Re: [Boatanchors] Article on changing from 2 to 3 wire power cords

[Maury Guzick]

 Glen
This is all good stuff. I will get back with you when I start to tackle the 
receiver.
73
Maury

On Wednesday, August 7, 2019, 3:26:06 PM CDT, Glen Zook  
wrote:  
 
 With a 2-wire line cord and the AC line bypass capacitors, if the chassis is 
not connected to a suitable ground, there will be a very low current AC voltage 
equal to 1/2 of the AC line voltage on the chassis.  This is true of virtually 
all of the "boat anchor" units that are transformer powered and have a 2-wire 
line cord.  Such is because the bypass capacitors actually pass a very small 
current AC voltage to the chassis.  Since both sides of the AC line are 
bypassed, the voltage is divided and about 1/2 of the AC line voltage can be 
measured between the chassis and a good ground.  Also, if the chassis is not 
grounded, you can often feel a little "tickle" when you touch the cabinet.

Remember, when the unit was new, the instructions said to connect an adequate 
ground to the chassis before plugging the unit into the AC mains.  Adding the 
3-wire line cord with the green wire connected directly to the chassis gets the 
chassis grounded and there is not a "tickle" when you touch the cabinet.
When you start on the AC / DC receivers, let me know the model numbers and I 
probably have schematics, etc., available and can tell if the unit is a "hot 
chassis" or not.  Also, I can usually tell you the safest way to wire the 
3-wire cord.
Glen, K9STH 
Website: https://k9sth.net 

On Wednesday, August 7, 2019, 09:08:51 AM CDT, Maury Guzick 
 wrote:  
 
  I appreciate all the replies. 

I have been replacing worn out 2 wire power cords with newer 2 wire cords of 
similar style on radios with one side grounded to the chassis. 

I am at the moment looking at bringing back to life a HT-32 I got for $10. But 
the AC is or has been lifted off the chassis. There have been a number of mods 
under the chassis. So I want to have a better understanding of how to rewire 
the power cord. 

I also am looking at some antique radios that are AC/DC types that will need 
new cords, so this inquiry is multipurpose. 



___
Boatanchors mailing list
Boatanchors@puck.nether.net
https://puck.nether.net/mailman/listinfo/boatanchors

Re: [Boatanchors] Article on changing from 2 to 3 wire power cords

[wb3fau55]

All boatanchors here get hooked to earth ground before power is
applied. Russ

-From: "Glen Zook" 
To: "Eric", "Maury Guzick"
Cc: 
Sent: Wednesday August 7 2019 4:26:00PM
Subject: Re: [Boatanchors] Article on changing from 2 to 3 wire power
cords

With a 2-wire line cord and the AC line bypass capacitors, if the
chassis is not connected to a suitable ground, there will be a very
low current AC voltage equal to 1/2 of the AC line voltage on the
chassis. This is true of virtually all of the "boat anchor" units that
are transformer powered and have a 2-wire line cord. Such is because
the bypass capacitors actually pass a very small current AC voltage to
the chassis. Since both sides of the AC line are bypassed, the voltage
is divided and about 1/2 of the AC line voltage can be measured
between the chassis and a good ground. Also, if the chassis is not
grounded, you can often feel a little "tickle" when you touch the
cabinet.

 Remember, when the unit was new, the instructions said to connect an
adequate ground to the chassis before plugging the unit into the AC
mains. Adding the 3-wire line cord with the green wire connected
directly to the chassis gets the chassis grounded and there is not a
"tickle" when you touch the cabinet.
 When you start on the AC / DC receivers, let me know the model
numbers and I probably have schematics, etc., available and can tell
if the unit is a "hot chassis" or not. Also, I can usually tell you
the safest way to wire the 3-wire cord.
 Glen, K9STH 
 Website: https://k9sth.net [1] 

 On Wednesday, August 7, 2019, 09:08:51 AM CDT, Maury Guzick  wrote: 

 I appreciate all the replies. 

 I have been replacing worn out 2 wire power cords with newer 2 wire
cords of similar style on radios with one side grounded to the
chassis. 

 I am at the moment looking at bringing back to life a HT-32 I got for
$10. But the AC is or has been lifted off the chassis. There have been
a number of mods under the chassis. So I want to have a better
understanding of how to rewire the power cord. 

