Re: [asterisk-users] Quick DUNDi Poll Questions, For All Asterisk, Users, Please Give Feedback
On Sun, Aug 19, 2007 at 09:00:33PM -0400, Matthew Brothers wrote: Questions: 1. Is the wiki DUNDi example and the dundi.conf file too difficult to follow for new users? I wouldn't exactly say that it is too difficult but that the target audience for the default examples is not the average person/entity that could make use of the power inherent with DUNDi. When an average * user/admin wants to use DUNDi they will want to start out small and local rather than worry about all of the intricacies of the e164 standard. It is much easier, in my opinion, to learn the power of DUNDi on a simple level and scale that up to a more globally connected platform. I'd say that duni.conf is a reference, and you expect it to be an introductory document. A reference should be comprehensive. It is best used after you've grasped the basic concepts, and together with a text search. Asterisk's sample configuration files actually serve a role of a reference. If you were to look for an introduction-level document in the asterisk source, you should have started in the /doc directory. Sadly the documentation there is close to non-existing at the moment: http://www.asterisk.org/doxygen/1.4/AstDUNDi.html How did I find that page? I went to the doxygen-generated documentation for 1.4: http://www.asterisk.org/doxygen/1.4/ In there, one non-trivial jump to the rest of the interesting documentation: Related Pages And there I can find some pretty handy documentation. If you have anything more to comment on that, I guess the place for that is either the (practically dead) asterisk-doc mailing list, or looking at some of the work done on the admin guide for 1.6 . (yeah, I know, patches are welcome, docs talk, whatever) -- Tzafrir Cohen icq#16849755jabber:[EMAIL PROTECTED] +972-50-7952406 mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.xorcom.com iax:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/tzafrir ___ --Bandwidth and Colocation Provided by http://www.api-digital.com-- asterisk-users mailing list To UNSUBSCRIBE or update options visit: http://lists.digium.com/mailman/listinfo/asterisk-users
Re: [asterisk-users] Quick DUNDi Poll Questions, For All Asterisk Users, Please Give Feedback
JR Richardson wrote: Questions: 1. Is the wiki DUNDi example and the dundi.conf file too difficult to follow for new users? 2. Does the complexity of the DUNDi setup discourage you from using it or even attempting to configure it? 3. If there was a simple tutorial, step by step guide with easy to setup and test examples, would this encourage more users to investigate and use DUNDi? I'm interested in putting together a new-user tutorial about DUNDi configuration and setup. There is a lot of great information, setup guides already but the feedback I get is that the current examples are a bit complicated to follow for new users. Your feedback is appreciated. Thanks. JR I just happened to spend some time this weekend messing with DUNDi after hearing the discussion on the asterisk users conference. I would say there is definitely room for improvement in the documentation. I did manage to get it working but there were a few things that would have helped me get moving more quickly: * I took me quite a while (and I'm still not sure I get it all) to understand what exactly a dundi context is. What are best-practices in naming them? Where else does this name get used? Something that showed the relationships between dundi context in the mappings section, the peers section and how it's used (and I mean more than just use a switch= statement) in the dialplan would be helpful. * Stating more clearly that the [mappings] section of dundi.conf determines how OTHER systems map dundi searches in a specific dundi context to extentions.conf contexts and how to connect to them on THIS system. * I had to guess a little bit about how to use dynamic peers. dundi.conf has a register=yes option but it doesn't specify how you told asterisk that it had a dynamic address. Knowing how it's done in IAX and SIP I just copied that syntax and it seemed to work. Also, an example with a dynamic peer would be helpful. I haven't gotten this far in testing, but if a site has a dynamic address how do you set up the IAX channel so the static side can contact the dynamic via IAX? As for your #2 and #3 questions: Once you have a basic understanding of what the components of DUNDi are and how they work I think it's only slightly more complex than setting up an IAX trunk between two systems. Which is all you're really doing anyway with some added features. I think simple examples showing you how to setup a DUNDi cloud with two systems that explained what each part of the config file accomplished would be very helpful to new users. A HOWTO that gives me a cookie cutter config file and says put host A address here, put host B address here... may get me a working setup but I still don't have any idea how to expand it without understanding it. My 2 cents anyway. -Dave ___ --Bandwidth and Colocation Provided by http://www.api-digital.com-- asterisk-users mailing list To UNSUBSCRIBE or update options visit: http://lists.digium.com/mailman/listinfo/asterisk-users
