Re: Tandon TM-100-1 electronics repair

[Warner Losh via cctalk]

On Thu, Apr 27, 2017 at 11:49 PM, Chuck Guzis via cctalk
 wrote:
>> On Thu, 27 Apr 2017, Ethan Dicks via cctalk wrote:
>>
>>> Additionally, for a testing framework to poke signals through the
>>> drive for debugging during the repair, what's a good platform?  A
>>> PC running MS-DOS?  The TRS-80 Model 4 itself?  Besides doing
>>> directories, are there any good bits of software anyone can
>>> recommend for exercising floppy drives on a sub-system-by-subsystem
>>> basis? (move the heads, do a read, do a write...)
>
>
> I'd still recommend Dave Dunfield's ImageDisk--it's got several good
> functions--test RPM, Clean heads, check alignment, etc.
>
> Runs on MS-DOS and, AFAIK, even on the 5150.
>
> I'm actually a bit surprised that nobody's done a floppy exerciser for
> the lowly Arduino.  Easy enough--if you use the timer "capture" feature
> on the AVR, you can even do simple disk read testing.

KryoFlux has something like that. https://www.kryoflux.com/ has the
details, but it is commercial.

Warner

Re: Tandon TM-100-1 electronics repair

[Chuck Guzis via cctalk]

> On Thu, 27 Apr 2017, Ethan Dicks via cctalk wrote:
> 
>> Additionally, for a testing framework to poke signals through the 
>> drive for debugging during the repair, what's a good platform?  A
>> PC running MS-DOS?  The TRS-80 Model 4 itself?  Besides doing 
>> directories, are there any good bits of software anyone can
>> recommend for exercising floppy drives on a sub-system-by-subsystem
>> basis? (move the heads, do a read, do a write...)


I'd still recommend Dave Dunfield's ImageDisk--it's got several good
functions--test RPM, Clean heads, check alignment, etc.

Runs on MS-DOS and, AFAIK, even on the 5150.

I'm actually a bit surprised that nobody's done a floppy exerciser for
the lowly Arduino.  Easy enough--if you use the timer "capture" feature
on the AVR, you can even do simple disk read testing.

--Chuck

Anyone driving from the Midwest to VCF_SE this weekend?

[Jim Brain via cctalk]

I am flying in and wondering if someone had any extra room coming home 
(for parts, not me).



Jim



--
Jim Brain
br...@jbrain.com
www.jbrain.com

Re: RA82 HDA

[Kirk Davis via cctalk]

Heh no. I’m going to ship it. It’s just the HDA assembly so it’s a lot more 
compact than the entire drive. Still it’s a heavy mutha :-)

Kirk

> On Apr 27, 2017, at 12:08 PM, Bill Gunshannon  
> wrote:
> 
> Did he come with a liftgate pickup truck?  :-)
> 
> bill
> 
> 
> From: cctalk [cctalk-boun...@classiccmp.org] on behalf of Kirk Davis via 
> cctalk [cctalk@classiccmp.org]
> Sent: Thursday, April 27, 2017 2:49 PM
> To: shad; General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts
> Subject: Re: RA82 HDA
> 
> San Jose, California. Someone has already nabbed it.
> 
> Kirk
> 
>> On Apr 27, 2017, at 11:03 AM, shad via cctalk  
>> wrote:
>> 
>> Hello,
>> where are you located?
>> If you are in EU, I'm interested.
>> 
>> Thanks
>> Andrea
> 

Re: Tandon TM-100-1 electronics repair

[Mike Loewen via cctalk]

On Thu, 27 Apr 2017, Ethan Dicks via cctalk wrote:


Additionally, for a testing framework to poke signals through the
drive for debugging during the repair, what's a good platform?  A PC
running MS-DOS?  The TRS-80 Model 4 itself?  Besides doing
directories, are there any good bits of software anyone can recommend
for exercising floppy drives on a sub-system-by-subsystem basis?
(move the heads, do a read, do a write...)


