Re: [CODE4LIB] College Question!
I got a BA in Anthropology, made my millions, heh heh, then got my MLS about 10 years later. No, but Karen is right, I constantly use what I learned about cultural anthropology in my job as a librarian. My place of work is currently hiring a library systems administrator and we don’t require an MLS. The upside is that we offer tuition remission for a certain amount of credit hours per semester. So in theory someone could take this job with a bachelor’s in CS or IT or Info Science, learn while on the job, and also take classes to earn an MLS through an online degree program offered at another university we partner with in our state. So it definitely varies by institution. I’d echo the sentiments others have made in this thread by saying get to know what it’s like to work in a library by taking any library job you can find. I’ve known people to spend years and years getting degrees only to find that they didn’t like the job once they started working in the courtroom, cubicle, etc. And I believe the most important thing regarding valuation of employees is the ability and drive to learn new things. Your job duties will probably change significantly within a short amount of time after your hiring, whatever it is you end up doing, so the drive to learn will serve you well no matter what undergrad path you choose. _ Scott Bacon Web Services and Emerging Technologies Librarian Coastal Carolina University On Thu, May 29, 2014 at 2:15 PM, Joshua Welker wel...@ucmo.edu wrote: Yes, experience trumps education completely in my experience as far as developing skills in libraries and technology. Some employers will demand the degree, but it is really of secondary value to hands-on experience. One possibility would be talking to a systems librarian or anyone else at your university whose job interests you and explain to them that you are looking for some mentoring and experience. It is quite likely that they could whip up a student worker position just for you. At least I know I would if a student approached me that way. All the libraries where I've worked have had fairly free reign with student worker hours. Chances are you are going to end up doing some kind of student work position anyway, so you might as well use it learning something valuable rather than raking leaves or cooking pizza. Josh Welker -Original Message- From: Code for Libraries [mailto:CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU] On Behalf Of Fleming, Declan Sent: Thursday, May 29, 2014 1:05 PM To: CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU Subject: Re: [CODE4LIB] College Question! Hi - I'm also an English undergrad. This was after miserably failing out of a Math/CS program (although I learned a lot). The English degree forced me to write a lot while in college - a time when one's mind needs some expanding lest it get caught in ruts. This helped my communication skills immensely. Despite what Giarlo says. I also agree that a background in informatics is going to be really helpful in the years to come. We are awash in data, yet little of it has the semantics needed to automate the extraction of meaning. I think there are going to be many years of smart people plowing meaning back into the data sets that we're struggling to put away at the bit level now, and I think it sounds like fun work. Another common thread I agree with, and one my kids have heard since they were in diapers, is GET A JOB! Especially in the area you think you're interested in. You'll learn more practical things there than in any class. You may suck at it at first, but hey, they're paying you anyway! If you like doing it, you'll get better, build your resume, and be better able to see if it's something you want to do long term. Year later, after working in corporate IT for a while and getting sick of my profession being treated like an expendable commodity, I went back and got an MBA to better understand business - and learned that corporate IT is an expendable commodity... I wasn't really OK with that, so I came back to academia to do more meaningful work for far less money ;) With the MBA, I was able to come back at a director level and influence change, so that's kinda cool. Good job getting ahead of this! You're a neat person and I appreciate what you do for the community! Declan -Original Message- From: Code for Libraries [mailto:CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU] On Behalf Of Henry, Laura Sent: Thursday, May 29, 2014 5:51 AM To: CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU Subject: Re: [CODE4LIB] College Question! My undergrad degree is in English, and it actually has come in handy at times. Good communication is important, regardless of what you end up doing. If I could do it again, I'd seriously consider informatics - but I didn't know it was a thing until I started library school. http://www.soic.indiana.edu/informatics/ As far as IT, I learned a lot from the tech-support job I had right out of college, and after that I'm self-taught
Re: [CODE4LIB] College Question!
I have a BA in Music and the MLIS(union card), starting the Ph.D this fall. Even though an MLIS was not required for my job, I find it incredibly useful to know the language of librarians and be able to serve all the librarians I support to the best of my abilities. Without the MLIS I would feel less able to speak the same jargon/language. And along the same lines as everyone else, I would highly recommend getting the most IT practical experience you can get with the most personal connections you can get in libraries. Attend as many library conferences you can as a student, while its still cheap. And once you get a part-time student IT job, volunteer to do everything you can. Also don't underestimate being a nice guy; having people like you in our customer service/IT type employment is a highly prized commodity. Good luck, Craig Boman, MLIS, BA On Fri, May 30, 2014 at 9:43 AM, scott bacon sdanielba...@gmail.com wrote: I got a BA in Anthropology, made my millions, heh heh, then got my MLS about 10 years later. No, but Karen is right, I constantly use what I learned about cultural anthropology in my job as a librarian. My place of work is currently hiring a library systems administrator and we don’t require an MLS. The upside is that we offer tuition remission for a certain amount of credit hours per semester. So in theory someone could take this job with a bachelor’s in CS or IT or Info Science, learn while on the job, and also take classes to earn an MLS through an online degree program offered at another university we partner with in our state. So it definitely varies by institution. I’d echo the sentiments others have made in this thread by saying get to know what it’s like to work in a library by taking any library job you can find. I’ve known people to spend years and years getting degrees only to find that they didn’t like the job once they started working in the courtroom, cubicle, etc. And I believe the most important thing regarding valuation of employees is the ability and drive to learn new things. Your job duties will probably change significantly within a short amount of time after your hiring, whatever it is you end up doing, so the drive to learn will serve you well no matter what undergrad path you choose. _ Scott Bacon Web Services and Emerging Technologies Librarian Coastal Carolina University On Thu, May 29, 2014 at 2:15 PM, Joshua Welker wel...@ucmo.edu wrote: Yes, experience trumps education completely in my experience as far as developing skills in libraries and technology. Some employers will demand the degree, but it is really of secondary value to hands-on experience. One possibility would be talking to a systems librarian or anyone else at your university whose job interests you and explain to them that you are looking for some mentoring and experience. It is quite likely that they could whip up a student worker position just for you. At least I know I would if a student approached me that way. All the libraries where I've worked have had fairly free reign with student worker hours. Chances are you are going to end up doing some kind of student work position anyway, so you might as well use it learning something valuable rather than raking leaves or cooking pizza. Josh Welker -Original Message- From: Code for Libraries [mailto:CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU] On Behalf Of Fleming, Declan Sent: Thursday, May 29, 2014 1:05 PM To: CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU Subject: Re: [CODE4LIB] College Question! Hi - I'm also an English undergrad. This was after miserably failing out of a Math/CS program (although I learned a lot). The English degree forced me to write a lot while in college - a time when one's mind needs some expanding lest it get caught in ruts. This helped my communication skills immensely. Despite what Giarlo says. I also agree that a background in informatics is going to be really helpful in the years to come. We are awash in data, yet little of it has the semantics needed to automate the extraction of meaning. I think there are going to be many years of smart people plowing meaning back into the data sets that we're struggling to put away at the bit level now, and I think it sounds like fun work. Another common thread I agree with, and one my kids have heard since they were in diapers, is GET A JOB! Especially in the area you think you're interested in. You'll learn more practical things there than in any class. You may suck at it at first, but hey, they're paying you anyway! If you like doing it, you'll get better, build your resume, and be better able to see if it's something you want to do long term. Year later, after working in corporate IT for a while and getting sick of my profession being treated like an expendable commodity, I went back and got an MBA to better understand business - and learned that corporate
Re: [CODE4LIB] College Question!
Riley, As an undergrad, I studied music, religion, and English. I got my MLIS after realizing that, out of my three majors, not a single one was employable. If I'd known at the time that I'd enjoy teaching myself to code, I would have just done that and skipped the MLIS. As many people have mentioned, having a broad education is important for librarians. This is especially true if you want the option of working at a smaller school, where job descriptions can be quite broad. At a small school, you'll be much more employable if you have both tech skills and a subject specialization needed by that library. So a liberal arts degree can be a good choice, especially if you pick one that isn't well represented in libraries (i.e., not English or history). But for now I wouldn't worry about choosing a major. Go to a good school that feels like a good fit for you. Get a job at the library, even if it's just circulation. During the first year, take a CS course along with GE courses from a variety of disciplines, then choose your major(s) based on what interests you the most. Sarah On Fri, May 30, 2014 at 9:30 AM, craig boman craig.bo...@gmail.com wrote: I have a BA in Music and the MLIS(union card), starting the Ph.D this fall. Even though an MLIS was not required for my job, I find it incredibly useful to know the language of librarians and be able to serve all the librarians I support to the best of my abilities. Without the MLIS I would feel less able to speak the same jargon/language. And along the same lines as everyone else, I would highly recommend getting the most IT practical experience you can get with the most personal connections you can get in libraries. Attend as many library conferences you can as a student, while its still cheap. And once you get a part-time student IT job, volunteer to do everything you can. Also don't underestimate being a nice guy; having people like you in our customer service/IT type employment is a highly prized commodity. Good luck, Craig Boman, MLIS, BA On Fri, May 30, 2014 at 9:43 AM, scott bacon sdanielba...@gmail.com wrote: I got a BA in Anthropology, made my millions, heh heh, then got my MLS about 10 years later. No, but Karen is right, I constantly use what I learned about cultural anthropology in my job as a librarian. My place of work is currently hiring a library systems administrator and we don’t require an MLS. The upside is that we offer tuition remission for a certain amount of credit hours per semester. So in theory someone could take this job with a bachelor’s in CS or IT or Info Science, learn while on the job, and also take classes to earn an MLS through an online degree program offered at another university we partner with in our state. So it definitely varies by institution. I’d echo the sentiments others have made in this thread by saying get to know what it’s like to work in a library by taking any library job you can find. I’ve known people to spend years and years getting degrees only to find that they didn’t like the job once they started working in the courtroom, cubicle, etc. And I believe the most important thing regarding valuation of employees is the ability and drive to learn new things. Your job duties will probably change significantly within a short amount of time after your hiring, whatever it is you end up doing, so the drive to learn will serve you well no matter what undergrad path you choose. _ Scott Bacon Web Services and Emerging Technologies Librarian Coastal Carolina University On Thu, May 29, 2014 at 2:15 PM, Joshua Welker wel...@ucmo.edu wrote: Yes, experience trumps education completely in my experience as far as developing skills in libraries and technology. Some employers will demand the degree, but it is really of secondary value to hands-on experience. One possibility would be talking to a systems librarian or anyone else at your university whose job interests you and explain to them that you are looking for some mentoring and experience. It is quite likely that they could whip up a student worker position just for you. At least I know I would if a student approached me that way. All the libraries where I've worked have had fairly free reign with student worker hours. Chances are you are going to end up doing some kind of student work position anyway, so you might as well use it learning something valuable rather than raking leaves or cooking pizza. Josh Welker -Original Message- From: Code for Libraries [mailto:CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU] On Behalf Of Fleming, Declan Sent: Thursday, May 29, 2014 1:05 PM To: CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU Subject: Re: [CODE4LIB] College Question! Hi - I'm also an English undergrad. This was after miserably failing out of a Math/CS program (although I learned a lot). The English degree forced me
Re: [CODE4LIB] College Question!
Hi Riley, I agree with most of the responses already provided. My personal background: I have a BA in Computer Science with minors in English and Business and my MLS. Currently, my official job title is IT Application Engineer and my job is to look after the ILS. Unlike a lot of other places, the only thing I work on is the ILS (and reports from the ILS). I don't do any cataloging or metadata work and don't interact with other electronic resources/databases unless they work directly with our ILS. I also currently don't do any web development or PC troubleshooting. Reflections on my education: I'm very happy with my BA in Computer Science. For my position, my database class was particularly useful as were the various projects assigned in other classes that required me to learn more than what the class was ostensibly teaching (i.e. learning how to learn). Because I went to a liberal arts school, I also had to take a full year of English writing which I felt was very valuable. My English minor made me more well-rounded which is useful in library land. My business minor has so far been pretty useless professionally but has been great from a personal finance perspective :) I worked for a year as phone tech support while an undergrad. That was a hellish job which I'd only do again if my child was starving. However, I learned a lot about people skills from it as well as it helped me practice troubleshooting things I couldn't see myself. I'm still bemused the company expected phone tech support to be able to walk a person with no computer experience through changing a hard drive (usually explaining the difference between the computer and the monitor was the hardest part). I value my MLS but from a cost perspective it's probably hard to justify in my current position. For my job description, the CS/IT degree is required and the MLS is preferred, I have mixed feelings about this. As an ILS administrator, the cataloging class I took was the most useful library school class. I'm not a cataloger but I have enough knowledge to be able to ask sensible questions when they need the ILS to do something specific. The reference class was also useful, particularly in terms of learning about the reference interview which is used all the time in IT troubleshooting. There's also cultural advantages to an MLS but computer people and library people already have a fairly similar culture, even if the jargon is different. My understanding is some libraries will help pay for an MLS (I believe mine does, or use to) so perhaps that might be an option. There's a lot of good online library programs and I know quite a few of the staff in our district get their MLS while working for the district. All that being said, being open to learning is more important than the specific classes you take. Regardless of what you take in school, things will change over the course of your career and it's important to know how to continue gaining knowledge and skills once you've graduated. Good luck, Gem Stone-Logan High Plains Library District http://www.mylibrary.us/ On Wed, May 28, 2014 at 9:17 PM, Riley Childs rchi...@cucawarriors.com wrote: I was curious about the type of degrees people had. I am heading off to college next year (class of 2015) and am trying to figure out what to major in. I want to be a systems librarian, but I can't tell what to major in! I wanted to hear about what paths people took and how they ended up where they are now. BTW Y'All at NC State need a better tour bus driver (not the c4l tour, the admissions tour) ;) the bus ride was like a rickety roller coaster... Also, if you know of any scholarships please let me know ;) you would be my BFF :P Riley Childs Student Asst. Head of IT Services Charlotte United Christian Academy (704) 497-2086 RileyChilds.net Sent from my Windows Phone, please excuse mistakes
Re: [CODE4LIB] College Question!
