Re: [backstage] First BBC Backstage Podcast: DRM and the BBC
At 00:36 +0100 21/2/07, Dave Crossland wrote: On 20/02/07, Gordon Joly [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: At 15:18 + 19/2/07, Matthew Cashmore wrote: Hi Gordon - nope an honest as you like Creative Commons Licence - no BBC fudge at all. I was thinking of the Creative Archive Licence which is a BBC fudge. I'm not sure why you'd think this, or why there was uncertainty over which CC license was in use: Both are licensed under creative commons attribution. - http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/news/archives/2007/02/bbc_backstage_p_1.html -- Regards, Dave Thanks Dave. Now I understand. This is a major step Gordo -- Think Feynman/ http://pobox.com/~gordo/ [EMAIL PROTECTED]/// - Sent via the backstage.bbc.co.uk discussion group. To unsubscribe, please visit http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/mailing_list.html. Unofficial list archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk/
Re: [backstage] First BBC Backstage Podcast: DRM and the BBC
On 21/02/07, Gordon Joly [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Thanks Dave. Now I understand. This is a major step Yes, Ian and Matthew are really showing how things should be done! :-) -- Regards, Dave - Sent via the backstage.bbc.co.uk discussion group. To unsubscribe, please visit http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/mailing_list.html. Unofficial list archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk/
Re: [backstage] First BBC Backstage Podcast: DRM and the BBC
Hi Gordon :-) We're using Creative Commons Attribution 2.0 - details here http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by/2.0/ m Why not the new version of the Attribution license? ( http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by/2.5/ ) Is there a bit difference? jonh
Re: [backstage] First BBC Backstage Podcast: DRM and the BBC
On 20/02/07, John Wesley [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: We're using Creative Commons Attribution 2.0 - details here Why not the new version of the Attribution license? ( http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by/2.5/ ) Is there a bit difference? No, because you can upgrade CC licenses to the latest versions yourself. -- Regards, Dave - Sent via the backstage.bbc.co.uk discussion group. To unsubscribe, please visit http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/mailing_list.html. Unofficial list archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk/
Re: [backstage] First BBC Backstage Podcast: DRM and the BBC
On 20/02/07, Gordon Joly [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: At 15:18 + 19/2/07, Matthew Cashmore wrote: Hi Gordon - nope an honest as you like Creative Commons Licence - no BBC fudge at all. I was thinking of the Creative Archive Licence which is a BBC fudge. I'm not sure why you'd think this, or why there was uncertainty over which CC license was in use: Both are licensed under creative commons attribution. - http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/news/archives/2007/02/bbc_backstage_p_1.html -- Regards, Dave - Sent via the backstage.bbc.co.uk discussion group. To unsubscribe, please visit http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/mailing_list.html. Unofficial list archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk/
Re: [backstage] First BBC Backstage Podcast: DRM and the BBC
The automation means that you don't lose any focus. Erm right, I mean, apart from the time you spend building the automation into your production process. And then fixing it when it goes wrong. And patching and sysadmining the servers running the automation. And having someone who understands how to support the system. And briefing your customer service team about it in case they get queries etc etc On 18/02/07, Dave Crossland [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On 18/02/07, James Cridland [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: It's possible for all our podcasts to be produced in Ogg Vorbis automatically, too. ... Ultimately, no organisation can spend time servicing 0.01% of people without losing focus for the 99.99% of people. The automation means that you don't lose any focus. -- Regards, Dave - Sent via the backstage.bbc.co.uk discussion group. To unsubscribe, please visit http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/mailing_list.html. Unofficial list archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk/ -- Martin Belam - http://www.currybet.net - Sent via the backstage.bbc.co.uk discussion group. To unsubscribe, please visit http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/mailing_list.html. Unofficial list archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk/
RE: [backstage] First BBC Backstage Podcast: DRM and the BBC
