Re: [board-discuss] Diversity Is Key?

[Franklin Weng]

2019年12月3日 06:21:43 Sam Tuke :

> Thanks Thorsten; that's very helpful context. The 48% chance you referenced 
> does indicate that the issue is still larger than this particular election. 
> It's also worth noting that Gabriele, Italo, and others did a great job of 
> reminding us of the opportunity to stand, and the deadlines.
> As the election has a strict timetable, it seems that a procedural change 
> would now be necessary in order to avoid a board devoid of women.
> Were procedural changes possible, they could include extending the nomination 
> phase, or keeping one or more seats open explicitly for a female board member 
> in future. If such changes are impossible, then those ideas could be explored 
> by the next board.
> Thoughts from other Board members or Trustees? This might be the most direct 
> stimulus to this subject for another two years.
> Thanks,
> Sam.

IIRC in the current term the board has only few decisions regarding genders. 
Currently I care more about the diversity of the community itself, i.e. to 
motivate communities in different countries, to include different fields of 
people like designing, marketing, politics, …etc. We may need more spaces to 
make these people shining in the FOSS world.

Also, ages may be a more serious problem than genders especially in some local 
communities. That's why I proposed the students program, to try attracting more 
young people into the community.

As for the board, I'm sure that it will eventually be diverse enough as long as 
1) the composition of our community members are broad enough, and 2) we don't 
block the interactions between the board of trustees and the BoD and the MC.


--
Franklin Weng, Member, Board of Director & Certification Committee
The Document Foundation, Kurfürstendamm 188, 10707 Berlin, DE
Gemeinnützige rechtsfähige Stiftung des bürgerlichen Rechts
Legal details: https://www.documentfoundation.org/imprint 
[https://www.documentfoundation.org/imprint]

Re: [board-discuss] Diversity Is Key?

[Simon Phipps]

I favour having one or two seats reserved for appointment by the board
rather than by election, so that missing skills or representations can be
temporarily addressed. OSI just did this, for example.

S

On Mon, 2 Dec 2019, 23:22 Sam Tuke,  wrote:

> Thanks Thorsten; that's very helpful context. The 48% chance you
> referenced does indicate that the issue is still larger than this
> particular election. It's also worth noting that Gabriele, Italo, and
> others did a great job of reminding us of the opportunity to stand, and the
> deadlines.
>
> As the election has a strict timetable, it seems that a procedural change
> would now be necessary in order to avoid a board devoid of women.
>
> Were procedural changes possible, they could include extending the
> nomination phase, or keeping one or more seats open explicitly for a female
> board member in future. If such changes are impossible, then those ideas
> could be explored by the next board.
>
> Thoughts from other Board members or Trustees? This might be the most
> direct stimulus to this subject for another two years.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Sam.
>
> On Sat, 30 Nov, 2019 at 15:14, Thorsten Behrens 
> wrote:
>
> Hi Sam, Sam Tuke wrote:
>
> This is a problem which past Boards and Membership Committees have no
> doubt worked on; perhaps those people can say more about their efforts and
> challenges.
>
> Right - it's been a topic for board and MC discussions at the very least
> since 2015 (if my memory serves me). That year saw the formation of
> LibreLadies, had a number of diversity talks at the conference, and the
> board started working on a code of conduct. Also (but perhaps Sophie can
> fill in with more details), IIRC the year before we started to try &
> balance conference travel bursaries a bit better, to ensure participants
> from far-away places get a chance to attend the conference.
>
> I understand that contributors with non-technical backgrounds make up a
> minority percentage of the Foundation's members.
>
> I'm not sure about that. Additionally my impression is, the membership
> committee does a good job encouraging contributors to become members of the
> Foundation, so I believe that body is ~representative of our community
> (whether diversity among _contributors_ could be improved is a different,
> but equally important question). Because that's relatively easy to derive
> from the members list: I currently count at least 15 female members, which
> constitutes a bit more than 7% of our membership. That's more than the
> average opensource female developer ratio (good news, but probably due to
> our mix of also non-developer members), but much less than I would expect
> from industry averages in the professions that would likely be found among
> our contributors. Sticking that into the helpful diversity calculator (
> http://aanandprasad.com/diversity-calculator/?groupName=women=10=7),
> the situation we find ourselves in for this board election, and that
> started this thread, has a probability of 48%. Which is a problem, because
> for increasing diversity, you want representation. Beyond that, there's the
> obvious negative signalling effect. The upcoming board will thus be the
> first since 2011 without a female member. :/ In conclusion, I'm decidedly
> unhappy about the current situation (while other aspects of the candidate
> list are encouraging), believe that we must do better here, and said so in
> my candidacy statement. What's additionally sad, is that past attempts to
> move the needle where so frustrating for some participants, that they gave
> up, or simply left. All the best, -- Thorsten
>
>

Re: [board-discuss] Diversity Is Key?