   You should check out a couple of disk utility programs for the Model 4:

Super Utility 4/4P

http://tim-mann.org/trs80/su4a.zip (CMD version)
https://fjkraan.home.xs4all.nl/comp/trs80-4p/dmkeilImages/util/97-0005.ace 
(bootable version)
http://tim-mann.org/trs80/doc/su4man.pdf

Hyperzap 3.2C

https://fjkraan.home.xs4all.nl/97-0002.ace

   If you hook up a working drive to boot from, one of those should help 
to exercise/exorcise the bad drive.  :-)



Mike Loewen mloe...@cpumagic.scol.pa.us
Old Technology  http://q7.neurotica.com/Oldtech/

Re: Tandon TM-100-1 electronics repair

[Ethan Dicks via cctalk]

On Thu, Apr 27, 2017 at 4:43 PM, Fred Cisin via cctalk
 wrote:
> On Thu, 27 Apr 2017, Ethan Dicks via cctalk wrote:
>>
>> It's not impossible to find another TM-100-1 or replace it with a
>> TM-100-2
>
> Actually, the IBM 5150 PC originally (August 1981) mostly came with TM100-1.
> It wasn't until about nine months later, when IBM released PC-DOS 1.10 (May,
> 1982, which supported double sided drives) that they added TM100-2
> availability.

Ah.  I had forgotten that detail.  I only ever worked machines with
double-sided drives.

> Why not use the TM100-2?   It will work for any of the single sided use, and
> some versions of the operating systems supported double sided drives.
> (On the Tandy version of LDOS, double sided support was undocumented,
> because Tandy didn't sell a double sided drive, until the model 4D?)

I know it will work.

> Remember that the PC uses all drives jumpered as if they were :1/DS1/B:

Right.  I well remember how to jumper drive selects.

> Radio Shack used an "unused" pin of the interface for drive :3/DS3/D:,
> Unfortunately, that was the pin that was "reserved" for side select!
> That poses a problem for model 1 (with four drives on one cable), but not
> for III, 4, nor 4P

Yes.  I was reading about that the other day.  I don't have any
4-drive units, just multiple dual-drive units.

> If you have a model 1 drive that has the modification for drive select using
> the side select signal, don't use it if you use any double sided drives in
> the machine, or clip that wire on the drive.

Good to keep in mind.  I borrowed a half-height "Bachelor" FD-104 from
a Model 1 for drive/controller testing.  I cannot find docs for it,
and barely a mention, even in TheRef.  There is one jumper block by
the 34-pin edge connector - marked D.S. / 0 / (1) / 2 / 3 / MX. (the
'1' is damaged/missing because of a PCB via).   It seems the first
jumper is likely to be single/double-sided (there are 2 heads), then 4
drive selects, then the MX one-drive-only-select jumper.

> You can use "half-height" drives in a model 3 or 4.

Yes but at the moment, I only have one half-height 40-track drive,
that Bachelor FD-104.  My only loose drives are 80-track HD units.

-ethan

Re: Tandon TM-100-1 electronics repair

[Ethan Dicks via cctalk]

On Thu, Apr 27, 2017 at 1:58 PM, Tony Duell  wrote:
> On Thu, Apr 27, 2017 at 6:42 PM, Ethan Dicks via cctalk
>> (diagnosing and repairing a) TM-100-1 floppy drive...

> Floppy drives of that vintage consist of a number of almost independant
> systems (there's a common enable/drive select but that's about it).
> It looks like a problem in the read chain, but is it? If the spindle was
> turning at the wrong speed I think it would fail to read.

Yes.  I did consider the spindle speed, but I'm reasonably certain it's good.

> So I would check each subsection of the drive, just in case it's not
> the obvious one.

Well, yes.  I'm really just asking about known weaknesses as a starting point.

> In the case of the read amplifier, you could start with a differential-
> input 'scope on the pins used for head alignment (reading a normal
> disk). If there's a good signal there the head select diodes (AFAIK
> these are present even on the single-sided drive) and first amplifier
> IC are OK. If not, then debug that part.

Right.

> I don't know of any obvious common failures, and anyway
> murphy's law will ensure that your drive has something odd failed :-)

Perhaps.  The last failure with this unit had the most obvious cause.
I literally tested one component and it was exactly that part that had
failed.