It's okay we're not automating it ;-) I did it by hand... The old fashioned way... The way my Grandfather thought me Well you get the point - it took me all of 3 minutes to do, and given our audience... BUT the interesting point is... Downloads wise this is how it stacks up... MP3 - 5117 OGG - 643 WAV - 38 -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Martin Belam Sent: 19 February 2007 09:15 To: backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk Subject: Re: [backstage] First BBC Backstage Podcast: DRM and the BBC The automation means that you don't lose any focus. Erm right, I mean, apart from the time you spend building the automation into your production process. And then fixing it when it goes wrong. And patching and sysadmining the servers running the automation. And having someone who understands how to support the system. And briefing your customer service team about it in case they get queries etc etc On 18/02/07, Dave Crossland [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On 18/02/07, James Cridland [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: It's possible for all our podcasts to be produced in Ogg Vorbis automatically, too. ... Ultimately, no organisation can spend time servicing 0.01% of people without losing focus for the 99.99% of people. The automation means that you don't lose any focus. -- Regards, Dave - Sent via the backstage.bbc.co.uk discussion group. To unsubscribe, please visit http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/mailing_list.html. Unofficial list archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk/ -- Martin Belam - http://www.currybet.net - Sent via the backstage.bbc.co.uk discussion group. To unsubscribe, please visit http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/mailing_list.html. Unofficial list archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk/ - Sent via the backstage.bbc.co.uk discussion group. To unsubscribe, please visit http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/mailing_list.html. Unofficial list archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk/
Re: [backstage] First BBC Backstage Podcast: DRM and the BBC
On 2/14/07, Dave Crossland [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On 14/02/07, David McBride [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Indeed, this seems particularly pointless when I can simply point my desk antenna at the Crystal Palace transmitter and record the 20Mbaud H.2641080p stream being broadcast in clear. This is the kind of thing I think the BBC should be telling rights holders :-) They are only too aware of this: which is why they want to start slapping DRM all over free-to-air broadcasts: http://www.informationweek.com/showArticle.jhtml?articleID=196901261 Pointing out to rights-holders that we're giving your content away anyway is probably going to be replied-to with well, stop it. -- http://james.cridland.net/
Re: [backstage] First BBC Backstage Podcast: DRM and the BBC
On 2/13/07, Dave Crossland [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I also note that its been published in the free software, open standard, cross platform ogg vorbis format as well as MP3, and hope this demonstrates that such formats do indeed exist - As I said in the show, I think that everything the BBC is publishing as MP3 can also be made available as OGG :-) Yes, it can be. However, nobody's interested. My employer has been making an Ogg Vorbis stream available for years (indeed, if you visit www.virginradio.co.uk/listen from any Linux box, it's the default choice). Currently, less than 0.01% of our online listeners use it. It's possible for all our podcasts to be produced in Ogg Vorbis automatically, too. Indeed, all our on-demand audio is already encoded into Ogg Vorbis, for when it becomes a popular codec (and we're still waiting). Ultimately, no organisation can spend time servicing 0.01% of people without losing focus for the 99.99% of people. -- http://james.cridland.net/
Re: [backstage] First BBC Backstage Podcast: DRM and the BBC
On 18/02/07, James Cridland [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: It's possible for all our podcasts to be produced in Ogg Vorbis automatically, too. ... Ultimately, no organisation can spend time servicing 0.01% of people without losing focus for the 99.99% of people. The automation means that you don't lose any focus. -- Regards, Dave - Sent via the backstage.bbc.co.uk discussion group. To unsubscribe, please visit http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/mailing_list.html. Unofficial list archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk/
Re: [backstage] First BBC Backstage Podcast: DRM and the BBC
not *exactly*... the 'it was too popular for its own good' refers to various local radio stations having their bandwidth soaked up due to people downloading stuff... not good for business, that... It didn't do much for productivity either as I recall - I think at the point my team blagged two or three accounts on the internal beta thing we must have wasted about five hours (=several people's licence fee) going effing hell, you can download x, effing hell, you can download y, effing hell, all of the sports programming etc etc I've got a similar experience here at Sony at the moment, where my test account on various live Vodafone services around europe in 'theory' means I have free access to a back catalogue of 500,000+ tracks that I can download for nowt onto my work laptop. Now, if I can just work out how to get the DRM off them ;-) cheers, martin www.currybet.net - Sent via the backstage.bbc.co.uk discussion group. To unsubscribe, please visit http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/mailing_list.html. Unofficial list archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk/
Re: [backstage] First BBC Backstage Podcast: DRM and the BBC
Greetings, Interesting discussion - primarily useful for the we don't have the rights arguments that haven't been effectively aired until now. The reason for using DRM has often been stated thus: * We need to prevent our users from re-distributing content that we feed them. However, it now appears clear that the real reason is thus: * We have to be seen to be trying to do something to prevent our users re-distributing content. Given that no DRM scheme has _ever_ met the goal of preventing users re-distributing content, would it not be better for the BBC, consumers and pretty much everyone (except perhaps MS) in the long-run if the BBC simply denounced DRM as the snake-oil it is and refuse to deploy it? Indeed, this seems particularly pointless when I can simply point my desk antenna at the Crystal Palace transmitter and record the 20Mbaud H.264 1080p stream being broadcast in clear. Cheers, David -- David McBride [EMAIL PROTECTED] Department of Computing, Imperial College, London - Sent via the backstage.bbc.co.uk discussion group. To unsubscribe, please visit http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/mailing_list.html. Unofficial list archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk/
