Re: [Bacula-users] Bacula and 16 bay JBOD

2011-03-23 Thread Alan Brown
Mehma Sarja wrote: There is one more thing to think about and that is cumulative aging. Starting with all new disks is a false sense of security because as they age, and if they are in any sort of RAID/performance configuration, they will age and wear evenly. Expanding on that: It is

Re: [Bacula-users] Bacula and 16 bay JBOD

2011-03-23 Thread Alan Brown
Phil Stracchino wrote: Well, a good start is to use something like SMART monitoring set up to alert you when any drive enters what it considers a pre-fail state. (Which can be simple age, increasing numbers of hard errors, increasing variation in spindle speed, increasing slow starts, etc,

Re: [Bacula-users] Bacula and 16 bay JBOD

2011-03-23 Thread John Drescher
Well, a good start is to use something like SMART monitoring set up to alert you when any drive enters what it considers a pre-fail state. (Which can be simple age, increasing numbers of hard errors, increasing variation in spindle speed, increasing slow starts, etc, etc...) FWIW: Nexan,

Re: [Bacula-users] Bacula and 16 bay JBOD

2011-03-23 Thread Alan Brown
John Drescher wrote: I would say this is true for smart PASS / FAIL but if you look at the raw SMART data you can use this to predict failure before it totally fails. I agree but they don't do that. At least I have been able to predict this for the 10 to 20 drives that have died here at

Re: [Bacula-users] Bacula and 16 bay JBOD

2011-03-23 Thread John Drescher
I haven't had as many die as you have (Do your users kick their computers around the room?) but my experience matches yours when looking at changes in the raw data. The problem is I haven't had enough die to put 100% certainty on it so I tend to rely on smartd's output. I have between 100

Re: [Bacula-users] Bacula and 16 bay JBOD

2011-03-23 Thread Alan Brown
John Drescher wrote: I haven't had as many die as you have (Do your users kick their computers around the room?) but my experience matches yours when looking at changes in the raw data. The problem is I haven't had enough die to put 100% certainty on it so I tend to rely on smartd's output.

Re: [Bacula-users] Bacula and 16 bay JBOD

2011-03-23 Thread Mehma Sarja
On 3/23/11 7:28 AM, Alan Brown wrote: Phil Stracchino wrote: Well, a good start is to use something like SMART monitoring set up to alert you when any drive enters what it considers a pre-fail state. (Which can be simple age, increasing numbers of hard errors, increasing variation in spindle

Re: [Bacula-users] Bacula and 16 bay JBOD

2011-03-23 Thread Alan Brown
Mehma Sarja wrote: Since drives ONLY fail on Friday afternoons local time, an effective remedy is to check for SMART messages before the weekend. Foolish as that is, I am surprised how many times it has held true for me. For similar reasons we only perform work on critical infrastructure on

Re: [Bacula-users] Bacula and 16 bay JBOD

2011-03-23 Thread Chris Hoogendyk
On 3/23/11 12:51 PM, Alan Brown wrote: Mehma Sarja wrote: Since drives ONLY fail on Friday afternoons local time, an effective remedy is to check for SMART messages before the weekend. Foolish as that is, I am surprised how many times it has held true for me. For similar reasons we only

Re: [Bacula-users] Bacula and 16 bay JBOD

2011-03-23 Thread Alan Brown
Chris Hoogendyk wrote: After that, I convinced management to pay for mirrored drives. How much was the overtime bill? ;) -- Enable your software for Intel(R) Active Management Technology to meet the growing

Re: [Bacula-users] Bacula and 16 bay JBOD

2011-03-18 Thread Alan Brown
Phil Stracchino wrote: With RAID6, you can survive any one or two disk failures, in degraded mode. You'll have a larger working set than RAID10, but performance will be slower because of the overhead of parity calculations. A third failure will bring the array down and you will lose the

Re: [Bacula-users] Bacula and 16 bay JBOD

2011-03-18 Thread Steve Costaras
Not really, RAID6+0 only requires 8 drives minimum you can create two RAID6's of 4 drives each and stripe them together.This has a benefit as multi-layer based parity raids increases random write iops performance. But the main issue is array integrity, mainly with large capacity drives