[Sam Tuke]

Thanks Thorsten; that's very helpful context. The 48% chance you 
referenced does indicate that the issue is still larger than this 
particular election. It's also worth noting that Gabriele, Italo, and 
others did a great job of reminding us of the opportunity to stand, and 
the deadlines.


As the election has a strict timetable, it seems that a procedural 
change would now be necessary in order to avoid a board devoid of women.


Were procedural changes possible, they could include extending the 
nomination phase, or keeping one or more seats open explicitly for a 
female board member in future. If such changes are impossible, then 
those ideas could be explored by the next board.


Thoughts from other Board members or Trustees? This might be the most 
direct stimulus to this subject for another two years.


Thanks,

Sam.

On Sat, 30 Nov, 2019 at 15:14, Thorsten Behrens  
wrote:

Hi Sam,

Sam Tuke wrote:

 This is a problem which past Boards and Membership Committees have
 no doubt worked on; perhaps those people can say more about their
 efforts and challenges.


Right - it's been a topic for board and MC discussions at the very
least since 2015 (if my memory serves me). That year saw the formation
of LibreLadies, had a number of diversity talks at the conference, and
the board started working on a code of conduct. Also (but perhaps
Sophie can fill in with more details), IIRC the year before we started
to try & balance conference travel bursaries a bit better, to ensure
participants from far-away places get a chance to attend the
conference.


 I understand that contributors with non-technical backgrounds make
 up a minority percentage of the Foundation's members.


I'm not sure about that. Additionally my impression is, the membership
committee does a good job encouraging contributors to become members
of the Foundation, so I believe that body is ~representative of our
community (whether diversity among _contributors_ could be improved is
a different, but equally important question).

Because that's relatively easy to derive from the members list: I
currently count at least 15 female members, which constitutes a bit
more than 7% of our membership. That's more than the average
opensource female developer ratio (good news, but probably due to our
mix of also non-developer members), but much less than I would expect
from industry averages in the professions that would likely be found
among our contributors.

Sticking that into the helpful diversity calculator
(),
the situation we find ourselves in for this board election, and that
started this thread, has a probability of 48%.

Which is a problem, because for increasing diversity, you want
representation. Beyond that, there's the obvious negative signalling
effect. The upcoming board will thus be the first since 2011 without a
female member. :/

In conclusion, I'm decidedly unhappy about the current situation
(while other aspects of the candidate list are encouraging), believe
that we must do better here, and said so in my candidacy
statement. What's additionally sad, is that past attempts to move the
needle where so frustrating for some participants, that they gave up,
or simply left.

All the best,

-- Thorsten

Re: [board-discuss] Diversity Is Key?

[Thorsten Behrens]

Hi Sam,

Sam Tuke wrote:
> This is a problem which past Boards and Membership Committees have
> no doubt worked on; perhaps those people can say more about their
> efforts and challenges.
>
Right - it's been a topic for board and MC discussions at the very
least since 2015 (if my memory serves me). That year saw the formation
of LibreLadies, had a number of diversity talks at the conference, and
the board started working on a code of conduct. Also (but perhaps
Sophie can fill in with more details), IIRC the year before we started
to try & balance conference travel bursaries a bit better, to ensure
participants from far-away places get a chance to attend the
conference.

> I understand that contributors with non-technical backgrounds make
> up a minority percentage of the Foundation's members.
>
I'm not sure about that. Additionally my impression is, the membership
committee does a good job encouraging contributors to become members
of the Foundation, so I believe that body is ~representative of our
community (whether diversity among _contributors_ could be improved is
a different, but equally important question).

Because that's relatively easy to derive from the members list: I
currently count at least 15 female members, which constitutes a bit
more than 7% of our membership. That's more than the average
opensource female developer ratio (good news, but probably due to our
mix of also non-developer members), but much less than I would expect
from industry averages in the professions that would likely be found
among our contributors.

Sticking that into the helpful diversity calculator
(http://aanandprasad.com/diversity-calculator/?groupName=women=10=7),
the situation we find ourselves in for this board election, and that
started this thread, has a probability of 48%.

