> From: Jim Stephens
> The fellow responded and as I had suspected had never seen anything
> this old before and had thought that the parts were separable.
> ...
> Also he is going to hopefully share photos of the entire pile and I'll
> try to help him market the parts in
Another eBait wonder:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/182597510806
The listing says "Local pick-up only", and it's in Denver, Colorado. Someone
should really save this (although the chances of finding all the boards to go
with it is pretty slim).
Noel
> From: Anders Nelson
> Heavens, why are the bit positions in descending order right to left in
> that PCM-12?
Numbering bits in descending order from right to left (AKA increasing order
from left to right) used to be the standard - IBM S/360, PDP-10, etc, etc
all did it that way.
> From: Christian Corti
> I have a similar setup with our 11/34. .. It's not the fastest system,
> and the kernel uses overlays like crazy ;-) ... I still have to add the
> cache and FPP boards and see how that improves the performance.
The cache should help some, but the FPP,
> From: Chuck Guzis
> Well, okay--but then let's be period-correct. The PDP-11 dates from
> 1970, when, AFAIK, BBSes, if they existed, were far from what people
> think they were.
You're thinking of the -11/20, released in 1970. But that was only the first
PDP-11 model; the
> From: Paul Koning
> For some definition of "standard". ... other machines of that time or
earlier
> numbered bits according to the power of 2 they represent, i.e., the
"current
> standard".
Well, the vast majority of computers 'back then' numbered bits (and byes)
from left to
> From: Marc Howard
> Although I can find the RK11D users manual on the web there doesn't
> appear to be print set (schematics) out there. Does this exist
> somewhere under a non-obvious name?
??? I just did a quick Google for 'RK11-D" (note quotes), and it turned up:
So I have some G-series Flip Chips that I don't have a use for, and I hope
someone out there does. If so, I'd like to trade them for something I _do_
have a use for - e.g. M-series FCs.
Alas, according to the "Spare Module Handbook", these seem to be pretty
exotic, but maybe I'll luck out. They
> From: Marc Howard
> I need (1) of the 8/32 x 1 3/8 captive screws that are at either end of
> a unibus backplane to mount it to the chassis.
You don't _have_ to use the special captive screws - quite a few of the
backplanes I've got were mounted with ordinary screws.
Noel
> From: Adrian Graham
> Completely by chance one of the programme managers for STC at the time
> found all my postings ... in a last ditch attempt to give his stash of
> goodies away before he put them all in the local recycling.
> This means that not only do I now have two
> From: Steven Malikoff
> I acquired an RC11 flip chip set
Do you mean literally this (just the cards), or did you mean a complete RC11
(including the backplane)? The Flip Chips do turn up (the ones I put up a
post about a few days back are RC11 chips), but the backplanes are rara aves
> From: Toby Thain
> And a lot is as-new or perfectly okay.
Ditto that.
Both my ADF A4 page scanner and my A3 scanner (a professional grade Epson)
came off eBay (the latter for a minimal amount of money - that pro scanner is
a multi-$K unit, for which I think I paid the princely sum of
> From: Jim Stephens
> I'm interested in whether this is a wound down or ongoing Dec material
> operation, or the operation of an e waste recycler.
> Vendor name on ebay is EFI. May have other aliases.
Oh, Efi! All hardened DEC collectors know about Efi (well, many of us do :-).
> does anyone have any spare "pivot bushings" for the DEC H9xx series
> cabinets (H950, H960, etc)? (These are the short pieces with a conical
> top which fit over the hinge pins, at the bottom.)
> ...
> I could also use some more of the pins (particularly the kind with the
On Fri, Sep 22, 2017 at 7:14 AM, Torfinn Ingolfsen wrote:
> Unfortunately, I don't have space for such a large system.
I hope someone can take this system, to prevent its being scapped!
Noel
Hi, does anyone have any spare "pivot bushings" for the DEC H9xx series
cabinets (H950, H960, etc)? (These are the short pieces with a conical top
which fit over the hinge pins, at the bottom.) I need at least one to hang a
back door which I have.
If nobody has any, they'd be easy to machine, so
> From: Charles Dickman
> Is pin AA == pin 1 or pin 40 ?