 I also am looking at some antique radios that are AC/DC types that
will need new cords, so this inquiry is multipurpose. 

 ___
 Boatanchors mailing list
 Boatanchors@puck.nether.net
 

Links:
--
[1] https://k9sth.net

___
Boatanchors mailing list
Boatanchors@puck.nether.net
https://puck.nether.net/mailman/listinfo/boatanchors

Re: [Boatanchors] Article on changing from 2 to 3 wire power cords

[Glen Zook]

With a 2-wire line cord and the AC line bypass capacitors, if the chassis is 
not connected to a suitable ground, there will be a very low current AC voltage 
equal to 1/2 of the AC line voltage on the chassis.  This is true of virtually 
all of the "boat anchor" units that are transformer powered and have a 2-wire 
line cord.  Such is because the bypass capacitors actually pass a very small 
current AC voltage to the chassis.  Since both sides of the AC line are 
bypassed, the voltage is divided and about 1/2 of the AC line voltage can be 
measured between the chassis and a good ground.  Also, if the chassis is not 
grounded, you can often feel a little "tickle" when you touch the cabinet.

Remember, when the unit was new, the instructions said to connect an adequate 
ground to the chassis before plugging the unit into the AC mains.  Adding the 
3-wire line cord with the green wire connected directly to the chassis gets the 
chassis grounded and there is not a "tickle" when you touch the cabinet.
When you start on the AC / DC receivers, let me know the model numbers and I 
probably have schematics, etc., available and can tell if the unit is a "hot 
chassis" or not.  Also, I can usually tell you the safest way to wire the 
3-wire cord.
Glen, K9STH 
Website: https://k9sth.net 

On Wednesday, August 7, 2019, 09:08:51 AM CDT, Maury Guzick 
 wrote:  
 
  I appreciate all the replies. 

I have been replacing worn out 2 wire power cords with newer 2 wire cords of 
similar style on radios with one side grounded to the chassis. 

I am at the moment looking at bringing back to life a HT-32 I got for $10. But 
the AC is or has been lifted off the chassis. There have been a number of mods 
under the chassis. So I want to have a better understanding of how to rewire 
the power cord. 

I also am looking at some antique radios that are AC/DC types that will need 
new cords, so this inquiry is multipurpose. 


  
___
Boatanchors mailing list
Boatanchors@puck.nether.net
https://puck.nether.net/mailman/listinfo/boatanchors

Re: [Boatanchors] Article on changing from 2 to 3 wire power cords

[Maury Guzick]

 Hi Al
Thanks for the info. The HT32 has been in AC for almost a year, so I don't 
think moisture will be an issue also, the rectifiers have been solid stated. 
But, I am unsure of any thing else except there has been a relay replacement 
with the new one hanging unsecured under the chassis. I will start with a new 3 
wire power cord and replace the one with bad insulation then do some checks on 
the transformer and main caps. 

All the best.
73
MauryW5IO

On Wednesday, August 7, 2019, 1:20:34 PM CDT, Al Parker  
wrote:  
 
 Hi Maury,
    The HT-32 is a great xmtr, I use mine weekly.  But there are a few 
"gotchas" in it.
    First off, don't power it up yet (or again).  The HT-32 & HT-37 (plus 
other Halli xfmrs) are prone to picking up moisture if in storage for 
any length of time.  The HV winding will short to one of the 5v windings 
fairly soon after powering up in it's been stored.  If any question, put 
a 60 watt light bulb under it for a day or 3 to warm it up and drive out 
moisture.
    The problem then can be avoided by installing SS diodes in place of 
both rectifiers, and disconnecting the 5v leads from both sockets.
    Second, the bias supply has a selenium rectifier in it that probably 
has gone bad and you won't get enough negative bias voltage on the 
finals to cut them off when you let the key or mike switch up.  If it's 
not too bad, the AC fuse, if it's proper size, will blow after a while. 
If a prev. owner has installed a bigger fuse, and the bias voltage is 
too far off, the finals will melt down.
    You can see some of my experiences with the HT-32/37's at 
  The SS diodes are covered abt half 
way down the pg.  I don't think I've put anything out on the bias 
rectifier fix, but a small SS diode will do the job, but since it has 
much less voltage drop it will need a dropping resistor added at its 
output.  IIRC, 2k-3k will be reqd.
    The fan will probably be noisy, if not now, after a while.  Replace it 
with a small fan from a PC or elsewhere, with a proper pwr supply to it. 
  (blowing out).
    The AC line is isolated from the chassis, no problem with that.  When 
you install a 3-wire cord, wire the hot (black wire to the fuse, and the 
neutral (white) to the other line, xfmr primary.  The green wire to any 
convenient ground point.
    I hope this is of some help to you,
73,
Al, W8UT
www.boatanchors.org
www.hammarlund.info