Re: [backstage] First BBC Backstage Podcast: DRM and the BBC
On 14/02/07, David McBride [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Indeed, this seems particularly pointless when I can simply point my desk antenna at the Crystal Palace transmitter and record the 20Mbaud H.264 1080p stream being broadcast in clear. This is the kind of thing I think the BBC should be telling rights holders :-) -- Regards, Dave - Sent via the backstage.bbc.co.uk discussion group. To unsubscribe, please visit http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/mailing_list.html. Unofficial list archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk/
Re: [backstage] First BBC Backstage Podcast: DRM and the BBC
Indeed, this seems particularly pointless when I can simply point my desk antenna at the Crystal Palace transmitter and record the 20Mbaud H.264 1080p stream being broadcast in clear. This is the kind of thing I think the BBC should be telling rights holders :-) http://strange.corante.com/archives/2006/05/17/xtech_2006_tom_loosemore_treating_digital_broadcast_as_just_another_api_and_other_such_ruminations.php - Sent via the backstage.bbc.co.uk discussion group. To unsubscribe, please visit http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/mailing_list.html. Unofficial list archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk/
RE: [backstage] First BBC Backstage Podcast: DRM and the BBC
Indeed, this seems particularly pointless when I can simply point my desk antenna at the Crystal Palace transmitter and record the 20Mbaud H.264 1080p stream being broadcast in clear. This is the kind of thing I think the BBC should be telling rights holders :-) Perhaps we could get some of these superannuated lovvies to perform in some form of drama serial - something on Radio 4 first and then have Alan Yentob doing something lovvie about DRM on BBC one. All we would need then is an In Out Time on Digital Rights Management! Anyway, Ofcom have published 'A new approach to public service content in the digital media age': http://www.ofcom.org.uk/media/news/2007/01/nr_20070124a http://www.ofcom.org.uk/consult/condocs/pspnewapproach/ Brian Butterworth www.ukfree.tv Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.441 / Virus Database: 268.17.39/685 - Release Date: 13/02/2007 22:01 - Sent via the backstage.bbc.co.uk discussion group. To unsubscribe, please visit http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/mailing_list.html. Unofficial list archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk/
Re: [backstage] First BBC Backstage Podcast: DRM and the BBC
Hi Tom! On 14/02/07, Tom Loosemore [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Indeed, this seems particularly pointless when I can simply point my desk antenna at the Crystal Palace transmitter and record the 20Mbaud H.264 1080p stream being broadcast in clear. This is the kind of thing I think the BBC should be telling rights holders :-) http://strange.corante.com/archives/2006/05/17/xtech_2006_tom_loosemore_treating_digital_broadcast_as_just_another_api_and_other_such_ruminations.php *Very* interesting - thanks for linking this up. Do you mean to imply that rightsholders have been approached with tales of Was fantastic, but had to limit it to a couple of hundred people within the BBC. Was a bit too popular for their own good and they turned it down? -- Regards, Dave - Sent via the backstage.bbc.co.uk discussion group. To unsubscribe, please visit http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/mailing_list.html. Unofficial list archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk/
Re: [backstage] First BBC Backstage Podcast: DRM and the BBC
On 14/02/07, Dave Crossland [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi Tom! On 14/02/07, Tom Loosemore [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Indeed, this seems particularly pointless when I can simply point my desk antenna at the Crystal Palace transmitter and record the 20Mbaud H.264 1080p stream being broadcast in clear. This is the kind of thing I think the BBC should be telling rights holders :-) http://strange.corante.com/archives/2006/05/17/xtech_2006_tom_loosemore_treating_digital_broadcast_as_just_another_api_and_other_such_ruminations.php *Very* interesting - thanks for linking this up. Do you mean to imply that rightsholders have been approached with tales of Was fantastic, but had to limit it to a couple of hundred people within the BBC. Was a bit too popular for their own good and they turned it down? not *exactly*... the 'it was too popular for its own good' refers to various local radio stations having their bandwidth soaked up due to people downloading stuff... not good for business, that... haveever, i demo'd it to many people over the past couple of years, from BBC Governors/Directors down, that if I get such a 100% broadcast-powered automatic system knocked together for Not Much Cash, then (almost) anyone can it ran for the first few weeks from a greenhouse in someone's back garden near Ascot. getting this built was fun too... http://gigaom.com/2005/08/16/bbc-builds-a-monster-tivo/ - Sent via the backstage.bbc.co.uk discussion group. To unsubscribe, please visit http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/mailing_list.html. Unofficial list archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk/