Which is a problem, because for increasing diversity, you want
representation. Beyond that, there's the obvious negative signalling
effect. The upcoming board will thus be the first since 2011 without a
female member. :/

In conclusion, I'm decidedly unhappy about the current situation
(while other aspects of the candidate list are encouraging), believe
that we must do better here, and said so in my candidacy
statement. What's additionally sad, is that past attempts to move the
needle where so frustrating for some participants, that they gave up,
or simply left.

All the best,

-- Thorsten


signature.asc
Description: PGP signature

Re: [board-discuss] Diversity Is Key?

[Andreas Mantke]

Hi Michael,

Am 29.11.19 um 10:59 schrieb Michael Meeks:
> Hi Andreas,
>
>   As you know, I'm a fan of you & your work on improving LibreOffice.

thank you. I know that.

But as you know there were some behaviors from key TDF members which
throw me out of the project. I worked only voluntary and since Feb. 2018
as pure volunteer.
I enjoyed the view on TDF from a pure volunteer since then with all
features ;-)
And I got a more balanced view (different from the view from the inner
circle).

>
>   What you write is (I assume) intended as humorous, but doesn't seem a 
> terribly fair characterization from many angles.

In some cases it's a bit of humor (not common for Germans?).

>
>   I'm rather encouraged that lots of board members want to make TDF a 
> safe place for diverse people to get involved and interact,
> that seems like a good thing to me.
>
>   I'm also -extremely- grateful for everyone who steps up to volunteer 
> their time to help take part in our governance - they rock!

It's always fine to have volunteers which stand for running the
governance. But I'm a fan of real and wide spread diversity among them.
If you have a look into the statutes of TDF
and the spirit between the lines you will see this as the DNA of the
foundation.
From my current perspective I would change § 8 IV S. 2 of the statutes
from 'one third of the members' to 'one member'. But this is only my own
opinion.

> (...)
>
>   Hope all's well,
Yes and I got more time for spare time activities others than reading
emails, coding and server / website administration ;-)

And I had also to spend a lot of energy to get into new topics of my
payed job.

Kind regards,
Andreas



--
To unsubscribe e-mail to: board-discuss+unsubscr...@documentfoundation.org
Problems? https://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/
Posting guidelines + more: https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette
List archive: https://listarchives.documentfoundation.org/www/board-discuss/
Privacy Policy: https://www.documentfoundation.org/privacy

Re: [board-discuss] Diversity Is Key?

[Sam Tuke]

Hi Andreas, thanks for highlighting the lack of gender diversity. This is a 
problem which past Boards and Membership Committees have no doubt worked on; 
perhaps those people can say more about their efforts and challenges.

I understand that contributors with non-technical backgrounds make up a 
minority percentage of the Foundation's members. Considering that candidates 
from the Board come from this group, doing more to encourage new members to 
join from our existing non-technical teams seems like a one good approach. A 
more diverse Membership makes possible more diverse Board candidates. 

Regarding affiliation and your comments about my statement: I hilighted my 
independence because affiliation is a critical issue  for many Members in this 
election, and also for statutory compliance. 

To clarify the links which you posted and address your suspicion: from 2014 to 
2015 I worked for 13 months as Consultant Marketing Manager for Collabora 
Productivity. Four intervening years working in a different sector have passed, 
during which time Collabora and I have communicated only on TDF lists, and 
briefly at LibreOffice conferences. During these years I've been an independent 
TDF member and supported the TDF Marketing Team as best I could. I believe my 
experience marketing LibreOffice, both professionally and voluntarily, would be 
valuable to the Board. 

Happy to answer other questions in this vein which you or others may have.

Sam. 