Re: [asterisk-users] Quick DUNDi Poll Questions, For All Asterisk, Users, Please Give Feedback
I wouldn't exactly say that it is too difficult but that the target audience for the default examples is not the average person/entity that could make use of the power inherent with DUNDi. When an average * user/admin wants to use DUNDi they will want to start out small and local rather than worry about all of the intricacies of the e164 standard. It is much easier, in my opinion, to learn the power of DUNDi on a simple level and scale that up to a more globally connected platform. I'd say that duni.conf is a reference, and you expect it to be an introductory document. A reference should be comprehensive. It is best used after you've grasped the basic concepts, and together with a text search. Asterisk's sample configuration files actually serve a role of a reference. The config files can be both a reference and an introduction. Look at sip.conf. Most of the examples in that file are relatively simple, what you would expect for a beginner to set up most of the time. There are also some more complex examples in that file. Lastly, the sip.conf file has a good section that explains pretty much any option that could be used in sip.conf. We should strive to make all of the conf files similar to sip.conf and iax.conf. I don't disagree with you that a separate intro document is needed but there is no reason that the conf files could not serve a broader purpose. Matthew Brothers ___ --Bandwidth and Colocation Provided by http://www.api-digital.com-- asterisk-users mailing list To UNSUBSCRIBE or update options visit: http://lists.digium.com/mailman/listinfo/asterisk-users
Re: [asterisk-users] Quick DUNDi Poll Questions, For All Asterisk, Users, Please Give Feedback
On Mon, Aug 20, 2007 at 09:26:00AM -0400, Matthew Brothers wrote: I wouldn't exactly say that it is too difficult but that the target audience for the default examples is not the average person/entity that could make use of the power inherent with DUNDi. When an average * user/admin wants to use DUNDi they will want to start out small and local rather than worry about all of the intricacies of the e164 standard. It is much easier, in my opinion, to learn the power of DUNDi on a simple level and scale that up to a more globally connected platform. I'd say that duni.conf is a reference, and you expect it to be an introductory document. A reference should be comprehensive. It is best used after you've grasped the basic concepts, and together with a text search. Asterisk's sample configuration files actually serve a role of a reference. The config files can be both a reference and an introduction. Look at sip.conf. Most of the examples in that file are relatively simple, what you would expect for a beginner to set up most of the time. There are also some more complex examples in that file. Lastly, the sip.conf file has a good section that explains pretty much any option that could be used in sip.conf. We should strive to make all of the conf files similar to sip.conf and iax.conf. It explains the configuration file. But it does not explain the SIP channel. And it is very very long. way too long to be useful for a beginner. Also, if you have NAT issues, what makes you think you should actually have a look in the section for media handling. What exactly is the meaning of path there? What does user mean? What does peer mean? A simple text-search in the document is not useful enough, as those two words appear in different contexts as well. This file has a lots of useful information. But it will not be useful enough to a novice admin without a nicer introduction. (But then again, if anybody wishes to write something, I won't say no) I don't disagree with you that a separate intro document is needed but there is no reason that the conf files could not serve a broader purpose. One obvious reason: it gets in the way of the original role as sample config files. If you have a huge sip.conf , you can't manage it. (even if you heard if 'grep -v ^; filename.conf') -- Tzafrir Cohen icq#16849755jabber:[EMAIL PROTECTED] +972-50-7952406 mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.xorcom.com iax:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/tzafrir ___ --Bandwidth and Colocation Provided by http://www.api-digital.com-- asterisk-users mailing list To UNSUBSCRIBE or update options visit: http://lists.digium.com/mailman/listinfo/asterisk-users