>> Additionally, for a testing framework...

> There are/were drive exercisers but no idea where you'd find one now.
> If you were nearer to me, you could use mine

Right.  I don't have a drive exerciser (and I live in the States) so I
didn't figure that was an easily achievable path.  I'm figuring on
having to use a live machine to make the drive dance and I don't fancy
writing my own code on top of it all.  Rather than go to that extent,
I'm more likely to toss the drive on the "to be fixed someday" pile
and get to it (much) later.

> You need a 'scope to debug the read amplifier of course (that
> applies even if you have a drive exerciser).

Yes.  Of course I have a scope.  At least one.

> Do check the spindle speed. Often there is a strobe disk on the
> spindle pulley in these drives

There is.  It works.

> But also check ('scope) that you are getting 5 index pulses
> per second, just in case the darn thing is running at half speed or
> something.

Worth verifying, but there's a visual difference between 300 RPM and
150 RPM (plus they sound different).

-ethan

Re: test, please ignore

[Sam O'nella via cctalk]

(Waits for Jay's next email "This has been a test of the new auto banning 
system. Thank you.")
 Original message From: Alexandre Souza via cctalk 
 Date: 4/27/17  1:58 PM  (GMT-06:00) To: "General 
Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts" , Jay West 
 Subject: Re: test, please ignore 
This is a test, designed to provoke an emotional response

Enviado do meu Tele-Movel

On Apr 26, 2017 9:39 PM, "Jay West via cctalk" 
wrote:

> Don't need a response, please ignore.
>
>
>
> J
>
>

Air Force Issues Challenge to “Hack the Air Force” 04/26/2017 04:10 PM CDT --

[Ed via cctalk]

 
 


 

   IMMEDIATE RELEASE No. NR-145-17
April 26,  2017

  
Air Force Issues Challenge to “Hack the Air Force”


The Air Force is inviting vetted computer  security specialists from across 
the U.S. and select partner nations to do  their best to hack some of its 
key public websites. 
The initiative is part of the Cyber Secure  campaign sponsored by the Air 
Force’s Chief Information Office as a  measure to further operationalize the 
domain and leverage talent from both  within and outside the Department of 
Defense. 
The event expands on the DoD ‘Hack the  Pentagon’ bug bounty program by 
broadening the participation pool from  U.S. citizens to include “white hat” 
hackers from the United Kingdom,  Canada, Australia and New Zealand. 
“This outside approach--drawing on the  talent and expertise of our 
citizens and partner-nation citizens--in  identifying our security 
vulnerabilities 
will help bolster our  cybersecurity. We already aggressively conduct 
exercises and 'red team'  our public facing and critical websites. But this 
next 
step throws open  the doors and brings additional talent onto our cyber team,”
 said Air  Force Chief of Staff Gen. David Goldfein. 
White hat hacking and crowdsourced security  concepts are industry 
standards that are used by small businesses and  large corporations alike to 
better 
secure their networks against malicious  attacks. Bug bounty programs offer 
paid bounties for all legitimate  vulnerabilities reported. 
“This is the first time the AF has opened up  our networks to such a broad 
scrutiny,” said Air Force Chief Information  Security Officer Peter Kim.  “
We have malicious hackers trying to get  into our systems every day. It will 
be nice to have friendly hackers  taking a shot and, most importantly, 
showing us how to improve our  cybersecurity and defense posture. The 
additional 
participation from our  partner nations greatly widens the variety of 
experience available to find  additional unique vulnerabilities.” 
Kim made the announcement at a kick-off  event held at the headquarters of 
HackerOne, the contracted security  consulting firm running the contest. 
"The whole idea of 'security through  obscurity' is completely backwards. 
We need to understand where our  weaknesses are in order to fix them, and 
there is no better way than to  open it up to the global hacker community," 
said Chris Lynch of the  Defense Digital Service (DDS), an organization 
comprised of industry  experts incorporating critical private sector experience 
across numerous  digital challenges.

