Re: [CentOS] Recommend Mail Server

Gordon Messmer wrote: > On 11/23/2009 08:37 PM, Les Mikesell wrote: >> Wasn't the last bug found and fixed 5 or 6 years ago? >> > > No. Earlier this year there was a heap overflow found that may allow > arbitrary code execution: > http://web.nvd.nist.gov/view/vuln/detail?vulnId=CVE-2009-1490

Re: [CentOS] Recommend Mail Server

On 11/23/2009 08:37 PM, Les Mikesell wrote: > > Wasn't the last bug found and fixed 5 or 6 years ago? > No. Earlier this year there was a heap overflow found that may allow arbitrary code execution: http://web.nvd.nist.gov/view/vuln/detail?vulnId=CVE-2009-1490 __

Re: [CentOS] Recommend Mail Server

> When Postfix was suggested to me, I started reading the docs on their > Web site, and discovered that the learning curve is nowhere near as > steep as it is with Sendmail.  So far, Postfix has done everything I > have needed, and with a LOT less pain. Yup, very similar experience over here. De

Re: [CentOS] Recommend Mail Server

Thomas Harold wrote: > On 11/25/2009 6:45 PM, Christopher Chan wrote: >> Thomas Harold wrote: >>> >>> We use postfix, dovecot, clamav milter (reject at SMTP time), spf >>> policy >>> check (with rejecting on SPF_FAIL at SMTP time), and AmavisD-New w/ >>> SpamAssassin for scoring what's left. >>> >

Re: [CentOS] Recommend Mail Server

On 11/25/2009 6:45 PM, Christopher Chan wrote: > Thomas Harold wrote: >> >> We use postfix, dovecot, clamav milter (reject at SMTP time), spf policy >> check (with rejecting on SPF_FAIL at SMTP time), and AmavisD-New w/ >> SpamAssassin for scoring what's left. >> > Have you looked at spamass-milter

Re: [CentOS] Recommend Mail Server

Thomas Harold wrote: > On 11/23/2009 1:59 PM, Robert Moskowitz wrote: > >> Susan Day wrote: >> >>> Hi; >>> I don't want sendmail. What's a good secure email server that I can >>> yum? I really only need smtp right now, but who knows what the future >>> will bring? >>> >> See my sligh

Re: [CentOS] Recommend Mail Server

On 11/23/2009 1:59 PM, Robert Moskowitz wrote: > Susan Day wrote: >> Hi; >> I don't want sendmail. What's a good secure email server that I can >> yum? I really only need smtp right now, but who knows what the future >> will bring? > > See my slightly prior post on: Re: [CentOS] > smtp+pop3+imap+t

Re: [CentOS] Recommend Mail Server

On 11/23/2009 2:21 PM, John R. Dennison wrote: > On Mon, Nov 23, 2009 at 01:59:40PM -0500, Robert Moskowitz wrote: >> >> It points you to: >> http://howtoforge.net/virtual-users-domains-postfix-courier-mysql-squirrelmail-fedora-10 >> >> Now granted this is for FC10, but I suspect it would be easy t

Re: [CentOS] Recommend Mail Server

>> At least I don't want to run software with poor security track on my >> public servers. >> > > So you don't run the Linux kernel? Wade through the changelog sometime. Or > BIND? it is unrealistic to think large software packages don't have bugs or > that they won't be found and fixe

Re: [CentOS] Recommend Mail Server

Eero Volotinen wrote: >> An IP stack which is part of the kernel *is* (more or less) directly >> exposed to the internet as long as there's the appropriate cable >> connected to that machine. > > Yes, I hope that IP-stack is not so buggy. Anyway, I think that is > easier to exploit systems via

Re: [CentOS] Recommend Mail Server

> Hi; > I don't want sendmail. What's a good secure email server that I can yum? I > really only need smtp right now, but who knows what the future will bring? > TIA, > Suzie http://www.exim.org/ Very configurable. Matt ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@c

Re: [CentOS] Recommend Mail Server

Timo Schoeler wrote: > thus Robert Moskowitz spake: > >> Timo Schoeler wrote: >> >>> thus Eero Volotinen spake: >>> >>> > Probably not, or someone would have found them in the last five years. > > Probably yes, it's hard to security audit complex

