. Load libraries could be on any DASD. I hope everybody used only disk and drum; I'd hate to see

Re: Does HLASM use NOTE and POINT on UNIX files?

2022-03-31 Thread Schmitt, Michael
Good point. Maybe it was a System/36? -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Assembler List On Behalf Of Dave Clark Sent: Thursday, March 31, 2022 11:53 AM To: ASSEMBLER-LIST@LISTSERV.UGA.EDU Subject: Re: Does HLASM use NOTE and POINT on UNIX files? "IBM Mainframe Assembler List" wrote

Re: Does HLASM use NOTE and POINT on UNIX files?

2022-03-31 Thread Dave Clark
"IBM Mainframe Assembler List" wrote on 03/31/2022 12:47:06 PM: > In 1980 I worked at a photofinishing plant that used punched cards > with an IBM minicomputer running AS/400. It also used paper tape, > but not with the AS/400. > > Can anyone guess why? I'll give a hint: it is industry workflo

Re: Does HLASM use NOTE and POINT on UNIX files?

2022-03-31 Thread Schmitt, Michael
In 1980 I worked at a photofinishing plant that used punched cards with an IBM minicomputer running AS/400. It also used paper tape, but not with the AS/400. Can anyone guess why? I'll give a hint: it is industry workflow related. -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Assembler List On

Re: Does HLASM use NOTE and POINT on UNIX files?

2022-03-31 Thread Charles Mills
My very first OSes were OS PCP and CP-67 back in 1969, but I did not do any serious OS/360 coding until around 1975. (I was coding for DOS/360 in the interim.) My recollection is that PGM= worked then more or less exactly as it does now. I don't recall about STEPLIB for sure -- I think then it was

Re: Does HLASM use NOTE and POINT on UNIX files?

2022-03-31 Thread Dave Clark
"IBM Mainframe Assembler List" wrote on 03/31/2022 12:01:21 PM: > On Mar 31, 2022, at 09:54:38, Schmitt, Michael wrote: > > How did the assembler originally work, back when punched cards > were used? I don't really know. > > > How did "EXEC PGM=..." originally work, back when punched cards were

Re: Does HLASM use NOTE and POINT on UNIX files?

2022-03-31 Thread Paul Gilmartin
On Mar 31, 2022, at 09:54:38, Schmitt, Michael wrote: > How did the assembler originally work, back when punched cards were used? I > don't really know. > How did "EXEC PGM=..." originally work, back when punched cards were used? I suspect SYSIN, but neither SYSLIB nor STEPLIB. -- gil

Re: Does HLASM use NOTE and POINT on UNIX files?

2022-03-31 Thread Charles Mills
I have done a LOT of assemblies from trays of cards. In DOS/360, in 1970, when I did so, COPY libraries were always on disk. This was even before spooling in DOS, so the assembler literally read from the card reader (well, called an access method that read card-by-card from the card reader). Th

Re: Does HLASM use NOTE and POINT on UNIX files?

2022-03-31 Thread Paul Gilmartin
On Mar 31, 2022, at 09:46:06, Charles Mills wrote: > > What language translator supports COPY members on cards (or in any other > sequential medium, for that matter)? > You didn't see the announcement for the new model card reader? -- gil

Re: Does HLASM use NOTE and POINT on UNIX files?

2022-03-31 Thread Schmitt, Michael
How did the assembler originally work, back when punched cards were used? I don't really know. -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Assembler List On Behalf Of Charles Mills Sent: Thursday, March 31, 2022 10:46 AM To: ASSEMBLER-LIST@LISTSERV.UGA.EDU Subject: Re: Does HLASM use NOTE a

Re: Does HLASM use NOTE and POINT on UNIX files?

2022-03-31 Thread Charles Mills
What language translator supports COPY members on cards (or in any other sequential medium, for that matter)? Charles -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Assembler List [mailto:ASSEMBLER-LIST@LISTSERV.UGA.EDU] On Behalf Of Schmitt, Michael Sent: Thursday, March 31, 2022 8:29 AM To:

Re: Does HLASM use NOTE and POINT on UNIX files?

2022-03-31 Thread Schmitt, Michael
A stack of file pointers doesn't work when you're reading the copy files from punched cards. 😉 -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Assembler List On Behalf Of Paul Gilmartin Sent: Thursday, March 31, 2022 9:54 AM To: ASSEMBLER-LIST@LISTSERV.UGA.EDU Subject: Re: Does HLASM use NOTE a

Re: Does HLASM use NOTE and POINT on UNIX files?

2022-03-31 Thread Jonathan Scott
Ref: Your note of Thu, 31 Mar 2022 08:45:00 -0600 gil writes: > What does HLASM in Linux for z do? I wouldn't expect NOTE and > POINT. On Linux, HLASM uses an interface module which maps the MVS supervisor and access method services which it uses to equivalent C library function calls (using th

Re: Does HLASM use NOTE and POINT on UNIX files?

2022-03-31 Thread Paul Gilmartin
On Mar 31, 2022, at 08:34:06, Bernd Oppolzer wrote: > > but, in general, when processing COPY instructions (or INCLUDE files, in > other languages), > you don't need such file positioning functions, because you can easily keep > files open > while processing other files which contain the COPY bo

Re: Does HLASM use NOTE and POINT on UNIX files?

2022-03-31 Thread Paul Gilmartin
On Mar 31, 2022, at 08:01:03, Jonathan Scott wrote: > > There was a problem with NOTE/POINT for large UNIX files in > SYSLIB which was fixed by access method APAR OA59500 in 2020: > https://www.ibm.com/support/pages/apar/OA59500 > > There were also earlier unrelated problems with UNIX files in >

Re: Does HLASM use NOTE and POINT on UNIX files?

2022-03-31 Thread Bernd Oppolzer
I cannot comment on the question concerning NOTE, POINT, ftell() and fseek(), but, in general, when processing COPY instructions (or INCLUDE files, in other languages), you don't need such file positioning functions, because you can easily keep files open while processing other files which con

Re: Does HLASM use NOTE and POINT on UNIX files?

2022-03-31 Thread Jonathan Scott
There was a problem with NOTE/POINT for large UNIX files in SYSLIB which was fixed by access method APAR OA59500 in 2020: https://www.ibm.com/support/pages/apar/OA59500 There were also earlier unrelated problems with UNIX files in SYSLIB such as an abend S112 which was triggered by access method s

Does HLASM use NOTE and POINT on UNIX files?

2022-03-31 Thread Paul Gilmartin
If SYSLIB contains UNIX directories and my program contains nested COPY instructions, does HLASM use NOTE and POINT to return to the point of the outer copy member? I know it took a couple APARs to get this finally working. Was the fix ini BPAM, or did HLASM resort to ftell() and fseek()? Or did