The competition for technical talent in  both the public and private 
sectors is fiercer than it has ever been  according to Kim. The Air Force must 
compete with companies like Facebook  and Google for the best and brightest, 
particularly in the science,  technology, engineering, and math fields.
Keen to leverage private sector talent, the  Air Force partnered with DDS 
to launch the Air Force Digital Service team  in January 2017, affording a 
creative solution that turns that competition  for talent into a partnership. 
In fact, Acting Secretary of the Air Force  Lisa S. Disbrow and Gen. 
Goldfein visited the Defense Digital Service and  Air Force Digital Service in 
early April to discuss a variety of  initiatives the Air Force can benefit 
from. 
“We're mobilizing the best talent from  across the nation and among partner 
nations to help strengthen the Air  Force's cyber defenses.  It's an 
exciting venture, one that will make  us better, and one that focuses an 
incredible pool of capabilities toward  keeping our Air Force sites secure," 
said 
Acting Secretary  Disbrow.  
The DoD’s ‘Hack the Pentagon’ initiative was  launched by the Defense 
Digital Service in April 2016 as the first bug  bounty program employed by the 
federal government. More than 1,400 hackers  registered to participate in the 
program. Nearly 200 reports were received  within the first six hours of 
the program’s launch, and $75,000 in total  bounties was paid out to 
participating hackers. 
Registration for the ‘Hack the Air Force’ event opens on May  15th on the 
_HackerOne_ (http://links.govdelivery.com/track?type=click
=ZWFzPTEmbWFpbGluZ2lkPTIwMTcwNDI3LjcyNzk2MTYxJm1lc3NhZ2VpZD1NREItUFJELUJVTC0yMDE3MDQyNy43M
jc5NjE2MSZkYXRhYmFzZWlkPTEwMDEmc2VyaWFsPTE3NDEwNDE5JmVtYWlsaWQ9Y291cnlob3VzZ
UBhb2wuY29tJnVzZXJpZD1jb3VyeWhvdXNlQGFvbC5jb20mZmw9JmV4dHJhPU11bHRpdmFyaWF0Z
UlkPSYmJg==&&&101&&&https://www.hackerone.com/?source=GovDelivery)  
website. The contest opens on  May 30th and ends on June 23rd. Military members 
and 
 government civilians are not eligible for compensation, but can  
participate on-duty with supervisor approval.


 

Updates from the U.S. Department of Defense 
 

Re: Tandon TM-100-1 electronics repair

[Fred Cisin via cctalk]

On Thu, 27 Apr 2017, Ethan Dicks via cctalk wrote:

It's not impossible to find another TM-100-1 or replace it with a
TM-100-2 (more common, owing to its appearance in the IBM 5150 PC),
but I'd like to just repair this one and get back to TRS-80 hacking.


Actually, the IBM 5150 PC originally (August 1981) mostly came with 
TM100-1.  It wasn't until about nine months later, when IBM released 
PC-DOS 1.10 (May, 1982, which supported double sided drives) that they 
added TM100-2 availability.


Why not use the TM100-2?   It will work for any of the single sided use, 
and some versions of the operating systems supported double sided drives.
(On the Tandy version of LDOS, double sided support was undocumented, 
because Tandy didn't sell a double sided drive, until the model 4D?)



Remember that the PC uses all drives jumpered as if they were :1/DS1/B:

Radio Shack used an "unused" pin of the interface for drive :3/DS3/D:, 
Unfortunately, that was the pin that was "reserved" for side select!
That poses a problem for model 1 (with four drives on one cable), but not 
for III, 4, nor 4P
If you have a model 1 drive that has the modification for drive select 
using the side select signal, don't use it if you use any double sided 
drives in the machine, or clip that wire on the drive.



You can use "half-height" drives in a model 3 or 4.

Re: IBM 3420 x2 + 3803 for sale

[Victor Presher via cctalk]

I am interested in your tape drives if you still have them.. Can you send
photos of all components?

 

Victor Presher

214-905-4447

 

 

Re: Tandon TM-100-1 electronics repair

[Chuck Guzis via cctalk]

On 04/27/2017 10:42 AM, Ethan Dicks via cctalk wrote:

> It's not impossible to find another TM-100-1 or replace it with a 
> TM-100-2 (more common, owing to its appearance in the IBM 5150 PC), 
> but I'd like to just repair this one and get back to TRS-80 hacking.


