Re: HP 2108A key

[Sam O'nella via cctalk]

Should be easy but my mobile google fu is failing. Didn't Jay and a few others 
know if a vintage computer key database/site somewhere? Would that possibly 
have or benefit from getting afterwards?
null

Re: COTROL SYS> Navy using X Boxes to control sub periscopes Check this out!

[Ed via cctalk]

probably  not  much..  but  It  was   odd!
#ed
 
 
In a message dated 9/21/2017 5:10:03 P.M. US Mountain Standard Time,  
cctalk@classiccmp.org writes:

That's  very nice, Ed. What does this have to do with classic  computing,
exactly?

On Wed, Sep 20, 2017 at 13:46 Ed via cctalk   wrote:

> Navy using X Boxes to control  sub  periscopesCheck this  out!
>
>  
http://www.foxnews.com/tech/2017/09/20/us-navy-will-use-xbox-controllers-to-
>  operate-submarine-periscopes.html
>  

>
--  
Ian Finder
(206) 395-MIPS
ian.fin...@gmail.com

Re: COTROL SYS> Navy using X Boxes to control sub periscopes Check this out!

[Ian Finder via cctalk]

That's very nice, Ed. What does this have to do with classic computing,
exactly?

On Wed, Sep 20, 2017 at 13:46 Ed via cctalk  wrote:

> Navy using X Boxes to control sub  periscopesCheck this  out!
>
> http://www.foxnews.com/tech/2017/09/20/us-navy-will-use-xbox-controllers-to-
> operate-submarine-periscopes.html
> 
>
-- 
   Ian Finder
   (206) 395-MIPS
   ian.fin...@gmail.com

Re: HP 2108A key

[Fred Cisin via cctalk]

On Thu, 21 Sep 2017, Liam Proven wrote:

I am finding it increasingly difficult to curb my curmudgeonliness as
I approach 50.


50 was relatively easy.


I think I must glumly conclude that there is basically nowhere that it
is safe to air it, and I must be constantly vigilant to rein it in.


We can sit on the front porch, waving our canes, and yelling at the kids 
to get off of the lawn.



And continue to rant about the decline in education, software quality, and 
users, such as email clients that don't even show the user what they 
failed to trim in replies.


--
Grumpy Ol' Fred ci...@xenosoft.com

Re: HP 2108A key

[Ed via cctalk]

Most of the  time  processors  came in whole  and   got  sold  out  as  
parts..
The  2  things that always seemed left overwere  keys and carcass!
Ed#
 
 
 
 
In a message dated 9/21/2017 10:25:38 A.M. US Mountain Standard Time,  
cctalk@classiccmp.org writes:

>  > > I used to come home after a hard day with computers and if I had  
> > > weird keys 30 plus years ago they went into a box or  plastic bag..
> > So, YOU are the guy who always walked off with the  keys at the end of 
> > the day, and never brought them  back.

On Thu, 21 Sep 2017, couryho...@aol.com wrote:
> Excuse me?  I owned the company!
> My Company... my  keys..
> and in  those days   there were lots of them!
> How   funny!
> Ed#

Ah!
So you are the BOSS who would wander off with  the keys, and not bring them 
back!
("Never give the boss the only  key!")


I was the boss in my auto shop.  One of my employees  taught me the basics 
of locksmithing.  I never developed much skill,  but at least I could 
understand the theory.


--
Grumpy Ol'  Fred  ci...@xenosoft.com

Re: HP 2108A key

[Fred Cisin via cctalk]

> > I used to come home after a hard day with computers and if I had 
> > weird keys 30 plus years ago they went into a box or plastic bag..
> So, YOU are the guy who always walked off with the keys at the end of 
> the day, and never brought them back.


On Thu, 21 Sep 2017, couryho...@aol.com wrote:

Excuse me? I owned the company!
My Company... my  keys..
and in those days   there were lots of them!
How  funny!
Ed#


Ah!
So you are the BOSS who would wander off with the keys, and not bring them 
back!

("Never give the boss the only key!")


I was the boss in my auto shop.  One of my employees taught me the basics 
of locksmithing.  I never developed much skill, but at least I could 
understand the theory.



--
Grumpy Ol' Fred ci...@xenosoft.com

Re: HP 2108A key

[Ed via cctalk]

Excuse me? I owned the company!
 
My Company... my  keys..
and in those days   there were lots of them!
 
How  funny!
 
