On 2022-10-17 09:38:41 +0200, Patrice Dumas wrote:
> Seems like MathML output was dropped from mathjax because it is not
> poratble:
> https://docs.mathjax.org/en/latest/output/mathml.html#mathml-output
The real solution would have been to use MathML on browsers that
support it and use a fallback
On Sun, Oct 16, 2022 at 10:08:17PM -0700, Raymond Toy wrote:
> Hmm, my default browser is Firefox. The output looks right, but I didn't
> check to see how it was actually rendered. I think texinfo 6.8 mathjax
> uses the SVG output instead of CHTML. Not sure why that is and if it
> really matters
On Sun, Oct 16, 2022 at 10:08:17PM -0700, Raymond Toy wrote:
> > I'm wondering why MathML (presentation markup) isn't available,
> > as according the test at
> >
> > http://eyeasme.com/Joe/MathML/MathML_browser_test.html
> >
> > it seems to be well supported by Firefox. It is as nice as SVG,
> >
On Fri, Oct 14, 2022 at 12:43 PM Vincent Lefevre wrote:
> On 2022-10-14 08:40:58 -0700, Raymond Toy wrote:
> > For one example of a texinfo doc using Mathjax, see
> > https://maxima.common-lisp.dev/. In particular, you can look at
> > https://maxima.common-lisp.dev/docs/maxima_79.html. A maxima
On 2022-10-15 18:34:16 -0500, Jacob Bachmeyer wrote:
> Vincent Lefevre wrote:
> > On 2022-10-14 21:11:19 -0500, Jacob Bachmeyer wrote:
> > > Arguably, this (having only a text terminal for reading the manual)
> > > is the use case for Info.
> >
> > The user may want to choose the HTML version for
On Sat, Oct 15, 2022 at 07:14:04PM -0500, Jacob Bachmeyer wrote:
> Since @math is defined to use TeX syntax in its argument, would it be better
> to extend the other Texinfo processors to recognize \var inside @math and do
> whatever is needed to make it act as @var in that case?
@var already seem
Gavin Smith wrote:
On Fri, Oct 14, 2022 at 09:27:22PM -0500, Jacob Bachmeyer wrote:
TeX has an \ifmmode conditional that is true in math mode; @var/\var and
other marking macros could be adjusted to mark their arguments appropriately
when invoked in math mode. Are there other macros that wou
Vincent Lefevre wrote:
On 2022-10-15 12:04:18 +0100, Gavin Smith wrote:
On Fri, Oct 14, 2022 at 09:27:22PM -0500, Jacob Bachmeyer wrote:
Since "var" actually is a TeX macro (Texinfo works by adjusting TeX's
configuration to make @ introduce commands, like backslash does in plain
TeX), w
Vincent Lefevre wrote:
On 2022-10-14 21:11:19 -0500, Jacob Bachmeyer wrote:
Vincent Lefevre wrote:
On 2022-10-14 07:06:03 +0100, Gavin Smith wrote:
On Fri, Oct 14, 2022 at 12:40:08AM +0200, Vincent Lefevre wrote:
[...]
* mathjax is not compatible with text browsers.
On Sat, Oct 15, 2022 at 03:43:00PM +0100, Gavin Smith wrote:
> On Sat, Oct 15, 2022 at 03:20:22PM +0200, Patrice Dumas wrote:
> > Should be done for latex2html too. I still haven't finished handling
> > @latex blocks correctly, but should be done soon.
>
> I doubt it is correct to convert the con
On Sat, Oct 15, 2022 at 03:20:22PM +0200, Patrice Dumas wrote:
> Should be done for latex2html too. I still haven't finished handling
> @latex blocks correctly, but should be done soon.
I doubt it is correct to convert the contents of @latex and @tex
blocks when outputting HTML unless --iflatex o
On Sat, Oct 15, 2022 at 01:52:57PM +0100, Gavin Smith wrote:
> On Sat, Oct 15, 2022 at 02:28:54PM +0200, Patrice Dumas wrote:
> > On Sat, Oct 15, 2022 at 12:32:00PM +0100, Gavin Smith wrote:
> > >
> > > l2h and t4h settings still output "@var" literally even with
> > > '-c CONVERT_TO_LATEX_IN_MATH
On Sat, Oct 15, 2022 at 02:28:54PM +0200, Patrice Dumas wrote:
> On Sat, Oct 15, 2022 at 12:32:00PM +0100, Gavin Smith wrote:
> >
> > l2h and t4h settings still output "@var" literally even with
> > '-c CONVERT_TO_LATEX_IN_MATH=1'. I'm going to spend some time
> > investigating this.
