Re: [c-nsp] Loopback/VLAN question

2009-12-23 Thread Frank Bulk 
The transport product was supposed to be able to re-tag, but we learned
during the turn-up that that's coming in future version.  As you can
imagine, we will be having further discussions on this issue.

Frank

-Original Message-
From: Thomas Habets [mailto:tho...@habets.pp.se] 
Sent: Wednesday, December 16, 2009 6:50 AM
To: Frank Bulk - iName.com
Cc: cisco-nsp@puck.nether.net
Subject: Re: [c-nsp] Loopback/VLAN question

On Tue, 15 Dec 2009, Frank Bulk - iName.com wrote:
 I have 5 remote sites where I'm doing FTTH and transporting the traffic
over
 a third-party transport gear to our HQ.  Each site-HQ link is a separate
 VLAN and uniquely numbered.

Have you considered re-tagging the VLANs on a cheaper device before the 
7600 (which I assume you're sparing because of port cost) and re-tagging 
them to the same VLAN, with some private vlan conf on there to keep VLANs 
from talking to each other (assuming you want that)? Then the 7600 will 
just get all sites on one VLAN.

Re-tagging VLANs does take up a few ports on a cheap switch, but it may be 
cheaper than using up more ports in the 7600 and the 3rd party transport.

And I never said it wasn't ugly.


 SiteA  SiteB  SiteC  SiteD  SiteE
  |  |  |  |  |
 VLAN1  VLAN2  VLAN3  VLAN4  VLAN5
  |  |  |  |  |
  =
|
   802.1q tagged (1 thru 5)
  |
2960
|   - untagged, one per VLAN
the same 2960
|
 7609-S
|
DHCP server

-
typedef struct me_s {
   char name[]  = { Thomas Habets };
   char email[] = { tho...@habets.pp.se };
   char kernel[]= { Linux };
   char *pgpKey[]   = { http://www.habets.pp.se/pubkey.txt; };
   char pgp[] = { A8A3 D1DD 4AE0 8467 7FDE  0945 286A E90A AD48 E854 };
   char coolcmd[]   = { echo '. ./_. ./_'_;. ./_ };
} me_t;

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Re: [c-nsp] Loopback/VLAN question

2009-12-16 Thread Thomas Habets 

On Tue, 15 Dec 2009, Frank Bulk - iName.com wrote:

I have 5 remote sites where I'm doing FTTH and transporting the traffic over
a third-party transport gear to our HQ.  Each site-HQ link is a separate
VLAN and uniquely numbered.


Have you considered re-tagging the VLANs on a cheaper device before the 
7600 (which I assume you're sparing because of port cost) and re-tagging 
them to the same VLAN, with some private vlan conf on there to keep VLANs 
from talking to each other (assuming you want that)? Then the 7600 will 
just get all sites on one VLAN.


Re-tagging VLANs does take up a few ports on a cheap switch, but it may be 
cheaper than using up more ports in the 7600 and the 3rd party transport.


And I never said it wasn't ugly.



SiteA  SiteB  SiteC  SiteD  SiteE
 |  |  |  |  |
VLAN1  VLAN2  VLAN3  VLAN4  VLAN5
 |  |  |  |  |
 =
   |
802.1q tagged (1 thru 5)

 |
   2960
   |   - untagged, one per VLAN
   the same 2960

   |
7609-S
   |
 DHCP server


-
typedef struct me_s {
  char name[]  = { Thomas Habets };
  char email[] = { tho...@habets.pp.se };
  char kernel[]= { Linux };
  char *pgpKey[]   = { http://www.habets.pp.se/pubkey.txt; };
  char pgp[] = { A8A3 D1DD 4AE0 8467 7FDE  0945 286A E90A AD48 E854 };
  char coolcmd[]   = { echo '. ./_. ./_'_;. ./_ };
} me_t;
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[c-nsp] Loopback/VLAN question

2009-12-15 Thread Frank Bulk - iName.com 
I have several uniquely numbered 802.1q tagged links coming into a Cisco
7609-S (12.2(33)SRB3) on a single physical port.  I would like to use the
same group of subnets for each VLAN and I tried using loopbacks but it
doesn't work.  Any ideas on what I'm doing wrong?