Re: [asterisk-users] Quick DUNDi Poll Questions, For All Asterisk, Users, Please Give Feedback
On 8/20/07, Tzafrir Cohen [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: (But then again, if anybody wishes to write something, I won't say no) So why all the verbiage? JR offered a valuable service to the community, I see no downside to this. If anyone doesn't care for the idea they can just ignore it. A lot of people including me will applaud his efforts. Over the years I've read these mailing lists, many people have done a lot for the community and the state of the art of asterisk without writing a single line of code. I think that's great and I'm sure Mark Spencer would agree. ___ --Bandwidth and Colocation Provided by http://www.api-digital.com-- asterisk-users mailing list To UNSUBSCRIBE or update options visit: http://lists.digium.com/mailman/listinfo/asterisk-users
Re: [asterisk-users] Quick DUNDi Poll Questions, For All Asterisk, Users, Please Give Feedback
On 8/20/07, Tzafrir Cohen [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: In an attempt to understand why there are no better docs inside asterisk. Well, we're all on the same page then :) My opinion, summed up into a sentence would be that the people who create the code have *mostly* commented the main conf files very well. So well (oh heck, I said one sentence) that they are filled with stuff you probably won't use as in sip.conf or in the case of the last features.conf I looked at, totally incomprehensible. Documentation is obviously the process of documenting and will often be terse and to the point. OTH, I think the words tutorial, guide, manual, how-to and cookbook should be most welcome! I hope a thousand JR's write a thousand tutorials on a thousand aspects of asterisk! We'll get them all talking on http://www.AsteriskUsersConference.org /r ___ --Bandwidth and Colocation Provided by http://www.api-digital.com-- asterisk-users mailing list To UNSUBSCRIBE or update options visit: http://lists.digium.com/mailman/listinfo/asterisk-users
Re: [asterisk-users] Quick DUNDi Poll Questions, For All Asterisk Users, Please Give Feedback
In article [EMAIL PROTECTED], Mike Clark [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Tony Mountifield wrote: Where can I find this paper? If you mean the one at voip-magazine, the links to it that I have found no longer seem to work. Tony: I believe this is it: http://www.astricon.net/files/usa06/Friday-General_Conference/JR_Richardson_Whitepaper.pdf Mike, many thanks for that - I have it now! Cheers Tony -- Tony Mountifield Work: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - http://www.softins.co.uk Play: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - http://tony.mountifield.org ___ --Bandwidth and Colocation Provided by http://www.api-digital.com-- asterisk-users mailing list To UNSUBSCRIBE or update options visit: http://lists.digium.com/mailman/listinfo/asterisk-users
Re: [asterisk-users] Quick DUNDi Poll Questions, For All Asterisk, Users, Please Give Feedback
Questions: 1. Is the wiki DUNDi example and the dundi.conf file too difficult to follow for new users? I wouldn't exactly say that it is too difficult but that the target audience for the default examples is not the average person/entity that could make use of the power inherent with DUNDi. When an average * user/admin wants to use DUNDi they will want to start out small and local rather than worry about all of the intricacies of the e164 standard. It is much easier, in my opinion, to learn the power of DUNDi on a simple level and scale that up to a more globally connected platform. 2. Does the complexity of the DUNDi setup discourage you from using it or even attempting to configure it? I don't see this as the case. Most people who use * are comfortable with the level of complexity that is present in DUNDi, they just don't know where to start. 3. If there was a simple tutorial, step by step guide with easy to setup and test examples, would this encourage more users to investigate and use DUNDi? Absolutely. If you need any help in putting this together or if you simply need people to review a tutorial, I would be glad to assist. I'm interested in putting together a new-user tutorial about DUNDi configuration and setup. There is a lot of great information, setup guides already but the feedback I get is that the current examples are a bit complicated to follow for new users. Thank you for being a part of the conference last Friday. Your participation is greatly appreciated. Matthew Brothers ___ --Bandwidth and Colocation Provided by http://www.api-digital.com-- asterisk-users mailing list To UNSUBSCRIBE or update options visit: http://lists.digium.com/mailman/listinfo/asterisk-users