Want to step in and say thank you, and keep em coming, I enjoy reading about everyone's backgrounds and their journey per se... Riley Childs Student Asst. Head of IT Services Charlotte United Christian Academy (704) 497-2086 RileyChilds.net Sent from my Windows Phone, please excuse mistakes From: Gem Stone-Loganmailto:gemstonelo...@gmail.com Sent: 5/30/2014 1:42 PM To: CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDUmailto:CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU Subject: Re: [CODE4LIB] College Question! Hi Riley, I agree with most of the responses already provided. My personal background: I have a BA in Computer Science with minors in English and Business and my MLS. Currently, my official job title is IT Application Engineer and my job is to look after the ILS. Unlike a lot of other places, the only thing I work on is the ILS (and reports from the ILS). I don't do any cataloging or metadata work and don't interact with other electronic resources/databases unless they work directly with our ILS. I also currently don't do any web development or PC troubleshooting. Reflections on my education: I'm very happy with my BA in Computer Science. For my position, my database class was particularly useful as were the various projects assigned in other classes that required me to learn more than what the class was ostensibly teaching (i.e. learning how to learn). Because I went to a liberal arts school, I also had to take a full year of English writing which I felt was very valuable. My English minor made me more well-rounded which is useful in library land. My business minor has so far been pretty useless professionally but has been great from a personal finance perspective :) I worked for a year as phone tech support while an undergrad. That was a hellish job which I'd only do again if my child was starving. However, I learned a lot about people skills from it as well as it helped me practice troubleshooting things I couldn't see myself. I'm still bemused the company expected phone tech support to be able to walk a person with no computer experience through changing a hard drive (usually explaining the difference between the computer and the monitor was the hardest part). I value my MLS but from a cost perspective it's probably hard to justify in my current position. For my job description, the CS/IT degree is required and the MLS is preferred, I have mixed feelings about this. As an ILS administrator, the cataloging class I took was the most useful library school class. I'm not a cataloger but I have enough knowledge to be able to ask sensible questions when they need the ILS to do something specific. The reference class was also useful, particularly in terms of learning about the reference interview which is used all the time in IT troubleshooting. There's also cultural advantages to an MLS but computer people and library people already have a fairly similar culture, even if the jargon is different. My understanding is some libraries will help pay for an MLS (I believe mine does, or use to) so perhaps that might be an option. There's a lot of good online library programs and I know quite a few of the staff in our district get their MLS while working for the district. All that being said, being open to learning is more important than the specific classes you take. Regardless of what you take in school, things will change over the course of your career and it's important to know how to continue gaining knowledge and skills once you've graduated. Good luck, Gem Stone-Logan High Plains Library District http://www.mylibrary.us/ On Wed, May 28, 2014 at 9:17 PM, Riley Childs rchi...@cucawarriors.com wrote: I was curious about the type of degrees people had. I am heading off to college next year (class of 2015) and am trying to figure out what to major in. I want to be a systems librarian, but I can't tell what to major in! I wanted to hear about what paths people took and how they ended up where they are now. BTW Y'All at NC State need a better tour bus driver (not the c4l tour, the admissions tour) ;) the bus ride was like a rickety roller coaster... Also, if you know of any scholarships please let me know ;) you would be my BFF :P Riley Childs Student Asst. Head of IT Services Charlotte United Christian Academy (704) 497-2086 RileyChilds.net Sent from my Windows Phone, please excuse mistakes
Re: [CODE4LIB] College Question!
Yes, definitely get a job on a library service desk! Just circulation is great. Circ is often where patrons go first when they have a question, comment or complaint. As a result, circ people know the collection, what patrons are interested in, and what problems they have, probably better than anyone else in the library. (YMMV, but this is my experience.) With any service-desk job, you'll get a feel for what front-line staff deal with and how they work, and you'll be better equipped to understand and assist with their IT requests. Laura C. Henry, MLS Assistant Systems Librarian Beaufort County Library 311 Scott Street, Beaufort, SC 29902 Phone 843.255.6444 lhe...@bcgov.net www.beaufortcountylibrary.org For Learning ♦ For Leisure ♦ For Life -Original Message- From: Code for Libraries [mailto:CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU] On Behalf Of Sarah Thorngate Sent: Friday, May 30, 2014 1:27 PM To: CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU Subject: Re: [CODE4LIB] College Question! Riley, As an undergrad, I studied music, religion, and English. I got my MLIS after realizing that, out of my three majors, not a single one was employable. If I'd known at the time that I'd enjoy teaching myself to code, I would have just done that and skipped the MLIS. As many people have mentioned, having a broad education is important for librarians. This is especially true if you want the option of working at a smaller school, where job descriptions can be quite broad. At a small school, you'll be much more employable if you have both tech skills and a subject specialization needed by that library. So a liberal arts degree can be a good choice, especially if you pick one that isn't well represented in libraries (i.e., not English or history). But for now I wouldn't worry about choosing a major. Go to a good school that feels like a good fit for you. Get a job at the library, even if it's just circulation. During the first year, take a CS course along with GE courses from a variety of disciplines, then choose your major(s) based on what interests you the most. Sarah On Fri, May 30, 2014 at 9:30 AM, craig boman craig.bo...@gmail.com wrote: I have a BA in Music and the MLIS(union card), starting the Ph.D this fall. Even though an MLIS was not required for my job, I find it incredibly useful to know the language of librarians and be able to serve all the librarians I support to the best of my abilities. Without the MLIS I would feel less able to speak the same jargon/language. And along the same lines as everyone else, I would highly recommend getting the most IT practical experience you can get with the most personal connections you can get in libraries. Attend as many library conferences you can as a student, while its still cheap. And once you get a part-time student IT job, volunteer to do everything you can. Also don't underestimate being a nice guy; having people like you in our customer service/IT type employment is a highly prized commodity. Good luck, Craig Boman, MLIS, BA On Fri, May 30, 2014 at 9:43 AM, scott bacon sdanielba...@gmail.com wrote: I got a BA in Anthropology, made my millions, heh heh, then got my MLS about 10 years later. No, but Karen is right, I constantly use what I learned about cultural anthropology in my job as a librarian. My place of work is currently hiring a library systems administrator and we don’t require an MLS. The upside is that we offer tuition remission for a certain amount of credit hours per semester. So in theory someone could take this job with a bachelor’s in CS or IT or Info Science, learn while on the job, and also take classes to earn an MLS through an online degree program offered at another university we partner with in our state. So it definitely varies by institution. I’d echo the sentiments others have made in this thread by saying get to know what it’s like to work in a library by taking any library job you can find. I’ve known people to spend years and years getting degrees only to find that they didn’t like the job once they started working in the courtroom, cubicle, etc. And I believe the most important thing regarding valuation of employees is the ability and drive to learn new things. Your job duties will probably change significantly within a short amount of time after your hiring, whatever it is you end up doing, so the drive to learn will serve you well no matter what undergrad path you choose. _ Scott Bacon Web Services and Emerging Technologies Librarian Coastal Carolina University On Thu, May 29, 2014 at 2:15 PM, Joshua Welker wel...@ucmo.edu wrote: Yes, experience trumps education completely in my experience as far as developing skills in libraries and technology. Some employers will demand the degree, but it is really of secondary value to hands-on experience. One possibility would be talking to a systems librarian or anyone else at your university whose
Re: [CODE4LIB] College Question!
Hi Riley, My absolute favorite thing about librarianship is that almost everything I have learned has the potential to be useful and I never know what little titbit of knowledge is going to be necessary on any given day. Also, the things I learned in school aren't necessarily the things I need to know - what's really important is that (and yes, this is a cliche) is that I learned how to learn. What systems librarians do today isn't going to be what they'll be doing in 2019 and beyond but a good foundation of knowledge, curiosity about the world, and problem-solving, communication, and interpersonal skills will keep you adapting to all the changes. Whatever you major in, I recommend getting a broad base within general education. Ideally, you'd have the opportunity to fill those GE requirements with stuff other than just survey courses - for example, a class about science fiction versus American Lit 101. And think about your assumptions about classes. You can think, Ugh, why do I have to take a *sociology *class?! or You know, someday I might work somewhere with a lot of people from different backgrounds. Also, don't toss out those papers, presentations, etc. at the end of the semester because you can assemble them into a portfolio of sorts for future job searches. College tours are going to show you the shiny new stuff on campus - dorms, dining halls, rec centers, etc. Look past that and ask students who their favorite teachers are, etc. What kind of access do they have to their professors? How many classes do they have with full-time faculty? Are there teachers with industry experience? What kind of jobs are available for students on campus? Do they have co-op/internship opportunities for students? In the long run that's more important than whether your dorm room has a double bed or an XL-twin. FWIW, my BA is in geophysics and geochemistry with an applied math minor and I also have my MLS, with about 36 additional graduate credits in miscellaneous stuff. Looking back at college, I wish I had continued my language studies past my first year and done a semester or year of study abroad. Also, a few stints in retail were among the most valuable for my professional development because it helped teach me to professionally interact and communicate with a wide variety of people, including a lot of difficult people. Difficult people are everywhere. Ellen Ellen Knowlton Wilson Electronic Resources Librarian Room 250, Marx Library University of South Alabama 5901 USA Drive North Mobile, AL 36688 (251) 460-6045 On Fri, May 30, 2014 at 1:14 PM, Riley Childs rchi...@cucawarriors.com wrote: Want to step in and say thank you, and keep em coming, I enjoy reading about everyone's backgrounds and their journey per se... Riley Childs Student Asst. Head of IT Services Charlotte United Christian Academy (704) 497-2086 RileyChilds.net Sent from my Windows Phone, please excuse mistakes _
Re: [CODE4LIB] College Question!
From: Code for Libraries [CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU] On Behalf Of Laura Krier [laura.kr...@gmail.com] Sent: Thursday, May 29, 2014 1:22 AM To: CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU Subject: Re: [CODE4LIB] College Question! Hi Riley, Congrats on starting college in the fall! If you like to learn, college is pretty much the best place ever. College next fall, but almost there, pretty scary :) I second others in not necessarily recommending a bachelors in library/ information science. I would actually suggest computer science if you're at all skilled with math and logic. You'll probably have the best post-graduate opportunities even if you change your mind about libraries. But make sure you get a well-rounded liberal arts education. Take advantage of gen ed courses to study things outside of your major whenever you can. All people are served well by having a broad base of knowledge, in my opinion. And you'll need solid writing skills no matter what you do in life so make sure you practice those every chance you get. :-) I am meh on liberal arts, my high school is Liberal Arts and I really don't like it Basically, as long as you learn to be a lifelong learner, it doesn't really matter what you major in I think. You'll always have to learn new things anyway. Congratulations again! Laura PS- To more directly answer your question, I majored in literature and women's studies in college. Now I'm a web services librarian. I kind of wish I had a more solid computer science background but I'm still able to learn what I need to. Sent from my iPhone On May 28, 2014, at 9:49 PM, Amy Drayer amost...@gmail.com wrote: Dear Riley et al: I was thinking the same thing as Coral. I have a humanities undergrad degree; a computer science oriented degree would certainly have been beneficial, especially with an emphasis on network and server administration, or even web development depending on your interest (as a systems librarian I also managed the website and catalog). The library-oriented education can wait until grad school. Honestly, I think we come from a variety of backgrounds. My liberal arts foundation works for me (I feel my education was well rounded in a way a science or IT degree may not have been), but I would definitely have wanted some more technical classes such as I mentioned above if I had known I would be in this field. In peace, Amy In peace, Amy M. Drayer, MLIS Senior IT Specialist, Web Developer amost...@gmail.com http://www.puzumaki.com On Wed, May 28, 2014 at 11:24 PM, Coral Sheldon-Hess co...@sheldon-hess.org wrote: Riley, Whatever you do, don't major in library science as an undergrad. Maybe minor in it, along with some other major, if you want, but it's not useful by itself as an undergraduate degree--most libraries want librarians to have the MLIS. And what if you change your mind after a few years and don't want to get the masters? Do something you could get a career in--or work in, part time, to afford the MLIS. If you want to be a systems librarian, why not get a degree in systems engineering or IT? (Seriously, there are degrees in IThttp://www.ccsu.edu/page.cfm?p=332now, what a world!) Computer science wouldn't hurt, if you don't mind theory, and you can get some good foundational stuff that will help with the information science part of libraries and information science. The school where I got my MLIS had an Information Science department that was mostly IT, too. So, that's a possibility. -- Coral Sheldon-Hess http://sheldon-hess.org/coral @web_kunoichi On Wed, May 28, 2014 at 7:17 PM, Riley Childs rchi...@cucawarriors.com wrote: I was curious about the type of degrees people had. I am heading off to college next year (class of 2015) and am trying to figure out what to major in. I want to be a systems librarian, but I can't tell what to major in! I wanted to hear about what paths people took and how they ended up where they are now. BTW Y'All at NC State need a better tour bus driver (not the c4l tour, the admissions tour) ;) the bus ride was like a rickety roller coaster... Also, if you know of any scholarships please let me know ;) you would be my BFF :P Riley Childs Student Asst. Head of IT Services Charlotte United Christian Academy (704) 497-2086 RileyChilds.net Sent from my Windows Phone, please excuse mistakes
Re: [CODE4LIB] College Question!
If you want to be a systems librarian, I wouldn't bother with the MLIS, honestly. Yes, it's still a requirement on a lot of job postings _now_, but more and more that's being dropped from systems roles in lieu of relevant experience. The other sad reality is that an entry level systems librarian position probably makes less than a developer or sysadmin position in the same department. Fwiw, I have no masters in anything, a BA in theatre (the BEST degree, but that's another thread), and have worked in library technology professionally for 20 years (oh, hey there, ravages of time). While not having an MLIS has kept me out of consideration for some jobs in the past, almost all of them just wanted a masters in _something_, which, in that case, get a masters in CS or CE. -Ross. On May 28, 2014 11:18 PM, Riley Childs rchi...@cucawarriors.com wrote: I was curious about the type of degrees people had. I am heading off to college next year (class of 2015) and am trying to figure out what to major in. I want to be a systems librarian, but I can't tell what to major in! I wanted to hear about what paths people took and how they ended up where they are now. BTW Y'All at NC State need a better tour bus driver (not the c4l tour, the admissions tour) ;) the bus ride was like a rickety roller coaster... Also, if you know of any scholarships please let me know ;) you would be my BFF :P Riley Childs Student Asst. Head of IT Services Charlotte United Christian Academy (704) 497-2086 RileyChilds.net Sent from my Windows Phone, please excuse mistakes
Re: [CODE4LIB] College Question!