Re: [CentOS] Recommend Mail Server

thus Eero Volotinen spake: >> IP machinery is simple enough, but then there is ICMP and ICMP6, and >> IPv6 Neighbor discovery, and > > Yes and lot of firewalls even lacks IPv6 support even nowdays.. Don't buy them, so vendors get aware it's already 2009. Let's talk off-list. We're getting v

Re: [CentOS] Recommend Mail Server

Eero Volotinen wrote: > I usually prefer softwares with good security track. Anyway kernel is > not usually exposed directly to internet, but some server software are > directly. > where do you think IP packets get processed? ___ CentOS mailing li

Re: [CentOS] Recommend Mail Server

> IP machinery is simple enough, but then there is ICMP and ICMP6, and > IPv6 Neighbor discovery, and Yes and lot of firewalls even lacks IPv6 support even nowdays.. -- Eero ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailma

Re: [CentOS] Recommend Mail Server

thus Robert Moskowitz spake: > Timo Schoeler wrote: >> thus Eero Volotinen spake: >> Probably not, or someone would have found them in the last five years. >>> Probably yes, it's hard to security audit complex software packages. >>> >> Yes; my bet would be that OpenBSD's sm

Re: [CentOS] Recommend Mail Server

Timo Schoeler wrote: > thus Eero Volotinen spake: > >>> An IP stack which is part of the kernel *is* (more or less) directly >>> exposed to the internet as long as there's the appropriate cable >>> connected to that machine. >>> >> Yes, I hope that IP-stack is not so buggy. Anyway, I th

Re: [CentOS] Recommend Mail Server

Timo Schoeler wrote: > thus Eero Volotinen spake: > >>> Probably not, or someone would have found them in the last five years. >>> >> Probably yes, it's hard to security audit complex software packages. >> > > Yes; my bet would be that OpenBSD's smtpd will be the most secure MTA > (

Re: [CentOS] Recommend Mail Server

thus Eero Volotinen spake: >> An IP stack which is part of the kernel *is* (more or less) directly >> exposed to the internet as long as there's the appropriate cable >> connected to that machine. > > Yes, I hope that IP-stack is not so buggy. Anyway, I think that is > easier to exploit systems

Re: [CentOS] Recommend Mail Server

> An IP stack which is part of the kernel *is* (more or less) directly > exposed to the internet as long as there's the appropriate cable > connected to that machine. Yes, I hope that IP-stack is not so buggy. Anyway, I think that is easier to exploit systems via normal tcp connection as the k

Re: [CentOS] Recommend Mail Server

thus Eero Volotinen spake: >> Probably not, or someone would have found them in the last five years. > > Probably yes, it's hard to security audit complex software packages. Yes; my bet would be that OpenBSD's smtpd will be the most secure MTA (when it hits the streets for production). That does

Re: [CentOS] Recommend Mail Server

> > Probably not, or someone would have found them in the last five years. Probably yes, it's hard to security audit complex software packages. > >> At least I don't want to run software with poor security track on my >> public servers. > > So you don't run the Linux kernel? Wade through th

Re: [CentOS] Recommend Mail Server

Eero Volotinen wrote: > How do you have a remote root exploit if you aren't running as root? >>> Ask the sendmail advisories for 8.12.x. >> Wasn't the last bug found and fixed 5 or 6 years ago? > > and still lots of more lurking in the dark corners of sendmail? Probably not, or

Re: [CentOS] Recommend Mail Server

Les Mikesell wrote: > Christopher Chan wrote: >>> >>> How do you have a remote root exploit if you aren't running as root? >>> >>> >> Ask the sendmail advisories for 8.12.x. > > Wasn't the last bug found and fixed 5 or 6 years ago? and still lots of more lurking in the dark corners of sen

Re: [CentOS] Recommend Mail Server

Les Mikesell wrote: > Christopher Chan wrote: > >> >> >>> Wasn't the last bug found and fixed 5 or 6 years ago? >>> >>> >>> >> Which is great. Just saying that if there is one still lurking around, >> the current model of operation might still be vulnerable. >> > > That

Re: [CentOS] Recommend Mail Server

Christopher Chan wrote: >> And how many LDAP implementations have mysql/postgresql behind the LDAP >> syntax? >> >> > > Okay, I will be honest, I do not have that much ldap experience but I > was under the impression that they used Berkeley DB or something. I did > not know that some had

