Re: [Bitcoin-development] Bitcoin-development Digest, Vol 31, Issue 41

2013-12-25 Thread Allen Piscitello
No, you don't get it, and it's been explained clearly to you twice.  Take
it to bitcointalk, this does not belong on this list.  Your cure is worse
than the disease.


On Wed, Dec 25, 2013 at 12:53 AM, Ryan Carboni ryan.jc...@gmail.com wrote:

 You just completely ignored my point. I'm not sure who's trying to insult
 whom, or if you're attempting an argumentum ad hominem. My idea is
 completely valid.

 The only way to man in the middle to have such a large percentage of hash
 power is to either a) attack a pool (which people would notice when their
 withdrawals go nowhere), b) attack a large number of nodes, which must have
 enough combined hash power to mine four blocks within three days for people
 to notice (I think it is unlikely for Bitcoin point of sale nodes to have
 significant hash power), or c) the attacker himself has 1% of the hash
 power and is diverting it to conduct a man in the middle attack against one
 single person (as opposed to a major retailer who has a round the clock IT
 staff). In order for a large number of nodes to be attacked, it must be by
 someone who either is a state actor or an ISP, at which point you've
 already lost.

 It's really simple math, it require on even the most optimistic estimates
 a tenth of a percent of the total network hash power to mine 4 blocks
 within three days with good luck. Or maybe this single person is on
 vacation, then it would take a hundredth of a percent of the total hash
 power over two weeks. I think very few people even have a hundredth of a
 percent of the total hash power, which goes to show how secure the network
 is, and how little my proposal would weaken network security. I'll concede
 that difficulty could be reduced only by 80% if only four blocks were mined
 in 3 days, which would provide sufficient margin against these proposed man
 in the middle attacks, because block-chain growth would be noticeably
 reduced.

 But I repeat myself. Repeatedly. I wish you would understand my points.
 I'm making a good faith effort to provide an original idea before it's
 possibly too late. But fine. I have nothing more to add, and it's the
 holidays.


 On Tue, Dec 24, 2013 at 2:47 AM, 
 bitcoin-development-requ...@lists.sourceforge.net wrote:

 An attacker with some small hashpower isolates you (as an individual)
 from the network by MITMing your network. You just switch the the
 attackers chain as if nothing happened because of the network rule
 that defines it as OK. Today, you will see that you're behind and warn
 the user.

 Was it really so hard to write a three-sentence paragraph to clarify
 the attack instead of insulting people? Still, posting ideas here
 without spending time to ensure you understand the Bitcoin network
 well is frowned upon.



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Re: [Bitcoin-development] Bitcoin-development Digest, Vol 31, Issue 41

2013-12-24 Thread Ryan Carboni
You just completely ignored my point. I'm not sure who's trying to insult
whom, or if you're attempting an argumentum ad hominem. My idea is
completely valid.

The only way to man in the middle to have such a large percentage of hash
power is to either a) attack a pool (which people would notice when their
withdrawals go nowhere), b) attack a large number of nodes, which must have
enough combined hash power to mine four blocks within three days for people
to notice (I think it is unlikely for Bitcoin point of sale nodes to have
significant hash power), or c) the attacker himself has 1% of the hash
power and is diverting it to conduct a man in the middle attack against one
single person (as opposed to a major retailer who has a round the clock IT
staff). In order for a large number of nodes to be attacked, it must be by
someone who either is a state actor or an ISP, at which point you've
already lost.

It's really simple math, it require on even the most optimistic estimates a
tenth of a percent of the total network hash power to mine 4 blocks within
three days with good luck. Or maybe this single person is on vacation, then
it would take a hundredth of a percent of the total hash power over two
weeks. I think very few people even have a hundredth of a percent of the
total hash power, which goes to show how secure the network is, and how
little my proposal would weaken network security. I'll concede that
difficulty could be reduced only by 80% if only four blocks were mined in 3
days, which would provide sufficient margin against these proposed man in
the middle attacks, because block-chain growth would be noticeably reduced.

But I repeat myself. Repeatedly. I wish you would understand my points. I'm
making a good faith effort to provide an original idea before it's possibly
too late. But fine. I have nothing more to add, and it's the holidays.


On Tue, Dec 24, 2013 at 2:47 AM, 
bitcoin-development-requ...@lists.sourceforge.net wrote:

 An attacker with some small hashpower isolates you (as an individual)
 from the network by MITMing your network. You just switch the the
 attackers chain as if nothing happened because of the network rule
 that defines it as OK. Today, you will see that you're behind and warn
 the user.

 Was it really so hard to write a three-sentence paragraph to clarify
 the attack instead of insulting people? Still, posting ideas here
 without spending time to ensure you understand the Bitcoin network
 well is frowned upon.

--
Rapidly troubleshoot problems before they affect your business. Most IT 
organizations don't have a clear picture of how application performance 
affects their revenue. With AppDynamics, you get 100% visibility into your 
Java,.NET,  PHP application. Start your 15-day FREE TRIAL of AppDynamics Pro!
http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=84349831iu=/4140/ostg.clktrk___
Bitcoin-development mailing list
Bitcoin-development@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/bitcoin-development