RE: desoldering (was Re: VAX 9440)
Al Kossow wrote: > Cleaning the Hakko is SO much easier than a > Pace (there is no glass to burn your > fingers on). The newer Pace desoldering tools (SX-90, SX-100) are much better, both in cleaning (disposable traps) and usage (the tips simply don't block at all). Bill S. --- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. https://www.avast.com/antivirus
Re: desoldering (was Re: VAX 9440)
I have a 605. I tend to use solder wick though, it has been a while since I needed a powered sucker. On Wed, Nov 14, 2018 at 8:40 AM systems_glitch via cctalk < cctalk@classiccmp.org> wrote: > Another Hakko 472D owner here. Got mine in pieces as used/nonworking. > They're easy to rebuild. I've used the 808s at workshops/friends' places, > there's no comparison IMO. I use the "pencil" style handpiece, we had the > "gun" style at a previous job, I definitely like the "pencil" style better. > > Thanks, > Jonathan > > On Tue, Nov 13, 2018 at 6:38 PM Ed C. via cctalk > wrote: > > > I have the combo unit including solder. I do not have any other > experience > > with any high-end ware but I can say that this unit does all I need and > > does it well. > > > > On Tue, Nov 13, 2018 at 7:17 PM Chuck Guzis via cctalk < > > cctalk@classiccmp.org> wrote: > > > > > On 11/13/18 7:38 AM, Mark J. Blair via cctalk wrote: > > > > > > > Instead, I use two pencil-type irons, one in each hand, working under > > > > a stereo microscope. The tips are much better, and manipulating each > > > > tip independently provides great control of what's going on. Only > > > > drawback is that if you want to use a fancy, expensive iron, now you > > > > get to buy two of them. If you're tempted by a soldering station with > > > > two or more outputs, make sure that it can drive both simultaneously. > > > > There are dual-output stations that have two outputs but can only run > > > > one at a time, as well as ones which can drive two irons at once. > > > > > > After seeing the video on the ZD-985 some years ago on Dave's EEVBlog: > > > > > > https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ft50m8UU5WQ > > > > > > I've been wondering if it's a worthwhile tool. Does anyone have one of > > > these things? > > > > > > --Chuck > > > > > > > > >
Re: desoldering (was Re: VAX 9440)
Another Hakko 472D owner here. Got mine in pieces as used/nonworking. They're easy to rebuild. I've used the 808s at workshops/friends' places, there's no comparison IMO. I use the "pencil" style handpiece, we had the "gun" style at a previous job, I definitely like the "pencil" style better. Thanks, Jonathan On Tue, Nov 13, 2018 at 6:38 PM Ed C. via cctalk wrote: > I have the combo unit including solder. I do not have any other experience > with any high-end ware but I can say that this unit does all I need and > does it well. > > On Tue, Nov 13, 2018 at 7:17 PM Chuck Guzis via cctalk < > cctalk@classiccmp.org> wrote: > > > On 11/13/18 7:38 AM, Mark J. Blair via cctalk wrote: > > > > > Instead, I use two pencil-type irons, one in each hand, working under > > > a stereo microscope. The tips are much better, and manipulating each > > > tip independently provides great control of what's going on. Only > > > drawback is that if you want to use a fancy, expensive iron, now you > > > get to buy two of them. If you're tempted by a soldering station with > > > two or more outputs, make sure that it can drive both simultaneously. > > > There are dual-output stations that have two outputs but can only run > > > one at a time, as well as ones which can drive two irons at once. > > > > After seeing the video on the ZD-985 some years ago on Dave's EEVBlog: > > > > https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ft50m8UU5WQ > > > > I've been wondering if it's a worthwhile tool. Does anyone have one of > > these things? > > > > --Chuck > > > > >
Re: desoldering (was Re: VAX 9440)
I have the combo unit including solder. I do not have any other experience with any high-end ware but I can say that this unit does all I need and does it well. On Tue, Nov 13, 2018 at 7:17 PM Chuck Guzis via cctalk < cctalk@classiccmp.org> wrote: > On 11/13/18 7:38 AM, Mark J. Blair via cctalk wrote: > > > Instead, I use two pencil-type irons, one in each hand, working under > > a stereo microscope. The tips are much better, and manipulating each > > tip independently provides great control of what's going on. Only > > drawback is that if you want to use a fancy, expensive iron, now you > > get to buy two of them. If you're tempted by a soldering station with > > two or more outputs, make sure that it can drive both simultaneously. > > There are dual-output stations that have two outputs but can only run > > one at a time, as well as ones which can drive two irons at once. > > After seeing the video on the ZD-985 some years ago on Dave's EEVBlog: > > https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ft50m8UU5WQ > > I've been wondering if it's a worthwhile tool. Does anyone have one of > these things? > > --Chuck > >
Re: desoldering (was Re: VAX 9440)
All this yammering about fancy desoldering gizmos harkens back memories of a "desoldering station" consisting of a hot soldering iron ... made of a hefty amount of copper (the kind you put in a pit of fire to heat up!) and a long, skinny screwdriver, or two, used to _very_ gently pry up ICs from each end while you ran the iron along the pins, loosening the IC a bit at a time until it popped loose. Clearing the pin holes of solder involved blowing through them as you heated up the pads ... with your breath, hopefully before the pads debonded from the PC board! There's no skill involved any more with the fancy-schmancy stuff ... That also harkens back to my days in the Navy when I would go visit the local Defense Reutilization and Marketing Office (DRMO), previously just called "The Dump". That's where all sorts of DoD-owned military and commercial grade equipment was sent as soon as the new models came along that the Air Force always got