> ...
> Did DEC have an accepted mapping between the alphabet and numbers?
http://gunkies.org/wiki/DEC_asynchronous_serial_line_pinout
Noel
> From: systems_glitch
> get a DLV11 and set it up as SLU0 for TU58
I think you meant SLU1, no? That's the standard for the TU58 (SLU0 is the
console).
Noel
> From: Vincent Slyngstad
> Aaron's website seems to be working for me
Anyone who still has access to it should down-load the entire thing promptly.
Noel
> From: Rod Smallwood
> I do not know the correct addresses or vectors I need so I can't set
> them.
> ...
> State like this for each and every jumper required
Sorry, too busy to type all that out. Jumper it for 776500/300.
Noel
> From: Jack Harper
> I HATE and LOATHE bloatware - e.g., so much MicroSoft stuff.
Some of us consider contemporary Linux/etc bloatware.
Noel
> From: Brent Hilpert
> I have wondered just how much influence the latent theory that was
> around influenced the practical implementors of calculating machinery
> ...
> My impression is the implementors at the time arrived at stored-program
> machines far more out of
> From: Aaron Jackson
> a PDP-11/73, M8192 CPU, two M8067 RAM, M7195 ... While playing in ODT,
> the console completely stopped responding.
> ...
> The CPU shows 1000, which I believe is fine, and means it's in ODT. The
> SLU card has . I've had a Google and I believe
> From: Rob Jarratt
> I have just tried accessing Manx at manx-docs.org, but it seems to have
> disappeared. Anyone know what has happened to it?
It moved. Now at:
https://vt100.net/manx/
Noel
> From: Aaron Jackson
> This is an 11/23+ chassis and the power supply seems very large, but
> reasonably easy to trace. I thought I'd ask first if anyone has any
> tips on how to debug this
Err, exactly which power supply is this - an H786, or an H7861? If so, there
are prints
> DEC also has excellent 'Technical Manuals' for both, which clearly
> explain how the circuitry works (although alas, the BA11-N Tech Manual
> is not [yet] online
Argh, my memory is failing me. The BA11-S technical info is in the "PDP-11/23B
Mounting Box Technical Manual",
> one option ... is to buy spare boards so you can board-swap to localize
> the problem to one board.
> ...
> start with another serial card
Also, if you get a working serial card to use for a console, and you get a
working system as a result, you can then use that ensenble to try
> From: Anders Nelson
> This is crazy, how is this auction not at $5k already at least?
"Patience, grasshopper"! :-)
With these big-budget, rare, items, the real action is always in the last few
seconds. I remember a PDP-11/40 that went from, like $2K (don't recall the
exact number,
> From: Tim Shoppa
> IEEE Annals of the History of Computing just published (in past few
> months) Paul McJones article "In Search of the Original Fortran Compiler".
Congratulations to Paul and everyone who helped in this magnificant effort.
To bad they couldn't find a copy of the
> On Aug 19, 2017, at 11:08 AM, Jon Elson wrote:
> Currently $676, but I suspect will go higher.
_Much_ higher. The TU56 alone is worth several US$K. I'd look for
the whole thing to go for _at least_ US$3K.
Noel
Hi, all, just got one of these in a group of stuff, and I have no LA30, and
thus no need for it. Anyone out there have an LA30? :-)
Noel
> From: Jerry Weiss
> The processor will probably halt due to non-existent memory address.
No, it'll take a NXM trap (through 4); what happens then depends on what the
trap handler is set to - if anything.
> However, a P entered in ODT will attempt to continue the bootstrap.
See
> From: Tomasz Rolak
>> Anyone who still has access to it should down-load the entire thing
promptly.
> I am
> wget -r -np -nc -U lynx -w 2 -l 0 http://pdp-8.org/
> right now.
Did you get it all? Anyone else download it?
Noel
So I have a Hallicrafters S-85 receiver which was my wife's father's, and just
arrived (he passed away, and they are cleaning out his basement):
http://ana-3.lcs.mit.edu/~jnc/jpg/tech/HallicraftersF.jpg
http://ana-3.lcs.mit.edu/~jnc/jpg/tech/HallicraftersB.jpg
I'm not into radios at all, so
> From: sandy hamlet
> There are a couple of ham radio sites that you could post on.