The issue with Jugi's artistry is that there isn't a single version of
the PCB for the TM-100.  I have drives with 3- 4- and 6-wire steppers on
them, all taking different PCBs.

But a TM-100 is a very simple-minded device.  You can easily check its
basic mechanical operation off the system by grounding various signal
lines (all are active-low).  So you can ground the motor line to make
sure that the motor spins; you can ground the drive select to see if the
LED illuminates.  With the drive select operating, you cna use the STEP
and DIRECTION lines to move the head carriage; you can check the
operation of the track zero sensor.

Checking the read-write channel is a bit more challenging and a 'scope
can be very useful.

For lack of anything else, if you've got a PC with a floppy controller,
you can use Dave Dunfield's ImageDisk utility to perform simple checks.
He includes an RPM tester, though if the drive still has the strobe disk
attached to the spindle flywheel, a simple line-operated neon lamp can
do the same.

--Chuck

RE: RA82 HDA

[Bill Gunshannon via cctalk]

Did he come with a liftgate pickup truck?  :-)

bill


From: cctalk [cctalk-boun...@classiccmp.org] on behalf of Kirk Davis via cctalk 
[cctalk@classiccmp.org]
Sent: Thursday, April 27, 2017 2:49 PM
To: shad; General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts
Subject: Re: RA82 HDA

San Jose, California. Someone has already nabbed it.

Kirk

> On Apr 27, 2017, at 11:03 AM, shad via cctalk  
> wrote:
>
> Hello,
> where are you located?
> If you are in EU, I'm interested.
>
> Thanks
> Andrea

Re: test, please ignore

[Alexandre Souza via cctalk]

This is a test, designed to provoke an emotional response

Enviado do meu Tele-Movel

On Apr 26, 2017 9:39 PM, "Jay West via cctalk" 
wrote:

> Don't need a response, please ignore.
>
>
>
> J
>
>

Re: RA82 HDA

[Kirk Davis via cctalk]

San Jose, California. Someone has already nabbed it.

Kirk

> On Apr 27, 2017, at 11:03 AM, shad via cctalk  
> wrote:
> 
> Hello,
> where are you located?
> If you are in EU, I'm interested.
> 
> Thanks
> Andrea

Re: RA82 HDA

[shadoooo via cctalk]

Hello,
where are you located?
If you are in EU, I'm interested.

Thanks
Andrea

Re: Tandon TM-100-1 electronics repair

[Tony Duell via cctalk]

On Thu, Apr 27, 2017 at 6:42 PM, Ethan Dicks via cctalk
 wrote:
> Hi, All,
>
> I'm cleaning/refurbing a TRS-80 Model 4 I picked up at VCFe that was
> in dirty-but-mostly-working shape.  I've completely dismantled,
> cleaned and reassembled the keyboard, I fixed the bad cable to the
> floppy controller, I cleaned and lubed the TM-100-1 floppy drive, and
> had it all nice and working, then I bumped the power strip it was
> plugged into and the momentary surge took out the electronics on the
> floppy drive.  I swapped it out with another TM-100-1 unit (borrowed
> from a Model 1) and it's booting again, but when using this toasted
> drive as :1, I get either an ERROR 3 or ERROR 4 from TRSDOS 1.3 (my
> primary testing disk for the moment).  The drive still seeks and spins
> but it won't read disks that it used to read before the power hit.
>
> I also have an original NEWDOS/80 disk and a copied MULTIDOS disk.  I
> have not yet fixed up a PC with a 40-track 5.25" drive for making
> fresh disks, but it's on the list of solution paths.
>
> I have the TM-100 service manual PDF (which includes schematics), so
> it shouldn't be difficult to work through the functional subsystems of
> the drive electronics.  My question is are there any specific issues
> with the parts on the TM-100 PCB to look for?  There are a handful of
> reasonably common ICs, and dozens of discrete components.  Of course I
> can trace through each section looking for where the results are
> unexpected, but for such a common thing as a TM-100, perhaps there are
> known pain points and perhaps someone here has repaired a few and
> could highlight what parts might be "fragile".

