Re: Extremely CISC instructions

2021-08-24 Thread Peter Corlett via cctalk
On Tue, Aug 24, 2021 at 01:38:33AM +0100, Tom Stepleton via cctalk wrote: > For the sake of illustration to folks who are not necessarily used to > thinking about what computers do at the machine code level, I'm interested > in collecting examples of single instructions for any CPU architecture >

Re: 3d modelling software

2021-08-24 Thread shadoooo via cctalk
Hello Rob, FreeCAD is nice for modeling 3D shapes. For 3D printing, depending on the technology of 3D printer, you need to process original model to convert compact sections into hollow honeycomb structure, and add small plastic bars into empty volumes to support the model while it's printed.

Re: 3d modelling software

2021-08-24 Thread geneb via cctalk
On Mon, 23 Aug 2021, shad via cctech wrote: Hello Rob, FreeCAD is nice for modeling 3D shapes. Not if you've ever used a commercial product that does the same job. ;) For 3D printing, depending on the technology of 3D printer, you need to process original model to convert compact

Re: 3d modelling software

2021-08-24 Thread Torfinn Ingolfsen via cctalk
On Mon, Aug 23, 2021 at 10:29 PM shad via cctech wrote: > > > For 3D printing, depending on the technology of 3D printer, you need to > process original model to convert compact sections into hollow honeycomb > structure, and add small plastic bars into empty volumes to support the model >

Re: 3d modelling software

2021-08-24 Thread Jon Elson via cctalk
On 8/23/21 3:29 PM, shad via cctech wrote: Hello Rob, FreeCAD is nice for modeling 3D shapes. For 3D printing, depending on the technology of 3D printer, you need to process original model to convert compact sections into hollow honeycomb structure, and add small plastic bars into empty

Re: 3d modelling software

2021-08-24 Thread Steve Malikoff via cctalk
Rob asked > I think I may need to get a small part 3d printed (some plastic board > mounting guide rails from a PDP 11/24 H7140 PSU). What software is best for > a novice? Preferably free! I've found OpenSCAD to be perfect for things like brackets, machine parts and so on. It's no good for

Re: Extremely CISC instructions

2021-08-24 Thread dwight via cctalk
DSP processors, like the 2100 series of Analog Devices, one single instruction that would take value from one array and multiply it by a value from another array and then add it to another array, while incrementing the indexes. I'd say that was CISC like. Dwight

Re: Extremely CISC instructions

2021-08-24 Thread John Foust via cctalk
At 04:13 AM 8/24/2021, Peter Corlett via cctalk wrote: >move.b ([0x12345678, %pc, %d0.w*8], 0x9abcdef0), ([0x87654321, %sp], %a0*4, >0x0fedcba9) And which language and compiler case was this aimed at? Wasn't that a primary driver for complex CISC instructions? That if it happened often

Re: Extremely CISC instructions

2021-08-24 Thread Diane Bruce via cctalk
On Mon, Aug 23, 2021 at 09:09:55PM -0400, Paul Koning via cctalk wrote: > > > > On Aug 23, 2021, at 8:38 PM, Tom Stepleton via cctalk > > wrote: > > > > Hello, > > > > For the sake of illustration to folks who are not necessarily used to > > thinking about what computers do at the machine

Re: Extremely CISC instructions

2021-08-24 Thread Chuck Guzis via cctalk
On 8/24/21 3:34 AM, Diane Bruce via cctalk wrote: > Indeed. Just its addressing modes, with indirection and two separate register > indexing operations, are hairy enough. Then consider the decimal arithmetic > instructions that might have up to 6 operands. > > And who can ever forget the built

Re: Extremely CISC instructions

2021-08-24 Thread Diane Bruce via cctalk
On Tue, Aug 24, 2021 at 11:38:42AM -0400, Paul Koning wrote: > > > > On Aug 24, 2021, at 6:34 AM, Diane Bruce wrote: > > > > On Mon, Aug 23, 2021 at 09:09:55PM -0400, Paul Koning via cctalk wrote: > >> > >> > >>> On Aug 23, 2021, at 8:38 PM, Tom Stepleton via cctalk > >>> wrote: > >>> ...