> ...
> You probably don't want to ship the SX101 as it it is quite heavy.
I don't think he wants to get rid of his, he was enquiring about getting one
more (from me). :-)
The unit has been
So Dave Bridgham and I are continuing to make (slow) progress with the QSIC
and indicator panel project; the latest step was to find some LEDs which look
much more like the original lights:
http://pdp10.froghouse.org/qsic/new-led.jpg
So now I'm trying to make up a prototype 'light shield' (the
> From: Liam Proven
> TCP/IP basically postdates the MS-DOS era, in PC terms, and it's Bloaty
> McBloatface.
This must be a uSloth TCP/IP you are speaking of. There's the one from FTP
software which was based on the one done at MIT which was freeware. That one
was definitely DOS-era
> From: Eric Christopherson
> I have an inside scoop that a certain library is about to get rid of
> their 2003 printing (which is apparently 1st edition)
ABE seems to have copies for around US$10:
On 11/28/17 13:27, emanuel stiebler via cctalk wrote:
> Dave has a KV10 already in verilog, so why not port it to the uengine?
Well, the uengine would have to be considerably modified before it could be
used for a PDP-10 (e.g. wider data-paths); this version is very specialized
to the SD
> From: Jonathan (Systems Glitch)
> the vtserver `rx` driver has a bug in it anyway where it continues
> reading past the end of the media
I'll be working with the RX driver for the standalone stuff soon on a project
of my own, I'll look into this then.
BTW, 'VTserver' refers to
> My copy of of the V7 standalone stuff (which I got from the VTServer
> directory) didn't include an RX driver. Where'd you manage to find one?
So, thanks to a tip (thanks, Jerry! :-), the source has been found:
https://github.com/chapmajs/vtserver/tree/master/pdpvtstand
> From: Aaron Jackson
> It was the disks after all.
Well, I'm glad you got it working. Where'd you get a good floppy?
Noel
> From: Guy Sotomayor Jr
> I *really* want them and I'm within an hour (usually) of where they
> are. The problem is that right now I'm on a business trip until the end
> of the month and he needs this gone prior to 12/31.
Why don't you reach out to the person and tell them you
> From: William Degnan
> 1) the console rom does not go in any of the 4 bootstrap slots, these
> should be empty for now. There is a special console rom slot.
Just to clarify, by "slot", you don't mean 'backplane slot', you mean 'socket
(on the card)', right?
Also, note that the
> From: John Welch
> CLR
> 765000
> LAD
> EXAM
> 'Bus Err' light comes on.
Oooh, that's very interesting, and illuminative. The ROM isn't working (so
there's no way for the software console to work - its code is in that ROM).
So look at Section 1.5 of the Technical
> From: Steven Malikoff
> they mention it will be scrapped if no takers.
Don't be misled by the .au URL; the units are in Sacramento, CA. Anyone in
the Bay area up for saving these?
Noel
> From: John Welch
> Anyway, 'a' comes over as 000141 and 'A' comes over as 000101.
Good, the console is working.
> CLR
> LAD
> DEP
OK, that loads a '0' (halt) in 0.
> CNTRL+INIT
> CNTRL+START -> reads 02
OK, so it reads the HALT at 0 and stops.
>
So, Dave and I are getting to the point where we're about to start mounting up
our indicator panels, but we're not sure what some of the mechanical details
(below) are.
Could someone who has one please take a look and let us know (or, even better,
send us photos)?
It appears that the bezel and
> From: Josh Dersch
> See the pictures at the below link: ...
> Hope this is the right assembly for you
Yes, those are _exactly_ what we're looking for. Thanks very much for
taking the time to take those!
Noel
> From: John Welch
> Any thoughts?
Concur 100% with Henk's comments.
There is a manual online for the M9312:
http://bitsavers.org/pdf/dec/unibus/M9312_TechRef.pdf
which will tell you what the other start options are (Appendix C), but see
page 3-1, too. Note especially the bit about
> From: Aaron Jackson
> The RL02 technical manual says to figure out why a drive error
> occurred, I can execute a get status command (?) and then perform an
> MPR read (?). So while I don't know how to do that,
RLV 12 User Guide, section 5.2.
