Re: [Bitcoin-development] Payment Protocol for Face-to-face Payments

2014-03-20 Thread Andreas Schildbach
On 03/20/2014 03:22 AM, Alex Kotenko wrote: Right now, before BIP70, I'm sending BIP21 URI via NFC or QR code, and I need to still be able to use it for backwards compatibility. But at the same time I want to be able to support BIP70. And also I want to avoid using external servers, the

Re: [Bitcoin-development] Payment Protocol for Face-to-face Payments

2014-03-20 Thread Mike Hearn
Very, very limited. The more data you stuff in them, the less reliable and slower scanning becomes. A URL is about the limit of what's practically achievable. Even with that, BitPay have been complaining about the increased character length from adding the https url to download the payment request

Re: [Bitcoin-development] Payment Protocol for Face-to-face Payments

2014-03-20 Thread Alex Kotenko
2014-03-20 8:08 GMT+00:00 Andreas Schildbach andr...@schildbach.de: On 03/20/2014 03:22 AM, Alex Kotenko wrote: Right now, before BIP70, I'm sending BIP21 URI via NFC or QR code, and I need to still be able to use it for backwards compatibility. But at the same time I want to be able to

Re: [Bitcoin-development] Payment Protocol for Face-to-face Payments

2014-03-20 Thread Jeff Garzik
On Thu, Mar 20, 2014 at 8:12 AM, Adam Back a...@cypherspace.org wrote: Whats a sensible limit on practical/convenient QR code size? Extremely limited. Preferably under 100 bytes. You will see increasingly poor operating in varying light conditions, such as paying via QR code on a printed

Re: [Bitcoin-development] Payment Protocol for Face-to-face Payments

2014-03-20 Thread Alex Kotenko
2014-03-20 17:31 GMT+00:00 Jeff Garzik jgar...@bitpay.com: On Thu, Mar 20, 2014 at 8:12 AM, Adam Back a...@cypherspace.org wrote: Whats a sensible limit on practical/convenient QR code size? Extremely limited. Preferably under 100 bytes. You will see increasingly poor operating in varying

Re: [Bitcoin-development] Payment Protocol for Face-to-face Payments

2014-03-20 Thread Jeff Garzik
It really depends on the physical, real world size of the QR code. If you have a big screen, and security permits displaying a larger QR code, you can afford more bytes. If you are displaying a tiny postage stamp 1-2cm in size, the practical byte limit is very low. Ideally, you test your QR

Re: [Bitcoin-development] Payment Protocol for Face-to-face Payments

2014-03-20 Thread Alex Kotenko
Hmm, is there any other way to do it? Can we provide a signed payment request and verify the sign on receiving side and this way protect from bluetooth MitM attack? Quick googling showed that SSL over bluetooth isn't a very well developed area, and my own skills are not enough to quickly implement

Re: [Bitcoin-development] Payment Protocol for Face-to-face Payments

2014-03-20 Thread Mike Hearn
With Java, in theory, you can use SSLSocketFactory.createSocket(btsocket, address, 1234, true) to wrap a bluetooth socket in SSL. However I have not tried it. For now, just prototype and build your product without the security. We can find someone to experiment with this, if you don't want to .

Re: [Bitcoin-development] Payment Protocol for Face-to-face Payments

2014-03-20 Thread Alex Kotenko
We'll see how it will go, maybe I will get to implement this somewhere soon. Yes, I'm thinking exactly about radio MitM attacks possible with bluetooth. I'll also look into using PKI inside the PoS for the merchant. It would be great user experience if we would be able to provide a signed payment

Re: [Bitcoin-development] Payment Protocol for Face-to-face Payments

2014-03-20 Thread Roy Badami
On Thu, Mar 20, 2014 at 07:31:27PM +0100, Mike Hearn wrote: Yes, this overlaps somewhat with the PKI signing in BIP70, but not entirely - you might want to serve unsigned payment requests, but still have confidentiality and authenticity for a local face to face transaction. The signing and