interface Loopback 2
 ip dhcp relay information trusted
 ip dhcp relay information option-insert none
 ip dhcp relay information policy-action keep
 ip address a.b.c.1 255.255.255.0
 ip address a.b.d.1 255.255.255.0 secondary
 ip address a.b.e.1 255.255.255.0 secondary
 ip helper-address w.x.y.z
 arp timeout 300

interface Vlan10
 ip unnumbered loopback 2
 ip dhcp relay information trusted
 ip dhcp relay information option-insert none
 ip dhcp relay information policy-action keep
 ip helper-address w.x.y.z

interface Vlan11
 ip unnumbered loopback 2
 ip dhcp relay information trusted
 ip dhcp relay information option-insert none
 ip dhcp relay information policy-action keep
 ip helper-address w.x.y.z

interface GigabitEthernet1/1
 switchport
 switchport trunk encapsulation dot1q
 switchport trunk allowed vlan 10, 11
 switchport mode trunk
end

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Re: [c-nsp] Loopback/VLAN question

2009-12-15 Thread Antonio Querubin 

On Tue, 15 Dec 2009, Frank Bulk - iName.com wrote:


I have several uniquely numbered 802.1q tagged links coming into a Cisco
7609-S (12.2(33)SRB3) on a single physical port.  I would like to use the
same group of subnets for each VLAN and I tried using loopbacks but it
doesn't work.  Any ideas on what I'm doing wrong?


Use BVI's, not loopbacks.

Antonio Querubin
808-545-5282 x3003
e-mail/xmpp:  t...@lava.net
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Re: [c-nsp] Loopback/VLAN question

2009-12-15 Thread Peter Rathlev 
On Tue, 2009-12-15 at 08:30 -1000, Antonio Querubin wrote:
 On Tue, 15 Dec 2009, Frank Bulk - iName.com wrote:
  I have several uniquely numbered 802.1q tagged links coming into a
  Cisco 7609-S (12.2(33)SRB3) on a single physical port.  I would like
  to use the same group of subnets for each VLAN and I tried using
  loopbacks but it doesn't work.  Any ideas on what I'm doing wrong?
 
 Use BVI's, not loopbacks.

I don't think using BVIs on a L3 switch will do much good; if it would
work (can they do anything but fallback bridging?) it would probably
be very bad performance wise.

As for the original question, I wouldn't have thought a PFC3B could do
such a thing, but one can never know. I suppose it _has_ to work like
that?

-- 
Peter



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Re: [c-nsp] Loopback/VLAN question

2009-12-15 Thread Arie Vayner (avayner) 
Frank,

Can you please explain what do you want to achieve?
I think this should be done in a different way.

Also, what HW do you have?

Arie

-Original Message-
From: cisco-nsp-boun...@puck.nether.net
[mailto:cisco-nsp-boun...@puck.nether.net] On Behalf Of Frank Bulk -
iName.com
Sent: Tuesday, December 15, 2009 20:19
To: cisco-nsp@puck.nether.net
Subject: [c-nsp] Loopback/VLAN question

I have several uniquely numbered 802.1q tagged links coming into a Cisco
7609-S (12.2(33)SRB3) on a single physical port.  I would like to use
the
same group of subnets for each VLAN and I tried using loopbacks but it
doesn't work.  Any ideas on what I'm doing wrong?

interface Loopback 2
 ip dhcp relay information trusted
 ip dhcp relay information option-insert none
 ip dhcp relay information policy-action keep
 ip address a.b.c.1 255.255.255.0
 ip address a.b.d.1 255.255.255.0 secondary
 ip address a.b.e.1 255.255.255.0 secondary
 ip helper-address w.x.y.z
 arp timeout 300

interface Vlan10
 ip unnumbered loopback 2
 ip dhcp relay information trusted
 ip dhcp relay information option-insert none
 ip dhcp relay information policy-action keep
 ip helper-address w.x.y.z

interface Vlan11
 ip unnumbered loopback 2
 ip dhcp relay information trusted
 ip dhcp relay information option-insert none
 ip dhcp relay information policy-action keep
 ip helper-address w.x.y.z

interface GigabitEthernet1/1
 switchport
 switchport trunk encapsulation dot1q
 switchport trunk allowed vlan 10, 11
 switchport mode trunk
end

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Re: [c-nsp] Loopback/VLAN question

2009-12-15 Thread Frank Bulk - iName.com 
It's my understanding that BVIs on the 7600-platform only bridge non-IP
traffic, so that wouldn't work.

Frank

-Original Message-
From: Antonio Querubin [mailto:t...@lava.net] 
Sent: Tuesday, December 15, 2009 12:30 PM
To: Frank Bulk - iName.com
Cc: cisco-nsp@puck.nether.net
Subject: Re: [c-nsp] Loopback/VLAN question

On Tue, 15 Dec 2009, Frank Bulk - iName.com wrote:

 I have several uniquely numbered 802.1q tagged links coming into a Cisco
 7609-S (12.2(33)SRB3) on a single physical port.  I would like to use the
 same group of subnets for each VLAN and I tried using loopbacks but it
 doesn't work.  Any ideas on what I'm doing wrong?