Re: [asterisk-users] Quick DUNDi Poll Questions, For All Asterisk Users, Please Give Feedback
On Aug 17, 2007, at 3:34 PM, JR Richardson wrote: Questions: 1. Is the wiki DUNDi example and the dundi.conf file too difficult to follow for new users? difficult enough to impede playing with it, to many things to do during a regular day, meaning, I won't go thru it unless I am desperate to use it, 2. Does the complexity of the DUNDi setup discourage you from using it or even attempting to configure it? ditto, 3. If there was a simple tutorial, step by step guide with easy to setup and test examples, would this encourage more users to investigate and use DUNDi? a cookbook, step by step to make all average Joes DUNDI with another friend's * box I'm interested in putting together a new-user tutorial about DUNDi configuration and setup. There is a lot of great information, setup guides already but the feedback I get is that the current examples are a bit complicated to follow for new users. yep, please disclose the secret handshake to get a hold of clear documentation, that's just humor, everybody appreciates open source free software at whatever level, Your feedback is appreciated. Thanks. JR -- JR Richardson Engineering for the Masses ___ --Bandwidth and Colocation Provided by http://www.api-digital.com-- asterisk-users mailing list To UNSUBSCRIBE or update options visit: http://lists.digium.com/mailman/listinfo/asterisk-users Andres Paglayan --Harmony is more important than being right Bapak ___ --Bandwidth and Colocation Provided by http://www.api-digital.com-- asterisk-users mailing list To UNSUBSCRIBE or update options visit: http://lists.digium.com/mailman/listinfo/asterisk-users
Re: [asterisk-users] Quick DUNDi Poll Questions, For All Asterisk Users, Please Give Feedback
In article [EMAIL PROTECTED], Mike Clark [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: JR Richardson wrote: I'm interested in putting together a new-user tutorial about DUNDi configuration and setup. There is a lot of great information, setup guides already but the feedback I get is that the current examples are a bit complicated to follow for new users. Your feedback is appreciated. I just got DUNDi up and going it the past couple of weeks. Your whitepaper on DUNDi and realtime clustering was the only way I would have gotten it up. Where can I find this paper? If you mean the one at voip-magazine, the links to it that I have found no longer seem to work. Cheers Tony -- Tony Mountifield Work: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - http://www.softins.co.uk Play: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - http://tony.mountifield.org ___ --Bandwidth and Colocation Provided by http://www.api-digital.com-- asterisk-users mailing list To UNSUBSCRIBE or update options visit: http://lists.digium.com/mailman/listinfo/asterisk-users
Re: [asterisk-users] Quick DUNDi Poll Questions, For All Asterisk Users, Please Give Feedback
On 8/17/07, JR Richardson [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Questions: 1. Is the wiki DUNDi example and the dundi.conf file too difficult to follow for new users? 2. Does the complexity of the DUNDi setup discourage you from using it or even attempting to configure it? 3. If there was a simple tutorial, step by step guide with easy to setup and test examples, would this encourage more users to investigate and use DUNDi? Hi JR, It was great to have you on the conference, thanks again for participating. Those who missed can hear your talk at http://asteriskusersconference.org/latest.htm I would very much welcome your efforts to make a tutorial on the subject and I'm sure the community would be happy to see it happen as well. /r ___ --Bandwidth and Colocation Provided by http://www.api-digital.com-- asterisk-users mailing list To UNSUBSCRIBE or update options visit: http://lists.digium.com/mailman/listinfo/asterisk-users
Re: [asterisk-users] Quick DUNDi Poll Questions, For All Asterisk Users, Please Give Feedback
Tony Mountifield wrote: In article [EMAIL PROTECTED], Mike Clark [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: JR Richardson wrote: I'm interested in putting together a new-user tutorial about DUNDi configuration and setup. There is a lot of great information, setup guides already but the feedback I get is that the current examples are a bit complicated to follow for new users. Your feedback is appreciated. I just got DUNDi up and going it the past couple of weeks. Your whitepaper on DUNDi and realtime clustering was the only way I would have gotten it up. Where can I find this paper? If you mean the one at voip-magazine, the links to it that I have found no longer seem to work. Cheers Tony Tony: I believe this is it: http://www.astricon.net/files/usa06/Friday-General_Conference/JR_Richardson_Whitepaper.pdf Mike Clark ___ --Bandwidth and Colocation Provided by http://www.api-digital.com-- asterisk-users mailing list To UNSUBSCRIBE or update options visit: http://lists.digium.com/mailman/listinfo/asterisk-users