Re: [Bacula-users] Bacula and 16 bay JBOD

2011-03-18 Thread Marcello Romani
Il 18/03/2011 19:01, Mehma Sarja ha scritto: On 3/17/11 4:57 PM, Phil Stracchino wrote: On 03/17/11 18:46, Marcello Romani wrote: Il 16/03/2011 18:38, Phil Stracchino ha scritto: On 03/16/11 13:08, Mike Hobbs wrote: Hello, I'm currently testing bacula v5.0.3 and so far so good. One of

Re: [Bacula-users] Bacula and 16 bay JBOD

2011-03-18 Thread Phil Stracchino
On 03/18/11 19:41, Marcello Romani wrote: Il 18/03/2011 19:01, Mehma Sarja ha scritto: There is one more thing to think about and that is cumulative aging. Starting with all new disks is a false sense of security because as they age, and if they are in any sort of RAID/performance

Re: [Bacula-users] Bacula and 16 bay JBOD

2011-03-18 Thread Phil Stracchino
On 03/18/11 21:00, Mehma Sarja wrote: I can only think of staggering drive age and maintenance. Here's hoping that someone on the list can come up with more creative solutions/practices. Try to avoid buying a large number of drives from the same batch. This is frequently easily accomplished

Re: [Bacula-users] Bacula and 16 bay JBOD

2011-03-17 Thread Marcello Romani
Il 16/03/2011 18:38, Phil Stracchino ha scritto: On 03/16/11 13:08, Mike Hobbs wrote: Hello, I'm currently testing bacula v5.0.3 and so far so good. One of my issues though, I have a 16 bay Promise Technologies VessJBOD. How do I get bacula to use all the disks for writing volumes to?

Re: [Bacula-users] Bacula and 16 bay JBOD

2011-03-17 Thread Marcello Romani
Il 18/03/2011 00:57, Phil Stracchino ha scritto: On 03/17/11 18:46, Marcello Romani wrote: Il 16/03/2011 18:38, Phil Stracchino ha scritto: On 03/16/11 13:08, Mike Hobbs wrote: Hello, I'm currently testing bacula v5.0.3 and so far so good. One of my issues though, I have a 16 bay

[Bacula-users] Bacula and 16 bay JBOD

2011-03-16 Thread Mike Hobbs
Hello, I'm currently testing bacula v5.0.3 and so far so good. One of my issues though, I have a 16 bay Promise Technologies VessJBOD. How do I get bacula to use all the disks for writing volumes to? I guess the way I envision it working would be, 50gb volumes would be used and when disk1

Re: [Bacula-users] Bacula and 16 bay JBOD

2011-03-16 Thread Mike Hobbs
On 03/16/2011 01:12 PM, Robison, Dave wrote: Just curious, why not put that jbod into a RAID array? I believe you'd get far better performance with the additional spools and you'd get redundancy as well. Personally I'd set that up as a RAIDZ using ZFS on FreeBSD. I believe the reason why

Re: [Bacula-users] Bacula and 16 bay JBOD

2011-03-16 Thread Bruno Friedmann
On 03/16/2011 06:29 PM, Mike Hobbs wrote: On 03/16/2011 01:12 PM, Robison, Dave wrote: Just curious, why not put that jbod into a RAID array? I believe you'd get far better performance with the additional spools and you'd get redundancy as well. Personally I'd set that up as a RAIDZ using

Re: [Bacula-users] Bacula and 16 bay JBOD

2011-03-16 Thread Phil Stracchino
On 03/16/11 13:08, Mike Hobbs wrote: Hello, I'm currently testing bacula v5.0.3 and so far so good. One of my issues though, I have a 16 bay Promise Technologies VessJBOD. How do I get bacula to use all the disks for writing volumes to? I guess the way I envision it working would be,

Re: [Bacula-users] Bacula and 16 bay JBOD

2011-03-16 Thread John Drescher
On Wed, Mar 16, 2011 at 1:29 PM, Mike Hobbs mho...@mtl.mit.edu wrote:  On 03/16/2011 01:12 PM, Robison, Dave wrote: Just curious, why not put that jbod into a RAID array? I believe you'd get far better performance with the additional spools and you'd get redundancy as well. Personally I'd