Re: [backstage] First BBC Backstage Podcast: DRM and the BBC
On Wednesday 14 February 2007 16:56, Tom Loosemore wrote: http://strange.corante.com/archives/2006/05/17/xtech_2006_tom_loosemore_tre ating_digital_broadcast_as_just_another_api_and_other_such_ruminations.php The link to Kamaelia Macro at the end of that post is broken, it should be: * http://kamaelia.sourceforge.net/KamaeliaMacro The code (since its just timeshifting) is here: http://svn.sourceforge.net/viewvc/kamaelia/trunk/Code/Python/Kamaelia/Examples/DVB_Systems/Macro.py?revision=2257view=markup Michael - Sent via the backstage.bbc.co.uk discussion group. To unsubscribe, please visit http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/mailing_list.html. Unofficial list archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk/
Re: [backstage] First BBC Backstage Podcast: DRM and the BBC
And overnight we got Boingboing'ed - http://www.boingboing.net/2007/02/12/bbc_techies_talk_drm.html Off the bat, I would say Cory has taken some of the simple stuff and ran with it... The debate was a lot more complex that suggested in BoingBoing Cheers, Ian - Sent via the backstage.bbc.co.uk discussion group. To unsubscribe, please visit http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/mailing_list.html. Unofficial list archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk/
Re: [backstage] First BBC Backstage Podcast: DRM and the BBC
Haven't had a chance to listen to it yet, but will do. Does that mean we don't have to carry on the debate here anymore ;-) cheers, martin -- Martin Belam - http://www.currybet.net On 13/02/07, Dave Crossland [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi All, I'd just like to say thanks to everyone who was involved, it was a pleasure being part of the debate :-) -- Regards, Dave - Sent via the backstage.bbc.co.uk discussion group. To unsubscribe, please visit http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/mailing_list.html. Unofficial list archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk/ - Sent via the backstage.bbc.co.uk discussion group. To unsubscribe, please visit http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/mailing_list.html. Unofficial list archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk/
Re: [backstage] First BBC Backstage Podcast: DRM and the BBC
Just finished listening to it, well worth my time; thanks for the good job, and it seems that the BBC now finally has some fully free content (even if it's only one podcastl; what makes a downloadable audio file into a podcast anyway??) that's available under a recognised copyleft licence. The first piece perhaps? On 12/02/07, Mr I Forrester [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi All, Just in case you've not all heard or seen yet. We recently convinced some of the key people from the DRM debate, to sit around a table . We then recorded the results and have now made it available under the creative commons attribution licence for you all to use and remix to your hearts content. Its BBC backstage's first, so I'm expecting you guys will tell us exactly what you think. http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/news/archives/2007/02/bbc_backstage_p_1.html Enjoy -- Ian Forrester | cubicgarden.com | backstage.bbc.co.uk | geekdinner.co.uk - Sent via the backstage.bbc.co.uk discussion group. To unsubscribe, please visit http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/mailing_list.html. Unofficial list archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk/
Re: [backstage] First BBC Backstage Podcast: DRM and the BBC
I have managed to listen to the first minutes and then the stream stops. can anyone share the mp3 with me? :-) RichE On 13 Feb 2007, at 11:53, Martin Belam wrote: Haven't had a chance to listen to it yet, but will do. Does that mean we don't have to carry on the debate here anymore ;-) cheers, martin -- Martin Belam - http://www.currybet.net On 13/02/07, Dave Crossland [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi All, I'd just like to say thanks to everyone who was involved, it was a pleasure being part of the debate :-) -- Regards, Dave - Sent via the backstage.bbc.co.uk discussion group. To unsubscribe, please visit http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/ 2005/01/mailing_list.html. Unofficial list archive: http:// www.mail-archive.com/backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk/ - Sent via the backstage.bbc.co.uk discussion group. To unsubscribe, please visit http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/ mailing_list.html. Unofficial list archive: http://www.mail- archive.com/backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk/ - Sent via the backstage.bbc.co.uk discussion group. To unsubscribe, please visit http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/mailing_list.html. Unofficial list archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk/
Re: [backstage] First BBC Backstage Podcast: DRM and the BBC
On 13/02/07, Richard P Edwards [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I have managed to listen to the first minutes and then the stream stops. can anyone share the mp3 with me? :-) RichE There are links to download it at the bottom of the blog post: http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/news/archives/2007/02/bbc_backstage_p_1.html
Re: [backstage] First BBC Backstage Podcast: DRM and the BBC