[asterisk-users] Quick DUNDi Poll Questions, For All Asterisk Users, Please Give Feedback
Questions: 1. Is the wiki DUNDi example and the dundi.conf file too difficult to follow for new users? 2. Does the complexity of the DUNDi setup discourage you from using it or even attempting to configure it? 3. If there was a simple tutorial, step by step guide with easy to setup and test examples, would this encourage more users to investigate and use DUNDi? I'm interested in putting together a new-user tutorial about DUNDi configuration and setup. There is a lot of great information, setup guides already but the feedback I get is that the current examples are a bit complicated to follow for new users. Your feedback is appreciated. Thanks. JR -- JR Richardson Engineering for the Masses ___ --Bandwidth and Colocation Provided by http://www.api-digital.com-- asterisk-users mailing list To UNSUBSCRIBE or update options visit: http://lists.digium.com/mailman/listinfo/asterisk-users
Re: [asterisk-users] Quick DUNDi Poll Questions, For All Asterisk Users, Please Give Feedback
1. Yes 2. Yes 3. Yes Nice sales pitch, sounds like one of those late night get rich now! schemes. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of JR Richardson Sent: Friday, August 17, 2007 4:35 PM To: asterisk-users@lists.digium.com Subject: [asterisk-users] Quick DUNDi Poll Questions, For All Asterisk Users, Please Give Feedback Questions: 1. Is the wiki DUNDi example and the dundi.conf file too difficult to follow for new users? 2. Does the complexity of the DUNDi setup discourage you from using it or even attempting to configure it? 3. If there was a simple tutorial, step by step guide with easy to setup and test examples, would this encourage more users to investigate and use DUNDi? I'm interested in putting together a new-user tutorial about DUNDi configuration and setup. There is a lot of great information, setup guides already but the feedback I get is that the current examples are a bit complicated to follow for new users. Your feedback is appreciated. Thanks. JR -- JR Richardson Engineering for the Masses ___ --Bandwidth and Colocation Provided by http://www.api-digital.com-- asterisk-users mailing list To UNSUBSCRIBE or update options visit: http://lists.digium.com/mailman/listinfo/asterisk-users -- This message has been scanned for viruses and dangerous content by MailScanner, and is believed to be clean. This e-mail, facsimile, or letter and any files or attachments transmitted with it contains information that is confidential and privileged. This information is intended only for the use of the individual(s) and entity(ies) to whom it is addressed. If you are the intended recipient, further disclosures are prohibited without proper authorization. If you are not the intended recipient, any disclosure, copying, printing, or use of this information is strictly prohibited and possibly a violation of federal or state law and regulations. If you have received this information in error, please notify Texas Health Management Group immediately at 1-817-310-4999. Texas Health Management Group, its subsidiaries, and affiliates hereby claim all applicable privileges related to this information. -- This message has been scanned for viruses and dangerous content by MailScanner, and is believed to be clean. ___ --Bandwidth and Colocation Provided by http://www.api-digital.com-- asterisk-users mailing list To UNSUBSCRIBE or update options visit: http://lists.digium.com/mailman/listinfo/asterisk-users
Re: [asterisk-users] Quick DUNDi Poll Questions, For All Asterisk Users, Please Give Feedback
-Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:asterisk-users- [EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of JR Richardson Sent: Friday, August 17, 2007 4:35 PM To: asterisk-users@lists.digium.com Subject: [asterisk-users] Quick DUNDi Poll Questions, For All Asterisk Users,Please Give Feedback Questions: 1. Is the wiki DUNDi example and the dundi.conf file too difficult to follow for new users? 2. Does the complexity of the DUNDi setup discourage you from using it or even attempting to configure it? 3. If there was a simple tutorial, step by step guide with easy to setup and test examples, would this encourage more users to investigate and use DUNDi? I'm interested in putting together a new-user tutorial about DUNDi configuration and setup. There is a lot of great information, setup guides already but the feedback I get is that the current examples are a bit complicated to follow for new users. Your feedback is appreciated. Thanks. JR -- JR Richardson Engineering for the Masses JR, I'd love to see some tutorials on how to setup DUNDi that are aimed at people who have little experience with DUNDi (that's me). Bobby ___ --Bandwidth and Colocation Provided by http://www.api-digital.com-- asterisk-users mailing list To UNSUBSCRIBE or update options visit: http://lists.digium.com/mailman/listinfo/asterisk-users