Use BVI's, not loopbacks.

Antonio Querubin
808-545-5282 x3003
e-mail/xmpp:  t...@lava.net

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Re: [c-nsp] Loopback/VLAN question

2009-12-15 Thread Frank Bulk - iName.com 
I have 5 remote sites where I'm doing FTTH and transporting the traffic over
a third-party transport gear to our HQ.  Each site-HQ link is a separate
VLAN and uniquely numbered.  My preference is to burn up only one port on
the Cisco 7609-S (RSP720-3C with WS-X6748-DFC3C) and transport gear by
trunking the traffic between the two boxes.  But I don't want to have a
separate IP address pool (with associated static IP /24 and web filter /24)
for each remote site.  I would like each remote site to use the same address
pool.  So I'm looking for something like IRB.

SiteA  SiteB  SiteC  SiteD  SiteE
  |  |  |  |  |
VLAN1  VLAN2  VLAN3  VLAN4  VLAN5
  |  |  |  |  |
  =
|
802.1q tagged (1 thru 5)
|
 7609-S
|
 DHCP server

I could use the transport gear's VLAN-translation and drop off each site
into their own physical port on the 7609-S but have it be the same VLAN, but
that's burning more ports on both boxes than what I would like.

But perhaps I have to use separate IP address pools for each remote site.
That would have the benefit of reducing the L3-broadcast traffic.

Frank

-Original Message-
From: Arie Vayner (avayner) [mailto:avay...@cisco.com] 
Sent: Tuesday, December 15, 2009 1:32 PM
To: frnk...@iname.com; cisco-nsp@puck.nether.net
Subject: RE: [c-nsp] Loopback/VLAN question

Frank,

Can you please explain what do you want to achieve?
I think this should be done in a different way.

Also, what HW do you have?

Arie

-Original Message-
From: cisco-nsp-boun...@puck.nether.net
[mailto:cisco-nsp-boun...@puck.nether.net] On Behalf Of Frank Bulk -
iName.com
Sent: Tuesday, December 15, 2009 20:19
To: cisco-nsp@puck.nether.net
Subject: [c-nsp] Loopback/VLAN question

I have several uniquely numbered 802.1q tagged links coming into a Cisco
7609-S (12.2(33)SRB3) on a single physical port.  I would like to use
the
same group of subnets for each VLAN and I tried using loopbacks but it
doesn't work.  Any ideas on what I'm doing wrong?

interface Loopback 2
 ip dhcp relay information trusted
 ip dhcp relay information option-insert none
 ip dhcp relay information policy-action keep
 ip address a.b.c.1 255.255.255.0
 ip address a.b.d.1 255.255.255.0 secondary
 ip address a.b.e.1 255.255.255.0 secondary
 ip helper-address w.x.y.z
 arp timeout 300

interface Vlan10
 ip unnumbered loopback 2
 ip dhcp relay information trusted
 ip dhcp relay information option-insert none
 ip dhcp relay information policy-action keep
 ip helper-address w.x.y.z

interface Vlan11
 ip unnumbered loopback 2
 ip dhcp relay information trusted
 ip dhcp relay information option-insert none
 ip dhcp relay information policy-action keep
 ip helper-address w.x.y.z

interface GigabitEthernet1/1
 switchport
 switchport trunk encapsulation dot1q
 switchport trunk allowed vlan 10, 11
 switchport mode trunk
end

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Re: [c-nsp] Loopback/VLAN question

2009-12-15 Thread Arie Vayner (avayner) 
Frank,

The right way to solve it would be to use the ES20 (or more actually the
more recent ES+) modules.
This would allow you to create a separate EVC/EFP (service-instance) per
site, using whatever VLAN IDs (even reusing them, or using QinQ) and
then bridge-domain them all to the same central global bridge VLAN,
which would be the Layer 3 service endpoint (for DHCP).

Use the right tools for the job

Anyway, with your setup, if this is not becoming a big service (which
would then make sense to invest in new HW), then maybe you should just
break them into separate L3 domains.

Another option is to use the MetroE model of uPE and nPE, where a uPE is
used for some parts of the service. This could be a L2 switch (CPE?
ME3400-2CS) to do the VLAN translation...

Hope this helps.