Noel
Please, everyone, I do actually know of BitSavers; you don't need to point me
at it.
When I said:
>> I could look at the engineering manuals, but I was hoping for something
>> in between them and Bashe et al.
I assumed everyone would understand that by "engineering manuals", I was
So, I was trying to find info about the early IBM 709/7090/7094 computers, but
when I went to what is supposedly the authoritative work on these computers
(among others):
Charles J. Bashe, Lyle R. Johnson, John H. Palmer, Emerson W. Pugh,
"IBM's Early Computers", MIT Press, Cambridge, 1986
> From: Allison
>> I would seriously consider shared data/address lines, like on the QBUS.
> QBUS is wrapped around a subset of PDP11 and the unique processors made
> to fit it.
I did say "like ... the QBUS", not "the QBUS"! I was just trying to make the
point that the original
> From: Charles Anthony
> a hybrid PDP-11 (16 bits) / PDP-15 (18 bits) on a shared bus (UNIBUS?)
That's a UNICHANNEL-15: it allowed devices on the -11 to do DMA directly into
the PDP-15's memory through the MX15-B Memory Multiplexer.
Odd factoid: this UNIBUS could run in 18-bit mode
> From: Allison
> simple 16 data, 24 address likely 6 lines for basic control plus others
> your up to 50+ lines
I would seriously consider shared data/address lines, like on the QBUS. It
doesn't add _that_ much complexity to share the lines (I did a slave device
using only 74xxx
> From: Sophie Haskins
> earlier editions of "Computer Systems: A Programmers Perspective" had a
> bunch of discussions of buses etc .. but the edition I have explicitly
> calls out that they felt like it wasn't important to have chapters on
> anymore :(
Well, that might not
> From: Fritz Mueller
> Overall, I have been pretty amazed by the sheer number of machined
> parts, castings, high quality bearings, etc. within this beast. Lots of
> stainless steel throughout. Sure wouldn't find anything built this way
> these days! What a tank.
That's DEC
> From: Evan Koblentz
> That's the dumbest thing I read today.
And that helped... how?
Noel
> From: Ben Franchuk
> Multics never really made it out of the lab.
This 'bogo-meme' (to use a word I coined) is, well, totally flat wrong.
Multics was a reasonably successful product for Honeywell from the end of
1972 (when the H6180 was introduced) to around 1987 (when they stopped
> From: Dave Wade
> ENIAC had been configured in stored program mode earlier in the year
> and had run a program stored in the function switches, e.g. ROM
> ...
> Despite the fact that when running stored programs ENIAC's parallel
> processing features were not available,
> From: Brent Hilpert
> What about that little issue of writeable program storage?
Just to clarify my understanding of your position, is a system with a CPU
chip (say one of the 68K models) with only ROM not a 'stored program machine'?
Noel
PS: You really should look at the
So if someone's building an earlier -8 from bits and pieces, here:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/192350321318
is something they might find useful - an empty chassis.
(I'm not associated with the seller, although I've bought stuff from them
before. They have some other PDP-8 stuff listed, too.)
> From: Peter Cetinski
>> I was left a home with all of its contents tons of electronics and
>> computers, call if you want me to send pics
> FWIW, I received some pics of these items.
So, what else was there (that you don't mind telling us about because you're
not grabbing
So if someone's building an earlier -8 from bits and pieces, here:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/192350321318
is something they might find useful - an empty chassis.
(I'm not associated with the seller, although I've bought stuff from them
before. They have some other PDP-8 stuff listed, too.)
> From: Rob Jarratt
> when I replaced it and powered on there was a big bang
What went 'bang'? (I assume if there was a loud noise, it mus have left
visible damage somewhere.)
Noel
> From: Dave
> I managed to snag the chassis and what I hope is the matching cover.
No, that cover is for a paper-tape reader.
Noel
> From: Aaron Jackson
> Picked up a few 555s and sockets and now it works!
Congratulations!