You could do worse than an undergrad degree in pure math, especially if you're interested in doing hard CS at some point. In general, math gives you lots of good background for things like data and object structures, flow control, etc. Math is also really useful for framing the world as a series of problems to be solved, which is often productive in a work context, especially in areas like application development, tech services, etc. As others have mentioned, undergrad degrees in library science are not particularly useful. You might find an information science degree useful if you're interested in something like data analysis, text mining, hardcore metadata stuff, though. For a systems librarian gig, you might not even need a masters degree in LS or IS -- it depends on the institution -- though having a theoretical understanding of the principles behind library operations can be really handy. In the library jobs sphere, your actual on-the-ground experience ultimately matters a lot more than what it says on your transcript (except for the whole ALA-accredited degree required thing, as applicable). As long as you keep pursuing interesting projects and challenging yourself with the kinds of things that matter to libraries, it almost doesn't matter whether you get an undergrad degree in theater, math, comparative literature, whatever. But if you know the direction you want to go, and it interests you from an academic perspective, it'd be hard to go wrong with something like math, computer engineering, systems engineering, even chemistry. One valuable thing you can try to get through an undergrad degree is the ability to think about problems in some sort of formal way, so any pursuit that gives you a means to do that could be of value. Regarding liberal arts, you'd be surprised at how much a little background in language, history, art, etc., can inform your work in a science or engineering discipline. -dre. On Thu, May 29, 2014 at 7:38 AM, Ross Singer rossfsin...@gmail.com wrote: If you want to be a systems librarian, I wouldn't bother with the MLIS, honestly. Yes, it's still a requirement on a lot of job postings _now_, but more and more that's being dropped from systems roles in lieu of relevant experience. The other sad reality is that an entry level systems librarian position probably makes less than a developer or sysadmin position in the same department. Fwiw, I have no masters in anything, a BA in theatre (the BEST degree, but that's another thread), and have worked in library technology professionally for 20 years (oh, hey there, ravages of time). While not having an MLIS has kept me out of consideration for some jobs in the past, almost all of them just wanted a masters in _something_, which, in that case, get a masters in CS or CE. -Ross. On May 28, 2014 11:18 PM, Riley Childs rchi...@cucawarriors.com wrote: I was curious about the type of degrees people had. I am heading off to college next year (class of 2015) and am trying to figure out what to major in. I want to be a systems librarian, but I can't tell what to major in! I wanted to hear about what paths people took and how they ended up where they are now. BTW Y'All at NC State need a better tour bus driver (not the c4l tour, the admissions tour) ;) the bus ride was like a rickety roller coaster... Also, if you know of any scholarships please let me know ;) you would be my BFF :P Riley Childs Student Asst. Head of IT Services Charlotte United Christian Academy (704) 497-2086 RileyChilds.net Sent from my Windows Phone, please excuse mistakes
Re: [CODE4LIB] College Question!
Riley, First, I wonder if there's anyone on this list who doesn't wish they had your foresight! You already have rare opportunity in that you're thinking about this now and not in your mid-20s, so way to go! We spoke about this a little @ the c4l conference, but I'll say more. I majored in music performance and even did a masters in it as well, which means that practically speaking I have a high school education. :-) I don't really mean that, but until you've had the experience it's difficult to explain (or at least I find it difficult) how relevant a degree in the arts/humanities can be to a job in technology--and there's no shortage of people who have taken this exact path. I did do an MLS, but see above re: high school education. At the time (~13 yrs ago) I felt like I needed to do it to get a job (I also didn't necessarily expect to wind up in systems, but that's another story), but, honestly, everything I know I learned on the job, or /a/ job, or the overnight hours between going to said job, which leads me to my point: Wherever you go to school, and regardless of your major, if you ultimately want to wind up working in a library, you should start now. Any brick and mortar university is going to have student jobs available (work study or otherwise) at the library, and while it may just be as a desk clerk or whatever, keep your ears open (we already know you're not shy): at some point there's going to be some stats that need munging, some Access (or even worse) database that needs migration, some web work to be done, or whatever and, et voilà, you're off! The point is, professional degree != professional experience, and--frankly--you probably don't want to be working at a place that requires a systems librarian to have a MLIS anyway, and certainly not in 4-5 years. Get as much experience as possible, do a CS degree, but also learn how to write and communicate OR do an arts degree, but also learn how to program (etc.), and you'll be fine. -Jon On 05/28/2014 11:17 PM, Riley Childs wrote: I was curious about the type of degrees people had. I am heading off to college next year (class of 2015) and am trying to figure out what to major in. I want to be a systems librarian, but I can't tell what to major in! I wanted to hear about what paths people took and how they ended up where they are now. BTW Y'All at NC State need a better tour bus driver (not the c4l tour, the admissions tour) ;) the bus ride was like a rickety roller coaster... Also, if you know of any scholarships please let me know ;) you would be my BFF :P Riley Childs Student Asst. Head of IT Services Charlotte United Christian Academy (704) 497-2086 RileyChilds.net Sent from my Windows Phone, please excuse mistakes
Re: [CODE4LIB] College Question!
My undergrad degree is in English, and it actually has come in handy at times. Good communication is important, regardless of what you end up doing. If I could do it again, I'd seriously consider informatics - but I didn't know it was a thing until I started library school. http://www.soic.indiana.edu/informatics/ As far as IT, I learned a lot from the tech-support job I had right out of college, and after that I'm self-taught. I imagine it's a steeper learning curve than if I had some sort of tech degree. If you're going for an ML(I)S, major in whatever interests you. Librarians come from all kinds of backgrounds. In my class there were a ton of English and History degrees, but we also had people with degrees in astrophysics, soil science, and accounting. Laura C. Henry, MLS Assistant Systems Librarian Beaufort County Library 311 Scott Street, Beaufort, SC 29902 Phone 843.255.6444 lhe...@bcgov.net www.beaufortcountylibrary.org For Learning ♦ For Leisure ♦ For Life -Original Message- From: Code for Libraries [mailto:CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU] On Behalf Of Amy Drayer Sent: Thursday, May 29, 2014 12:50 AM To: CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU Subject: Re: [CODE4LIB] College Question! Dear Riley et al: I was thinking the same thing as Coral. I have a humanities undergrad degree; a computer science oriented degree would certainly have been beneficial, especially with an emphasis on network and server administration, or even web development depending on your interest (as a systems librarian I also managed the website and catalog). The library-oriented education can wait until grad school. Honestly, I think we come from a variety of backgrounds. My liberal arts foundation works for me (I feel my education was well rounded in a way a science or IT degree may not have been), but I would definitely have wanted some more technical classes such as I mentioned above if I had known I would be in this field. In peace, Amy In peace, Amy M. Drayer, MLIS Senior IT Specialist, Web Developer amost...@gmail.com http://www.puzumaki.com On Wed, May 28, 2014 at 11:24 PM, Coral Sheldon-Hess co...@sheldon-hess.org wrote: Riley, Whatever you do, don't major in library science as an undergrad. Maybe minor in it, along with some other major, if you want, but it's not useful by itself as an undergraduate degree--most libraries want librarians to have the MLIS. And what if you change your mind after a few years and don't want to get the masters? Do something you could get a career in--or work in, part time, to afford the MLIS. If you want to be a systems librarian, why not get a degree in systems engineering or IT? (Seriously, there are degrees in IThttp://www.ccsu.edu/page.cfm?p=332now, what a world!) Computer science wouldn't hurt, if you don't mind theory, and you can get some good foundational stuff that will help with the information science part of libraries and information science. The school where I got my MLIS had an Information Science department that was mostly IT, too. So, that's a possibility. -- Coral Sheldon-Hess http://sheldon-hess.org/coral @web_kunoichi On Wed, May 28, 2014 at 7:17 PM, Riley Childs rchi...@cucawarriors.com wrote: I was curious about the type of degrees people had. I am heading off to college next year (class of 2015) and am trying to figure out what to major in. I want to be a systems librarian, but I can't tell what to major in! I wanted to hear about what paths people took and how they ended up where they are now. BTW Y'All at NC State need a better tour bus driver (not the c4l tour, the admissions tour) ;) the bus ride was like a rickety roller coaster... Also, if you know of any scholarships please let me know ;) you would be my BFF :P Riley Childs Student Asst. Head of IT Services Charlotte United Christian Academy (704) 497-2086 RileyChilds.net Sent from my Windows Phone, please excuse mistakes
Re: [CODE4LIB] College Question!
Riley - Here's my question to you: WHY do you want to be a systems librarian? And even more specifically, why a systems librarian and not just an IT person? What do you think a systems librarian does all day? The title is as varied as other any job title in library world -- I'm a systems librarian and I can name at least half a dozen other system librarians who have wholly different job duties than I do yet we all have the same title. What do you _really_ want to do and not do? Now on to Ross: On Thu, May 29, 2014 at 7:38 AM, Ross Singer rossfsin...@gmail.com wrote: If you want to be a systems librarian, I wouldn't bother with the MLIS, honestly. Yes, it's still a requirement on a lot of job postings _now_, but more and more that's being dropped from systems roles in lieu of relevant experience. I mostly agree with this, but it will vary from market to market and industry to industry. The other sad reality is that an entry level systems librarian position probably makes less than a developer or sysadmin position in the same department. As someone fairly new in the field, and in her first position out of school, it varies from market to market and industry to industry. I'm a systems librarian at a community college in a mid-sized city and I make $62K. Other job postings I've seen have ranged from $35-80K -- but cost of living, location, industry, experience, and more add whether or not you're going to have hookers and blow lifestyle. Fwiw, I have no masters in anything, a BA in theatre (the BEST degree, but that's another thread), and have worked in library technology professionally for 20 years (oh, hey there, ravages of time). While not having an MLIS has kept me out of consideration for some jobs in the past, almost all of them just wanted a masters in _something_, which, in that case, get a masters in CS or CE. To reiterate Ross' point about experience -- I worked as a network engineer for nearly a decade before dumping it all and going back to undergrad and doing a double major in English/Art History, then on to two masters (one in humanities and then my MLIS). I took some unix classes while my first foray into college and loved it as well as some programming classes and hated those. During my networking career, I was working on my CCIE but everything I learned was either self-study or on the job training and experience. I wouldn't have had it any other way. (Interestingly, when I graduated from undergrad, I couldn't get hired for beans in any field I was applying because it was assumed I was going to jump ship back to tech, which wasn't the case.Which is why I went on a Masters obtaining spree. But in the long run, my having two masters means I can command more money in academia so hey, it worked out in the end.) YMMV. -- Lisa M. Rabey | @pnkrcklibrarian http://exitpursuedbyabear.net | http://lisa.rabey.net
Re: [CODE4LIB] College Question!
My advise is to get the broadest possible liberal arts education you can as an undergrad. I went through some big changes in my sophomore year that set me on a mission to seek that path at the University of Michigan, a huge school which, at least in in that era, seemed to be focused on prepping undergrads for their grad school paths. The path I chose was not easy, and the school was little help, although a lot of my profs were very helpful in guiding me. Really, even a surgeon can benefit from Russian lit, a poet can occasionally draw on organic chemistry, and an attorney can build a case for differential equations. Librarians, of course, need to know everything. Cary On Wednesday, May 28, 2014, Riley Childs rchi...@cucawarriors.com wrote: I was curious about the type of degrees people had. I am heading off to college next year (class of 2015) and am trying to figure out what to major in. I want to be a systems librarian, but I can't tell what to major in! I wanted to hear about what paths people took and how they ended up where they are now. BTW Y'All at NC State need a better tour bus driver (not the c4l tour, the admissions tour) ;) the bus ride was like a rickety roller coaster... Also, if you know of any scholarships please let me know ;) you would be my BFF :P Riley Childs Student Asst. Head of IT Services Charlotte United Christian Academy (704) 497-2086 RileyChilds.net Sent from my Windows Phone, please excuse mistakes -- Cary Gordon The Cherry Hill Company http://chillco.com
Re: [CODE4LIB] College Question!
I highly recommend a Physics degree. 1) not as many required courses as engineering so more electives, more opportunities to study the important Russian Literature you might need as a surgeon :) 2) heavy math, heavy computer science but in a solve-a-problem sense, not in a maintain-a-server sense which gets out of date quickly 3) fascinating stuff in class 4) people who graduated with me went on to PhDs but others went on to do MDs, law degrees, and some started work immediately as computer scientists :) Christina, BS, MLS Oh, and adding a BS after your name is fun, too! -Original Message- From: Code for Libraries [mailto:CODE4LIB@listserv.nd.edu] On Behalf Of Riley Childs Sent: Wednesday, May 28, 2014 11:17 PM To: CODE4LIB@listserv.nd.edu Subject: [CODE4LIB] College Question! I was curious about the type of degrees people had. I am heading off to college next year (class of 2015) and am trying to figure out what to major in. I want to be a systems librarian, but I can't tell what to major in! I wanted to hear about what paths people took and how they ended up where they are now. BTW Y'All at NC State need a better tour bus driver (not the c4l tour, the admissions tour) ;) the bus ride was like a rickety roller coaster... Also, if you know of any scholarships please let me know ;) you would be my BFF :P Riley Childs Student Asst. Head of IT Services Charlotte United Christian Academy (704) 497-2086 RileyChilds.net Sent from my Windows Phone, please excuse mistakes
Re: [CODE4LIB] College Question!
I have an undergraduate degree in Mathematics from a college they had a strong liberal arts curriculum. I also took many credits in computer science, religion, philosophy, and communications. Others have said this earlier in this thread, but I highly recommend whatever you do decided to get a degree in, that you make sure you get a well-rounded liberal arts eduction. This is especially helpful in a library setting where you will be interacting with people from all different academic disciplines; Having a little background goes a long way. I'd also recommend a school where you are able to (easily) have significant interaction with full-time faculty and not have many or most of your courses taught by adjuncts or doctoral students. It is not that adjuncts and doctoral students can not be excellent teachers (in fact some of the best professors I have had were adjuncts) but the connections and the help navigating your way into grad school (should you choose to go in that direction after you receive your bachelors degree) will be valuable. If I were to do it all over again and had the resources and grades, I would go to a highly ranked smaller liberal arts college and get a well-rounded education (probably would still major in math) for an undergraduate degree and than go to a highly ranked graduate program at a research university (most likely a PhD program). I guess that isn't much different than I did, except for the PhD part, but my undergrad degree wasn't from the highest ranked school ever, even if it was a good school. FWIW: I also have a MLS and unlike some people, I thought it was an extremely useful and worthwhile degree (but that is another topic). Edward On Thu, May 29, 2014 at 9:16 AM, Pikas, Christina K. christina.pi...@jhuapl.edu wrote: I highly recommend a Physics degree. 1) not as many required courses as engineering so more electives, more opportunities to study the important Russian Literature you might need as a surgeon :) 2) heavy math, heavy computer science but in a solve-a-problem sense, not in a maintain-a-server sense which gets out of date quickly 3) fascinating stuff in class 4) people who graduated with me went on to PhDs but others went on to do MDs, law degrees, and some started work immediately as computer scientists :) Christina, BS, MLS Oh, and adding a BS after your name is fun, too! -Original Message- From: Code for Libraries [mailto:CODE4LIB@listserv.nd.edu] On Behalf Of Riley Childs Sent: Wednesday, May 28, 2014 11:17 PM To: CODE4LIB@listserv.nd.edu Subject: [CODE4LIB] College Question! I was curious about the type of degrees people had. I am heading off to college next year (class of 2015) and am trying to figure out what to major in. I want to be a systems librarian, but I can't tell what to major in! I wanted to hear about what paths people took and how they ended up where they are now. BTW Y'All at NC State need a better tour bus driver (not the c4l tour, the admissions tour) ;) the bus ride was like a rickety roller coaster... Also, if you know of any scholarships please let me know ;) you would be my BFF :P Riley Childs Student Asst. Head of IT Services Charlotte United Christian Academy (704) 497-2086 RileyChilds.net Sent from my Windows Phone, please excuse mistakes
Re: [CODE4LIB] College Question!
