To: Community@Apache.org
On the Jakarta General list, we've been discussing the possibility of
introducing an Internationalization project into incubation. It seems the
consensus is that it should be targeted for a top-level
programming-language-independent and spoken-language-independent Apache
project, rather a Jakarta subproject.
(To anyone on the JG list: I used a blind CC so that this is the only message
on Community@Apache.org which should be CCd to JG. You can set up message
filters on [i18n] on both lists to follow the discussions in either place)
A preliminary organization of the project based on the JG discussions is
included in my message below.
I don't mind spearheading the incubation myself. Is there anyone else
interested whom we can add to the list of contributors (see A through F below)?
Is there anything else we should consider before requesting entry into
incubation?
TIA.
Robert Simpson
Original Message
Subject: Re: [i18n] Internationalization subproject sponsor?
Date: Sun, 13 Jul 2003 21:32:36 +0100
From: robert burrell donkin [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Reply-To: Jakarta General List general@jakarta.apache.org
To: Jakarta General List general@jakarta.apache.org
On Monday, July 7, 2003, at 01:14 PM, Robert Simpson wrote:
snip
I am surprised there isn't more interest in a common internationalization
framework within Jakarta. But then I have been assuming that there are
non-English-speaking members in Jakarta, not just committers and
other users of the code.
i think that there several jakarta members who are not native english
speakers. as Tetsuya Kitahata pointed out there are far fewer members than
committers and i'm not sure whether there are any jakarta members who are
native speakers of non-latin languages. it takes a lot of energy to
spearhead an incubation and it's a big commitment for a member to make.
but i don't think that the member would have to come from jakarta (even if
that's where those people involved with the product hope that it will end
up). i wonder whether you might have more luck finding a sponsor over in
xml-land. since many of their products are multi-language a common i18n
framework may be of more pressing importance than here. i also have an
idea that there are members whose native languages are non-latin.
i like the idea of an apache wide i18n project along the lines suggested
by Tetsuya Kitahata.
- robert
Original Message
Subject: Re: [i18n] Internationalization subproject
Date: Sat, 12 Jul 2003 08:55:00 -0400
Reply-To: Jakarta General List general@jakarta.apache.org,[EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: Jakarta General List general@jakarta.apache.org
References: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL
PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED]
WRT Santiago's point about keeping the different translations in sync, the
solution is to have each word/phrase in (1) or each section in (2) identified
in the XML with a version number. Then it would be a simple matter to have a
program compare the two documents, and indicate where the translation needs to
be updated (the program could even provide an initial translation of the
section via machine translation, to be refined by the human translator). The
XML should also indicate who made each change and whether a change was prompted
by a need to change the document (additions to content, for example) or as a
translation of another version. That way, no particular translation would have
to be the primary document, and any conflicts could be identified and
handled. For example, a Spanish-speaking person could add a missing section to
the Spanish translation of a document, and that section could then be
translated back into the original and other translations. This arrangement
could also handle proposed additions (the XML equivalent of I, a Spanish
translator, propose to add a new section here), which could be commented on
(ex: that section would be better placed over there) and/or voted on by
translators of other languages, etc
Am I getting the feeling right that the Internationalization project would be
ultimately targeted for a top level, multiple-programming-language Apache
project? If so, I think the best approach would be to get the Java support
done first, to demonstrate its viability and usefulness. But still, from the
start, the intent should be to design with language-independence as the
ultimate goal.
So, in summary, the organization of the project would be:
1. code common to both (1) and (2)
1.1 code
This would include any code that supports both (2) and (3), such as the
code to do comparisons between translations
1.1.1 any programming-language-neutral stuff (configuration files, XML, etc)
1.1.2 Java
1.1.2.1 source code
1.1.2.1.1 source code contributors (committers)
1.1.3+ other programming languages, similarly
2. user interface internationalization (words and phrases)
2.1 code