It's odd that a 555 failed, but sometimes there's no rhyme or reason to what
fails. E.g. I was fixing some broken M7859's (KY11-LB Programmer's Console),
and on one of them a 7493 (4-bit counter)
> From: Aaron Jackson
> Most of the tests now look something like this:
> ...
> SECTOR ADDRESS ERROR
> EXPECTED SECTOR=18.
> TARGET SECTOR=17.
I wonder if there's a problem with the floppy you are using?
Remember, the RX0x drives can't hard reformat the floppies
> From: John Welch
> Can you give me a refresher on how to tell which slots are cut? I
> remember having to turn the chassis over and looking for a particular
> wire
Yeah; you can use the G7273 as a 'crib', since it has the NPG jumper on it.
That jumper goes from CA1 to CB1:
> From: Henk Gooijen
A few comments to you about Henk's points:
> Standing in front of the 11/34 processor box (looking at the console),
> slot number 1 is at the right side.
That's for the 10-1/2" box; the 5-1/4" is different. Which is this?
> Each slot has 6 positions.
> From: John Welch
> Any suggestions as to what to try first?
I would _definitely_ start by pulling _all_ the cards you can, to get down to
the simplest possible configuration. Once that works, start adding things
back in, one at a time.
If that configuration doesn't work, first try
> From: Aaron Jackson
>> My copy of of the V7 standalone stuff (which I got from the VTServer
>> directory) didn't include an RX driver. Where'd you manage to find one?
> I am using the version from here: https://github.com/sethm/vtserver/
After offline discussion with Aaron, we
> From: Ethan Dicks
> I look forward to taking a stab at this.
I suspect there are a number of people who'd be interested in MASSBUS storage
devices (e.g. me - suddenly all those RH11's I've got are no longer boat-
anchors :-). We should try and organize an group build, to share the
FTGH:
http://ana-3.lcs.mit.edu/~jnc/jpg/tmp/HeadSet.jpg
Noel
> From: Henk Gooijen
> the M7859 is sort of a UNIBUS device. The (front panel) console only
> communicates with the M7859.
Not quite; it does _mostly_ 'do its thing' over the UNIBUS, but there are
also two special lines carried across the DD11-P backplane to the CPU, 'Halt
Request'
> Aaron Jackson
> if I try to dump using vtserver using a floppy which passed the
> diagnostics, it fails.
My copy of of the V7 standalone stuff (which I got from the VTServer
directory) didn't include an RX driver. Where'd you manage to find one?
(I need one for my own use, plus I
> From: Kip Koon
> f I were to have to decide on just one model DEC PDP system to run in a
> DEC Emulator, which one would be the most useful, versatile and has the
> most software available for it?
To echo what others have said, when you say 'emulator', do you mean hardware
(the
> From: Jon Elson
> I'm not sure the original DEC PDP-10 (KA-10) used microcode
No, it didn't; in part because it pre-dated fast, cheap ROMs (the development
of which was a considerable task in the /360 project - the wonderful "IBM's
360 and Early 370 Systems" covers this is some
> From: Adrian Stoness
> theres a 3d model for printing those brakets over on this site
> http://so-much-stuff.com/pdp8/cad/3d.php
http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/2017-December/036544.html
Noel
> From: Josh Dersch
> the plastic "ball on post" brackets
PS: Apparently the 'official' DEC name for the 'ball on post' plastic brackets
is "latch molding". Not very descriptive/apt, alas.
Noel
> From: Pete Lancashire
> NO PACKING OR SHIPPING, must be local pickup.
Just a reminded to everyone; most PakMail franchises are prepared to go
somewhere off-site, pick items up where they sit, and then pack them; I've
used this service several times for 'pick up only' items.
> From: Yvan Janssens
> ...
> I'm located at the other side of the planet.
> Would PakMail work for that as well?
Pakmail can _send_ to most countries (they can only do _pickups_ in the US
and Canada, that I know of), but of course sending a large object a long way
> From: Pete Lancashire
> Pak Mail is not cheap
Actually, since they buy 'in bulk' from carriers, they are surprisingly
reasonable; their quote to ship an H960 rack from Arizona to me was less
than I was quoted by some carriers.