I'd echo what others have said and say either CS/CSE or MIS/IT. You might want to make that choice depending on the school you go to--my undergrad's MIS program is fantastic but I know a lot of people weren't as happy with the CS department. I'd also like to +1 what Lisa said about what you want to do as a systems librarian. I worked as a systems librarian in a public library and I most definitely did not need a CS degree, but MIS or IT would have been very useful. Look at job postings, see what sounds like what you want to do, and then go from there. Also see what you like in terms of classes! You might find the CS theory stuff less interesting than more hands-on type IT work, or you might fall in love with Physics (you can always grab a minor in CS, since there's quite a bit of overlap for the gen eds). I also wouldn't completely ignore the liberal arts--if you want to work in libraries, being able to communicate with your co-workers and with patrons is VERY important. While you might get a job that's just IT or programming work all day, more than likely you will have to interact with non-tech people. Being able to coherently express yourself, and being able to break things down for people, is crucial to having a good working relationship with your co-workers. At my public job, I was also the person who more often than not helped patrons with their tech questions, from computer trouble shooting to setting up an iTunes account, to even helping someone build a website once. For the record, I was a history undergrad who took a few CS courses, who then got an MLIS and took a few more CS/IT/Tech courses. I work at a university, which means I have the benefit of being able to take free classes (which I plan to take advantage of to take some MORE CS classes :-D). Good luck! -Maura On Thu, May 29, 2014 at 9:16 AM, Pikas, Christina K. christina.pi...@jhuapl.edu wrote: I highly recommend a Physics degree. 1) not as many required courses as engineering so more electives, more opportunities to study the important Russian Literature you might need as a surgeon :) 2) heavy math, heavy computer science but in a solve-a-problem sense, not in a maintain-a-server sense which gets out of date quickly 3) fascinating stuff in class 4) people who graduated with me went on to PhDs but others went on to do MDs, law degrees, and some started work immediately as computer scientists :) Christina, BS, MLS Oh, and adding a BS after your name is fun, too! -Original Message- From: Code for Libraries [mailto:CODE4LIB@listserv.nd.edu] On Behalf Of Riley Childs Sent: Wednesday, May 28, 2014 11:17 PM To: CODE4LIB@listserv.nd.edu Subject: [CODE4LIB] College Question! I was curious about the type of degrees people had. I am heading off to college next year (class of 2015) and am trying to figure out what to major in. I want to be a systems librarian, but I can't tell what to major in! I wanted to hear about what paths people took and how they ended up where they are now. BTW Y'All at NC State need a better tour bus driver (not the c4l tour, the admissions tour) ;) the bus ride was like a rickety roller coaster... Also, if you know of any scholarships please let me know ;) you would be my BFF :P Riley Childs Student Asst. Head of IT Services Charlotte United Christian Academy (704) 497-2086 RileyChilds.net Sent from my Windows Phone, please excuse mistakes -- Maura Carbone Digital Initiatives Librarian Brandeis University Library and Technology Services (781) 736-4659 415 South Street, (MS 017/P.O. Box 549110) Waltham, MA 02454-9110 email: mau...@brandeis.edu
Re: [CODE4LIB] College Question!
Riley, ’m one of the more over-degreed individuals around here, having a B, M, and now a Dr. all in music, which means I know next to nothing! I do also have masters in information science which *really* means I know next to nothing. Having held a couple of systems librarian jobs, I can truly say that nothing I learned in my 4 degrees in higher education came into any direct use on the job. What your higher education should be is lesson in how to teach yourself, and to understand that learning is never complete nor ever finished. A computer science background might have helped me, but that just means I have a little catching up to do. Thankfully, there are a lot of brilliant people in this community to help me out with that. …adam On May 28, 2014, at 23:17, Riley Childs rchi...@cucawarriors.com wrote: I was curious about the type of degrees people had. I am heading off to college next year (class of 2015) and am trying to figure out what to major in. I want to be a systems librarian, but I can't tell what to major in! I wanted to hear about what paths people took and how they ended up where they are now. BTW Y'All at NC State need a better tour bus driver (not the c4l tour, the admissions tour) ;) the bus ride was like a rickety roller coaster... Also, if you know of any scholarships please let me know ;) you would be my BFF :P Riley Childs Student Asst. Head of IT Services Charlotte United Christian Academy (704) 497-2086 RileyChilds.net Sent from my Windows Phone, please excuse mistakes
Re: [CODE4LIB] College Question!
I have a BS in telecommunications, a minor in CS, and an additional master's in information science. All of which have been extremely helpful in learning programming and usability. However, I believe its worthwhile to also pursue what you're passionate about that aren't related to technology, such as art, music, or literature. I suggest studying something you're truly interested in, and if you have a background in computers, to get a CS or related minor or major. I also agree with others that a bachelor's in library science probably isn't that useful. Also, a lot of institutions offer dual-degree programs where you can concurrently work towards a MLS and another master's degree. Best, Junior Tidal Assistant Professor Web Services and Multimedia Librarian New York City College of Technology, CUNY 300 Jay Street, Rm A434 Brooklyn, NY 11201 718.260.5481 http://library.citytech.cuny.edu Riley Childs rchi...@cucawarriors.com 5/29/2014 1:16 AM I was planing to major in CS or CE, but I am not sure. At c4l I was told by several people to not major in LS, some people said I need a masters from a university, some said an online degree would work. I am really not sure, hopefully more peope will pickup this thread in the morning! Riley Childs Junior IT Admin email: rchi...@cucawarriors.com office: +1 (704) 537-0031 x101 cell: +1 (704) 497-2086 Please Think Before Hitting Reply All I Do Web Design! RileyChilds.net/services From: Code for Libraries [CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU] On Behalf Of Coral Sheldon-Hess [co...@sheldon-hess.org] Sent: Thursday, May 29, 2014 12:24 AM To: CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU Subject: Re: [CODE4LIB] College Question! Riley, Whatever you do, don't major in library science as an undergrad. Maybe minor in it, along with some other major, if you want, but it's not useful by itself as an undergraduate degree--most libraries want librarians to have the MLIS. And what if you change your mind after a few years and don't want to get the masters? Do something you could get a career in--or work in, part time, to afford the MLIS. If you want to be a systems librarian, why not get a degree in systems engineering or IT? (Seriously, there are degrees in IThttp://www.ccsu.edu/page.cfm?p=332now, what a world!) Computer science wouldn't hurt, if you don't mind theory, and you can get some good foundational stuff that will help with the information science part of libraries and information science. The school where I got my MLIS had an Information Science department that was mostly IT, too. So, that's a possibility. -- Coral Sheldon-Hess http://sheldon-hess.org/coral @web_kunoichi On Wed, May 28, 2014 at 7:17 PM, Riley Childs rchi...@cucawarriors.comwrote: I was curious about the type of degrees people had. I am heading off to college next year (class of 2015) and am trying to figure out what to major in. I want to be a systems librarian, but I can't tell what to major in! I wanted to hear about what paths people took and how they ended up where they are now. BTW Y'All at NC State need a better tour bus driver (not the c4l tour, the admissions tour) ;) the bus ride was like a rickety roller coaster... �� Also, if you know of any scholarships please let me know ;) you would be my BFF :P Riley Childs Student Asst. Head of IT Services Charlotte United Christian Academy (704) 497-2086 RileyChilds.net Sent from my Windows Phone, please excuse mistakes
Re: [CODE4LIB] College Question!
I think you'll find tech-oriented librarians come from a variety of backgrounds. What we have in common is a sense of actionable curiosity, and we all seem to enjoy breaking things (I think, because we learn so much putting them back together). My programming background is entirely self-taught. A.S. Galvan Digital Reformatting Specialist Head, Interlibrary Services The Ohio State University Health Sciences Library angela.gal...@osumc.edu -Original Message- From: Code for Libraries [mailto:CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU] On Behalf Of Riley Childs Sent: Thursday, May 29, 2014 1:17 AM To: CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU Subject: Re: [CODE4LIB] College Question! I was planing to major in CS or CE, but I am not sure. At c4l I was told by several people to not major in LS, some people said I need a masters from a university, some said an online degree would work. I am really not sure, hopefully more peope will pickup this thread in the morning! Riley Childs Junior IT Admin email: rchi...@cucawarriors.com office: +1 (704) 537-0031 x101 cell: +1 (704) 497-2086 Please Think Before Hitting Reply All I Do Web Design! RileyChilds.net/services From: Code for Libraries [CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU] On Behalf Of Coral Sheldon-Hess [co...@sheldon-hess.org] Sent: Thursday, May 29, 2014 12:24 AM To: CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU Subject: Re: [CODE4LIB] College Question! Riley, Whatever you do, don't major in library science as an undergrad. Maybe minor in it, along with some other major, if you want, but it's not useful by itself as an undergraduate degree--most libraries want librarians to have the MLIS. And what if you change your mind after a few years and don't want to get the masters? Do something you could get a career in--or work in, part time, to afford the MLIS. If you want to be a systems librarian, why not get a degree in systems engineering or IT? (Seriously, there are degrees in IThttps://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v1/url?u=http://www.ccsu.edu/page.cfm?p%3D332k=ux7ohqYFcw1oDo0gOpSLlw%3D%3D%0Ar=HqiqdHpLzxsCxTpfRs%2BH92aFduchN66GvuvqPRSJHl0%3D%0Am=ZwG%2BuLbfPg7XJb1U2%2Ft2osb15P6XGq0pT4ZmDGPifrE%3D%0As=1c46fbbab48513bdf9ffd4910f8a013f1eefbab1623735277eef3bbc9f3edf31now, what a world!) Computer science wouldn't hurt, if you don't mind theory, and you can get some good foundational stuff that will help with the information science part of libraries and information science. The school where I got my MLIS had an Information Science department that was mostly IT, too. So, that's a possibility. -- Coral Sheldon-Hess https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v1/url?u=http://sheldon-hess.org/coralk=ux7ohqYFcw1oDo0gOpSLlw%3D%3D%0Ar=HqiqdHpLzxsCxTpfRs%2BH92aFduchN66GvuvqPRSJHl0%3D%0Am=ZwG%2BuLbfPg7XJb1U2%2Ft2osb15P6XGq0pT4ZmDGPifrE%3D%0As=efd8c0dbf465e713c7270cf6156e9c88716e6a15267da3c94f6aa058594c6c98 @web_kunoichi On Wed, May 28, 2014 at 7:17 PM, Riley Childs rchi...@cucawarriors.comwrote: I was curious about the type of degrees people had. I am heading off to college next year (class of 2015) and am trying to figure out what to major in. I want to be a systems librarian, but I can't tell what to major in! I wanted to hear about what paths people took and how they ended up where they are now. BTW Y'All at NC State need a better tour bus driver (not the c4l tour, the admissions tour) ;) the bus ride was like a rickety roller coaster... Also, if you know of any scholarships please let me know ;) you would be my BFF :P Riley Childs Student Asst. Head of IT Services Charlotte United Christian Academy (704) 497-2086 RileyChilds.net Sent from my Windows Phone, please excuse mistakes
Re: [CODE4LIB] College Question!
On 29 May 2014 22:44, Jon Stroop jstr...@princeton.edu wrote: Riley, First, I wonder if there's anyone on this list who doesn't wish they had your foresight! You already have rare opportunity in that you're thinking about this now and not in your mid-20s, so way to go! Heh, hear hear. My own background was in IT with a degree in data communications (network engineering, effectively). I did that for about eight years, ending up in management accounting, before deciding to refocus on LIS and taking a Master's degree in it. I second the rest of the advice to get as broad an education as you can. In hiring, I'll generally favour people who have done interesting and varied things throughout their career, as opposed to someone who has laser-like focused on a single field. No position is going to be entirely in the one field, so by diversifying you're going to increase the potential number of positions you're qualified for. Cheers, Craig
Re: [CODE4LIB] College Question!
Riley, I have an BA in Anthropology and Music from a small liberal arts school as well as my MLS and MS in Information Management from Syracuse University While I sometime wish I took the computer science path, there are just as many other times when I'm super grateful for my cultural anthropology background. IMHO, if you are going to build systems that work well you need to understand your user's needs. How the system is going to be part of their lives. Good troubleshooting can benefit from this thinking as well. Studying and watching people in their lives is a big part of cultural anthropology. Being able to know how to do ethnography and put on that hat when building systems has been a godsend. I feel like the another virtue of my liberal arts education was the fact I had to develop general critical thinking and analytical skills which I find invaluable in my career. Whatever you degree you choose to get, get real world practical experience as much as possible. Every internship I've had has been worth its weight in gold. Through one I found out what I DIDN'T want to do which saved me countless $$s and time. Best of luck, Karen On Thu, May 29, 2014 at 8:46 AM, Maura Carbone mau...@brandeis.edu wrote: I'd echo what others have said and say either CS/CSE or MIS/IT. You might want to make that choice depending on the school you go to--my undergrad's MIS program is fantastic but I know a lot of people weren't as happy with the CS department. I'd also like to +1 what Lisa said about what you want to do as a systems librarian. I worked as a systems librarian in a public library and I most definitely did not need a CS degree, but MIS or IT would have been very useful. Look at job postings, see what sounds like what you want to do, and then go from there. Also see what you like in terms of classes! You might find the CS theory stuff less interesting than more hands-on type IT work, or you might fall in love with Physics (you can always grab a minor in CS, since there's quite a bit of overlap for the gen eds). I also wouldn't completely ignore the liberal arts--if you want to work in libraries, being able to communicate with your co-workers and with patrons is VERY important. While you might get a job that's just IT or programming work all day, more than likely you will have to interact with non-tech people. Being able to coherently express yourself, and being able to break things down for people, is crucial to having a good working relationship with your co-workers. At my public job, I was also the person who more often than not helped patrons with their tech questions, from computer trouble shooting to setting up an iTunes account, to even helping someone build a website once. For the record, I was a history undergrad who took a few CS courses, who then got an MLIS and took a few more CS/IT/Tech courses. I work at a university, which means I have the benefit of being able to take free classes (which I plan to take advantage of to take some MORE CS classes :-D). Good luck! -Maura On Thu, May 29, 2014 at 9:16 AM, Pikas, Christina K. christina.pi...@jhuapl.edu wrote: I highly recommend a Physics degree. 1) not as many required courses as engineering so more electives, more opportunities to study the important Russian Literature you might need as a surgeon :) 2) heavy math, heavy computer science but in a solve-a-problem sense, not in a maintain-a-server sense which gets out of date quickly 3) fascinating stuff in class 4) people who graduated with me went on to PhDs but others went on to do MDs, law degrees, and some started work immediately as computer scientists :) Christina, BS, MLS Oh, and adding a BS after your name is fun, too! -Original Message- From: Code for Libraries [mailto:CODE4LIB@listserv.nd.edu] On Behalf Of Riley Childs Sent: Wednesday, May 28, 2014 11:17 PM To: CODE4LIB@listserv.nd.edu Subject: [CODE4LIB] College Question! I was curious about the type of degrees people had. I am heading off to college next year (class of 2015) and am trying to figure out what to major in. I want to be a systems librarian, but I can't tell what to major in! I wanted to hear about what paths people took and how they ended up where they are now. BTW Y'All at NC State need a better tour bus driver (not the c4l tour, the admissions tour) ;) the bus ride was like a rickety roller coaster... Also, if you know of any scholarships please let me know ;) you would be my BFF :P Riley Childs Student Asst. Head of IT Services Charlotte United Christian Academy (704) 497-2086 RileyChilds.net Sent from my Windows Phone, please excuse mistakes -- Maura Carbone Digital Initiatives Librarian Brandeis University Library and Technology Services (781) 736-4659 415 South Street, (MS 017/P.O. Box 549110) Waltham, MA 02454-9110 email: mau...@brandeis.edu
Re: [CODE4LIB] College Question!
