Re: Spec explanations for Pebble?

2005-08-13 Thread Simon Brown

Graham Parks [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
 
 On 12 Aug 2005, at 9:16 am, Carey Evans wrote:
 
  First, where does the spec actually say that the atom:id shouldn't
  change if the blog moves to a different domain?  I think that if the
  URL of the blog changes, it means that the Atom Feed Document has been
  relocated so the ID should stay the same, but Simon doesn't see this
  in the spec.
 
 Section 4.2.6, paragraph 3:
 
an atom:id element pertains to all instantiations of a particular
 Atom entry or feed; revisions retain the same content in their
 atom:id elements. It is suggested that the atom:id element be
 stored along with the associated resource.
 
 If an Atom document is a feed of the same blog, then even if the blog  
 has moved, the id should stay the same. What makes you think otherwise?

That same paragraph starts, When an Atom Document is relocated, migrated,
syndicated, republished, exported or imported, the content of its atom:id
element MUST NOT change.. For me, this paragraph talks about the *Atom
Document* moving, rather than the content that it represents (i.e. a blog). Mark
Pilgrim has a great article about Atom IDs and towards the end of it goes on to
talk about the same entry in multiple feeds
(http://diveintomark.org/archives/2004/05/28/howto-atom-id#multiple), although
that's not what I'm talking about here.

Just to quote an example, Tim is currently using URL based Atom IDs, such as :

idhttp://www.tbray.org/ongoing//id
idhttp://www.tbray.org/ongoing/When/200x/2005/08/09/Web-2.0/id

If Tim *moves* his blog to www.timbray.com/ongoing, would you expect his Atom
IDs to remain the same? Spec aside, this has some implications for storing Atom
IDs next to content they identify, which I imagine doesn't happen in most CMS
tools at the moment.

  Second, what sort of values should be used for the scheme attribute on
  the category?  Looking at http://www.tbray.org/ongoing/ongoing.atom as
  an authoritative example, it seems that the scheme should be the same
  for all categories, but Pebble uses the URL of the individual category
  page.  The spec doesn't say, so does it matter?
 
 Section 4.2.2.2:
 
 The scheme attribute is an IRI that identifies a  
 categorization scheme.
 
 categorization scheme means the system used to categorize entries.  
 Presumably each blog has its own system for doing so, so the scheme  
 attribute should be the same for all posts from the same blog, and  
 unique to the blog.

The categorization scheme is a little confusing, although looking at Tim's feed
and a few others has cleared up in my mind what I should be using. Basically, I
was using this

category term=pebble label=pebble
scheme=http://www.simongbrown.com/blog/tags/pebble; /

rather than this (notice the shorter scheme)

category term=pebble label=pebble
scheme=http://www.simongbrown.com/blog/tags/; /

Are there any recommendations as to that the scheme attribute should be and what
it might be used for?

Simon



atom:id spec bug

2005-08-13 Thread Graham


Simon brown raises a valid point on the Spec explanations for  
Pebble? thread:


  That same paragraph starts, When an Atom Document is relocated,  
migrated,
  syndicated, republished, exported or imported, the content of its  
atom:id
  element MUST NOT change.. For me, this paragraph talks about the  
*Atom
  Document* moving, rather than the content that it represents (i.e.  
a blog).


Perhaps we could add or its associated resource after Atom Document?

Graham



Re: Spec explanations for Pebble?

2005-08-13 Thread Tim Bray


On Aug 13, 2005, at 1:34 AM, Simon Brown wrote:

Just to quote an example, Tim is currently using URL based Atom  
IDs, such as :


idhttp://www.tbray.org/ongoing//id
idhttp://www.tbray.org/ongoing/When/200x/2005/08/09/Web-2.0/id

If Tim *moves* his blog to www.timbray.com/ongoing, would you  
expect his Atom

IDs to remain the same?


Absolutely, otherwise everyone who subscribes to me is going to see  
all the same old articles again, exactly what atom:id exists to  
prevent.  The fact that I use HTTP URIs for identifiers reflects my  
belief that good Web citizenship requires that once something is  
published and its URI widely disseminated, it should never ever be  
moved; so in my case this scenario is unlikely to arise. -Tim