Re: Extremely CISC instructions

2021-08-24 Thread Van Snyder via cctalk
On Tue, 2021-08-24 at 15:55 +, dwight via cctalk wrote: > DSP processors, like the 2100 series of Analog Devices, one single > instruction that would take value from one array and multiply it by a > value from another array and then add it to another array, while > incrementing the indexes.

Re: Extremely CISC instructions

2021-08-24 Thread Chuck Guzis via cctalk
As a followup, I did find the following article about the Saxpy Matrix-1: https://techmonitor.ai/techonology/the_saxpy_affair_and_why_we_all_have_to_worry_about_the_theft_of_its_secrets --Chuck

Re: Extremely CISC instructions

2021-08-24 Thread Paul Koning via cctalk
> On Aug 24, 2021, at 11:57 AM, Peter Corlett via cctalk > wrote: > > On Tue, Aug 24, 2021 at 08:47:33AM -0500, John Foust via cctalk wrote: >> At 04:13 AM 8/24/2021, Peter Corlett via cctalk wrote: >>> move.b ([0x12345678, %pc, %d0.w*8], 0x9abcdef0), ([0x87654321, %sp], %a0*4, >>>

RE: Extremely CISC instructions

2021-08-24 Thread Dave Wade G4UGM via cctalk
Hi Tom, Well for me the VAX has some of the most interesting instructions, so the POLY instruction will evaluate a polynomial and EMOD will multiply and separate the integer and fractional parts. I also find it interesting that some architectures will only allow the privilege state to be

Re: Extremely CISC instructions

2021-08-24 Thread Gordon Henderson via cctalk
On Tue, 24 Aug 2021, Tom Stepleton via cctalk wrote: Hello, For the sake of illustration to folks who are not necessarily used to thinking about what computers do at the machine code level, I'm interested in collecting examples of single instructions for any CPU architecture that are unusually

Re: Extremely CISC instructions

2021-08-24 Thread Paul Koning via cctalk
> On Aug 24, 2021, at 6:34 AM, Diane Bruce wrote: > > On Mon, Aug 23, 2021 at 09:09:55PM -0400, Paul Koning via cctalk wrote: >> >> >>> On Aug 23, 2021, at 8:38 PM, Tom Stepleton via cctalk >>> wrote: >>> >>> Hello, >>> >>> For the sake of illustration to folks who are not necessarily

Re: Extremely CISC instructions

2021-08-24 Thread Chuck Guzis via cctalk
On 8/24/21 10:40 AM, Van Snyder via cctalk wrote: > That's the BLAS SAXPY (or DAXPY) routine, a fundamental step in > Gaussian elimination. Speaking of which, do any specimens of the Saxpy Matrix-1 still exist? Saxpy Computer was a brief flash in the supercomputing universe; fell onto bad times

Re: Extremely CISC instructions

2021-08-24 Thread Peter Corlett via cctalk
On Tue, Aug 24, 2021 at 08:47:33AM -0500, John Foust via cctalk wrote: > At 04:13 AM 8/24/2021, Peter Corlett via cctalk wrote: >> move.b ([0x12345678, %pc, %d0.w*8], 0x9abcdef0), ([0x87654321, %sp], %a0*4, >> 0x0fedcba9) > And which language and compiler case was this aimed at? I have no idea

Re: Multiprocessor Qbus PDP-11

2021-08-24 Thread Charles Dickman via cctalk
On Fri, Aug 20, 2021 at 7:55 AM Paul Koning wrote: > > > > On Aug 19, 2021, at 7:39 PM, Charles Dickman via cctalk < > cctalk@classiccmp.org> wrote: > > > > There are indications in the KDJ11-B processor spec on bitsavers that the > > M8190 could be used in a multiprocessor configuration. For