vijay chopra wrote: (even if it's only one podcastl; what makes a downloadable audio file into a podcast anyway??) If this is going to be a (semi-)regular occurrence, could we get a real RSS feed for it? Cheers, David -- David McBride [EMAIL PROTECTED] Department of Computing, Imperial College, London - Sent via the backstage.bbc.co.uk discussion group. To unsubscribe, please visit http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/mailing_list.html. Unofficial list archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk/
Re: [backstage] First BBC Backstage Podcast: DRM and the BBC
On 13/02/07, David McBride [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: If this is going to be a (semi-)regular occurrence, could we get a real RSS feed for it? Yes, I'd be in favour of that. I also note that its been published in the free software, open standard, cross platform ogg vorbis format as well as MP3, and hope this demonstrates that such formats do indeed exist - As I said in the show, I think that everything the BBC is publishing as MP3 can also be made available as OGG :-) -- Regards, Dave - Sent via the backstage.bbc.co.uk discussion group. To unsubscribe, please visit http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/mailing_list.html. Unofficial list archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk/
Re: [backstage] First BBC Backstage Podcast: DRM and the BBC
On 13/02/07, David McBride [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: vijay chopra wrote: (even if it's only one podcastl; what makes a downloadable audio file into a podcast anyway??) If this is going to be a (semi-)regular occurrence, could we get a real RSS feed for it? Cheers, David I agree. I spent a good few minutes looking for an RSS feed with the podcast in it (there are loads of RSS feeds on the site) before just giving up and grabbing the ogg. jonh
Re: [backstage] First BBC Backstage Podcast: DRM and the BBC
On 13/02/07, John Wesley [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I agree. I spent a good few minutes looking for an RSS feed with the podcast in it (there are loads of RSS feeds on the site) before just giving up and grabbing the ogg. The MSM (including the BBC) is guilty of doing this all the time, every time an audio file is made available for download it's labelled a podcast, for example we've had a podcast from space no rss feed was there, just a download (can't be bothered to find the link, but it was sometime last year). And the BBC frequently advertises download the podcast from our website I thought it was the feed that was the podcast, not the file, but the way it's advertised is that if I go and manually download a BBC programme, it's just as much a podcast as if I get my feedreader to do it for me. Add to that the fact that I don't own an iPod, just a generic mp3 player, it leaves me wondering is there any real meaning to the word podcast at all?
the question of DRM necessity (Re: [backstage] First BBC Backstage Podcast: DRM and the BBC)
Mr I Forrester [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: We recently convinced some of the key people from the DRM debate, to sit around a table . We then recorded the results and have now made it available under the creative commons attribution licence for you all to use and remix to your hearts content. Its BBC backstage's first, so I'm expecting you guys will tell us exactly what you think. http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/news/archives/2007/02/bbc_backstage_p_1.html Enjoy Sheesh... that's a pretty good round table. The thing that most leapt out at me was James Cridland's point about DRM: if you don't have anything to protect content then what's to stop people copying it between themselves. Dave's answer to this is the answer I always give: people will go to the authoritative source first, and be happy to pay 10p or 30p or £1 or whatever because they're paying for the service: the quality of the download, the ease of navigation around the website, etc... But we're not really talking about people doing rsync between their machines vs downloading from a website. We're talking about whether another company can come along as a direct competitor to you and set up another website, just ripping off your content, but charging 2p less. As long as their website is better than yours they should get all your business. This is a tricky question to answer. In free software we answer it with value add. We say: sure - you could sell this software what I wrote for less money than I do. But actually, I'm not selling the software I'm selling a service around it: support and assistance, maybe consultancy. People are prepared to pay for that from me, and not you, because I wrote the software, so there's a chance I know more about it than you. This doesn't exist in music or visual arts. And we can see why: can you imagine asking Morrissey to change a line in a song if you pay him? Or Paul Simon? Hey Paul? If I pay you £200 could you sing me a copy where it's Fridge over troubled water? David Bowie answered this question a while ago by suggesting that musicians will have to play live to earn their keep. This seems to be similar to the consultancy business model. Finding a benefactor seems like another reasonable way to go. But listening to the podcast does suggest this to me: either we're going to get some kind of DRM or rights holders are going to be a less rich overall. -- Nic Ferrier http://www.tapsellferrier.co.uk for all your tapsell ferrier needs - Sent via the backstage.bbc.co.uk discussion group. To unsubscribe, please visit http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/mailing_list.html. Unofficial list archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk/