Arie

-Original Message-
From: Frank Bulk - iName.com [mailto:frnk...@iname.com] 
Sent: Tuesday, December 15, 2009 21:56
To: Arie Vayner (avayner); cisco-nsp@puck.nether.net
Subject: RE: [c-nsp] Loopback/VLAN question

I have 5 remote sites where I'm doing FTTH and transporting the traffic
over
a third-party transport gear to our HQ.  Each site-HQ link is a separate
VLAN and uniquely numbered.  My preference is to burn up only one port
on
the Cisco 7609-S (RSP720-3C with WS-X6748-DFC3C) and transport gear by
trunking the traffic between the two boxes.  But I don't want to have a
separate IP address pool (with associated static IP /24 and web filter
/24)
for each remote site.  I would like each remote site to use the same
address
pool.  So I'm looking for something like IRB.

SiteA  SiteB  SiteC  SiteD  SiteE
  |  |  |  |  |
VLAN1  VLAN2  VLAN3  VLAN4  VLAN5
  |  |  |  |  |
  =
|
802.1q tagged (1 thru 5)
|
 7609-S
|
 DHCP server

I could use the transport gear's VLAN-translation and drop off each site
into their own physical port on the 7609-S but have it be the same VLAN,
but
that's burning more ports on both boxes than what I would like.

But perhaps I have to use separate IP address pools for each remote
site.
That would have the benefit of reducing the L3-broadcast traffic.

Frank

-Original Message-
From: Arie Vayner (avayner) [mailto:avay...@cisco.com] 
Sent: Tuesday, December 15, 2009 1:32 PM
To: frnk...@iname.com; cisco-nsp@puck.nether.net
Subject: RE: [c-nsp] Loopback/VLAN question

Frank,

Can you please explain what do you want to achieve?
I think this should be done in a different way.

Also, what HW do you have?

Arie

-Original Message-
From: cisco-nsp-boun...@puck.nether.net
[mailto:cisco-nsp-boun...@puck.nether.net] On Behalf Of Frank Bulk -
iName.com
Sent: Tuesday, December 15, 2009 20:19
To: cisco-nsp@puck.nether.net
Subject: [c-nsp] Loopback/VLAN question

I have several uniquely numbered 802.1q tagged links coming into a Cisco
7609-S (12.2(33)SRB3) on a single physical port.  I would like to use
the
same group of subnets for each VLAN and I tried using loopbacks but it
doesn't work.  Any ideas on what I'm doing wrong?

interface Loopback 2
 ip dhcp relay information trusted
 ip dhcp relay information option-insert none
 ip dhcp relay information policy-action keep
 ip address a.b.c.1 255.255.255.0
 ip address a.b.d.1 255.255.255.0 secondary
 ip address a.b.e.1 255.255.255.0 secondary
 ip helper-address w.x.y.z
 arp timeout 300

interface Vlan10
 ip unnumbered loopback 2
 ip dhcp relay information trusted
 ip dhcp relay information option-insert none
 ip dhcp relay information policy-action keep
 ip helper-address w.x.y.z

interface Vlan11
 ip unnumbered loopback 2
 ip dhcp relay information trusted
 ip dhcp relay information option-insert none
 ip dhcp relay information policy-action keep
 ip helper-address w.x.y.z

interface GigabitEthernet1/1
 switchport
 switchport trunk encapsulation dot1q
 switchport trunk allowed vlan 10, 11
 switchport mode trunk
end

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Re: [c-nsp] Loopback/VLAN question

2009-12-15 Thread Frank Bulk - iName.com 
Looks like I will be creating separate L3 domains. ARIN, here I come.  =)

Thanks again to this group for this helpful information.

Frank

-Original Message-
From: Arie Vayner (avayner) [mailto:avay...@cisco.com] 
Sent: Tuesday, December 15, 2009 2:14 PM
To: frnk...@iname.com; cisco-nsp@puck.nether.net
Subject: RE: [c-nsp] Loopback/VLAN question

Frank,

The right way to solve it would be to use the ES20 (or more actually the
more recent ES+) modules.
This would allow you to create a separate EVC/EFP (service-instance) per
site, using whatever VLAN IDs (even reusing them, or using QinQ) and
then bridge-domain them all to the same central global bridge VLAN,
which would be the Layer 3 service endpoint (for DHCP).

Use the right tools for the job

Anyway, with your setup, if this is not becoming a big service (which
would then make sense to invest in new HW), then maybe you should just
break them into separate L3 domains.

Another option is to use the MetroE model of uPE and nPE, where a uPE is
used for some parts of the service. This could be a L2 switch (CPE?
ME3400-2CS) to do the VLAN translation...

Hope this helps.