On 28 November 2019 20:45:35 GMT+01:00, Andreas Mantke  wrote:
>Hello,
>
>there is the view that diversity is key for a successful community,
>leading body etc.  This counts for open source communities and their
>(leading) bodies too.
>
>I had a look into the applications for the next TDF board and found
>there the narration 'while our user base is amazingly diverse, and so
>is
>our  community (...)'.
>
>This makes me curious and I tried to find out, if the applications
>reflects this narration.
>
>First I had a look at gender of the candidates and thought that among
>them would be more women than among the members of the German federal
>parliament (Deutscher Bundestag):
>https://www.bundestag.de/abgeordnete/biografien/mdb_zahlen_19/frauen_maenner-529508
>709 members, 221 women and 488 men; about 31 % female members.
>TDF board candidates: 12 candidates, 0 women, 12 men;  accurate 0 %
>women.
>Thus the prediction about the gender relation of the next TDF board is
>not that difficult. There will not be any gender diversity.
>
>The newspapers and news pages  in Germany talk about a Swedish study
>today that women are the better leaders, because of their soft skills.
>
>I looked further around for amazingly diversity among the candidates.
>But I don't get the information that among them is someone who is not
>working inside the IT business. Is this an effigy of the current TDF
>community?
>
>Let's have a look at the affiliation of the candidates. One of them
>declared him 'an independent candidate', something that alerted me and
>made me suspicious. And I found this:
>http://samtuke.com/tag/collabora/
>and
>http://samtuke.com/2015/12/goodbye-collabora-hello-phplist/
>
>But the message of the declaration 'an independent candidate' could
>read
>as: I'm the only independent candidate.
>
>Let's have a look on the affiliation of the candidates: five or more
>(?)
>of the twelf candidates have an affiliation with one company: about
>41%.
>
>It seemed this overcompensate the missing balance between female and
>male board candidates ;-)
>
>Kind regards,
>Andreas
>
>
>
>--
>To unsubscribe e-mail to:
>board-discuss+unsubscr...@documentfoundation.org
>Problems?
>https://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/
>Posting guidelines + more:
>https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette
>List archive:
>https://listarchives.documentfoundation.org/www/board-discuss/
>Privacy Policy: https://www.documentfoundation.org/privacy

Re: [board-discuss] Diversity Is Key?

[Michael Meeks]

Hi Andreas,

As you know, I'm a fan of you & your work on improving LibreOffice.

What you write is (I assume) intended as humorous, but doesn't seem a 
terribly fair characterization from many angles.

I'm rather encouraged that lots of board members want to make TDF a 
safe place for diverse people to get involved and interact,
that seems like a good thing to me.

I'm also -extremely- grateful for everyone who steps up to volunteer 
their time to help take part in our governance - they rock!

In general it seems to me that "If you look for the bad in people 
expecting to find it, you surely will." - I'd love instead to
see concrete contributions and suggestions for positive change here. I'd like 
to talk some of those over with you, please don't
hesitate to give me a call.

Hope all's well,

Michael.

-- 
michael.me...@collabora.com <><, GM Collabora Productivity
Hangout: mejme...@gmail.com, Skype: mmeeks
(M) +44 7795 666 147 - timezone usually UK / Europe

-- 
To unsubscribe e-mail to: board-discuss+unsubscr...@documentfoundation.org
Problems? https://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/
Posting guidelines + more: https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette
List archive: https://listarchives.documentfoundation.org/www/board-discuss/
Privacy Policy: https://www.documentfoundation.org/privacy

[board-discuss] Diversity Is Key?

[Andreas Mantke]

Hello,

there is the view that diversity is key for a successful community,
leading body etc.  This counts for open source communities and their
(leading) bodies too.

I had a look into the applications for the next TDF board and found
there the narration 'while our user base is amazingly diverse, and so is
our  community (...)'.

This makes me curious and I tried to find out, if the applications
reflects this narration.

First I had a look at gender of the candidates and thought that among
them would be more women than among the members of the German federal
parliament (Deutscher Bundestag):
https://www.bundestag.de/abgeordnete/biografien/mdb_zahlen_19/frauen_maenner-529508
709 members, 221 women and 488 men; about 31 % female members.
TDF board candidates: 12 candidates, 0 women, 12 men;  accurate 0 % women.
Thus the prediction about the gender relation of the next TDF board is
not that difficult. There will not be any gender diversity.

The newspapers and news pages  in Germany talk about a Swedish study
today that women are the better leaders, because of their soft skills.

I looked further around for amazingly diversity among the candidates.
But I don't get the information that among them is someone who is not
working inside the IT business. Is this an effigy of the current TDF
community?

Let's have a look at the affiliation of the candidates. One of them
declared him 'an independent candidate', something that alerted me and
made me suspicious. And I found this:
http://samtuke.com/tag/collabora/
and
http://samtuke.com/2015/12/goodbye-collabora-hello-phplist/

But the message of the declaration 'an independent candidate' could read
as: I'm the only independent candidate.

Let's have a look on the affiliation of the candidates: five or more (?)
of the twelf candidates have an affiliation with one company: about 41%.

It seemed this overcompensate the missing balance between female and
male board candidates ;-)

Kind regards,
Andreas



--
To unsubscribe e-mail to: board-discuss+unsubscr...@documentfoundation.org
Problems? https://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/
Posting guidelines + more: https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette
List archive: https://listarchives.documentfoundation.org/www/board-discuss/
Privacy Policy: https://www.documentfoundation.org/privacy