Re: [CentOS] Recommend Mail Server

Les Mikesell wrote: > Christopher Chan wrote: > >>> You are removing a layer if you just pass through the recipient check to >>> the >>> ultimate source (the internal delivery machine) before accepting, and it >>> does in >>> fact need to be able to handle the lookups

Re: [CentOS] Recommend Mail Server

Christopher Chan wrote: >>> Ho hum. I do not know why you keep insisting that letting mimedefang >>> handle say lookups to mysql and perform decisions based on those is >>> faster than if sendmail had native support. It is after all, one less >>> layer to going through and not run in something t

Re: [CentOS] Recommend Mail Server

Christopher Chan wrote: > >>> >> You are removing a layer if you just pass through the recipient check to the >> ultimate source (the internal delivery machine) before accepting, and it >> does in >> fact need to be able to handle the lookups at the speed real messages come >> in. >> How

Re: [CentOS] Recommend Mail Server

>> Ho hum. I do not know why you keep insisting that letting mimedefang >> handle say lookups to mysql and perform decisions based on those is >> faster than if sendmail had native support. It is after all, one less >> layer to going through and not run in something that is interpreted. >>

Re: [CentOS] Recommend Mail Server

Christopher Chan wrote: > >> Wasn't the last bug found and fixed 5 or 6 years ago? >> >> > > Which is great. Just saying that if there is one still lurking around, > the current model of operation might still be vulnerable. That was a joke, since you can never know when the last bug is f

Re: [CentOS] Recommend Mail Server

Les Mikesell wrote: > Christopher Chan wrote: > >> >> >>> If you have a reasonably fast internal mailer you can just let mimedefang >>> on >>> your external relay check against it with smtp in real time. Exchange >>> isn't one >>> of those, though. >>> >>> >>> >> That in

Re: [CentOS] Recommend Mail Server

Christopher Chan wrote: > >> If you have a reasonably fast internal mailer you can just let mimedefang on >> your external relay check against it with smtp in real time. Exchange isn't >> one >> of those, though. >> >> > > That internal mailer still has to whack something. You would ju

Re: [CentOS] Recommend Mail Server

> And how many LDAP implementations have mysql/postgresql behind the LDAP > syntax? > Okay, I will be honest, I do not have that much ldap experience but I was under the impression that they used Berkeley DB or something. I did not know that some had a sql backend... > So LDAP is frequentl

Re: [CentOS] Recommend Mail Server

Les Mikesell wrote: > Christopher Chan wrote: > >> >> Ian pointed how he needs to 'replicate' a local copy of user 'accounts' >> from Exchange so that he does not kill Exchange. I just pointed out that >> this sort of thing can be done also for sites with a very large user >> base that will

Re: [CentOS] Recommend Mail Server

Christopher Chan wrote: > Craig White wrote: > >> On Tue, 2009-11-24 at 11:00 +0800, Christopher Chan wrote: >> >> >>> Ian Forde wrote: >>> >>> On Nov 23, 2009, at 5:34 PM, Christopher Chan >>> > wrote:

Re: [CentOS] Recommend Mail Server

Les Mikesell wrote: > Christopher Chan wrote: > >>> >>> How do you have a remote root exploit if you aren't running as root? >>> >>> >>> >> Ask the sendmail advisories for 8.12.x. >> > > Wasn't the last bug found and fixed 5 or 6 years ago? > > Which is great. Just saying

Re: [CentOS] Recommend Mail Server

Christopher Chan wrote: > > >> How do you have a remote root exploit if you aren't running as root? >> >> > > Ask the sendmail advisories for 8.12.x. Wasn't the last bug found and fixed 5 or 6 years ago? >>> I fail to see how that becomes an advantage for sendmail. >>> >> It lets y

Re: [CentOS] Recommend Mail Server

Christopher Chan wrote: > > Ian pointed how he needs to 'replicate' a local copy of user 'accounts' > from Exchange so that he does not kill Exchange. I just pointed out that > this sort of thing can be done also for sites with a very large user > base that will want something that is more eff