Noel
Hey, all, the RK11-D contoller for the PDP-11 uses Motorola 4015 MSI chips on
one of the boards (M7254), but I can't find out anything about them. Google
didn't turn anything up, and the appendix in the RK11-D Maintenance Manual
that has info about 'all' the MSI chips used in the RK11-D doesn't
So I've just realized that the KB11-B (the earlier -11/70 CPU, the KB11-C
being the later) FMPS is not online; I couldn't find them (but then my
Google-fu is notoriously weak, q.v. the Motorola 4015 - thanks all, BTW), but
Manx also says:
http://manx-docs.org/details.php/1,9214
they aren't
> From: Mark Linimon
> Would love to if you can change your mind on shipping?
https://www.pakmail.com/
Like I said, they will come pick things up, as they sit - perfect for Pete's
situation. And from my experience, not _always_ cheap, but _usually_ pretty
good (e.g. a large PDP-11 in a
So I notice that M8120 controller card for the MS11 seems to share its etch
with the earlier M8110 variant (the M8120 says "M8110" in the etch :-); so the
differences must be component/configuration/ECO. Does anyone happen to know
what the differences between the two are? Thanks!
Noel
> From: Bob Smith
> 8110 for MOS memory, and 8120 for bipolar memory is what field guyde
> list says.
Well, the early bipolar MS11-C (1K boards) used the M8110 during early
production (see e.g. DEC-11-HMSAA-D-D, pg. 1-1), and apparently then switched
over to the M8120. I've only seen
> From: Josh Dersch
> the TU56 lacks the G888 flip-chips necessary to work with the TD8E; I
> know these parts are in short supply, but in the unlikely event that
> anyone has (a) a set of 5 G888 boards,
I have this memory that someone in Scandanavia is well along with the
> From: Randy Dawson
> For a while I have collected bits of legacy CAD
> ...
> My question is, did any of the source code for these systems
> .. ever make it out
Well, not quite what you're asking about, I think (it sounds like you're
interested in MechE CAD, not EE, even
>From: Al Kossow
> NASTRAN is available
That's a finite element modeling code, isn't it? (I guess it all depends on
what the OP meant by 'CAD'...)
Noel
Hi, I'm hoping someone here knows the low-level nitty-gritty on how the
characters on the CDC 6600 console CRTs were generated.
Thornton, "Design of a Computer", says "Control of the beam .. is provided by
electrostatic deflection ... electronically converting from the symbol .. to
deflection
> From: Henk Gooijen
> My findings so far :
> www.pdp-11.nl/pdp11-35/repair/repair35page.html
> Comments are very welcome!
I got a:
You don't have permission to access to this document on this server.
Apache Server at pdp-11.nl
error message?
> I vaguely remember
> From: Dominique Carlier
> I just regret this incredible rise in prices for collector machines
> that, not so long ago, were languishing in wet sheds
Hey, look at the bright side: as a result, they are much less likely to be
simply recycled as scrap.
I took great pleasure in
> From: Jon Elson
> Steve Ciarcia ... made a board using the NS405 called the Term-Mite.
I decided I'd do an article about the Term-Mite for the CHWiki; I found
Ciarcia's long article about the Term-Mite (in his book, which Google books
has); it talks throughout the article about the
So I have discovered that the manual and prints for the MM11-F core memory are
not online; it turns out I have a manual/prints set, and at some point will
get them scanned and over to Al.
My question is: is there anyone who has an immediate need for these things?
If so, I will make the scan
> From: Ethan Dicks
> Mostly, what I need is affordable ($250 or less) Unibus storage with
> modern media
There's this:
http://www.retrocmp.com/projects/unibone
Not quite there yet, but getting there.
Noel
> Jon Elson
> How/where should I submit this?
This is now available through here:
http://gunkies.org/wiki/Term-Mite_ST_Smart_Terminal
I put in a little infrastructure around it (articles on the Term-Mite, NS405,
etc), using info I dug up online.
Noel
> From: Toby Thain
> It's suggested there (without any proof though) that the CDC used a
> Fourier process
> ...
> I'd be very interested to know what you find out about the circuitry.
Someone very kindly pointed me at:
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