Ed#
 
 
 
In a message dated 9/21/2017 9:15:14 A.M. US Mountain Standard Time,  
cctalk@classiccmp.org writes:

On 21  September 2017 at 18:02, Fred Cisin via  cctalk
 wrote:
>
> On Thu, 21 Sep  2017, Ed Sharpe via cctalk wrote:
>>
>> I dunno what all  thathe means
>
>
> Q: Do you WANT to know what all thathe  means?
>
>> I am offering to
>> .look thru shoe box of  keys I Ave one if the thin mx processors do not
>> temember what  number but I know Keyes not in it... I used to come home 
after
>> a  hard day with computers and if I had weird keys 30 plus years ago  
they
>> went into a box or plastic bag..
>
>
> So,  YOU are the guy who always walked off with the keys at the end of the
>  day, and never brought them back.


Well, you know: certain things  are correlated.

"I am too important to bother to learn how to quote  properly."

"I am too important to bother to return keys."

Both  mean that the person doesn't respect other people, and expects
them to just  work around their "adorable little eccentricities".

It means, in short,  "fsck you".

I don't know about anyone else, but I know how _I_ respond  to folk like 
that.

-- 
Liam Proven • Profile:  https://about.me/liamproven
Email: lpro...@cix.co.uk • Google  Mail/Talk/Plus: lpro...@gmail.com
Twitter/Facebook/Flickr: lproven •  Skype/LinkedIn/AIM/Yahoo: liamproven
UK: +44 7939-087884 •  ČR/WhatsApp/Telegram/Signal: +420 702 829  053

Re: HP 2108A key

[Liam Proven via cctalk]

On 21 September 2017 at 18:35, Fred Cisin via cctalk
 wrote:
> We all do it.
> I have my share of random keys from random unknown sources.

Sure, me too.

> There are plenty of things that I have no clue about.
> Some of which I would like to learn, and might or might not ever make the
> effort to do so;  and some that I don't want to know.

Absolutely. Also me.

> In the 1970s, between "the collapse of aerospace", and the availability of
> "tabletop computers" (I guessed wrong on what they would be called), I did
> auto repair, and learned the basics of that particular form of locksmithing
> and code cutting.  Otherwise, I would still be completely ignorant on the
> subject.
>
> I hope that we can chide each other, as friends.

No offence taken here. I was surprised, but it's a fair cop.

I am finding it increasingly difficult to curb my curmudgeonliness as
I approach 50.

I think I must glumly conclude that there is basically nowhere that it
is safe to air it, and I must be constantly vigilant to rein it in.

-- 
Liam Proven • Profile: https://about.me/liamproven
Email: lpro...@cix.co.uk • Google Mail/Talk/Plus: lpro...@gmail.com
Twitter/Facebook/Flickr: lproven • Skype/LinkedIn/AIM/Yahoo: liamproven
UK: +44 7939-087884 • ČR/WhatsApp/Telegram/Signal: +420 702 829 053

Re: HP 2108A key

[Fred Cisin via cctalk]

We all do it.
I have my share of random keys from random unknown sources.

There are plenty of things that I have no clue about.
Some of which I would like to learn, and might or might not ever make the 
effort to do so;  and some that I don't want to know.


In the 1970s, between "the collapse of aerospace", and the availability of 
"tabletop computers" (I guessed wrong on what they would be called), I did 
auto repair, and learned the basics of that particular form of 
locksmithing and code cutting.  Otherwise, I would still be completely 
ignorant on the subject.



I hope that we can chide each other, as friends.


--
Grumpy Ol' Fred ci...@xenosoft.com

Re: HP 2108A key

[Liam Proven via cctalk]

On 21 September 2017 at 18:02, Fred Cisin via cctalk
 wrote:
>
> On Thu, 21 Sep 2017, Ed Sharpe via cctalk wrote:
>>
>> I dunno what all thathe means
>
>
> Q: Do you WANT to know what all thathe means?
>
>> I am offering to
>> .look thru shoe box of keys I Ave one if the thin mx processors do not
>> temember what number but I know Keyes not in it... I used to come home after
>> a hard day with computers and if I had weird keys 30 plus years ago they
>> went into a box or plastic bag..
>
>
> So, YOU are the guy who always walked off with the keys at the end of the
> day, and never brought them back.


Well, you know: certain things are correlated.

"I am too important to bother to learn how to quote properly."

"I am too important to bother to return keys."

Both mean that the person doesn't respect other people, and expects
them to just work around their "adorable little eccentricities".

It means, in short, "fsck you".