Re: Extremely CISC instructions

2021-08-24 Thread Paul Koning via cctalk
> On Aug 23, 2021, at 8:38 PM, Tom Stepleton via cctalk > wrote: > > Hello, > > For the sake of illustration to folks who are not necessarily used to > thinking about what computers do at the machine code level, I'm interested > in collecting examples of single instructions for any CPU

Re: Extremely CISC instructions

2021-08-24 Thread Van Snyder via cctalk
On Tue, 2021-08-24 at 11:11 -0700, Chuck Guzis via cctalk wrote: > On 8/24/21 10:40 AM, Van Snyder via cctalk wrote: > > > That's the BLAS SAXPY (or DAXPY) routine, a fundamental step in > > Gaussian elimination. > > Speaking of which, do any specimens of the Saxpy Matrix-1 still > exist? >

Re: Archiving otrona attache disks

2021-08-24 Thread Fred Cisin via cctalk
On Tue, 24 Aug 2021, Bill Degnan wrote: Fred, Just for the purpose of imaging the disks, is there any reason I cant treat these disks like any other 5 1/4" cpm 360k disk? Bill Treat them just like any other 5.25" MFM CP/M disk. IIRC, the 48TPI ones are 400K, with 512 bytes per sector, 10

Re: Archiving otrona attache disks

2021-08-24 Thread Bill Degnan via cctalk
Fred, Just for the purpose of imaging the disks, is there any reason I cant treat these disks like any other 5 1/4" cpm 360k disk? Bill On Fri, Aug 20, 2021, 9:09 PM Fred Cisin via cctech wrote: > On Fri, 20 Aug 2021, Bill Degnan via cctech wrote: > > Is there a simh for the otrona attache? I

Re: Archiving otrona attache disks

2021-08-24 Thread geneb via cctalk
On Tue, 24 Aug 2021, Fred Cisin via cctech wrote: The 96tpi ones are 800K, and should be treated like any other "Quad Density" CP/M disk. Just for my own curiosity, can a "typical" high-density 5.25" drive correctly image a 96tpi disk? Thanks Fred! g. -- Proud owner of F-15C 80-0007

Re: Extremely CISC instructions

2021-08-24 Thread Ken Seefried via cctalk
The Hitachi SH4 has a set of pipelineable vector instructions that work on 4x4 and 4x1 length vectors (implemented as 2 sets of 16 FP registers). Nothing compared to MMX/SSE/AVX, but relatively complex.

Re: Extremely CISC instructions

2021-08-24 Thread Jay Jaeger via cctalk
On 8/23/2021 8:51 PM, Van Snyder via cctech wrote: On Tue, 2021-08-24 at 01:38 +0100, Tom Stepleton via cctalk wrote: For the sake of illustration to folks who are not necessarily used to thinking about what computers do at the machine code level, I'm interested in collecting examples of single

CWVG

2021-08-24 Thread Mike Loewen via cctalk
Back in the 2007 time frame, Andrew Lynch had written a utility to read Vector Graphic hard-sectored diskettes on a Catweasel board. Called "CWVG", does anyone have a copy of the program? Mike Loewen mloe...@cpumagic.scol.pa.us Old Technology

Re: Extremely CISC instructions

2021-08-24 Thread Paul Koning via cctalk
Another interesting architecture, not sure if it quite fits your question: the orthogonal computer. You could think of that as vector processor with serial arithmetic -- a cross of a Cray-1 and a PDP-8/S :-) It was invented in the 1960s by William Shooman, and sold for a time by Sanders

Re: Archiving otrona attache disks

2021-08-24 Thread Fred Cisin via cctalk
The 96tpi ones are 800K, and should be treated like any other "Quad Density" CP/M disk. On Tue, 24 Aug 2021, geneb via cctech wrote: Just for my own curiosity, can a "typical" high-density 5.25" drive correctly image a 96tpi disk? USUALLY. Either the drive needs to be able to switch to 300