Riley, Like many others here, I came from the humanities and stumbled into this line of work. I have BAs in philosophy and religion. There were virtually zero job opportunities with those degrees, so for various reasons I did an MLS program and at the same time got an entry-level IT job, and from there I have just learned through experience and self-teaching. If I could go back, I would definitely have majored in something computer-science related. There are usually (at least) two tracks of computer science offered at schools: the hard computer science that learns about the inner workings of processors, languages, etc, and the applied computer science that focuses on learning how to design software or administer systems. Personally, I would definitely lean towards the applied branch. As a systems librarian, I don't need to know how to write a kernel or anything, I just need to know how to write web apps and actually do stuff with the computer. Also, there is a pretty huge chance that by the time you get to the end of college you will have changed your mind several times about what kind of career you want. A degree related to software development or systems administration pretty much guarantees you job security _forever_ in the event that you are no longer interested in library work. And, as others have stated, under no circumstances should you major in library science as an undergrad. You can't do anything with that degree except library work, so you have effectively pigeonholed yourself in the event that you are not interested in libraries in the future. There is a strong sentiment among many librarians that even the MLS degree is of questionable value, and an undergraduate library science degree is even more questionable. I'd say get an IT- or CS-related bachelor's degree, and later _if_ you are still interested in working in libraries, _consider_ getting an MLS degree. Something to keep in mind is that you make a lot more money in an entry-level programming job with just a BA as you would in an entry-level librarian job with an MLS. At least in the Midwest, programmer salaries typically start in the $50k range, and library jobs pay something in the low $40k range for professional librarian positions and somewhere between $18k - $30k for a paraprofessional staff job. And then you also have to pay off student loans for the MLS. In perspective, my (very cheap) MLS cost about $20,000, and my loan payments for a 10-year payment plan are $240/month or $2880/year. And that is on top of whatever debt you incur as an undergrad. As far as which school, I'd just look for an affordable public university that has smallish class sizes. IMO the big-wig Ivy-League type schools are good for graduate studies because you get to study with leading scholars, but as an undergrad you will probably be taking classes with TAs and adjuncts. The massive amount of debt you will incur at those schools is not worth the extra bit of prestige that will come from your degree. You want a school that has an established program in your field of study and not huge class sizes. Look for somewhere with 3 or more CS profs and class sizes less than 20 if possible. All my best learning in college occurred when I got to interact with my profs, and that is a lot easier when they don't have 100 other students competing for their time. Well this message got long. Sorry for the textwall. Josh Welker Information Technology Librarian James C. Kirkpatrick Library University of Central Missouri Warrensburg, MO 64093 JCKL 2260 660.543.8022 -Original Message- From: Code for Libraries [mailto:CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU] On Behalf Of Riley Childs Sent: Wednesday, May 28, 2014 10:17 PM To: CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU Subject: [CODE4LIB] College Question! I was curious about the type of degrees people had. I am heading off to college next year (class of 2015) and am trying to figure out what to major in. I want to be a systems librarian, but I can't tell what to major in! I wanted to hear about what paths people took and how they ended up where they are now. BTW Y'All at NC State need a better tour bus driver (not the c4l tour, the admissions tour) ;) the bus ride was like a rickety roller coaster... Also, if you know of any scholarships please let me know ;) you would be my BFF :P Riley Childs Student Asst. Head of IT Services Charlotte United Christian Academy (704) 497-2086 RileyChilds.net Sent from my Windows Phone, please excuse mistakes
Re: [CODE4LIB] College Question!
This is a great thread. I've always been impressed every time I read Riley's signature. My hunch is you're in for a great and successful ride, no matter the particular path. Brian Zelip --- MS Student, Graduate School of Library Information Science Graduate Assistant, University Library's Scholarly Commons University of Illinois at Urbana-Champaign zelip.me On Thu, May 29, 2014 at 8:58 AM, Karen Coombs librarywebc...@gmail.com wrote: Riley, I have an BA in Anthropology and Music from a small liberal arts school as well as my MLS and MS in Information Management from Syracuse University While I sometime wish I took the computer science path, there are just as many other times when I'm super grateful for my cultural anthropology background. IMHO, if you are going to build systems that work well you need to understand your user's needs. How the system is going to be part of their lives. Good troubleshooting can benefit from this thinking as well. Studying and watching people in their lives is a big part of cultural anthropology. Being able to know how to do ethnography and put on that hat when building systems has been a godsend. I feel like the another virtue of my liberal arts education was the fact I had to develop general critical thinking and analytical skills which I find invaluable in my career. Whatever you degree you choose to get, get real world practical experience as much as possible. Every internship I've had has been worth its weight in gold. Through one I found out what I DIDN'T want to do which saved me countless $$s and time. Best of luck, Karen On Thu, May 29, 2014 at 8:46 AM, Maura Carbone mau...@brandeis.edu wrote: I'd echo what others have said and say either CS/CSE or MIS/IT. You might want to make that choice depending on the school you go to--my undergrad's MIS program is fantastic but I know a lot of people weren't as happy with the CS department. I'd also like to +1 what Lisa said about what you want to do as a systems librarian. I worked as a systems librarian in a public library and I most definitely did not need a CS degree, but MIS or IT would have been very useful. Look at job postings, see what sounds like what you want to do, and then go from there. Also see what you like in terms of classes! You might find the CS theory stuff less interesting than more hands-on type IT work, or you might fall in love with Physics (you can always grab a minor in CS, since there's quite a bit of overlap for the gen eds). I also wouldn't completely ignore the liberal arts--if you want to work in libraries, being able to communicate with your co-workers and with patrons is VERY important. While you might get a job that's just IT or programming work all day, more than likely you will have to interact with non-tech people. Being able to coherently express yourself, and being able to break things down for people, is crucial to having a good working relationship with your co-workers. At my public job, I was also the person who more often than not helped patrons with their tech questions, from computer trouble shooting to setting up an iTunes account, to even helping someone build a website once. For the record, I was a history undergrad who took a few CS courses, who then got an MLIS and took a few more CS/IT/Tech courses. I work at a university, which means I have the benefit of being able to take free classes (which I plan to take advantage of to take some MORE CS classes :-D). Good luck! -Maura On Thu, May 29, 2014 at 9:16 AM, Pikas, Christina K. christina.pi...@jhuapl.edu wrote: I highly recommend a Physics degree. 1) not as many required courses as engineering so more electives, more opportunities to study the important Russian Literature you might need as a surgeon :) 2) heavy math, heavy computer science but in a solve-a-problem sense, not in a maintain-a-server sense which gets out of date quickly 3) fascinating stuff in class 4) people who graduated with me went on to PhDs but others went on to do MDs, law degrees, and some started work immediately as computer scientists :) Christina, BS, MLS Oh, and adding a BS after your name is fun, too! -Original Message- From: Code for Libraries [mailto:CODE4LIB@listserv.nd.edu] On Behalf Of Riley Childs Sent: Wednesday, May 28, 2014 11:17 PM To: CODE4LIB@listserv.nd.edu Subject: [CODE4LIB] College Question! I was curious about the type of degrees people had. I am heading off to college next year (class of 2015) and am trying to figure out what to major in. I want to be a systems librarian, but I can't tell what to major in! I wanted to hear about what paths people took and how they ended up where they are now. BTW Y'All at NC State need a better tour bus driver (not the c4l tour, the admissions tour) ;) the bus ride was like a rickety
Re: [CODE4LIB] College Question!
Riley, Don't major in Library Science. As an undergrad degree it's worthless and you'll just have to take the same type of courses for a Masters. You'll miss the chance to broaden your skill set. As an undergrad either major in IT, CS, CE or the like and then minor in something in the Humanities. Something with plenty of writing and speaking. Good communication skills are essential in all professional positions. Or you could do the opposite, major in something in the Humanities and minor in something that will cover networks, coding, databases, and so on. As for scholarships, talk to your HS guidance counselor. They often have access to lots of resources. Also talk to the admissions and student aid office at the college, if they want you they'll often be willing to help you. Community colleges often have great resources for scholarship info, if you have access to one take advantage of them. Your local public library may have a strong collection in that area, wouldn't hurt to ask. As a junior you have some time to investigate. It's good you've started school visits. Your local public library or school may offer test prep courses for free. If you are taking the SAT again this Fall it might be worthwhile to take advantage of this. Have fun with the process, its work, but it is exciting, so many possibilities to choose from. Sincerely, David Bigwood dbigw...@hou.usra.edu Lunar and Planetary Institute http://www.lpi.usra.edu/library/ @LPI_Library -Original Message- From: Code for Libraries [mailto:CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU] On Behalf Of Riley Childs Sent: Thursday, May 29, 2014 12:17 AM To: CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU Subject: Re: [CODE4LIB] College Question! I was planing to major in CS or CE, but I am not sure. At c4l I was told by several people to not major in LS, some people said I need a masters from a university, some said an online degree would work. I am really not sure, hopefully more peope will pickup this thread in the morning! Riley Childs Junior IT Admin email: rchi...@cucawarriors.com office: +1 (704) 537-0031 x101 cell: +1 (704) 497-2086
Re: [CODE4LIB] College Question!
I wouldn't knock a liberal arts education, especially based only on high school experience. It's sort of the point of college: to be able to learn and understand about a wide range of fields and subjects. Otherwise you might as well go to trade school. College isn't just about getting a job when you graduate, but about learning how to think and understand different perspectives. And liberal arts includes the sciences, which I think people tend to forget. We think oh, liberal arts are the arts and humanities but they really encompass every school and department in a university. And as other people have mentioned, there are key skills you can learn from courses in English, anthropology, history, philosophy, sociology, etc. This is where you learn to write, to communicate effectively, to understand how people think (user experience, anyone?). These are all crucial skills that separate leaders and those who are more successful in their fields from those who are not. I'm not saying you can ONLY learn these skills in college, from a liberal arts education, but it sure helps. I also don't think there's anything wrong at all with going to a trade school or whatever we call them these days, and learning a skill set outside of the realm of a liberal arts education. It really depends on what you want to do and how fast you want to get to doing it. Laura [image: Laura Krier on about.me] Laura Krier about.me/laurakrier http://about.me/laurakrier On Wed, May 28, 2014 at 11:11 PM, Riley Childs rchi...@cucawarriors.com wrote: From: Code for Libraries [CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU] On Behalf Of Laura Krier [laura.kr...@gmail.com] Sent: Thursday, May 29, 2014 1:22 AM To: CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU Subject: Re: [CODE4LIB] College Question! Hi Riley, Congrats on starting college in the fall! If you like to learn, college is pretty much the best place ever. College next fall, but almost there, pretty scary :) I second others in not necessarily recommending a bachelors in library/ information science. I would actually suggest computer science if you're at all skilled with math and logic. You'll probably have the best post-graduate opportunities even if you change your mind about libraries. But make sure you get a well-rounded liberal arts education. Take advantage of gen ed courses to study things outside of your major whenever you can. All people are served well by having a broad base of knowledge, in my opinion. And you'll need solid writing skills no matter what you do in life so make sure you practice those every chance you get. :-) I am meh on liberal arts, my high school is Liberal Arts and I really don't like it Basically, as long as you learn to be a lifelong learner, it doesn't really matter what you major in I think. You'll always have to learn new things anyway. Congratulations again! Laura PS- To more directly answer your question, I majored in literature and women's studies in college. Now I'm a web services librarian. I kind of wish I had a more solid computer science background but I'm still able to learn what I need to. Sent from my iPhone On May 28, 2014, at 9:49 PM, Amy Drayer amost...@gmail.com wrote: Dear Riley et al: I was thinking the same thing as Coral. I have a humanities undergrad degree; a computer science oriented degree would certainly have been beneficial, especially with an emphasis on network and server administration, or even web development depending on your interest (as a systems librarian I also managed the website and catalog). The library-oriented education can wait until grad school. Honestly, I think we come from a variety of backgrounds. My liberal arts foundation works for me (I feel my education was well rounded in a way a science or IT degree may not have been), but I would definitely have wanted some more technical classes such as I mentioned above if I had known I would be in this field. In peace, Amy In peace, Amy M. Drayer, MLIS Senior IT Specialist, Web Developer amost...@gmail.com http://www.puzumaki.com On Wed, May 28, 2014 at 11:24 PM, Coral Sheldon-Hess co...@sheldon-hess.org wrote: Riley, Whatever you do, don't major in library science as an undergrad. Maybe minor in it, along with some other major, if you want, but it's not useful by itself as an undergraduate degree--most libraries want librarians to have the MLIS. And what if you change your mind after a few years and don't want to get the masters? Do something you could get a career in--or work in, part time, to afford the MLIS. If you want to be a systems librarian, why not get a degree in systems engineering or IT? (Seriously, there are degrees in IThttp://www.ccsu.edu/page.cfm?p=332now, what a world!) Computer science wouldn't hurt, if you don't mind theory, and you can get some good foundational stuff that will help
Re: [CODE4LIB] College Question!
is fantastic but I know a lot of people weren't as happy with the CS department. I'd also like to +1 what Lisa said about what you want to do as a systems librarian. I worked as a systems librarian in a public library and I most definitely did not need a CS degree, but MIS or IT would have been very useful. Look at job postings, see what sounds like what you want to do, and then go from there. Also see what you like in terms of classes! You might find the CS theory stuff less interesting than more hands-on type IT work, or you might fall in love with Physics (you can always grab a minor in CS, since there's quite a bit of overlap for the gen eds). I also wouldn't completely ignore the liberal arts--if you want to work in libraries, being able to communicate with your co-workers and with patrons is VERY important. While you might get a job that's just IT or programming work all day, more than likely you will have to interact with non-tech people. Being able to coherently express yourself, and being able to break things down for people, is crucial to having a good working relationship with your co-workers. At my public job, I was also the person who more often than not helped patrons with their tech questions, from computer trouble shooting to setting up an iTunes account, to even helping someone build a website once. For the record, I was a history undergrad who took a few CS courses, who then got an MLIS and took a few more CS/IT/Tech courses. I work at a university, which means I have the benefit of being able to take free classes (which I plan to take advantage of to take some MORE CS classes :-D). Good luck! -Maura On Thu, May 29, 2014 at 9:16 AM, Pikas, Christina K. christina.pi...@jhuapl.edu wrote: I highly recommend a Physics degree. 1) not as many required courses as engineering so more electives, more opportunities to study the important Russian Literature you might need as a surgeon :) 2) heavy math, heavy computer science but in a solve-a-problem sense, not in a maintain-a-server sense which gets out of date quickly 3) fascinating stuff in class 4) people who graduated with me went on to PhDs but others went on to do MDs, law degrees, and some started work immediately as computer scientists :) Christina, BS, MLS Oh, and adding a BS after your name is fun, too! -Original Message- From: Code for Libraries [mailto:CODE4LIB@listserv.nd.edu] On Behalf Of Riley Childs Sent: Wednesday, May 28, 2014 11:17 PM To: CODE4LIB@listserv.nd.edu Subject: [CODE4LIB] College Question! I was curious about the type of degrees people had. I am heading off to college next year (class of 2015) and am trying to figure out what to major in. I want to be a systems librarian, but I can't tell what to major in! I wanted to hear about what paths people took and how they ended up where they are now. BTW Y'All at NC State need a better tour bus driver (not the c4l tour, the admissions tour) ;) the bus ride was like a rickety roller coaster... Also, if you know of any scholarships please let me know ;) you would be my BFF :P Riley Childs Student Asst. Head of IT Services Charlotte United Christian Academy (704) 497-2086 RileyChilds.net Sent from my Windows Phone, please excuse mistakes -- Maura Carbone Digital Initiatives Librarian Brandeis University Library and Technology Services (781) 736-4659 415 South Street, (MS 017/P.O. Box 549110) Waltham, MA 02454-9110 email: mau...@brandeis.edu
Re: [CODE4LIB] College Question!