I don't know about anyone else, but I know how _I_ respond to folk like that.

-- 
Liam Proven • Profile: https://about.me/liamproven
Email: lpro...@cix.co.uk • Google Mail/Talk/Plus: lpro...@gmail.com
Twitter/Facebook/Flickr: lproven • Skype/LinkedIn/AIM/Yahoo: liamproven
UK: +44 7939-087884 • ČR/WhatsApp/Telegram/Signal: +420 702 829 053

Re: HP 2108A key

[Fred Cisin via cctalk]

> The CCL 4T1427 key, which is NOT what Mike needs, would be cut on an
> Ilco S1003A blank, cuts 1427 bow-to-tip.
>
> The CAT99 key I see referenced in the list archives (might open a cab
> back door) would be on an Ilco S1000V, cuts 5 bow-to-tip.



On Thu, 21 Sep 2017, Ed Sharpe via cctalk wrote:

I dunno what all thathe means


Q: Do you WANT to know what all thathe means?


I am offering to
.look thru shoe box of keys I Ave one if the thin mx processors do not 
temember what number but I know Keyes not in it... I used to come home 
after a hard day with computers and if I had weird keys 30 plus years 
ago they went into a box or plastic bag..


So, YOU are the guy who always walked off with the keys at the end of the 
day, and never brought them back.


Well, he provided complete description of what to look for. 
He described in industry terms exactly what two keys are, to the 
extent that a competent locksmith could make them without having seen the 
originals.


The first part is which keyblank - what will fit into the keyhole.  While 
a machinist could mill keys from a solid piece of brass, the description 
required is most easily handled by simply specifiying which commercial 
keyblank to use.  Ilco is the largest supplier, to it is customary to 
specify the Ilco number.  (like chip numbers) If you use a different 
supplier, then you need an appropriate cross-reference.


Next are the actual cuts made to the blank.
For a given application, there are standards for the "depth and spacing", 
how far apart the cuts are, where the first cut is, and how deep the cuts 
are.  That could be specified as measurements, but a competent locksmith 
has a "depth and spacings" database in which to look up the placement and 
depths for a given application.


Cuts are typically listed from the bow to the tip.  (The bow is what you 
hold, the tip goes into the keyhole).  An exception is Best, which is TIP 
indexed.   Non-locksmiths identify keys by the shape of the bow, which is, 
of course, irrelevant.


Cuts are specified numerically, starting with zero or one being the 
shallowist cut.  (Q: Can you explain why some computers number sectors 
from zero, and some number from one?) For a given application, there will 
be anywhere from 2 to 10 different depths of cuts.  So, one of his 
examples has four moderate cuts and then one deeper one.
His other example has a very shallow cut, a moderate one, a shallow one, 
and then a deep one.  If you LOOK at the cuts of a key, rather than 
habitually blank out with, "it's just incomprehensible random 
mountaintops", you can SEE whether a key had cuts that would fit that 
description.  BTW, the mountain tops are irrelevant, what matters is the 
depths of the valleys between them.


Notice that each valley has a flat area on the bottom (like Yosemite 
valley).  Thus, if you move the key in or out 1/4 mm, it doesn't change 
the depths.



On Thu, 21 Sep 2017, Ed via cctalk wrote:

EEEK!  bad cell phone  typing!
OK  anyway I was under the  assumption that  the   hp  keys  would have 
certain number on them  depending on what  they  fit?

If I am wrong then unless I have a  photo this   group of old  keys
will be of  no use.
Just  a thought. Ed#


Sure, every key has a number.  Sometimes it is stamped on the key, 
sometimes it isn't.  Is every floppy disk labelled with what machine it 
goes with? Or its contents?


When it is labelled, the label is almost never the model of computer.  Do 
you know what an XX2247 key fits?

(Q: Is an 8272 chip marked with what it is for?)

The label may or may not be the depths of the cuts.  New Schlage keys (not 
duplicates) are stamped with their cuts - look at a few!


But, just as often, the cut is a seemingly random number, which doesn't 
tell you anything until you look it up in a "Code Book", which is a simple 
locksmith database where the key number indexes a list of the cuts for the 
key.  (XX2247 is NOT the depths of the cuts.  But if you look it up in the 
right Code Book, you can find out the cuts.


Your car keys (particularly old ones) might have a number stamped on them, 
or there might have been a paper tag on them when you bought your new car. 
If you save that number, then a locksmith can make a new key when you lose 
yours.   (Car owners normally never save that info!)