Floppy drives of that vintage consist of a number of almost independant
systems (there's a common enable/drive select but that's about it).
It looks like a problem in the read chain, but is it? If the spindle was
turning at the wrong speed I think it would fail to read.

So I would check each subsection of the drive, just in case it's not
the obvious one.

In the case of the read amplifier, you could start with a differential-
input 'scope on the pins used for head alignment (reading a normal
disk). If there's a good signal there the head select diodes (AFAIK
these are present even on the single-sided drive) and first amplifier
IC are OK. If not, then debug that part.

I don't know of any obvious common failures, and anyway
murphy's law will ensure that your drive has something odd failed :-)
Stock fault lists are useful if you have many indentical units to repair,
you might get 90% of them off the bench quickly but fairly useless for
one-off jobs.


>
> Additionally, for a testing framework to poke signals through the
> drive for debugging during the repair, what's a good platform?  A PC
> running MS-DOS?  The TRS-80 Model 4 itself?  Besides doing
> directories, are there any good bits of software anyone can recommend
> for exercising floppy drives on a sub-system-by-subsystem basis?
> (move the heads, do a read, do a write...)

There are/were drive exercisers but no idea where you'd find one now.
If you were nearer to me, you could use mine

More seriously, the signals involved are fairly slow speed. Before
I had a drive exerciser, I linked the important drive inputs (select,
motor on, step, direction, etc) to a PC parallel port and wrote a
short program (I think in Turbo Pascal, but it was a long time
ago) to turn the motor on, step the heads around, etc. I think
I monitored some of the drive outputs using the printer port input
lines too, but a logic probe is all you really need to check index,
track 0, etc.

You need a 'scope to debug the read amplifier of course (that
applies even if you have a drive exerciser).

Do check the spindle speed. Often there is a strobe disk on the
spindle pulley in these drives (if it's missing, I am sure you can
get an image of it somewhere, print it, cut it out and stick it on the
pulley). But also check ('scope) that you are getting 5 index pulses
per second, just in case the darn thing is running at half speed or
something.

-tony

Re: Help identifying this old terminal

[Ethan Dicks via cctalk]

On Wed, Apr 26, 2017 at 3:24 PM, Syd Bolton via cctalk
 wrote:
> Anybody recognize what kind of terminal this is?

If you think you attached a photo, you did not.  This list filters out
attachments.  Send a link to a photo.

-ethan

Tandon TM-100-1 electronics repair

[Ethan Dicks via cctalk]

Hi, All,

I'm cleaning/refurbing a TRS-80 Model 4 I picked up at VCFe that was
in dirty-but-mostly-working shape.  I've completely dismantled,
cleaned and reassembled the keyboard, I fixed the bad cable to the
floppy controller, I cleaned and lubed the TM-100-1 floppy drive, and
had it all nice and working, then I bumped the power strip it was
plugged into and the momentary surge took out the electronics on the
floppy drive.  I swapped it out with another TM-100-1 unit (borrowed
from a Model 1) and it's booting again, but when using this toasted
drive as :1, I get either an ERROR 3 or ERROR 4 from TRSDOS 1.3 (my
primary testing disk for the moment).  The drive still seeks and spins
but it won't read disks that it used to read before the power hit.

I also have an original NEWDOS/80 disk and a copied MULTIDOS disk.  I
have not yet fixed up a PC with a 40-track 5.25" drive for making
fresh disks, but it's on the list of solution paths.

I have the TM-100 service manual PDF (which includes schematics), so
it shouldn't be difficult to work through the functional subsystems of
the drive electronics.  My question is are there any specific issues
with the parts on the TM-100 PCB to look for?  There are a handful of
reasonably common ICs, and dozens of discrete components.  Of course I
can trace through each section looking for where the results are
unexpected, but for such a common thing as a TM-100, perhaps there are
known pain points and perhaps someone here has repaired a few and
could highlight what parts might be "fragile".