Re: [asterisk-users] Quick DUNDi Poll Questions, For All Asterisk Users, Please Give Feedback
JR Richardson wrote: Questions: 1. Is the wiki DUNDi example and the dundi.conf file too difficult to follow for new users? 2. Does the complexity of the DUNDi setup discourage you from using it or even attempting to configure it? 3. If there was a simple tutorial, step by step guide with easy to setup and test examples, would this encourage more users to investigate and use DUNDi? I'm interested in putting together a new-user tutorial about DUNDi configuration and setup. There is a lot of great information, setup guides already but the feedback I get is that the current examples are a bit complicated to follow for new users. Your feedback is appreciated. Thanks. JR JR I just got DUNDi up and going it the past couple of weeks. Your whitepaper on DUNDi and realtime clustering was the only way I would have gotten it up. Everything else on the wiki is simply too complicated and not well explained. And it still wasn't a piece of cake, even with you document. So yes, additional cookbook type documents that thoroughly explain things should greatly help adoption. Mike Clark ___ --Bandwidth and Colocation Provided by http://www.api-digital.com-- asterisk-users mailing list To UNSUBSCRIBE or update options visit: http://lists.digium.com/mailman/listinfo/asterisk-users
Re: [asterisk-users] Quick DUNDi Poll Questions, For All Asterisk Users, Please Give Feedback
On Friday 17 August 2007 04:34:33 pm JR Richardson wrote: Questions: 1. Is the wiki DUNDi example and the dundi.conf file too difficult to follow for new users? it's a bit complicated, though it seems to make sense for large-scale ops. 2. Does the complexity of the DUNDi setup discourage you from using it or even attempting to configure it? what would also encourage me is if dundi.com would be updated, etc. when setting up dundi, i feel as if i'm entering an underground secret society where no one really wants to share much. this leads me to feel as though it's not something that's actively developed/used in the usa, outside of (intra)corporations. i see lots of e164 dundi activity in europe, but not here, why? 3. If there was a simple tutorial, step by step guide with easy to setup and test examples, would this encourage more users to investigate and use DUNDi? this would help a lot. also, since dundi is peer based, it would be nice if dundi.com or some central place could get new users introduced to finding peers, etc. even people on the dundi.com list of tier 1 peers don't respond to emails, etc. i heard your talk today! thanks again for your help. -- Anthony - http://messinet.com - http://messinet.com/~amessina/gallery 8F89 5E72 8DF0 BCF0 10BE 9967 92DC 35DC B001 4A4E signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part. ___ --Bandwidth and Colocation Provided by http://www.api-digital.com-- asterisk-users mailing list To UNSUBSCRIBE or update options visit: http://lists.digium.com/mailman/listinfo/asterisk-users
Re: [asterisk-users] Quick DUNDi Poll Questions, For All Asterisk Users, Please Give Feedback
On Fri, Aug 17, 2007 at 04:34:33PM -0500, JR Richardson wrote: Questions: 1. Is the wiki DUNDi example and the dundi.conf file too difficult to follow for new users? You imply that both need fixing 2. Does the complexity of the DUNDi setup discourage you from using it or even attempting to configure it? 3. If there was a simple tutorial, step by step guide with easy to setup and test examples, would this encourage more users to investigate and use DUNDi? And then suggest to fix the problem elsewhere. If there was such a tutorial, it would be half-frustrated before I would have even heard of it. Which brings another set of questions: 1. Is it difficult to add documentation to the wiki? 2. Is it difficult to add documentation to the Asterisk source? -- Tzafrir Cohen icq#16849755jabber:[EMAIL PROTECTED] +972-50-7952406 mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.xorcom.com iax:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/tzafrir ___ --Bandwidth and Colocation Provided by http://www.api-digital.com-- asterisk-users mailing list To UNSUBSCRIBE or update options visit: http://lists.digium.com/mailman/listinfo/asterisk-users