first (it helps when you don't have to drive your runways full of aircraft and fuel all over the world, like we do in the Navy!). Most of the Navy stuff showed up when ships got decommissioned ... a typical ship can stay in service for four or five decades, s ... anyone need any vacuum tubes, or a mechanical fire-control computer??? Do you know why the Air Force always builds the Officers Club first, and the runways last, on a new base? Congress will _always_ approve more money to finish a runway on a typically horribly-underbid DoD contract (that their brothers-in-law always seem to be involved with)! Anyway, as I was perusing the offerings, I wandered around a corner and there was a guy sitting over what can only be described as a medieval blacksmith's furnace. He was recovering the gold and other precious metals from boards and ICs by basically heating everything and collecting the metals as they dribbled out of the cracking, charring non-metals! He appeared to be positioning the materials over time to achieve various melting temperatures, which allowed him to pretty accurately collect each metal in sequence as the materials heated up. I can only wonder whether he wound up with a medical retirement, as I don't recall him wearing any kind of respirator, and it was being done in a large warehouse structure. Come to think of it, I'm surprised _I_ didn't wind up with a medical retirement, given the amount of time I spent in those places finding all sorts of great stuff! Speaking of inheriting Air Force hand-me-downs, a little-known factoid is that Admiral Grace Hopper (co-author of COBOL and an operator of the Harvard Mark IV) used to send her enlisted people around the Pentagon in the evenings to snag things left in the halls by Air Force offices to be carted off by the janitors. That included all of the furniture in her basement-level office and even the American Flag there (complete with heavy stand and oak pole with an eagle atop it). Few able-bodied military men escorted by armed guards ever wandered around in the basement of the Pentagon because of the dank, poorly lit (if at all) corridors, let alone a woman. However, Admiral Hopper wasn't just any woman, and there are rumors that the ne'er-do-wells scattered like cockroaches when they heard her coming (and that was easy to do, as she was always instructing someone about something very useful in conversations). I still have a Nanosecond piece of ~11.2-inch insulated 22-gauge solid wire that she handed out at her presentations - it's even signed, which means it has little marks that correspond to where her signature crossed its horizontal midpoint! She originally used them to explain to MBA-degreed flag officers why there was a noticeable delay between the then-new geosynchronous communications satellites located about 22,300 miles in altitude over the Equator, and satellite ground stations. She would show them a Nanosecond wire (the distance it would take for an electromagnetic wave to travel at the speed of light in one nanosecond) and then move it along an imaginary line-of-sight from a ground station to a satellite and start counting, "One nanosecond ... two nanoseconds ... three nanoseconds ... " until the audience members all exhibited the "Ah-HA!" moment on their faces. Then, she would repeat it along another path between the satellite and another ground station. Ain't computing history great??? All the Best, Jim
Re: desoldering (was Re: VAX 9440)
On 11/13/18 7:38 AM, Mark J. Blair via cctalk wrote: > Instead, I use two pencil-type irons, one in each hand, working under > a stereo microscope. The tips are much better, and manipulating each > tip independently provides great control of what's going on. Only > drawback is that if you want to use a fancy, expensive iron, now you > get to buy two of them. If you're tempted by a soldering station with > two or more outputs, make sure that it can drive both simultaneously. > There are dual-output stations that have two outputs but can only run > one at a time, as well as ones which can drive two irons at once. After seeing the video on the ZD-985 some years ago on Dave's EEVBlog: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ft50m8UU5WQ I've been wondering if it's a worthwhile tool. Does anyone have one of these things? --Chuck
Re: desoldering (was Re: VAX 9440)
On the topic of desoldering tweezers: I don't like them. I've done tons of rework of components down to 0201 size. I consider 0201 to be difficult, but I found that once I could work on 0201 components at all, 0402 suddenly seemed easy to work with! Anyway, the tweezers I've used had poor tip alignment, tips too blunt for small components, and of course the whole handle has to be positioned in a plane such that both tips touch their corresponding terminals at the same time. And that was with high-end Metcal tweezers. Instead, I use two pencil-type irons, one in each hand, working under a stereo microscope. The tips are much better, and manipulating each tip independently provides great control of what's going on. Only drawback is that if you want to use a fancy, expensive iron, now you get to buy two of them. If you're tempted by a soldering station with two or more outputs, make sure that it can drive both simultaneously. There are dual-output stations that have two outputs but can only run one at a time, as well as ones which can drive two irons at once. -- Mark J. Blair, NF6X http://www.nf6x.net/
desoldering (was Re: VAX 9440)
On 11/12/18 7:24 AM, W2HX via cctalk wrote: > Hot air setup is the next thing. > I was doing some board repair this weekend, and used a mix of Hakko 472 vacuum and hot air equipment. I was having trouble clearing the holes completely with the Hakko so I heated the board with a 1" hot air nozzle, pulled the part, then used an Edsyn Atmoscope to blow the holes clean. Cleaning the Hakko is SO much easier than a Pace (there is no glass to burn your fingers on). I'm not impressed with Weller vaccums either, though to be fair it's pretty old tech.