I'm super grateful for my cultural anthropology background. IMHO, if you are going to build systems that work well you need to understand your user's needs. How the system is going to be part of their lives. Good troubleshooting can benefit from this thinking as well. Studying and watching people in their lives is a big part of cultural anthropology. Being able to know how to do ethnography and put on that hat when building systems has been a godsend. I feel like the another virtue of my liberal arts education was the fact I had to develop general critical thinking and analytical skills which I find invaluable in my career. Whatever you degree you choose to get, get real world practical experience as much as possible. Every internship I've had has been worth its weight in gold. Through one I found out what I DIDN'T want to do which saved me countless $$s and time. Best of luck, Karen On Thu, May 29, 2014 at 8:46 AM, Maura Carbone mau...@brandeis.edu wrote: I'd echo what others have said and say either CS/CSE or MIS/IT. You might want to make that choice depending on the school you go to--my undergrad's MIS program is fantastic but I know a lot of people weren't as happy with the CS department. I'd also like to +1 what Lisa said about what you want to do as a systems librarian. I worked as a systems librarian in a public library and I most definitely did not need a CS degree, but MIS or IT would have been very useful. Look at job postings, see what sounds like what you want to do, and then go from there. Also see what you like in terms of classes! You might find the CS theory stuff less interesting than more hands-on type IT work, or you might fall in love with Physics (you can always grab a minor in CS, since there's quite a bit of overlap for the gen eds). I also wouldn't completely ignore the liberal arts--if you want to work in libraries, being able to communicate with your co-workers and with patrons is VERY important. While you might get a job that's just IT or programming work all day, more than likely you will have to interact with non-tech people. Being able to coherently express yourself, and being able to break things down for people, is crucial to having a good working relationship with your co-workers. At my public job, I was also the person who more often than not helped patrons with their tech questions, from computer trouble shooting to setting up an iTunes account, to even helping someone build a website once. For the record, I was a history undergrad who took a few CS courses, who then got an MLIS and took a few more CS/IT/Tech courses. I work at a university, which means I have the benefit of being able to take free classes (which I plan to take advantage of to take some MORE CS classes :-D). Good luck! -Maura On Thu, May 29, 2014 at 9:16 AM, Pikas, Christina K. christina.pi...@jhuapl.edu wrote: I highly recommend a Physics degree. 1) not as many required courses as engineering so more electives, more opportunities to study the important Russian Literature you might need as a surgeon :) 2) heavy math, heavy computer science but in a solve-a-problem sense, not in a maintain-a-server sense which gets out of date quickly 3) fascinating stuff in class 4) people who graduated with me went on to PhDs but others went on to do MDs, law degrees, and some started work immediately as computer scientists :) Christina, BS, MLS Oh, and adding a BS after your name is fun, too! -Original Message- From: Code for Libraries [mailto:CODE4LIB@listserv.nd.edu] On Behalf Of Riley Childs Sent: Wednesday, May 28, 2014 11:17 PM To: CODE4LIB@listserv.nd.edu Subject: [CODE4LIB] College Question! I was curious about the type of degrees people had. I am heading off to college next year (class of 2015) and am trying to figure out what to major in. I want to be a systems librarian, but I can't tell what to major in! I wanted to hear about what paths people took and how they ended up where they are now. BTW Y'All at NC State need a better tour bus driver (not the c4l tour, the admissions tour) ;) the bus ride was like a rickety roller coaster... Also, if you know of any scholarships please let me know ;) you would be my BFF :P Riley Childs Student Asst. Head of IT Services Charlotte United Christian Academy (704) 497-2086 RileyChilds.net Sent from my Windows Phone, please excuse mistakes -- Maura Carbone Digital Initiatives Librarian Brandeis University Library and Technology Services (781) 736-4659 415 South Street, (MS 017/P.O. Box 549110) Waltham, MA 02454-9110 email: mau...@brandeis.edu
Re: [CODE4LIB] College Question!
I include science and math in liberal arts. Of course, Greek and Latin are also considered liberal arts essentials, and I wish I had studied them. I also have an MLS, which beyond being a requirement for many jobs, makes it easier to comprehend the conversation. I got mine 10 years into working with libraries. Cary On Thursday, May 29, 2014, Laura Krier laura.kr...@gmail.com wrote: I wouldn't knock a liberal arts education, especially based only on high school experience. It's sort of the point of college: to be able to learn and understand about a wide range of fields and subjects. Otherwise you might as well go to trade school. College isn't just about getting a job when you graduate, but about learning how to think and understand different perspectives. And liberal arts includes the sciences, which I think people tend to forget. We think oh, liberal arts are the arts and humanities but they really encompass every school and department in a university. And as other people have mentioned, there are key skills you can learn from courses in English, anthropology, history, philosophy, sociology, etc. This is where you learn to write, to communicate effectively, to understand how people think (user experience, anyone?). These are all crucial skills that separate leaders and those who are more successful in their fields from those who are not. I'm not saying you can ONLY learn these skills in college, from a liberal arts education, but it sure helps. I also don't think there's anything wrong at all with going to a trade school or whatever we call them these days, and learning a skill set outside of the realm of a liberal arts education. It really depends on what you want to do and how fast you want to get to doing it. Laura [image: Laura Krier on about.me] Laura Krier about.me/laurakrier http://about.me/laurakrier On Wed, May 28, 2014 at 11:11 PM, Riley Childs rchi...@cucawarriors.comjavascript:; wrote: From: Code for Libraries [CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU] On Behalf Of Laura Krier [laura.kr...@gmail.com] Sent: Thursday, May 29, 2014 1:22 AM To: CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU Subject: Re: [CODE4LIB] College Question! Hi Riley, Congrats on starting college in the fall! If you like to learn, college is pretty much the best place ever. College next fall, but almost there, pretty scary :) I second others in not necessarily recommending a bachelors in library/ information science. I would actually suggest computer science if you're at all skilled with math and logic. You'll probably have the best post-graduate opportunities even if you change your mind about libraries. But make sure you get a well-rounded liberal arts education. Take advantage of gen ed courses to study things outside of your major whenever you can. All people are served well by having a broad base of knowledge, in my opinion. And you'll need solid writing skills no matter what you do in life so make sure you practice those every chance you get. :-) I am meh on liberal arts, my high school is Liberal Arts and I really don't like it Basically, as long as you learn to be a lifelong learner, it doesn't really matter what you major in I think. You'll always have to learn new things anyway. Congratulations again! Laura PS- To more directly answer your question, I majored in literature and women's studies in college. Now I'm a web services librarian. I kind of wish I had a more solid computer science background but I'm still able to learn what I need to. Sent from my iPhone On May 28, 2014, at 9:49 PM, Amy Drayer amost...@gmail.com wrote: Dear Riley et al: I was thinking the same thing as Coral. I have a humanities undergrad degree; a computer science oriented degree would certainly have been beneficial, especially with an emphasis on network and server administration, or even web development depending on your interest (as a systems librarian I also managed the website and catalog). The library-oriented education can wait until grad school. Honestly, I think we come from a variety of backgrounds. My liberal arts foundation works for me (I feel my education was well rounded in a way a science or IT degree may not have been), but I would definitely have wanted some more technical classes such as I mentioned above if I had known I would be in this field. In peace, Amy In peace, Amy M. Drayer, MLIS Senior IT Specialist, Web Developer amost...@gmail.com http://www.puzumaki.com On Wed, May 28, 2014 at 11:24 PM, Coral Sheldon-Hess co...@sheldon-hess.org wrote: Riley, Whatever you do, don't major in library science as an undergrad. Maybe minor in it, along with some other major, if you want, but it's not useful by itself as an undergraduate degree--most libraries want
Re: [CODE4LIB] College Question!
Riley, great questions! Everyone, great answers! I guess I'd just add (as another English major who went to a small liberal arts school for undergrad, and who sort of backed into systems and programming) that what I've found really useful about the breadth of education I got kind of breaks down into 3 things: 1) I get cred with people I potentially otherwise wouldn't. I have enough knowledge to be dangerous about a lot of subjects, but it helps faculty see me as someone who knows what I'm talking about. I can speak some of the language of a lot of fields, which then helps those faculty feel comfortable about my expertise (such as it is). So that's really useful. 2) I got used to the idea of seeing problems as complex, large-system things. I have worked with folks who can absolutely bash something together and make it work, but they don't always see the big picture re: how much time/sweat/frustration it's going to cost them 3 years from now, and 5 years from now, etc. when they have to migrate or upgrade or fix up that thing they never really did properly in the first place and then didn't document. This is NOT TO SAY that you can't get that perspective elsewhere, or to allege that I always document or build things properly, etc. It's just a useful perspective to have, and that's where I learned to think that way. 3) If you're a person who learns or explains well through analogies, a broad education that forces you to take classes in a lot of subject areas and brain work types (textual analysis vs. modeling, etc.) will give you TONS more fodder for those analogies. I share the regrets of many others, in that I wish I had taken advantage of the CS curriculum offered at my institution and taken classes in that area when I had the chance. As Adam says, I just have some catching up to do now. I'm really enjoying watching this discussion and seeing where we all came from, academically speaking :) On Thu, May 29, 2014 at 11:27 AM, Cary Gordon listu...@chillco.com wrote: I include science and math in liberal arts. Of course, Greek and Latin are also considered liberal arts essentials, and I wish I had studied them. I also have an MLS, which beyond being a requirement for many jobs, makes it easier to comprehend the conversation. I got mine 10 years into working with libraries. Cary On Thursday, May 29, 2014, Laura Krier laura.kr...@gmail.com wrote: I wouldn't knock a liberal arts education, especially based only on high school experience. It's sort of the point of college: to be able to learn and understand about a wide range of fields and subjects. Otherwise you might as well go to trade school. College isn't just about getting a job when you graduate, but about learning how to think and understand different perspectives. And liberal arts includes the sciences, which I think people tend to forget. We think oh, liberal arts are the arts and humanities but they really encompass every school and department in a university. And as other people have mentioned, there are key skills you can learn from courses in English, anthropology, history, philosophy, sociology, etc. This is where you learn to write, to communicate effectively, to understand how people think (user experience, anyone?). These are all crucial skills that separate leaders and those who are more successful in their fields from those who are not. I'm not saying you can ONLY learn these skills in college, from a liberal arts education, but it sure helps. I also don't think there's anything wrong at all with going to a trade school or whatever we call them these days, and learning a skill set outside of the realm of a liberal arts education. It really depends on what you want to do and how fast you want to get to doing it. Laura [image: Laura Krier on about.me] Laura Krier about.me/laurakrier http://about.me/laurakrier On Wed, May 28, 2014 at 11:11 PM, Riley Childs rchi...@cucawarriors.com javascript:; wrote: From: Code for Libraries [CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU] On Behalf Of Laura Krier [laura.kr...@gmail.com] Sent: Thursday, May 29, 2014 1:22 AM To: CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU Subject: Re: [CODE4LIB] College Question! Hi Riley, Congrats on starting college in the fall! If you like to learn, college is pretty much the best place ever. College next fall, but almost there, pretty scary :) I second others in not necessarily recommending a bachelors in library/ information science. I would actually suggest computer science if you're at all skilled with math and logic. You'll probably have the best post-graduate opportunities even if you change your mind about libraries. But make sure you get a well-rounded liberal arts education. Take advantage of gen ed courses to study things outside of your major whenever you can. All people are served well
Re: [CODE4LIB] College Question!
And say et voilà a lot. D -Original Message- From: Code for Libraries [mailto:CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU] On Behalf Of Jon Stroop Sent: Thursday, May 29, 2014 5:45 AM To: CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU Subject: Re: [CODE4LIB] College Question! Riley, First, I wonder if there's anyone on this list who doesn't wish they had your foresight! You already have rare opportunity in that you're thinking about this now and not in your mid-20s, so way to go! We spoke about this a little @ the c4l conference, but I'll say more. I majored in music performance and even did a masters in it as well, which means that practically speaking I have a high school education. :-) I don't really mean that, but until you've had the experience it's difficult to explain (or at least I find it difficult) how relevant a degree in the arts/humanities can be to a job in technology--and there's no shortage of people who have taken this exact path. I did do an MLS, but see above re: high school education. At the time (~13 yrs ago) I felt like I needed to do it to get a job (I also didn't necessarily expect to wind up in systems, but that's another story), but, honestly, everything I know I learned on the job, or /a/ job, or the overnight hours between going to said job, which leads me to my point: Wherever you go to school, and regardless of your major, if you ultimately want to wind up working in a library, you should start now. Any brick and mortar university is going to have student jobs available (work study or otherwise) at the library, and while it may just be as a desk clerk or whatever, keep your ears open (we already know you're not shy): at some point there's going to be some stats that need munging, some Access (or even worse) database that needs migration, some web work to be done, or whatever and, et voilà, you're off! The point is, professional degree != professional experience, and--frankly--you probably don't want to be working at a place that requires a systems librarian to have a MLIS anyway, and certainly not in 4-5 years. Get as much experience as possible, do a CS degree, but also learn how to write and communicate OR do an arts degree, but also learn how to program (etc.), and you'll be fine. -Jon On 05/28/2014 11:17 PM, Riley Childs wrote: I was curious about the type of degrees people had. I am heading off to college next year (class of 2015) and am trying to figure out what to major in. I want to be a systems librarian, but I can't tell what to major in! I wanted to hear about what paths people took and how they ended up where they are now. BTW Y'All at NC State need a better tour bus driver (not the c4l tour, the admissions tour) ;) the bus ride was like a rickety roller coaster... Also, if you know of any scholarships please let me know ;) you would be my BFF :P Riley Childs Student Asst. Head of IT Services Charlotte United Christian Academy (704) 497-2086 RileyChilds.net Sent from my Windows Phone, please excuse mistakes
Re: [CODE4LIB] College Question!