>
> I think
On Fri, Oct 14, 2022 at 12:40:08AM +0200, Vincent Lefevre wrote:
> * Concerning t4h,
> @math{@var{base} \le 16},
> yields "@varbase ≤ 16 ,", so @var doesn't work (while it is needed
> to ensure exactly the same typography/code as outside @math, e.g.
> base) and there is a spurio
On Sat, Oct 15, 2022 at 12:32:00PM +0100, Gavin Smith wrote:
>
> l2h and t4h settings still output "@var" literally even with
> '-c CONVERT_TO_LATEX_IN_MATH=1'. I'm going to spend some time
> investigating this.
I think that I fixed it. CONVERT_TO_LATEX_IN_MATH is set in the default
case if HTM
On 2022-10-15 12:32:00 +0100, Gavin Smith wrote:
> On Fri, Oct 14, 2022 at 09:27:22PM -0500, Jacob Bachmeyer wrote:
> > TeX has an \ifmmode conditional that is true in math mode; @var/\var and
> > other marking macros could be adjusted to mark their arguments appropriately
> > when invoked in math
On 2022-10-15 12:04:18 +0100, Gavin Smith wrote:
> On Fri, Oct 14, 2022 at 09:27:22PM -0500, Jacob Bachmeyer wrote:
> > Since "var" actually is a TeX macro (Texinfo works by adjusting TeX's
> > configuration to make @ introduce commands, like backslash does in plain
> > TeX), would the correct synt
On Fri, Oct 14, 2022 at 09:27:22PM -0500, Jacob Bachmeyer wrote:
> TeX has an \ifmmode conditional that is true in math mode; @var/\var and
> other marking macros could be adjusted to mark their arguments appropriately
> when invoked in math mode. Are there other macros that would be appropriate
>
On Fri, Oct 14, 2022 at 09:27:22PM -0500, Jacob Bachmeyer wrote:
> Vincent Lefevre wrote:
> > On 2022-10-14 11:30:33 +0200, Patrice Dumas wrote:
> > > On Fri, Oct 14, 2022 at 12:40:08AM +0200, Vincent Lefevre wrote:
> > > > On 2022-10-13 21:15:57 +0200, Patrice Dumas wrote:
> > > > All of them are
On 2022-10-14 21:27:22 -0500, Jacob Bachmeyer wrote:
> Vincent Lefevre wrote:
> > I assumed that this was for commands that exist in plain TeX, which
> > is not the case of @var.
>
> Since "var" actually is a TeX macro (Texinfo works by adjusting TeX's
> configuration to make @ introduce commands,
On 2022-10-14 21:11:19 -0500, Jacob Bachmeyer wrote:
> Vincent Lefevre wrote:
> > On 2022-10-14 07:06:03 +0100, Gavin Smith wrote:
> > > On Fri, Oct 14, 2022 at 12:40:08AM +0200, Vincent Lefevre wrote:
> > > [...]
> > > > * mathjax is not compatible with text browsers.
> > > Not a bug, working as
Vincent Lefevre wrote:
On 2022-10-14 11:30:33 +0200, Patrice Dumas wrote:
On Fri, Oct 14, 2022 at 12:40:08AM +0200, Vincent Lefevre wrote:
On 2022-10-13 21:15:57 +0200, Patrice Dumas wrote:
All of them are buggy:
* Concerning t4h,
@math{@var{base} \le 16},
yields "@varbase ≤
Vincent Lefevre wrote:
On 2022-10-14 07:06:03 +0100, Gavin Smith wrote:
On Fri, Oct 14, 2022 at 12:40:08AM +0200, Vincent Lefevre wrote:
[...]
* mathjax is not compatible with text browsers.
Not a bug, working as designed.