Re: [CentOS] Recommend Mail Server

Craig White wrote: > On Tue, 2009-11-24 at 11:00 +0800, Christopher Chan wrote: > >> Ian Forde wrote: >> >>> On Nov 23, 2009, at 5:34 PM, Christopher Chan >>> >> > wrote: >>> >>> Les Mikesell wrote: > You probably reall

Re: [CentOS] Recommend Mail Server

On Tue, 2009-11-24 at 11:00 +0800, Christopher Chan wrote: > Ian Forde wrote: > > > > On Nov 23, 2009, at 5:34 PM, Christopher Chan > > > > wrote: > > > >> Les Mikesell wrote: > > >>> > >>> You probably really want ldap for that sort of thing. > >> >

Re: [CentOS] Recommend Mail Server

Les Mikesell wrote: > Christopher Chan wrote: > >> >> >>> By not-monolithic, I mean that now submission queuing, forwarding, and >>> local >>> delivery are all different processes, each running with limited credentials >>> most >>> of the time. And milters also can run under differ

Re: [CentOS] Recommend Mail Server

Ian Forde wrote: > > On Nov 23, 2009, at 5:34 PM, Christopher Chan > > wrote: > >> Les Mikesell wrote: >>> >>> You probably really want ldap for that sort of thing. >> >> You probably really want to reconsider using ldap for anything that gets >> load

Re: [CentOS] Recommend Mail Server

Ian Forde wrote: > > Sent from my iPhone > > On Nov 23, 2009, at 6:14 PM, Les Mikesell wrote: > >> On the contrary, having the ability to extend through external >> software gives >> you unlimited options. Note that postfix eventually got around to >> copying this >> feature. Also with mi

Re: [CentOS] Recommend Mail Server

On Nov 23, 2009, at 5:34 PM, Christopher Chan > wrote: Les Mikesell wrote: You probably really want ldap for that sort of thing. You probably really want to reconsider using ldap for anything that gets loads of changes daily. In the case of a mail relay, at one point years back I d

Re: [CentOS] Recommend Mail Server

Sent from my iPhone On Nov 23, 2009, at 6:14 PM, Les Mikesell wrote: > > On the contrary, having the ability to extend through external > software gives > you unlimited options. Note that postfix eventually got around to > copying this > feature. Also with mimedefang you can do most of y

Re: [CentOS] Recommend Mail Server

Christopher Chan wrote: > >> By not-monolithic, I mean that now submission queuing, forwarding, and local >> delivery are all different processes, each running with limited credentials >> most >> of the time. And milters also can run under different uids. >> >> > > All that means naught

Re: [CentOS] Recommend Mail Server

Les Mikesell wrote: > Christopher Chan wrote: > >> Les Mikesell wrote: >> >>> Susan Day wrote: >>> >>> Hi; I don't want sendmail. What's a good secure email server that I can yum? I really only need smtp right now, but who knows what the future will bring? >>

Re: [CentOS] Recommend Mail Server

Christopher Chan wrote: > Les Mikesell wrote: >> Susan Day wrote: >> >>> Hi; >>> I don't want sendmail. What's a good secure email server that I can yum? >>> I really only need smtp right now, but who knows what the future will bring? >>> >> >> Postfix is probably a reasonable choice, but

Re: [CentOS] Recommend Mail Server

Les Mikesell wrote: > Gilbert Sebenste wrote: > >> On Mon, 23 Nov 2009, Ron Loftin wrote: >> >> >>> As others have already suggested, consider Postfix. >>> >>> I'm putting in my $0.02(US) so I can add my experience when I first had >>> a need for a decent MTA. I had used Sendmail in the pa

Re: [CentOS] Recommend Mail Server

Susan Day wrote: > > On Mon, Nov 23, 2009 at 1:23 PM, Craig White > wrote: > > yum install postfix system-switch-mail > # edit /etc/postfix/main.conf > system-switch-mail # choose postfix, confirm > # done > > > Craig, I stopped qmail, which I had ins

Re: [CentOS] Recommend Mail Server

Eero Volotinen wrote: > Susan Day wrote: > >> On Mon, Nov 23, 2009 at 1:46 PM, Craig White > > wrote: >> >> No but you need to do this then... >> >> chkconfig postfix on >> chkconfig sendmail off >> >> and if there is some mechanism for starting qma