"Code Cutting" is the process of making a key from the key number.  Some 
municipalities have restrictions on doing it, ranging from no restrictions 
to outright prohibition, but usually mostly of the form of 
proving/convincing the locksmith that you OWN the lock in question, 
and have the right to have a key to it.  (carry the machine into the 
locksmith shop, or a letter of authorization on business letterhead, etc.)


There is no LOCKSMITH at Home Depot.  You need to find a REAL
locksmith, who has a suitable selection of blanks (hardware stores no 
longer do), and who has suitable equipment for cutting a key by code. 
That is either a key machine 

Re: HP 2108A key

[Fred Cisin via cctalk]

On Thu, 21 Sep 2017, Mike Loewen via cctalk wrote:
  Mike Thompson at the RICM is going to look for a number on the key 
for their 2108A, this weekend.


Ask if he can snap a few good close-up pictures of it.  While measurement 
from a picture isn't reliable, it doesn't have to be, if the picture is 
clear enough to decide whether a given cut is a 2 cut or a 3 cut.

Re: HP 2108A key

[Mike Loewen via cctalk]

   Mike Thompson at the RICM is going to look for a number on the key for 
their 2108A, this weekend.



Mike Loewen mloe...@cpumagic.scol.pa.us
Old Technology  http://q7.neurotica.com/Oldtech/

On Thu, 21 Sep 2017, Dennis Boone via cctalk wrote:


If we can id the Chicago double-sided key Mike _does_ need, I can
probably make it.

The CCL 4T1427 key, which is NOT what Mike needs, would be cut on an
Ilco S1003A blank, cuts 1427 bow-to-tip.

The CAT99 key I see referenced in the list archives (might open a cab
back door) would be on an Ilco S1000V, cuts 5 bow-to-tip.

De

Re: ICL 1501 terminal available in Sweden.

[Klemens Krause via cctalk]

On Sun, 17 Sep 2017, Ed Sharpe via cctalk wrote:


looks like a good catch for someone... we have never seen these before   Ed#

Sent from AOL Mobile Mail

On Sunday, September 17, 2017 Torfinn Ingolfsen via cctalk 
 wrote:
On Sun, Sep 17, 2017 at 10:01 PM, Mattis Lind via cctalk
 wrote:

In a closed Facebook group in Sweden there is someone that want to sell a
number of ICL1501 terminals.



There doesn't seem to be any information about ICL terminals at the
Terminals wiki http://terminals-wiki.org/

But some information is found
http://computermuseum.informatik.uni-stuttgart.de/dev_en/icl1501/icl1501.html

looks like these are a bit more than terminals



Indeed, the 1501s are real computers, built by a firm called "Cogar". At 
the end of our page about the ICL1501 is a link to the technical 
information: schematics and programmers manual.


Klemens

--

klemens krause
http://computermuseum.informatik.uni-stuttgart.de

Re: FTGH Decstation 5000

[Lionel Johnson via cctalk]

On 3/09/2017 4:49 PM, Kevin Parker via cctech wrote:

FTGH Decstation 5000

  


*   Decstation 5000/125 - also houses a CD drive
*   2 Expansion storage boxes - one has a tape drive and the other one has 
a floppy drive.
*   2 very large and heavy RGB Digital monitors - one has both Digital and 
Sony branding on the back of it. I haven't dug the
other one out as it's in a corner and is dam heavy but it looks the same as the 
other one.
*   A box of spares including a keyboard, two mice, a CD drive, some 
cables, a couple of CPU's, three genuine HDDs and a big bag
of RAM

  


I've never powered it up - it was a rescue - I believe it was a server in a 
TAFE college in Adelaide, South Australia.

  


I am located in south wester nVictoria (Australia)

  

  

  

  


Kevin Parker

P: 0418 815 527

  

  

  


I'm interested, locn Croydon, 3136

Re: PDP-11/73 and 11/94 update

[Rod Smallwood via cctalk]

On 20/09/2017 17:30, Ulrich Tagge via cctalk wrote:

Hi Rod,

I have not the chance to go into the basement before Weekend, but have 
document the installation here:

http://www.pdp-11.de/index.php/pdp-11/rt11-5-4g-installation/

My 11/84 have the KDJ11-B (m8190).



Vielen Dank am interessantesten. Ich muss auch genau die Einstellung 
kennen, die du auf deinem Konfigurationsbildschirm hast - Rod


--
Wanted one pdp-8/i rocker switch leaver to copy.