Also broken design as there is no correct fallb
On 2022-10-14 20:52:38 +0100, Gavin Smith wrote:
> Rendering mathematical notation in a text terminal can work well for
> very simple formulae but breaks down for more complex formulae, like
>
> J_v(z) = \sum_{k=0}^{\infty }{{{\left(-1\right)^{k}\,\left(z\over
> 2\right)^{v+2\,k}
> }\over{k!\,\G
On Fri, Oct 14, 2022 at 04:33:54PM +0200, Vincent Lefevre wrote:
> Wikipedia has an article about kerning, but not with a good example
> of how ugly and disturbing the lack of kerning can be. I suggest
> that you look at
>
>
> https://tex.stackexchange.com/questions/448069/fix-ugly-kerning-in-e
On Fri, Oct 14, 2022 at 07:06:04AM +0100, Gavin Smith wrote:
> On Fri, Oct 14, 2022 at 12:40:08AM +0200, Vincent Lefevre wrote:
> > On 2022-10-13 21:15:57 +0200, Patrice Dumas wrote:
> > > I agree with Gavin, you should not use @math if you want normal text,
> > > but given that there is now good s
On Fri, Oct 14, 2022 at 08:40:58AM -0700, Raymond Toy wrote:
> > I tested the page
> > https://mathjax.github.io/MathJax-demos-web/tex-chtml.html
> > with lynx (there are no Texinfo manuals with mathjax enabled I know of,
> > if anybody knows about one, please tell me), and the result seems good
>
On 2022-10-14 08:40:58 -0700, Raymond Toy wrote:
> For one example of a texinfo doc using Mathjax, see
> https://maxima.common-lisp.dev/. In particular, you can look at
> https://maxima.common-lisp.dev/docs/maxima_79.html. A maxima user (who
> might be blind?) says that the MathJax-enabled formul
On Fri, Oct 14, 2022 at 7:02 AM Patrice Dumas wrote:
> On Fri, Oct 14, 2022 at 01:31:20PM +0200, Vincent Lefevre wrote:
> > > On Fri, Oct 14, 2022 at 12:40:08AM +0200, Vincent Lefevre wrote:
> > > >
> > > > * l2h generates image files as documented, which have many
> drawbacks
> > > > (do n
On 2022-10-14 16:08:59 +0200, Patrice Dumas wrote:
> I was probably unclear, I just wanted to add an information on
> ligatures, it was not related to kerning (I do not actually really
> know what kerning is...).
Wikipedia has an article about kerning, but not with a good example
of how ugly and d
On 2022-10-14 16:01:58 +0200, Patrice Dumas wrote:
> On Fri, Oct 14, 2022 at 01:31:20PM +0200, Vincent Lefevre wrote:
> > > On Fri, Oct 14, 2022 at 12:40:08AM +0200, Vincent Lefevre wrote:
> > > >
> > > > * l2h generates image files as documented, which have many drawbacks
> > > > (do not wo
On Fri, Oct 14, 2022 at 03:50:51PM +0200, Vincent Lefevre wrote:
> > No, it is for all the @-commands, and, in my opinion, the sentence is
> > clear as is. But do not hesitate to propose changes in the manual if
> > you think it can be ameliorated.
>
> What I thought was that plain TeX was render
On Fri, Oct 14, 2022 at 01:31:20PM +0200, Vincent Lefevre wrote:
> > On Fri, Oct 14, 2022 at 12:40:08AM +0200, Vincent Lefevre wrote:
> > >
> > > * l2h generates image files as documented, which have many drawbacks
> > > (do not work with text browsers, not accessible, font size issues
> > >
On 2022-10-14 15:15:40 +0200, Patrice Dumas wrote:
> On Fri, Oct 14, 2022 at 01:41:20PM +0200, Vincent Lefevre wrote:
> > On 2022-10-14 11:30:33 +0200, Patrice Dumas wrote:
> > > "In general, the contents of @math or @displaymath should be plain TeX
> > > only, with no interspersed Texinfo command
On Fri, Oct 14, 2022 at 01:41:20PM +0200, Vincent Lefevre wrote:
> On 2022-10-14 11:30:33 +0200, Patrice Dumas wrote:
> > "In general, the contents of @math or @displaymath should be plain TeX
> > only, with no interspersed Texinfo commands."