Hi - I'm also an English undergrad. This was after miserably failing out of a Math/CS program (although I learned a lot). The English degree forced me to write a lot while in college - a time when one's mind needs some expanding lest it get caught in ruts. This helped my communication skills immensely. Despite what Giarlo says. I also agree that a background in informatics is going to be really helpful in the years to come. We are awash in data, yet little of it has the semantics needed to automate the extraction of meaning. I think there are going to be many years of smart people plowing meaning back into the data sets that we're struggling to put away at the bit level now, and I think it sounds like fun work. Another common thread I agree with, and one my kids have heard since they were in diapers, is GET A JOB! Especially in the area you think you're interested in. You'll learn more practical things there than in any class. You may suck at it at first, but hey, they're paying you anyway! If you like doing it, you'll get better, build your resume, and be better able to see if it's something you want to do long term. Year later, after working in corporate IT for a while and getting sick of my profession being treated like an expendable commodity, I went back and got an MBA to better understand business - and learned that corporate IT is an expendable commodity... I wasn't really OK with that, so I came back to academia to do more meaningful work for far less money ;) With the MBA, I was able to come back at a director level and influence change, so that's kinda cool. Good job getting ahead of this! You're a neat person and I appreciate what you do for the community! Declan -Original Message- From: Code for Libraries [mailto:CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU] On Behalf Of Henry, Laura Sent: Thursday, May 29, 2014 5:51 AM To: CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU Subject: Re: [CODE4LIB] College Question! My undergrad degree is in English, and it actually has come in handy at times. Good communication is important, regardless of what you end up doing. If I could do it again, I'd seriously consider informatics - but I didn't know it was a thing until I started library school. http://www.soic.indiana.edu/informatics/ As far as IT, I learned a lot from the tech-support job I had right out of college, and after that I'm self-taught. I imagine it's a steeper learning curve than if I had some sort of tech degree. If you're going for an ML(I)S, major in whatever interests you. Librarians come from all kinds of backgrounds. In my class there were a ton of English and History degrees, but we also had people with degrees in astrophysics, soil science, and accounting. Laura C. Henry, MLS Assistant Systems Librarian Beaufort County Library 311 Scott Street, Beaufort, SC 29902 Phone 843.255.6444 lhe...@bcgov.net www.beaufortcountylibrary.org For Learning ♦ For Leisure ♦ For Life -Original Message- From: Code for Libraries [mailto:CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU] On Behalf Of Amy Drayer Sent: Thursday, May 29, 2014 12:50 AM To: CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU Subject: Re: [CODE4LIB] College Question! Dear Riley et al: I was thinking the same thing as Coral. I have a humanities undergrad degree; a computer science oriented degree would certainly have been beneficial, especially with an emphasis on network and server administration, or even web development depending on your interest (as a systems librarian I also managed the website and catalog). The library-oriented education can wait until grad school. Honestly, I think we come from a variety of backgrounds. My liberal arts foundation works for me (I feel my education was well rounded in a way a science or IT degree may not have been), but I would definitely have wanted some more technical classes such as I mentioned above if I had known I would be in this field. In peace, Amy In peace, Amy M. Drayer, MLIS Senior IT Specialist, Web Developer amost...@gmail.com http://www.puzumaki.com On Wed, May 28, 2014 at 11:24 PM, Coral Sheldon-Hess co...@sheldon-hess.org wrote: Riley, Whatever you do, don't major in library science as an undergrad. Maybe minor in it, along with some other major, if you want, but it's not useful by itself as an undergraduate degree--most libraries want librarians to have the MLIS. And what if you change your mind after a few years and don't want to get the masters? Do something you could get a career in--or work in, part time, to afford the MLIS. If you want to be a systems librarian, why not get a degree in systems engineering or IT? (Seriously, there are degrees in IThttp://www.ccsu.edu/page.cfm?p=332now, what a world!) Computer science wouldn't hurt, if you don't mind theory, and you can get some good foundational stuff that will help with the information science part of libraries and information science. The school where I got my MLIS had an Information
Re: [CODE4LIB] College Question!
Yes, experience trumps education completely in my experience as far as developing skills in libraries and technology. Some employers will demand the degree, but it is really of secondary value to hands-on experience. One possibility would be talking to a systems librarian or anyone else at your university whose job interests you and explain to them that you are looking for some mentoring and experience. It is quite likely that they could whip up a student worker position just for you. At least I know I would if a student approached me that way. All the libraries where I've worked have had fairly free reign with student worker hours. Chances are you are going to end up doing some kind of student work position anyway, so you might as well use it learning something valuable rather than raking leaves or cooking pizza. Josh Welker -Original Message- From: Code for Libraries [mailto:CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU] On Behalf Of Fleming, Declan Sent: Thursday, May 29, 2014 1:05 PM To: CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU Subject: Re: [CODE4LIB] College Question! Hi - I'm also an English undergrad. This was after miserably failing out of a Math/CS program (although I learned a lot). The English degree forced me to write a lot while in college - a time when one's mind needs some expanding lest it get caught in ruts. This helped my communication skills immensely. Despite what Giarlo says. I also agree that a background in informatics is going to be really helpful in the years to come. We are awash in data, yet little of it has the semantics needed to automate the extraction of meaning. I think there are going to be many years of smart people plowing meaning back into the data sets that we're struggling to put away at the bit level now, and I think it sounds like fun work. Another common thread I agree with, and one my kids have heard since they were in diapers, is GET A JOB! Especially in the area you think you're interested in. You'll learn more practical things there than in any class. You may suck at it at first, but hey, they're paying you anyway! If you like doing it, you'll get better, build your resume, and be better able to see if it's something you want to do long term. Year later, after working in corporate IT for a while and getting sick of my profession being treated like an expendable commodity, I went back and got an MBA to better understand business - and learned that corporate IT is an expendable commodity... I wasn't really OK with that, so I came back to academia to do more meaningful work for far less money ;) With the MBA, I was able to come back at a director level and influence change, so that's kinda cool. Good job getting ahead of this! You're a neat person and I appreciate what you do for the community! Declan -Original Message- From: Code for Libraries [mailto:CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU] On Behalf Of Henry, Laura Sent: Thursday, May 29, 2014 5:51 AM To: CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU Subject: Re: [CODE4LIB] College Question! My undergrad degree is in English, and it actually has come in handy at times. Good communication is important, regardless of what you end up doing. If I could do it again, I'd seriously consider informatics - but I didn't know it was a thing until I started library school. http://www.soic.indiana.edu/informatics/ As far as IT, I learned a lot from the tech-support job I had right out of college, and after that I'm self-taught. I imagine it's a steeper learning curve than if I had some sort of tech degree. If you're going for an ML(I)S, major in whatever interests you. Librarians come from all kinds of backgrounds. In my class there were a ton of English and History degrees, but we also had people with degrees in astrophysics, soil science, and accounting. Laura C. Henry, MLS Assistant Systems Librarian Beaufort County Library 311 Scott Street, Beaufort, SC 29902 Phone 843.255.6444 lhe...@bcgov.net www.beaufortcountylibrary.org For Learning ♦ For Leisure ♦ For Life -Original Message- From: Code for Libraries [mailto:CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU] On Behalf Of Amy Drayer Sent: Thursday, May 29, 2014 12:50 AM To: CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU Subject: Re: [CODE4LIB] College Question! Dear Riley et al: I was thinking the same thing as Coral. I have a humanities undergrad degree; a computer science oriented degree would certainly have been beneficial, especially with an emphasis on network and server administration, or even web development depending on your interest (as a systems librarian I also managed the website and catalog). The library-oriented education can wait until grad school. Honestly, I think we come from a variety of backgrounds. My liberal arts foundation works for me (I feel my education was well rounded in a way a science or IT degree may not have been), but I would definitely have wanted some more technical classes such as I mentioned above if I had known I would be in this field. In peace, Amy In peace, Amy M. Drayer, MLIS
Re: [CODE4LIB] College Question!
I'd like to second Jon's suggestions. I majored in political science and worked in the library because my dad suggested it (damn him), and after graduation I took a full time job there for two years. There I learned a lot about desktop management, HTML, some PHP, serials, systems, electronic resources, etc. That experience got me great internships at Duke when I went to library school; I did reference, expanded my knowledge of the web, learned more about electronic resources, and serials. And that led to a job at a software vendor where I again got to expand my knowledge about systems work, perl, well you see where this is going. I truly believe that my experience in undergrad put me on the path to where I am today. So I give ++ to getting a job in your university library. I'd also like to suggest that when you choose a college you let us all know, you never know, there may be someone on this list that would be happy to hire an ambitious freshman to work for them. On Thu, May 29, 2014 at 5:44 AM, Jon Stroop jstr...@princeton.edu wrote: Riley, First, I wonder if there's anyone on this list who doesn't wish they had your foresight! You already have rare opportunity in that you're thinking about this now and not in your mid-20s, so way to go! We spoke about this a little @ the c4l conference, but I'll say more. I majored in music performance and even did a masters in it as well, which means that practically speaking I have a high school education. :-) I don't really mean that, but until you've had the experience it's difficult to explain (or at least I find it difficult) how relevant a degree in the arts/humanities can be to a job in technology--and there's no shortage of people who have taken this exact path. I did do an MLS, but see above re: high school education. At the time (~13 yrs ago) I felt like I needed to do it to get a job (I also didn't necessarily expect to wind up in systems, but that's another story), but, honestly, everything I know I learned on the job, or /a/ job, or the overnight hours between going to said job, which leads me to my point: Wherever you go to school, and regardless of your major, if you ultimately want to wind up working in a library, you should start now. Any brick and mortar university is going to have student jobs available (work study or otherwise) at the library, and while it may just be as a desk clerk or whatever, keep your ears open (we already know you're not shy): at some point there's going to be some stats that need munging, some Access (or even worse) database that needs migration, some web work to be done, or whatever and, et voilà, you're off! The point is, professional degree != professional experience, and--frankly--you probably don't want to be working at a place that requires a systems librarian to have a MLIS anyway, and certainly not in 4-5 years. Get as much experience as possible, do a CS degree, but also learn how to write and communicate OR do an arts degree, but also learn how to program (etc.), and you'll be fine. -Jon On 05/28/2014 11:17 PM, Riley Childs wrote: I was curious about the type of degrees people had. I am heading off to college next year (class of 2015) and am trying to figure out what to major in. I want to be a systems librarian, but I can't tell what to major in! I wanted to hear about what paths people took and how they ended up where they are now. BTW Y'All at NC State need a better tour bus driver (not the c4l tour, the admissions tour) ;) the bus ride was like a rickety roller coaster... Also, if you know of any scholarships please let me know ;) you would be my BFF :P Riley Childs Student Asst. Head of IT Services Charlotte United Christian Academy (704) 497-2086 RileyChilds.net Sent from my Windows Phone, please excuse mistakes
Re: [CODE4LIB] College Question!
able to break things down for people, is crucial to having a good working relationship with your co-workers. At my public job, I was also the person who more often than not helped patrons with their tech questions, from computer trouble shooting to setting up an iTunes account, to even helping someone build a website once. For the record, I was a history undergrad who took a few CS courses, who then got an MLIS and took a few more CS/IT/Tech courses. I work at a university, which means I have the benefit of being able to take free classes (which I plan to take advantage of to take some MORE CS classes :-D). Good luck! -Maura On Thu, May 29, 2014 at 9:16 AM, Pikas, Christina K. christina.pi...@jhuapl.edu wrote: I highly recommend a Physics degree. 1) not as many required courses as engineering so more electives, more opportunities to study the important Russian Literature you might need as a surgeon :) 2) heavy math, heavy computer science but in a solve-a-problem sense, not in a maintain-a-server sense which gets out of date quickly 3) fascinating stuff in class 4) people who graduated with me went on to PhDs but others went on to do MDs, law degrees, and some started work immediately as computer scientists :) Christina, BS, MLS Oh, and adding a BS after your name is fun, too! -Original Message- From: Code for Libraries [mailto:CODE4LIB@listserv.nd.edu] On Behalf Of Riley Childs Sent: Wednesday, May 28, 2014 11:17 PM To: CODE4LIB@listserv.nd.edu Subject: [CODE4LIB] College Question! I was curious about the type of degrees people had. I am heading off to college next year (class of 2015) and am trying to figure out what to major in. I want to be a systems librarian, but I can't tell what to major in! I wanted to hear about what paths people took and how they ended up where they are now. BTW Y'All at NC State need a better tour bus driver (not the c4l tour, the admissions tour) ;) the bus ride was like a rickety roller coaster... Also, if you know of any scholarships please let me know ;) you would be my BFF :P Riley Childs Student Asst. Head of IT Services Charlotte United Christian Academy (704) 497-2086 RileyChilds.net Sent from my Windows Phone, please excuse mistakes -- Maura Carbone Digital Initiatives Librarian Brandeis University Library and Technology Services (781) 736-4659 415 South Street, (MS 017/P.O. Box 549110) Waltham, MA 02454-9110 email: mau...@brandeis.edu
Re: [CODE4LIB] College Question!
