Re: [bitcoin-dev] eltoo: A Simplified update Mechanism for Lightning and Off-Chain Contracts

2018-05-01 Thread Jim Posen via bitcoin-dev
OK, I see what you are saying. You are effectively suggesting pipelining the broadcasts of the update transactions. I think this introduces a problem that a node in the circuit that withholds the preimage for too long can force all upstream channels to be closed, at only the expense of their one up

Re: [bitcoin-dev] eltoo: A Simplified update Mechanism for Lightning and Off-Chain Contracts

2018-05-01 Thread Jim Posen via bitcoin-dev
I'm still not following why this doesn't accumulate. In the example route, let's look at it from the point of view of C. C sees the following regardless of whether D or E or someone behind E is the last hop in the route: B -> HTLC(expire = X + delta) -> C -> HTLC(expire = X) -> D So D is not req

Re: [bitcoin-dev] BIP sighash_noinput

2018-05-01 Thread Christian Decker via bitcoin-dev
Russell O'Connor writes: > At the risk of bikeshedding, shouldn't NOINPUT also zero out the > hashSequence so that its behaviour is consistent with ANYONECANPAY? Good catch, must've missed that somehow. I'll amend the BIP accordingly. ___ bitcoin-dev ma

Re: [bitcoin-dev] eltoo: A Simplified update Mechanism for Lightning and Off-Chain Contracts

2018-05-01 Thread Christian Decker via bitcoin-dev
Jim Posen writes: > I'm still not following why this doesn't accumulate. > > In the example route, let's look at it from the point of view of C. C sees > the following regardless of whether D or E or someone behind E is the last > hop in the route: > > B -> HTLC(expire = X + delta) -> C -> HTLC(ex

Re: [bitcoin-dev] BIP sighash_noinput

2018-05-01 Thread Russell O'Connor via bitcoin-dev
At the risk of bikeshedding, shouldn't NOINPUT also zero out the hashSequence so that its behaviour is consistent with ANYONECANPAY? On Mon, Apr 30, 2018 at 12:29 PM, Christian Decker via bitcoin-dev < bitcoin-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org> wrote: > Hi all, > > I'd like to pick up the discussion

Re: [bitcoin-dev] eltoo: A Simplified update Mechanism for Lightning and Off-Chain Contracts

2018-05-01 Thread Christian Decker via bitcoin-dev
Jim Posen writes: > Can you explain why a fixed offset along the whole circuit is enough to > ensure safely as opposed to an increased delta at each hop? Sure. Let's assume we have chosen a path `A->B->C->D->E`. For simplicity let's assume they all have a CLTV delta of 144 blocks (lnd's default s

Re: [bitcoin-dev] eltoo: A Simplified update Mechanism for Lightning and Off-Chain Contracts

2018-05-01 Thread Jim Posen via bitcoin-dev
Can you explain why a fixed offset along the whole circuit is enough to ensure safely as opposed to an increased delta at each hop? On Tue, May 1, 2018, 5:05 AM Christian Decker wrote: > Jim Posen writes: > > If my understanding is correct though, this construction would > > significantly incre

Re: [bitcoin-dev] [Lightning-dev] eltoo: A Simplified update Mechanism for Lightning and Off-Chain Contracts

2018-05-01 Thread Christian Decker via bitcoin-dev
ZmnSCPxj writes: > Good morning Christian, > > This is very interesting indeed! > > I have started skimming through the paper. > > I am uncertain if the below text is correct? > >> Throughout this paper we will use the terms *input script* to refer to >> `witnessProgram` and `scriptPubKey`, and *

Re: [bitcoin-dev] eltoo: A Simplified update Mechanism for Lightning and Off-Chain Contracts

2018-05-01 Thread Christian Decker via bitcoin-dev
Jim Posen writes: > If my understanding is correct though, this construction would > significantly increase the safe CLTV delta requirements because HTLCs > cannot be timed out immediately on the settlement transaction. Consider a > case where node B receives an HTLC from A and forwards to C. If t

Re: [bitcoin-dev] [Lightning-dev] eltoo: A Simplified update Mechanism for Lightning and Off-Chain Contracts

2018-05-01 Thread ZmnSCPxj via bitcoin-dev
Good morning Christian, This is very interesting indeed! I have started skimming through the paper. I am uncertain if the below text is correct? > Throughout this paper we will use the terms *input script* to refer to > `witnessProgram` and `scriptPubKey`, and *output script* to refer to the

Re: [bitcoin-dev] eltoo: A Simplified update Mechanism for Lightning and Off-Chain Contracts

2018-05-01 Thread ZmnSCPxj via bitcoin-dev
Good morning Jim, > If my understanding is correct though, this construction would significantly > increase the safe CLTV delta requirements because HTLCs cannot be timed out > immediately on the settlement transaction. Consider a case where node B > receives an HTLC from A and forwards to C. I