>
> I assumed that this was for commands that exist in
On 2022-10-14 11:30:33 +0200, Patrice Dumas wrote:
> On Fri, Oct 14, 2022 at 12:40:08AM +0200, Vincent Lefevre wrote:
> > On 2022-10-13 21:15:57 +0200, Patrice Dumas wrote:
> > All of them are buggy:
> > * Concerning t4h,
> > @math{@var{base} \le 16},
> > yields "@varbase ≤ 16 ,", so @v
On 2022-10-14 07:06:03 +0100, Gavin Smith wrote:
> On Fri, Oct 14, 2022 at 12:40:08AM +0200, Vincent Lefevre wrote:
> > On 2022-10-13 21:15:57 +0200, Patrice Dumas wrote:
> > > I agree with Gavin, you should not use @math if you want normal text,
> > > but given that there is now good support of Te
On Fri, Oct 14, 2022 at 12:40:08AM +0200, Vincent Lefevre wrote:
> On 2022-10-13 21:15:57 +0200, Patrice Dumas wrote:
> All of them are buggy:
> * Concerning t4h,
> @math{@var{base} \le 16},
> yields "@varbase ≤ 16 ,", so @var doesn't work (while it is needed
> to ensure exactly the
On Fri, Oct 14, 2022 at 12:40:08AM +0200, Vincent Lefevre wrote:
> On 2022-10-13 21:15:57 +0200, Patrice Dumas wrote:
> > I agree with Gavin, you should not use @math if you want normal text,
> > but given that there is now good support of TeX math in texi2any for
> > HTML with any of the 3 HTML_MA
On Thu, Oct 13, 2022 at 11:20:24PM +0200, Vincent Lefevre wrote:
> is not true. More precisely, I would expect
>
> @macro ttie
> @end macro
>
> to generate nothing, but inserting @ttie{} in a TeX expression
> modifies the spacing in the generated PDF.
Please provide a minimal example showing the
On 2022-10-13 21:15:57 +0200, Patrice Dumas wrote:
> I agree with Gavin, you should not use @math if you want normal text,
> but given that there is now good support of TeX math in texi2any for
> HTML with any of the 3 HTML_MATH option,
All of them are buggy:
* l2h generates image files as docum
On 2022-10-13 19:17:13 +0100, Gavin Smith wrote:
> On Thu, Oct 13, 2022 at 11:57:26AM +0200, Vincent Lefevre wrote:
> > The GMP manual has the following:
> >
> > @c @m{T,N} is $T$ in tex or @math{N} otherwise. Commas in N or T don't
> > work,
> > @c but @C{} can be used instead.
> > @iftex
> >
On Thu, Oct 13, 2022 at 11:57:26AM +0200, Vincent Lefevre wrote:
> The GMP manual has the following:
>
> @c @m{T,N} is $T$ in tex or @math{N} otherwise. Commas in N or T don't work,
> @c but @C{} can be used instead.
> @iftex
> @macro m {T,N}
> @tex$\T\$@end tex
> @end macro
> @end iftex
> @ifn
On Thu, Oct 13, 2022 at 11:57:26AM +0200, Vincent Lefevre wrote:
> On 2022-10-13 06:48:49 +0100, Gavin Smith wrote:
> > This is the default if MathJax is not turned on or tex4ht or latex2html
> > are not used. The tag marks the text as separate. There is not
> > much more that could be done - te
On 2022-10-13 06:48:49 +0100, Gavin Smith wrote:
> This is the default if MathJax is not turned on or tex4ht or latex2html
> are not used. The tag marks the text as separate. There is not
> much more that could be done - texi2any does not itself interpret
> TeX math notation at all and is not go
On Wed, Oct 12, 2022 at 12:40:12AM +0200, Vincent Lefevre wrote:
> The Texinfo manual says
>
>The '@math' command has no special effect on the Info output or (by
> default) the HTML output, merely outputting the contents verbatim.
>
> However, as said later, the contents are emphasized (with
On Wed, Oct 12, 2022 at 11:34:45AM +0200, Vincent Lefevre wrote:
> >
> > There are now other options for math formatting in HTML, but they are
> > suitable for TeX/LaTeX math, not much for text describing math. If I
> > understand well your need, I think that using CSS to change how @math is
> >
On 2022-10-12 11:22:22 +0200, Patrice Dumas wrote:
> On Wed, Oct 12, 2022 at 12:40:12AM +0200, Vincent Lefevre wrote:
> > Moreover, using is incorrect because things like digits should
> > not be in italics. For instance, with the GMP manual, one has about
> > mpz_mul_2exp (since r3083): "op1 time
On Wed, Oct 12, 2022 at 12:40:12AM +0200, Vincent Lefevre wrote:
> The Texinfo manual says
>
>The '@math' command has no special effect on the Info output or (by
> default) the HTML output, merely outputting the contents verbatim.
>
> However, as said later, the contents are emphasized (with
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