"There is nothing -- absolutely nothing -- half so much
worth doing as simply messing about in boats"
Ratty, to Mole

On 8/7/2019 10:08 AM, Maury Guzick wrote:
>  I appreciate all the replies.
> 
> I have been replacing worn out 2 wire power cords with newer 2 wire cords of 
> similar style on radios with one side grounded to the chassis.
> 
> I am at the moment looking at bringing back to life a HT-32 I got for $10. 
> But the AC is or has been lifted off the chassis. There have been a number of 
> mods under the chassis. So I want to have a better understanding of how to 
> rewire the power cord.
> 
> I also am looking at some antique radios that are AC/DC types that will need 
> new cords, so this inquiry is multipurpose.
> 
> 73MauryW5IO
> 
> 
> 
>      On Tuesday, August 6, 2019, 7:17:20 PM CDT, Eric  
>wrote:
>  
>  My very unlearned opinion.
> 
> 
> Connecting a supposed to be floating metal cabinet to the grounding wire
> and then using the hot and neutral wires to connect to the chassis
> inside the cabinet would protect against the cabinet from "going hot".
> As far as I know this is the entire purpose of the grounding wire.
> 
> If the cabinet is wood, plastic or some other insulating material,then I
> can't see any reason to install a 3 wire cord & plug.
> 
> 
> Eric
> WB6TIX
  
___
Boatanchors mailing list
Boatanchors@puck.nether.net
https://puck.nether.net/mailman/listinfo/boatanchors

Re: [Boatanchors] Article on changing from 2 to 3 wire power cords

[Al Parker]

Hi Maury,
	The HT-32 is a great xmtr, I use mine weekly.  But there are a few 
"gotchas" in it.
	First off, don't power it up yet (or again).  The HT-32 & HT-37 (plus 
other Halli xfmrs) are prone to picking up moisture if in storage for 
any length of time.  The HV winding will short to one of the 5v windings 
fairly soon after powering up in it's been stored.  If any question, put 
a 60 watt light bulb under it for a day or 3 to warm it up and drive out 
moisture.
	The problem then can be avoided by installing SS diodes in place of 
both rectifiers, and disconnecting the 5v leads from both sockets.
	Second, the bias supply has a selenium rectifier in it that probably 
has gone bad and you won't get enough negative bias voltage on the 
finals to cut them off when you let the key or mike switch up.  If it's 
not too bad, the AC fuse, if it's proper size, will blow after a while. 
If a prev. owner has installed a bigger fuse, and the bias voltage is 
too far off, the finals will melt down.
	You can see some of my experiences with the HT-32/37's at 
  The SS diodes are covered abt half 
way down the pg.  I don't think I've put anything out on the bias 
rectifier fix, but a small SS diode will do the job, but since it has 
much less voltage drop it will need a dropping resistor added at its 
output.  IIRC, 2k-3k will be reqd.
	The fan will probably be noisy, if not now, after a while.  Replace it 
with a small fan from a PC or elsewhere, with a proper pwr supply to it. 
 (blowing out).
	The AC line is isolated from the chassis, no problem with that.  When 
you install a 3-wire cord, wire the hot (black wire to the fuse, and the 
neutral (white) to the other line, xfmr primary.  The green wire to any 
convenient ground point.

I hope this is of some help to you,
73,
Al, W8UT
www.boatanchors.org
www.hammarlund.info

"There is nothing -- absolutely nothing -- half so much
worth doing as simply messing about in boats"
Ratty, to Mole

On 8/7/2019 10:08 AM, Maury Guzick wrote:

  I appreciate all the replies.