Re: [CentOS] Recommend Mail Server

Les Mikesell wrote: > Susan Day wrote: > >> Hi; >> I don't want sendmail. What's a good secure email server that I can yum? >> I really only need smtp right now, but who knows what the future will bring? >> > > > Postfix is probably a reasonable choice, but I'm curious as to how you > rea

Re: [CentOS] Recommend Mail Server

John R. Dennison wrote: > On Mon, Nov 23, 2009 at 01:59:40PM -0500, Robert Moskowitz wrote: > >> It points you to: >> http://howtoforge.net/virtual-users-domains-postfix-courier-mysql-squirrelmail-fedora-10 >> >> Now granted this is for FC10, but I suspect it would be easy to fit into >> Cent

Re: [CentOS] Recommend Mail Server

On Mon, 2009-11-23 at 13:25 -0600, Les Mikesell wrote: > fred smith wrote: > > On Mon, Nov 23, 2009 at 08:55:38AM -0800, John R Pierce wrote: > >> Susan Day wrote: > >>> Hi; > >>> I don't want sendmail. What's a good secure email server that I can > >>> yum? I really only need smtp right now, but

Re: [CentOS] Recommend Mail Server

fred smith wrote: > On Mon, Nov 23, 2009 at 08:55:38AM -0800, John R Pierce wrote: >> Susan Day wrote: >>> Hi; >>> I don't want sendmail. What's a good secure email server that I can >>> yum? I really only need smtp right now, but who knows what the future >>> will bring? >> SMTP only provides fo

Re: [CentOS] Recommend Mail Server

On Mon, Nov 23, 2009 at 01:59:40PM -0500, Robert Moskowitz wrote: > > It points you to: > http://howtoforge.net/virtual-users-domains-postfix-courier-mysql-squirrelmail-fedora-10 > > Now granted this is for FC10, but I suspect it would be easy to fit into > Centos. Please, for the lov

Re: [CentOS] Recommend Mail Server

On Mon, Nov 23, 2009 at 08:55:38AM -0800, John R Pierce wrote: > Susan Day wrote: > > Hi; > > I don't want sendmail. What's a good secure email server that I can > > yum? I really only need smtp right now, but who knows what the future > > will bring? > > SMTP only provides for relaying mail.

Re: [CentOS] Recommend Mail Server

Susan Day wrote: > On Mon, Nov 23, 2009 at 1:46 PM, Craig White > wrote: > > No but you need to do this then... > > chkconfig postfix on > chkconfig sendmail off > > and if there is some mechanism for starting qmail on startup, you will > have

Re: [CentOS] Recommend Mail Server

Susan Day wrote: > Hi; > I don't want sendmail. What's a good secure email server that I can > yum? I really only need smtp right now, but who knows what the future > will bring? See my slightly prior post on: Re: [CentOS] smtp+pop3+imap+tls+webmail+anti spam+anti virus It points you to: ht

Re: [CentOS] Recommend Mail Server

On Mon, Nov 23, 2009 at 1:46 PM, Craig White wrote: > No but you need to do this then... > > chkconfig postfix on > chkconfig sendmail off > > and if there is some mechanism for starting qmail on startup, you will > have to disable it...perhaps there is a sysv initscript that you can > discover h

Re: [CentOS] Recommend Mail Server

On Mon, 2009-11-23 at 13:30 -0500, Susan Day wrote: > > On Mon, Nov 23, 2009 at 1:23 PM, Craig White > wrote: > yum install postfix system-switch-mail > # edit /etc/postfix/main.conf > system-switch-mail # choose postfix, confirm > # done > > Craig, I stopped qmai

Re: [CentOS] Recommend Mail Server

On Mon, Nov 23, 2009 at 1:23 PM, Craig White wrote: > yum install postfix system-switch-mail > # edit /etc/postfix/main.conf > system-switch-mail # choose postfix, confirm > # done > Craig, I stopped qmail, which I had installed outside of yum, turning off sendmail first, then I just did a yum i

Re: [CentOS] Recommend Mail Server

On Mon, 2009-11-23 at 10:45 -0500, Susan Day wrote: > Hi; > I don't want sendmail. What's a good secure email server that I can > yum? I really only need smtp right now, but who knows what the future > will bring? > TIA, as root... yum install postfix system-switch-mail # edit /etc/postfix/ma