On May 28, 2014, at 11:17 PM, Riley Childs wrote: I was curious about the type of degrees people had. I am heading off to college next year (class of 2015) and am trying to figure out what to major in. I want to be a systems librarian, but I can't tell what to major in! I wanted to hear about what paths people took and how they ended up where they are now. What paths we took? Well, I'm in the mood for procrastinating, so here goes. ... Mine started well before college. My dad got our family a computer (Apple IIe) when I was in 3rd or 4th grade ... so I learned Basic back in the days when you'd copy program listings from magazines. In middle school, I learned Logo, and in 8th grade was a aide for the computer lab. One summer I went to a two week camp, and learned Pascal, and the difference between Basic and Basica. During this time, my mom worked for a computer company, and we upgraded to a Apple ][gs. My high school was a 'science and tech' school. I had 2.5 years of drafting, 2 years of commercial graphics, and by senior year I was working as a TA in the computer lab, and had an independent study in the school's print shop. Through this time, we upgraded to a Macintosh SE/30 and then a Macintosh IIci. For summers in high school, I was working as an intern for an office of the Department of Defense (my dad was military), and I learned a few other OSes, including ALIS (a window manager for Sun UNIX boxes). I was also calling into BBSes quite regularly (had started back in middle school w/ a 1200 baud modem). In college, I had planned to work towards a degree in Architectural Engineering, but my dad taught at a school that didn't offer it ... so I started a degree in Civil Engineering. After my freshman year, I started working in the university's academic computing center. (They managed the computer labs the general use UNIX CMS machines). I started off doing general helpdesk support, but by my junior year that whole 'world wide web' thing was getting popular. As I had experience with computer programming, databases, desktop publishing, graphics, etc ... so I ended up splitting my time between the helpdesk, and the newly formed 'web development team' ... which was two of us (both students), working half time. And I was getting to be a fairly fast typist from mudding. After my sophomore year, Tim, the other member of our 'web development team' graduated, and went to work full time, while I was half time. We grew to four people (3 half time, as we were full time students), and we did some cutting edge stuff to get all of the university's course information online (required parsing quark xpress files to generate HTML, parsing dumps from the university's course registration system, and generating HTML, etc) ... and so Tim got offered a job to go work for Harvard. Through this time, I helped out on the university's solar car team, and got distracted and never got around to switching to a school for architecture. I ended up taking over in managing the university's web server while they tried to find a new manager for our group. (this was back when 'webmaster' meant 'web server administrator' and not 'person who designs web pages') I learned Perl, to go along with the various shell scripting that I had already learned. I picked up the 'UNIX System Administration Handbook' and learned from our group's sysadmins until I was trusted to manage that server. While all of this was going on, as I had taken enough classes to be 1/2 a semester off from my classmates, I never realized that I was supposed to take the EIT (Engineer in Training test) ... so I was a bit screwed if I wanted to be an engineer. After graduation, I went to resign, as I wanted to look for a full time job, but the director said that they were putting in for a new position for me. By the middle of summer, my new manager told me that the director had told her that under no circumstances was she to hire me for the job that was being created. He really didn't like guys with long hair. ... but through this time, I spent some of my savings to help one of the folks on the mud to start an ISP (so they could host the mud which was getting kicked out of the university it was at). I was working as their webmaster, remotely. After all of this crap went down at my university, I got offered to do some contract work at that ISP, so I moved out to Kentucky. The first contract fell through, but I kept doing various coding projects for them, did tech support (phone and still the days when we'd drive out to people's houses to set up their modems). I learned mysql in the process. The contracting side of our company merged with another contracting company, but then everything fell through ... and oddly I was the only employee that suddenly found themselves working for a different company. Through this time, I did mostly web database work ... the ISP that I worked for
[CODE4LIB] College Question!
I was curious about the type of degrees people had. I am heading off to college next year (class of 2015) and am trying to figure out what to major in. I want to be a systems librarian, but I can't tell what to major in! I wanted to hear about what paths people took and how they ended up where they are now. BTW Y'All at NC State need a better tour bus driver (not the c4l tour, the admissions tour) ;) the bus ride was like a rickety roller coaster... Also, if you know of any scholarships please let me know ;) you would be my BFF :P Riley Childs Student Asst. Head of IT Services Charlotte United Christian Academy (704) 497-2086 RileyChilds.net Sent from my Windows Phone, please excuse mistakes
Re: [CODE4LIB] College Question!
http://sils.unc.edu/programs/undergraduate -t On 5/28/14, 11:17 PM, Riley Childs rchi...@cucawarriors.com wrote: I was curious about the type of degrees people had. I am heading off to college next year (class of 2015) and am trying to figure out what to major in. I want to be a systems librarian, but I can't tell what to major in! I wanted to hear about what paths people took and how they ended up where they are now. BTW Y'All at NC State need a better tour bus driver (not the c4l tour, the admissions tour) ;) the bus ride was like a rickety roller coaster... Also, if you know of any scholarships please let me know ;) you would be my BFF :P Riley Childs Student Asst. Head of IT Services Charlotte United Christian Academy (704) 497-2086 RileyChilds.net Sent from my Windows Phone, please excuse mistakes
Re: [CODE4LIB] College Question!
Riley, Whatever you do, don't major in library science as an undergrad. Maybe minor in it, along with some other major, if you want, but it's not useful by itself as an undergraduate degree--most libraries want librarians to have the MLIS. And what if you change your mind after a few years and don't want to get the masters? Do something you could get a career in--or work in, part time, to afford the MLIS. If you want to be a systems librarian, why not get a degree in systems engineering or IT? (Seriously, there are degrees in IThttp://www.ccsu.edu/page.cfm?p=332now, what a world!) Computer science wouldn't hurt, if you don't mind theory, and you can get some good foundational stuff that will help with the information science part of libraries and information science. The school where I got my MLIS had an Information Science department that was mostly IT, too. So, that's a possibility. -- Coral Sheldon-Hess http://sheldon-hess.org/coral @web_kunoichi On Wed, May 28, 2014 at 7:17 PM, Riley Childs rchi...@cucawarriors.comwrote: I was curious about the type of degrees people had. I am heading off to college next year (class of 2015) and am trying to figure out what to major in. I want to be a systems librarian, but I can't tell what to major in! I wanted to hear about what paths people took and how they ended up where they are now. BTW Y'All at NC State need a better tour bus driver (not the c4l tour, the admissions tour) ;) the bus ride was like a rickety roller coaster... Also, if you know of any scholarships please let me know ;) you would be my BFF :P Riley Childs Student Asst. Head of IT Services Charlotte United Christian Academy (704) 497-2086 RileyChilds.net Sent from my Windows Phone, please excuse mistakes
Re: [CODE4LIB] College Question!
Dear Riley et al: I was thinking the same thing as Coral. I have a humanities undergrad degree; a computer science oriented degree would certainly have been beneficial, especially with an emphasis on network and server administration, or even web development depending on your interest (as a systems librarian I also managed the website and catalog). The library-oriented education can wait until grad school. Honestly, I think we come from a variety of backgrounds. My liberal arts foundation works for me (I feel my education was well rounded in a way a science or IT degree may not have been), but I would definitely have wanted some more technical classes such as I mentioned above if I had known I would be in this field. In peace, Amy In peace, Amy M. Drayer, MLIS Senior IT Specialist, Web Developer amost...@gmail.com http://www.puzumaki.com On Wed, May 28, 2014 at 11:24 PM, Coral Sheldon-Hess co...@sheldon-hess.org wrote: Riley, Whatever you do, don't major in library science as an undergrad. Maybe minor in it, along with some other major, if you want, but it's not useful by itself as an undergraduate degree--most libraries want librarians to have the MLIS. And what if you change your mind after a few years and don't want to get the masters? Do something you could get a career in--or work in, part time, to afford the MLIS. If you want to be a systems librarian, why not get a degree in systems engineering or IT? (Seriously, there are degrees in IThttp://www.ccsu.edu/page.cfm?p=332now, what a world!) Computer science wouldn't hurt, if you don't mind theory, and you can get some good foundational stuff that will help with the information science part of libraries and information science. The school where I got my MLIS had an Information Science department that was mostly IT, too. So, that's a possibility. -- Coral Sheldon-Hess http://sheldon-hess.org/coral @web_kunoichi On Wed, May 28, 2014 at 7:17 PM, Riley Childs rchi...@cucawarriors.com wrote: I was curious about the type of degrees people had. I am heading off to college next year (class of 2015) and am trying to figure out what to major in. I want to be a systems librarian, but I can't tell what to major in! I wanted to hear about what paths people took and how they ended up where they are now. BTW Y'All at NC State need a better tour bus driver (not the c4l tour, the admissions tour) ;) the bus ride was like a rickety roller coaster... Also, if you know of any scholarships please let me know ;) you would be my BFF :P Riley Childs Student Asst. Head of IT Services Charlotte United Christian Academy (704) 497-2086 RileyChilds.net Sent from my Windows Phone, please excuse mistakes
Re: [CODE4LIB] College Question!
I was planing to major in CS or CE, but I am not sure. At c4l I was told by several people to not major in LS, some people said I need a masters from a university, some said an online degree would work. I am really not sure, hopefully more peope will pickup this thread in the morning! Riley Childs Junior IT Admin email: rchi...@cucawarriors.com office: +1 (704) 537-0031 x101 cell: +1 (704) 497-2086 Please Think Before Hitting Reply All I Do Web Design! RileyChilds.net/services From: Code for Libraries [CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU] On Behalf Of Coral Sheldon-Hess [co...@sheldon-hess.org] Sent: Thursday, May 29, 2014 12:24 AM To: CODE4LIB@LISTSERV.ND.EDU Subject: Re: [CODE4LIB] College Question! Riley, Whatever you do, don't major in library science as an undergrad. Maybe minor in it, along with some other major, if you want, but it's not useful by itself as an undergraduate degree--most libraries want librarians to have the MLIS. And what if you change your mind after a few years and don't want to get the masters? Do something you could get a career in--or work in, part time, to afford the MLIS. If you want to be a systems librarian, why not get a degree in systems engineering or IT? (Seriously, there are degrees in IThttp://www.ccsu.edu/page.cfm?p=332now, what a world!) Computer science wouldn't hurt, if you don't mind theory, and you can get some good foundational stuff that will help with the information science part of libraries and information science. The school where I got my MLIS had an Information Science department that was mostly IT, too. So, that's a possibility. -- Coral Sheldon-Hess http://sheldon-hess.org/coral @web_kunoichi On Wed, May 28, 2014 at 7:17 PM, Riley Childs rchi...@cucawarriors.comwrote: I was curious about the type of degrees people had. I am heading off to college next year (class of 2015) and am trying to figure out what to major in. I want to be a systems librarian, but I can't tell what to major in! I wanted to hear about what paths people took and how they ended up where they are now. BTW Y'All at NC State need a better tour bus driver (not the c4l tour, the admissions tour) ;) the bus ride was like a rickety roller coaster... Also, if you know of any scholarships please let me know ;) you would be my BFF :P Riley Childs Student Asst. Head of IT Services Charlotte United Christian Academy (704) 497-2086 RileyChilds.net Sent from my Windows Phone, please excuse mistakes
Re: [CODE4LIB] College Question!
Hi Riley, Congrats on starting college in the fall! If you like to learn, college is pretty much the best place ever. I second others in not necessarily recommending a bachelors in library/ information science. I would actually suggest computer science if you're at all skilled with math and logic. You'll probably have the best post-graduate opportunities even if you change your mind about libraries. But make sure you get a well-rounded liberal arts education. Take advantage of gen ed courses to study things outside of your major whenever you can. All people are served well by having a broad base of knowledge, in my opinion. And you'll need solid writing skills no matter what you do in life so make sure you practice those every chance you get. :-) Basically, as long as you learn to be a lifelong learner, it doesn't really matter what you major in I think. You'll always have to learn new things anyway. Congratulations again! Laura PS- To more directly answer your question, I majored in literature and women's studies in college. Now I'm a web services librarian. I kind of wish I had a more solid computer science background but I'm still able to learn what I need to. Sent from my iPhone On May 28, 2014, at 9:49 PM, Amy Drayer amost...@gmail.com wrote: Dear Riley et al: I was thinking the same thing as Coral. I have a humanities undergrad degree; a computer science oriented degree would certainly have been beneficial, especially with an emphasis on network and server administration, or even web development depending on your interest (as a systems librarian I also managed the website and catalog). The library-oriented education can wait until grad school. Honestly, I think we come from a variety of backgrounds. My liberal arts foundation works for me (I feel my education was well rounded in a way a science or IT degree may not have been), but I would definitely have wanted some more technical classes such as I mentioned above if I had known I would be in this field. In peace, Amy In peace, Amy M. Drayer, MLIS Senior IT Specialist, Web Developer amost...@gmail.com http://www.puzumaki.com On Wed, May 28, 2014 at 11:24 PM, Coral Sheldon-Hess co...@sheldon-hess.org wrote: Riley, Whatever you do, don't major in library science as an undergrad. Maybe minor in it, along with some other major, if you want, but it's not useful by itself as an undergraduate degree--most libraries want librarians to have the MLIS. And what if you change your mind after a few years and don't want to get the masters? Do something you could get a career in--or work in, part time, to afford the MLIS. If you want to be a systems librarian, why not get a degree in systems engineering or IT? (Seriously, there are degrees in IThttp://www.ccsu.edu/page.cfm?p=332now, what a world!) Computer science wouldn't hurt, if you don't mind theory, and you can get some good foundational stuff that will help with the information science part of libraries and information science. The school where I got my MLIS had an Information Science department that was mostly IT, too. So, that's a possibility. -- Coral Sheldon-Hess http://sheldon-hess.org/coral @web_kunoichi On Wed, May 28, 2014 at 7:17 PM, Riley Childs rchi...@cucawarriors.com wrote: I was curious about the type of degrees people had. I am heading off to college next year (class of 2015) and am trying to figure out what to major in. I want to be a systems librarian, but I can't tell what to major in! I wanted to hear about what paths people took and how they ended up where they are now. BTW Y'All at NC State need a better tour bus driver (not the c4l tour, the admissions tour) ;) the bus ride was like a rickety roller coaster... Also, if you know of any scholarships please let me know ;) you would be my BFF :P Riley Childs Student Asst. Head of IT Services Charlotte United Christian Academy (704) 497-2086 RileyChilds.net Sent from my Windows Phone, please excuse mistakes
Re: [CODE4LIB] College Question!
Riley, I'm also a humanities darling , and I'm completely self-taught on the IT front (Lynda.com and the Head First books are a godsend if you're going that route). Web Development and Systems Administration are two big areas to think about specializing in. My systems librarian role has ended up with a lot of successful troubleshooting through my interest in information and computer history, We had a Z39.5 bug that was tracked down as being due to an obscure aspect of the MARC cataloging format interacting with the specific implementation of YAZ in our ILS. I didn't know the answer, but I was able to track down the listserv that could provide me with the answer. The humanities program I was in (I did history, religious studies (anthropology/history/comparative religion) and some digital humanities English as undergrad) did give me the research tools, but not the specific technical skills. I've learned rather quickly that understanding how information is structured is critical, and then depending on my own fast learning and my vendors for the specific details has been the core of my successful projects. You might want to look for courses in information architecture and database design because those skills are widely applicable to other thorny information management problems. Best advice I can give, is start building your own library projects now with one of the Head First books or a Lynda.com subscription. They don't have to be spectacular, but you can get a feel for how to build and structure websites, use Javascript and Jquery, maybe some further programming with Python or Ruby. Get a cheap laptop or desktop and install Koha and Evergreen, try out SolrMARC and Blacklight. Get your hands dirty and break things when you're not working with production systems. Best of luck, Brett Williams Systems Electronic Resources Librarian College of the North Atlantic - Qatar On Thu, May 29, 2014 at 6:17 AM, Riley Childs rchi...@cucawarriors.comwrote: I was curious about the type of degrees people had. I am heading off to college next year (class of 2015) and am trying to figure out what to major in. I want to be a systems librarian, but I can't tell what to major in! I wanted to hear about what paths people took and how they ended up where they are now. BTW Y'All at NC State need a better tour bus driver (not the c4l tour, the admissions tour) ;) the bus ride was like a rickety roller coaster... Also, if you know of any scholarships please let me know ;) you would be my BFF :P Riley Childs Student Asst. Head of IT Services Charlotte United Christian Academy (704) 497-2086 RileyChilds.net Sent from my Windows Phone, please excuse mistakes