I have been replacing worn out 2 wire power cords with newer 2 wire cords of 
similar style on radios with one side grounded to the chassis.

I am at the moment looking at bringing back to life a HT-32 I got for $10. But 
the AC is or has been lifted off the chassis. There have been a number of mods 
under the chassis. So I want to have a better understanding of how to rewire 
the power cord.

I also am looking at some antique radios that are AC/DC types that will need 
new cords, so this inquiry is multipurpose.

73MauryW5IO



 On Tuesday, August 6, 2019, 7:17:20 PM CDT, Eric  wrote:
  
  My very unlearned opinion.



Connecting a supposed to be floating metal cabinet to the grounding wire
and then using the hot and neutral wires to connect to the chassis
inside the cabinet would protect against the cabinet from "going hot".
As far as I know this is the entire purpose of the grounding wire.

If the cabinet is wood, plastic or some other insulating material,then I
can't see any reason to install a 3 wire cord & plug.


Eric
WB6TIX

___
Boatanchors mailing list
Boatanchors@puck.nether.net
https://puck.nether.net/mailman/listinfo/boatanchors

Re: [Boatanchors] Article on changing from 2 to 3 wire power cords

[David Rossetti]

According to Wikipedia, on a subject entitled Cheater Plugs, "In 1969 
Underwriters Laboratories mandated three-prong plugs on major appliances for 
safety", and "At that time, only half of the receptacles in US homes were 
three-prong." Additionally, "In 1971, the US National Electrical Code (NEC) 
required grounded receptacles in all locations of the home (effective January 
1, 1974)."

Dave Rossetti

Sent from my Verizon Motorola Droid
On Aug 7, 2019 1:29 PM, David Rossetti  wrote:
>
> Just as a data point, the house I grew up in was built around 1952 and used 
> the two equally sized outlets. Seems the addition, added on in or about 1961 
> used the three pronged outlets. I also remember buying lamps in 1977 that had 
> two equally sized prongs, something you won't see today.
>
> Dave Rossetti
>
> Sent from my Verizon Motorola Droid
> On Aug 7, 2019 11:42 AM, LARRY PICARD  wrote:
> >
> > I live in an older home.  
> > Before the knob and tube wiring was replaced a number of years ago, the 
> > original electrical outlets had only two slots and they were both the same 
> > size.
> > Does anyone know when three prong plugs and polarized plugs and their 
> > respective receptacles came into use? 
> > ___
> > Boatanchors mailing list
> > Boatanchors@puck.nether.net
> > https://puck.nether.net/mailman/listinfo/boatanchors
> ___
> Boatanchors mailing list
> Boatanchors@puck.nether.net
> https://puck.nether.net/mailman/listinfo/boatanchors
___
Boatanchors mailing list
Boatanchors@puck.nether.net
https://puck.nether.net/mailman/listinfo/boatanchors

Re: [Boatanchors] Article on changing from 2 to 3 wire power cords

[wb3fau55]

This is as safe as you wish to make it. Knob and tube wiring is safe
as long as you do not disturb it. Polarized 2 wire plugs are a help.
Lot of new stuff sold that way. New hair dryers have GFI protection in
the cords. Boatanchor radios are usually metal cabinets and need 3
wire cords. also good HQ ceramic caps on each wire to ground. GFIs
that trip, tell you there is a problem. 73 Russ.

-From: "David Rossetti" 
To: lmpic...@rogers.com
Cc: boatanchors@puck.nether.net
Sent: Wednesday August 7 2019 1:29:17PM
Subject: Re: [Boatanchors] Article on changing from 2 to 3 wire power
cords

Just as a data point, the house I grew up in was built around 1952 and
used the two equally sized outlets. Seems the addition, added on in or
about 1961 used the three pronged outlets. I also remember buying
lamps in 1977 that had two equally sized prongs, something you won't
see today.