Arie

-Original Message-
From: Frank Bulk - iName.com [mailto:frnk...@iname.com] 
Sent: Tuesday, December 15, 2009 21:56
To: Arie Vayner (avayner); cisco-nsp@puck.nether.net
Subject: RE: [c-nsp] Loopback/VLAN question

I have 5 remote sites where I'm doing FTTH and transporting the traffic
over
a third-party transport gear to our HQ.  Each site-HQ link is a separate
VLAN and uniquely numbered.  My preference is to burn up only one port
on
the Cisco 7609-S (RSP720-3C with WS-X6748-DFC3C) and transport gear by
trunking the traffic between the two boxes.  But I don't want to have a
separate IP address pool (with associated static IP /24 and web filter
/24)
for each remote site.  I would like each remote site to use the same
address
pool.  So I'm looking for something like IRB.

SiteA  SiteB  SiteC  SiteD  SiteE
  |  |  |  |  |
VLAN1  VLAN2  VLAN3  VLAN4  VLAN5
  |  |  |  |  |
  =
|
802.1q tagged (1 thru 5)
|
 7609-S
|
 DHCP server

I could use the transport gear's VLAN-translation and drop off each site
into their own physical port on the 7609-S but have it be the same VLAN,
but
that's burning more ports on both boxes than what I would like.

But perhaps I have to use separate IP address pools for each remote
site.
That would have the benefit of reducing the L3-broadcast traffic.

Frank

-Original Message-
From: Arie Vayner (avayner) [mailto:avay...@cisco.com] 
Sent: Tuesday, December 15, 2009 1:32 PM
To: frnk...@iname.com; cisco-nsp@puck.nether.net
Subject: RE: [c-nsp] Loopback/VLAN question

Frank,

Can you please explain what do you want to achieve?
I think this should be done in a different way.

Also, what HW do you have?

Arie

-Original Message-
From: cisco-nsp-boun...@puck.nether.net
[mailto:cisco-nsp-boun...@puck.nether.net] On Behalf Of Frank Bulk -
iName.com
Sent: Tuesday, December 15, 2009 20:19
To: cisco-nsp@puck.nether.net
Subject: [c-nsp] Loopback/VLAN question

I have several uniquely numbered 802.1q tagged links coming into a Cisco
7609-S (12.2(33)SRB3) on a single physical port.  I would like to use
the
same group of subnets for each VLAN and I tried using loopbacks but it
doesn't work.  Any ideas on what I'm doing wrong?

interface Loopback 2
 ip dhcp relay information trusted
 ip dhcp relay information option-insert none
 ip dhcp relay information policy-action keep
 ip address a.b.c.1 255.255.255.0
 ip address a.b.d.1 255.255.255.0 secondary
 ip address a.b.e.1 255.255.255.0 secondary
 ip helper-address w.x.y.z
 arp timeout 300

interface Vlan10
 ip unnumbered loopback 2
 ip dhcp relay information trusted
 ip dhcp relay information option-insert none
 ip dhcp relay information policy-action keep
 ip helper-address w.x.y.z

interface Vlan11
 ip unnumbered loopback 2
 ip dhcp relay information trusted
 ip dhcp relay information option-insert none
 ip dhcp relay information policy-action keep
 ip helper-address w.x.y.z

interface GigabitEthernet1/1
 switchport
 switchport trunk encapsulation dot1q
 switchport trunk allowed vlan 10, 11
 switchport mode trunk
end

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Re: [c-nsp] Loopback/VLAN question

2009-12-15 Thread Mikael Abrahamsson 

On Tue, 15 Dec 2009, Frank Bulk - iName.com wrote:


Looks like I will be creating separate L3 domains.


If you can live with knowing what part of the IP pool belongs in what vlan 
then you can (this works with static addresses (no dhcp) anyway) route the 
individual parts of the unnumbered subnets to the vlan interface in 
question.


A static route to an interface means the ARP(s) will be done on that 
interface, so in conjunction with local-proxy-arp (which you seem to 
have missed in your conf?) you can do this:


int lo20
ip addr 192.168.1.1 255.255.255.0
int vlan10
ip unnumbered lo20
ip local-proxy-arp
int vlan20
ip unnumbered lo20
ip local-proxy-arp

ip route 192.168.1.0 255.255.255.128 vlan10
ip route 192.168.1.128 255.255.255.128 vlan10

Now you've split this subnet into two vlans and there is still full 
communication between them. How this interacts with dhcp, I don't know. 
You should try your original conf with added ip local-proxy-arp anyway.


--
Mikael Abrahamssonemail: swm...@swm.pp.se
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