Additionally, for a testing framework to poke signals through the
drive for debugging during the repair, what's a good platform?  A PC
running MS-DOS?  The TRS-80 Model 4 itself?  Besides doing
directories, are there any good bits of software anyone can recommend
for exercising floppy drives on a sub-system-by-subsystem basis?
(move the heads, do a read, do a write...)

I expect like the last repair (shorted tantalum filter cap), this
repair is going to be a small number of components.  Parts of the
drive are known to work - the motor turns on and off when it should,
and it does seek back to track zero when manually moved off of track
zero prior to doing a DIR :1 or when booting it as :0.  At first
glance, something appears to be toasted in the read electronics.

It's not impossible to find another TM-100-1 or replace it with a
TM-100-2 (more common, owing to its appearance in the IBM 5150 PC),
but I'd like to just repair this one and get back to TRS-80 hacking.

Thanks for any tips or pointers.

-ethan

Re: test, please ignore

[Anders Nelson via cctalk]

LOL

A+ thread would read again

--
Anders Nelson

+1 (517) 775-6129

www.erogear.com

On Thu, Apr 27, 2017 at 1:02 PM, Alfred M. Szmidt via cctalk <
cctalk@classiccmp.org> wrote:

> This isn't a response, do not ignore.
>

Re: test, please ignore

[Alfred M. Szmidt via cctalk]

This isn't a response, do not ignore.

Re: ISO Matrox Multibus SX-900 graphics card manual

[Glen Slick via cctalk]

On Thu, Apr 27, 2017 at 8:49 AM, Glen Slick  wrote:
>
> If anyone is interested in images of the Q-Bus version QG-640 I posted
> a scan of one here, along with binary images of the firmware:
>
> https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B8Vwo-hnhVM5dUhOYnZqY3JUM3M
>

Sorry for sidetracking this thread further.  I meant to post this link
to the folder, not an individual file.

https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B8Vwo-hnhVM5X3puYVZ2U0E5NFU

Re: ISO Matrox Multibus SX-900 graphics card manual

[Glen Slick via cctalk]

On Thu, Apr 27, 2017 at 12:37 AM, r.stricklin via cctalk
 wrote:
>
> On Apr 26, 2017, at 6:01 PM, Glen Slick via cctech wrote:
>
>> While on the topic of Matrox graphics boards from around the same time
>> frame, does anyone know of any Matrox boards that use an NS32016 CPU
>> other than the QG-640?
>
> The Matrox PG-640. Same graphics accelerator, but for PC compatibles. I just 
> happened to have one sitting out on the counter. I checked it and it 
> definitely has an NS32016 on it.
>

Thank you. Mystery solved. The board in question does appear to be a
match for the bottom board of the Matrox PG-640 board set shown in the
photos of this eBay listing:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/311599569320

If anyone is interested in images of the Q-Bus version QG-640 I posted
a scan of one here, along with binary images of the firmware:

https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B8Vwo-hnhVM5dUhOYnZqY3JUM3M


Back on topic, hope someone can provide Al with a copy of the Matrox
Multibus SX-900 graphics card manual.

Re: ISO Matrox Multibus SX-900 graphics card manual

[r.stricklin via cctalk]

On Apr 26, 2017, at 6:01 PM, Glen Slick via cctech wrote:

> While on the topic of Matrox graphics boards from around the same time
> frame, does anyone know of any Matrox boards that use an NS32016 CPU
> other than the QG-640?

The Matrox PG-640. Same graphics accelerator, but for PC compatibles. I just 
happened to have one sitting out on the counter. I checked it and it definitely 
has an NS32016 on it.

The PG-640 is a dual-width 8-bit ISA card (instead of QBus for the QG-640). 
It's supposed to be compatible with the IBM PGC, but presumably only if your 
software behaves and doesn't try to program the 8086 on the PGC directly. My 
experience with the supposedly-PGC-compatible Vermont Microsystems Image 
Manager 1024 is that it is compatible (AutoCAD), except when it isn't (Generic 
CADD). I haven't actually tried to use the PG-640 yet so I can't say more about 
this. 

The PG-640 is supposed to be faster than the PGC, too. Perhaps it is, except 
when it isn't.


ok
bear.

-- 
until further notice