 Dave Rossetti

 Sent from my Verizon Motorola Droid
 On Aug 7, 2019 11:42 AM, LARRY PICARD  wrote:
 >
 > I live in an older home. 
 > Before the knob and tube wiring was replaced a number of years ago,
the original electrical outlets had only two slots and they were both
the same size.
 > Does anyone know when three prong plugs and polarized plugs and
their respective receptacles came into use? 
 > ___
 > Boatanchors mailing list
 > Boatanchors@puck.nether.net
 >  

Links:
--
[1] https://puck.nether.net/mailman/listinfo/boatanchors
https://puck.nether.net/mailman/listinfo/boatanchors
 /> ___
 Boatanchors mailing list
 Boatanchors@puck.nether.net
 https://puck.nether.net/mailman/listinfo/boatanchors

Re: [Boatanchors] Article on changing from 2 to 3 wire power cords

[David Rossetti]

Just as a data point, the house I grew up in was built around 1952 and used the 
two equally sized outlets. Seems the addition, added on in or about 1961 used 
the three pronged outlets. I also remember buying lamps in 1977 that had two 
equally sized prongs, something you won't see today.

Dave Rossetti

Sent from my Verizon Motorola Droid
On Aug 7, 2019 11:42 AM, LARRY PICARD  wrote:
>
> I live in an older home.  
> Before the knob and tube wiring was replaced a number of years ago, the 
> original electrical outlets had only two slots and they were both the same 
> size.
> Does anyone know when three prong plugs and polarized plugs and their 
> respective receptacles came into use? 
> ___
> Boatanchors mailing list
> Boatanchors@puck.nether.net
> https://puck.nether.net/mailman/listinfo/boatanchors
___
Boatanchors mailing list
Boatanchors@puck.nether.net
https://puck.nether.net/mailman/listinfo/boatanchors

Re: [Boatanchors] Article on changing from 2 to 3 wire power cords

[LARRY PICARD]

I live in an older home.  
Before the knob and tube wiring was replaced a number of years ago, the 
original electrical outlets had only two slots and they were both the same size.
Does anyone know when three prong plugs and polarized plugs and their 
respective receptacles came into use? 
___
Boatanchors mailing list
Boatanchors@puck.nether.net
https://puck.nether.net/mailman/listinfo/boatanchors

Re: [Boatanchors] Article on changing from 2 to 3 wire power cords

[Maury Guzick]

 I appreciate all the replies. 

I have been replacing worn out 2 wire power cords with newer 2 wire cords of 
similar style on radios with one side grounded to the chassis. 

I am at the moment looking at bringing back to life a HT-32 I got for $10. But 
the AC is or has been lifted off the chassis. There have been a number of mods 
under the chassis. So I want to have a better understanding of how to rewire 
the power cord. 

I also am looking at some antique radios that are AC/DC types that will need 
new cords, so this inquiry is multipurpose. 

73MauryW5IO



On Tuesday, August 6, 2019, 7:17:20 PM CDT, Eric  wrote: 
 
 
 My very unlearned opinion.


Connecting a supposed to be floating metal cabinet to the grounding wire 
and then using the hot and neutral wires to connect to the chassis 
inside the cabinet would protect against the cabinet from "going hot". 
As far as I know this is the entire purpose of the grounding wire.

If the cabinet is wood, plastic or some other insulating material,then I 
can't see any reason to install a 3 wire cord & plug.


Eric
WB6TIX
___
Boatanchors mailing list
Boatanchors@puck.nether.net
https://puck.nether.net/mailman/listinfo/boatanchors
  
___
Boatanchors mailing list
Boatanchors@puck.nether.net
https://puck.nether.net/mailman/listinfo/boatanchors

Re: [Boatanchors] Article on changing from 2 to 3 wire power cords

[Glen Zook]

What is the model?
Some AC / DC receivers have a "hot" chassis and some do not.  Even those with a 
"hot" chassis are wired differently and things can be slightly modified to make 
such more safe.
Glen, K9STH 
Website: https://k9sth.net 

On Tuesday, August 6, 2019, 04:34:01 PM CDT, Maury Guzick 
 wrote:  
 
  
Hi Glenn, 

Long time. 

Yea, it's the tricky AC/DC I am concerned about. 

What about using MOV's, thought I read something about them not being 
recommended to use anymore in boatanchors?

 
___
Boatanchors mailing list
Boatanchors@puck.nether.net
https://puck.nether.net/mailman/listinfo/boatanchors