Re: [CentOS] Recommend Mail Server

I know everyone else has said it but postfix is a great replacement for sendmail. Another tool I've found that I like is ssmtp. It's not a replacement for sendmail/postfix by any stretch but if you want a simple down & dirty tool to send email from an internal server to your main email server it's

Re: [CentOS] Recommend Mail Server

Susan Day wrote: > Hi; > I don't want sendmail. What's a good secure email server that I can yum? > I really only need smtp right now, but who knows what the future will bring? Postfix is probably a reasonable choice, but I'm curious as to how you reached the decision that you don't want to use

Re: [CentOS] Recommend Mail Server

Gilbert Sebenste wrote: > On Mon, 23 Nov 2009, Ron Loftin wrote: > >> As others have already suggested, consider Postfix. >> >> I'm putting in my $0.02(US) so I can add my experience when I first had >> a need for a decent MTA. I had used Sendmail in the past, but I didn't >> want to fight with t

Re: [CentOS] Recommend Mail Server

On Mon, Nov 23, 2009 at 11:55 AM, John R Pierce wrote: > Susan Day wrote: > > Hi; > > I don't want sendmail. What's a good secure email server that I can > > yum? I really only need smtp right now, but who knows what the future > > will bring? > > SMTP only provides for relaying mail.a mail s

Re: [CentOS] Recommend Mail Server

>> As others have already suggested, consider Postfix. >> >> I'm putting in my $0.02(US) so I can add my experience when I first had >> a need for a decent MTA. I had used Sendmail in the past, but I didn't >> want to fight with the arcane syntax of the config files, and at that >> time the add-on

Re: [CentOS] Recommend Mail Server

thus Susan Day spake: > Hi; > I don't want sendmail. What's a good secure email server that I can yum? > I really only need smtp right now, but who knows what the future will bring? > TIA, > Suzie postfix rocks. :) HTH, Timo ___ CentOS mailing list Cen

Re: [CentOS] Recommend Mail Server

On Mon, 23 Nov 2009, Ron Loftin wrote: > As others have already suggested, consider Postfix. > > I'm putting in my $0.02(US) so I can add my experience when I first had > a need for a decent MTA. I had used Sendmail in the past, but I didn't > want to fight with the arcane syntax of the config fi

Re: [CentOS] Recommend Mail Server

On Mon, 2009-11-23 at 10:45 -0500, Susan Day wrote: > Hi; > I don't want sendmail. What's a good secure email server that I can > yum? I really only need smtp right now, but who knows what the future > will bring? As others have already suggested, consider Postfix. I'm putting in my $0.02(US) so

Re: [CentOS] Recommend Mail Server

See sendmail, postfix, Exim, qmail, dovecot, cyrus, Zimbra all related mail world. regards, Santiago N. El lun, 23-11-2009 a las 08:55 -0800, John R Pierce escribió: > Susan Day wrote: > > Hi; > > I don't want sendmail. Wha

Re: [CentOS] Recommend Mail Server

Susan Day wrote: > Hi; > I don't want sendmail. What's a good secure email server that I can > yum? I really only need smtp right now, but who knows what the future > will bring? SMTP only provides for relaying mail.a mail server typically needs a MTA (message transfer agent, smtp such as

Re: [CentOS] Recommend Mail Server

Susan Day wrote: > Hi; > I don't want sendmail. What's a good secure email server that I can yum? > I really only need smtp right now, but who knows what the future will bring? Postfix -- Eero, RHCE ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://list

Re: [CentOS] Recommend Mail Server

Hi there -- The postfix e-mail server is one possibility. From: centos-boun...@centos.org [mailto:centos-boun...@centos.org] On Behalf Of Susan Day Sent: Monday, November 23, 2009 10:45 AM To: CentOS mailing list Subject: [CentOS] Recommend Mail Server Hi; I

Re: [CentOS] Recommend Mail Server

Postfix.. Check it out at http://www.postfix.org. Its very powerful and is the future of mailing. Rgds Dhiraj Charles de Gaulle - "The better I get to know men, the more I find myself loving dogs." On Mon, Nov 23, 2009 at 21:1

[CentOS] Recommend Mail Server

Hi; I don't want sendmail. What's a good secure email server that I can yum? I really only need smtp right now, but who knows what the future will bring? TIA, Suzie ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos