Re: Unofficial poll: Do you want 3G in the proposed successor, GTA03?
In Italy there is an operator that give GPRS / UMTS / HSDPA with the same tariff: 500 Megabyte/Month - 20 Eur (after the first renew it become 1 Gbyte, and you can renew it more time in a month) It is not too expensive, for who do't have a broadband connection, because here a bb connection cost around 40 Eur / month. But I don't know how much necessary is to have it integrated in OpenMoko. Lally Singh wrote: On Mon, Apr 7, 2008 at 12:15 PM, Steven ** [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: As a US resident, 3G is pretty useless to me. Mostly because it costs AT LEAST an additional $30 a month to utilize it. I'm also not sure it's available in my area. WiFi, on the other hand, is free when it's available (which is admittedly scarce in some areas). WiFi's useful for a lot of things. But, 3G may get cheaper in the states. When the 3G iPhone comes out, Apple may coerce ATT to provide cheap data for it. Perhaps within the existing $20 data plan. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: OpenMoko project future - Dreamliner vs. 737
To all those who are frustrated. First of all, please note the recent message from Steve that the Freerunner is already in production rampup (PVT), i.e. the hardware engineering phase is finished. Usually this means just weeks and no longer months until sales can start. But taking your picture of liftoff, and knowing about all those eagerly waiting members on this list who have expected something different, I have worked on a solution for those who have different needs than the Freerunner will fulfill. The best result so far is sort of a 737 Open Linux PDA-Smartphone (when compared to the Neo Dreamliner). While the alternate device lacks WiFi, GPS, USB-Host and the latest kernels, it comes with * Quadband (800/850/1800/1900) * a 1.3Mpix camera * a builtin telescpoe pen * weights just 90g * is mature (i.e. end-user ready incl. power management) and * runs Qtopia (not the latest one) out of the box. I am in discussion with the manufacturer about the SDK and the limitations of openness. But what I have already tried with the sample devices is that it is really possible to install and run Sharp Zaurus binaries and cross-compile some code. Since I don't know if discussing alternatives to the Openmoko fits into the rules of this list, please send me a private mail (mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] ) if you are interested, or follow the links in the signature. With kind regards, Nikolaus Schaller http://www.handheld-linux.com http://groups.google.de/group/org-letux-discuss PS: we plan to add both, the Freerunner and this alternate device to our shop so you have more choice Am 07.04.2008 um 23:58 schrieb Ron K. Jeffries: OpenMoko is a brilliant concept. I hope to buy a Freerunner when it's relatively safe to go in the water. Before we jump down the throats of those who express some frustration about how the release schedule has taken longer than we all hoped, here's my non-emotional comment in support of those who are frustrated. I do no know why, but the OpenMoko project (Hardware and software) objectively is dragging out. From the sidelines, it is difficult to judge whether this VIRTUOUS project will or will not achieve liftoff, or will crash off the end of the runway. yes, absolutely, developing in a fully open environment means everybody knows each and every wart along the way. Apple and Steve Jobs did not have that burden, nor do Nokia, or LG, Samsung, Motorola. BUT the OpenMoko project likely does not have enough financial capital and human resource to accomplish its lofty ambitions. I passionately hope I am TOTALLY WRONG. But the track record to date is dodgy at best. -- Ron K. Jeffries http://blog.eronj.com http://twitter.com/rjeffries ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: OpenMoko project future - Dreamliner vs. 737
Hi, You really should host your pictures on your own server and not include it out of a forum. (e.g. picture http://www.oesf.org/forum/index.php?act=attachtype=postid=5358 is used in http://www.handheld-linux.com/wiki.php?page=Letux%20380 ) So users have to register in that forum to see the picture in your shop... not really useful :) Am Dienstag, den 08.04.2008, 08:16 +0200 schrieb Dr. H. Nikolaus Schaller: To all those who are frustrated. First of all, please note the recent message from Steve that the Freerunner is already in production rampup (PVT), i.e. the hardware engineering phase is finished. Usually this means just weeks and no longer months until sales can start. But taking your picture of liftoff, and knowing about all those eagerly waiting members on this list who have expected something different, I have worked on a solution for those who have different needs than the Freerunner will fulfill. The best result so far is sort of a 737 Open Linux PDA-Smartphone (when compared to the Neo Dreamliner). While the alternate device lacks WiFi, GPS, USB-Host and the latest kernels, it comes with * Quadband (800/850/1800/1900) * a 1.3Mpix camera * a builtin telescpoe pen * weights just 90g * is mature (i.e. end-user ready incl. power management) and * runs Qtopia (not the latest one) out of the box. I am in discussion with the manufacturer about the SDK and the limitations of openness. But what I have already tried with the sample devices is that it is really possible to install and run Sharp Zaurus binaries and cross-compile some code. Since I don't know if discussing alternatives to the Openmoko fits into the rules of this list, please send me a private mail (mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] ) if you are interested, or follow the links in the signature. With kind regards, Nikolaus Schaller http://www.handheld-linux.com http://groups.google.de/group/org-letux-discuss PS: we plan to add both, the Freerunner and this alternate device to our shop so you have more choice Am 07.04.2008 um 23:58 schrieb Ron K. Jeffries: OpenMoko is a brilliant concept. I hope to buy a Freerunner when it's relatively safe to go in the water. Before we jump down the throats of those who express some frustration about how the release schedule has taken longer than we all hoped, here's my non-emotional comment in support of those who are frustrated. I do no know why, but the OpenMoko project (Hardware and software) objectively is dragging out. From the sidelines, it is difficult to judge whether this VIRTUOUS project will or will not achieve liftoff, or will crash off the end of the runway. yes, absolutely, developing in a fully open environment means everybody knows each and every wart along the way. Apple and Steve Jobs did not have that burden, nor do Nokia, or LG, Samsung, Motorola. BUT the OpenMoko project likely does not have enough financial capital and human resource to accomplish its lofty ambitions. I passionately hope I am TOTALLY WRONG. But the track record to date is dodgy at best. -- Ron K. Jeffries http://blog.eronj.com http://twitter.com/rjeffries ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: OpenMoko project future - Dreamliner vs. 737
Ooops... Must have been done while having some blackout... Am 08.04.2008 um 09:27 schrieb Kevin Zuber: Hi, You really should host your pictures on your own server and not include it out of a forum. (e.g. picture http://www.oesf.org/forum/index.php?act=attachtype=postid=5358 is used in http://www.handheld-linux.com/wiki.php?page=Letux%20380 ) Thanks for this hint... So users have to register in that forum to see the picture in your shop... not really useful :) Well, the forum is great but you are right that we shouldn't require users to subscribe there... Am Dienstag, den 08.04.2008, 08:16 +0200 schrieb Dr. H. Nikolaus Schaller: To all those who are frustrated. First of all, please note the recent message from Steve that the Freerunner is already in production rampup (PVT), i.e. the hardware engineering phase is finished. Usually this means just weeks and no longer months until sales can start. But taking your picture of liftoff, and knowing about all those eagerly waiting members on this list who have expected something different, I have worked on a solution for those who have different needs than the Freerunner will fulfill. The best result so far is sort of a 737 Open Linux PDA-Smartphone (when compared to the Neo Dreamliner). While the alternate device lacks WiFi, GPS, USB-Host and the latest kernels, it comes with * Quadband (800/850/1800/1900) * a 1.3Mpix camera * a builtin telescpoe pen * weights just 90g * is mature (i.e. end-user ready incl. power management) and * runs Qtopia (not the latest one) out of the box. I am in discussion with the manufacturer about the SDK and the limitations of openness. But what I have already tried with the sample devices is that it is really possible to install and run Sharp Zaurus binaries and cross-compile some code. Since I don't know if discussing alternatives to the Openmoko fits into the rules of this list, please send me a private mail (mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] ) if you are interested, or follow the links in the signature. With kind regards, Nikolaus Schaller http://www.handheld-linux.com http://groups.google.de/group/org-letux-discuss PS: we plan to add both, the Freerunner and this alternate device to our shop so you have more choice Am 07.04.2008 um 23:58 schrieb Ron K. Jeffries: OpenMoko is a brilliant concept. I hope to buy a Freerunner when it's relatively safe to go in the water. Before we jump down the throats of those who express some frustration about how the release schedule has taken longer than we all hoped, here's my non-emotional comment in support of those who are frustrated. I do no know why, but the OpenMoko project (Hardware and software) objectively is dragging out. From the sidelines, it is difficult to judge whether this VIRTUOUS project will or will not achieve liftoff, or will crash off the end of the runway. yes, absolutely, developing in a fully open environment means everybody knows each and every wart along the way. Apple and Steve Jobs did not have that burden, nor do Nokia, or LG, Samsung, Motorola. BUT the OpenMoko project likely does not have enough financial capital and human resource to accomplish its lofty ambitions. I passionately hope I am TOTALLY WRONG. But the track record to date is dodgy at best. -- Ron K. Jeffries http://blog.eronj.com http://twitter.com/rjeffries ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Speeding up browsing and lightening the traffic load
On Monday 07 April 2008 12:13:17 Mikko Rauhala wrote: ma, 2008-04-07 kello 11:24 +0200, Erland Lewin kirjoitti: IMHO, the Opera Mini design (compressing and optimizing web pages before sending them to the phone) is excellent, because it saves traffic (=money) and speeds up loading. I'm not aware of any open source alternative with the same design. Over the last weekend, I've been working a bit on a prototype proxy doing streaming html/xml diffs (dubbed mldiffs) based on a shared cache, largely as described here: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Server:WebProxy Hi I wanted to let you know I added the following to your wiki entry: improvement: it would be better NOT to modify the client, but instead have a 'reassembly proxy' on the client, so that all http clients/user agents benefit without hacks. The reassembly proxy could then inject a cookie to keep track of page versions. Also, with pictures the proxy pair could detect on the second load it has already sent the 'crappified' image and send a diff with the next 'progression' of the image. That way the user can get the full quality image with 2 or 3 page refresh actions. Sadly, going by track record, I probably will not have the energy to productize the thing, but maybe it'll provide inspiration and/or a basis for someone to do so. I do intend to get at least the mldiffs going (currently just need to debug the interproxy communication, other stuff is done) and hopefully add rdiff support for non-ml content (during testing I found the mldiffs to be notably better for markup content so I started with that). Then I'll put the (python/twisted) source out there (if someone's really interested for it now, feel free to ask). I think it's a great idea! Image crappification support would be good, but I don't know, it would really require inserting javascript or at least mucking with the (x)html to work nicely with a browser knowing nothing of this. (You know, something along the lines of click the image the first time, and you'll get a better version; second time does what it normally does.) I'm not sure if that's something I want to tackle with. OTOH, simple crappification controlled from a configuration key on the client might be doable with my concentration levels, we'll see. No need for hacks with the two-proxy scenario It might even be extended to a session manager that keeps your (XMPP, IRC, etc) sessions open even when switching from Wifi to GPRS or vice versa. This would make possible 'handovers' when losing Wifi coverage. The server and client proxies just reconnect over the other channel while the endpoints will not disconnect. grtz, Sander ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Speeding up browsing and lightening the traffic load
On ti, 2008-04-08 at 11:30 +0200, Sander van Grieken wrote: Over the last weekend, I've been working a bit on a prototype proxy doing streaming html/xml diffs (dubbed mldiffs) based on a shared cache, largely as described here: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Server:WebProxy improvement: it would be better NOT to modify the client, but instead have a 'reassembly proxy' on the client, so that all http clients/user agents benefit without hacks. The reassembly proxy could then inject a cookie to keep track of page versions. Yeah that's actually pretty much what I've done so far. Using a custom header, to be exact. Also, with pictures the proxy pair could detect on the second load it has already sent the 'crappified' image and send a diff with the next 'progression' of the image. That way the user can get the full quality image with 2 or 3 page refresh actions. Mm, that mechanic could work, if hopefully one could distinguish between reloads and arriving on the page again at a later time. Besides a timeout. Image crappification support would be good, but I don't know, it would really require inserting javascript or at least mucking with the (x)html to work nicely with a browser knowing nothing of this. (You know, something along the lines of click the image the first time, and you'll get a better version; second time does what it normally does.) No need for hacks with the two-proxy scenario I was mostly thinking along the lines of transform img reference to a crappified one, along with a surrounding link to a page version where this image is the full-quality one, or add javascript to pop up a menu when image is clicked to load the full quality image or just do whatever the original page wants to do when the image is clicked. Exactly this sort of hacks are necessary for this sort of fine-grained tuning without modifying the browser. It might even be extended to a session manager that keeps your (XMPP, IRC, etc) sessions open even when switching from Wifi to GPRS or vice versa. This would make possible 'handovers' when losing Wifi coverage. The server and client proxies just reconnect over the other channel while the endpoints will not disconnect. Now this is an excellent idea, but I'm not so sure if it should be an extension of this. First, a mobile diffing proxy is useful in many places where one might not need those other things, and second, it's less important to keep a single session going all the time with web browsing. Also, such a session manager would be rather simple on its own, which is always a nice thing for maintainability. The web proxy could perhaps just be routed through it, though; it would make things smoother for it too in some situations. Should really also check if someone's already done that sort of thing, one would think someone might've... -- Mikko Rauhala [EMAIL PROTECTED] University of Helsinki ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Speeding up browsing and lightening the traffic load
Am Di 8. April 2008 schrieb Mikko Rauhala: On ti, 2008-04-08 at 11:30 +0200, Sander van Grieken wrote: Over the last weekend, I've been working a bit on a prototype proxy doing streaming html/xml diffs (dubbed mldiffs) based on a shared cache, largely as described here: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Server:WebProxy improvement: it would be better NOT to modify the client, but instead have a 'reassembly proxy' on the client, so that all http clients/user agents benefit without hacks. The reassembly proxy could then inject a cookie to keep track of page versions. Yeah that's actually pretty much what I've done so far. Using a custom header, to be exact. [...] It might even be extended to a session manager that keeps your (XMPP, IRC, etc) sessions open even when switching from Wifi to GPRS or vice versa. This would make possible 'handovers' when losing Wifi coverage. The server and client proxies just reconnect over the other channel while the endpoints will not disconnect. Now this is an excellent idea, but I'm not so sure if it should be an extension of this. First, a mobile diffing proxy is useful in many places where one might not need those other things, and second, it's less important to keep a single session going all the time with web browsing. Also, such a session manager would be rather simple on its own, which is always a nice thing for maintainability. The web proxy could perhaps just be routed through it, though; it would make things smoother for it too in some situations. Should really also check if someone's already done that sort of thing, one would think someone might've... Andy Green is considering a VPN based concept that's close to this. jOERG ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Data over normal GSM call
Does anyone know if it is legal (in the standard TOS) with providers (such as ATnT) to send data over a normal phone call? I have plenty of cell minutes (not to mention free calls between certain numbers...) but I dont want to pay for a data planso I figure if I wanted to, I could just have my phone call my computer and transfer data over the line. Has anyone else looked into this? -Dan Staley ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Data over normal GSM call
I don't know about specific cases, but I think that cell phone companies are more concerned about people using VOIP over data over gsm voice calls. There was talk earlier about writing a fax program that uses incoming calls to receive faxes, and that GSM couldn't transmit decent faxes because of a quality or bandwidth problem, but I can't remember the specifics. This might hinder such a setup. Matt On Tue, Apr 8, 2008 at 10:22 AM, Dan Staley [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Does anyone know if it is legal (in the standard TOS) with providers (such as ATnT) to send data over a normal phone call? I have plenty of cell minutes (not to mention free calls between certain numbers...) but I dont want to pay for a data planso I figure if I wanted to, I could just have my phone call my computer and transfer data over the line. Has anyone else looked into this? -Dan Staley ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Data over normal GSM call
On ti, 2008-04-08 at 10:22 -0400, Dan Staley wrote: I have plenty of cell minutes (not to mention free calls between certain numbers...) but I dont want to pay for a data planso I figure if I wanted to, I could just have my phone call my computer and transfer data over the line. There has been talk of it (especially in connection to encrypted phonecalls). The archives have a lot of it. To summarize, you can't transfer very useful amounts of data over a GSM voice call since we can't bypass the GSM chip's audio codec for those. Obviously you can get some data through, but the highest anyone's gone was IIRC ~1k using some kind of funky phonetic coding, but I believe there was no exact reference to this either, let alone code (which would be rather complex). You could perhaps do stuff like update GPS coordinates through DTMF or something like that, but for larger data transfer needs you really want a data plan. -- Mikko Rauhala [EMAIL PROTECTED] University of Helsinki ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Data over normal GSM call
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Somebody in the thread at some point said: | On ti, 2008-04-08 at 10:22 -0400, Dan Staley wrote: | I have plenty of cell minutes (not to mention free calls between certain | numbers...) but I dont want to pay for a data planso I figure if I | wanted to, I could just have my phone call my computer and transfer data | over the line. | | There has been talk of it (especially in connection to encrypted | phonecalls). The archives have a lot of it. | | To summarize, you can't transfer very useful amounts of data over a GSM | voice call since we can't bypass the GSM chip's audio codec for those. | Obviously you can get some data through, but the highest anyone's gone | was IIRC ~1k using some kind of funky phonetic coding, but I believe | there was no exact reference to this either, let alone code (which would | be rather complex). | | You could perhaps do stuff like update GPS coordinates through DTMF or | something like that, but for larger data transfer needs you really want | a data plan. I think you're right, but just a thought if you could issue ready-coded GSM codec frames, you can put the data direct in there for 1KBytes/sec or so. It still has GSM frame format just not GSM data really in the payload. Of course what is on the other end has to realize you played that game or it will sound very strange. - -Andy -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.9 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Fedora - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iEYEARECAAYFAkf7iR8ACgkQOjLpvpq7dMpUjQCfRtEuVhgtkNYK5rQK6VBjcPHo TyQAn2Aa1TyfNZU1fbOENI3YHeIpy6Vt =rX7j -END PGP SIGNATURE- ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Data over normal GSM call
On ti, 2008-04-08 at 16:02 +0100, Andy Green wrote: I think you're right, but just a thought if you could issue ready-coded GSM codec frames, you can put the data direct in there for 1KBytes/sec Yeah, but you can't. -- Mikko Rauhala [EMAIL PROTECTED] University of Helsinki ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Hardware update
Hi Steven, It is my understanding that this is the intention, but I haven't yet received positive confirmation. I'll try to get an answer soon. Michael Steven Kurylo wrote: PVT testing is in process, and I'll ask Steve to send an update within the next few days. A little while ago when I asked, you weren't sure if they are mass producing the 850 and 900 Mhz versions at the same time. Are they being produced at the same time or will we have to wait a few months for the second version? Thank you. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Data over normal GSM call
Mikko Rauhala wrote: On ti, 2008-04-08 at 10:22 -0400, Dan Staley wrote: I have plenty of cell minutes (not to mention free calls between certain numbers...) but I dont want to pay for a data planso I figure if I wanted to, I could just have my phone call my computer and transfer data over the line. There has been talk of it (especially in connection to encrypted phonecalls). The archives have a lot of it. To summarize, you can't transfer very useful amounts of data over a GSM voice call since we can't bypass the GSM chip's audio codec for those. Obviously you can get some data through, but the highest anyone's gone was IIRC ~1k using some kind of funky phonetic coding, but I believe there was no exact reference to this either, let alone code (which would be rather complex). Maybe CSD is billed like a voice call. I never used it, but i don't remember any special charges for that. The Wikipedia article about CSD has some hints about running voice modems via GSM too. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Circuit_Switched_Data Regards Tilman ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Data over normal GSM call
Tilman Baumann wrote: Maybe CSD is billed like a voice call. I never used it, but i don't remember any special charges for that. I dug deeper. Seems like this is true. But this raises the question if the Neo can do CSD. Probably it does, since the GSM module does not appear to be somehow intentionally crippled. 9.6 kBit/s is no fun though... Regards Tilman ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Data over normal GSM call
On ti, 2008-04-08 at 17:16 +0200, Tilman Baumann wrote: Maybe CSD is billed like a voice call. I never used it, but i don't remember any special charges for that. Doubtful for the US drop your pants and bend over, please carriers' minutes; I presume the original poster was in this situation from his .edu account and mention of ATT. Here in Finland we're mostly billed by minute (though there are _optional_ US-like plans), and CSD calls indeed cost pretty much the same as voice calls. I presume the situation may be similar in many other (esp. EU) countries as well, which is good for us if we want to do eg. those encrypted phone calls or cheaper international calls via VOIP/CSD, but doesn't help the original poster. The Wikipedia article about CSD has some hints about running voice modems via GSM too. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Circuit_Switched_Data A quick glance finds mostly mentions of 1st gen analog mobiles having been used with modems, and notably At the same time, the speech oriented audio compression used in GSM actually meant that data rates using a traditional modem connected to the phone would have been even lower than with older analogue systems. -- Mikko Rauhala [EMAIL PROTECTED] University of Helsinki ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Hardware update
All 850 and 900 Mhz versions are being produced at the same time. -Sean Michael Shiloh wrote: Hi Steven, It is my understanding that this is the intention, but I haven't yet received positive confirmation. I'll try to get an answer soon. Michael Steven Kurylo wrote: PVT testing is in process, and I'll ask Steve to send an update within the next few days. A little while ago when I asked, you weren't sure if they are mass producing the 850 and 900 Mhz versions at the same time. Are they being produced at the same time or will we have to wait a few months for the second version? Thank you. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Data over normal GSM call
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Somebody in the thread at some point said: | On ti, 2008-04-08 at 16:02 +0100, Andy Green wrote: | I think you're right, but just a thought if you could issue ready-coded | GSM codec frames, you can put the data direct in there for 1KBytes/sec | | Yeah, but you can't. can't is pretty strong... isn't not without seriously hacking something around better? - -Andy -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.9 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Fedora - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iEYEARECAAYFAkf7kLsACgkQOjLpvpq7dMrVRgCfSOMbH6ZzSEZTjmBLH1wCXeZp GIkAn0XztvIzPbJJAEiSH4cZXtFMVpVU =zjlL -END PGP SIGNATURE- ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Data over normal GSM call
Mikko Rauhala wrote: A quick glance finds mostly mentions of 1st gen analog mobiles having been used with modems, and notably At the same time, the speech oriented audio compression used in GSM actually meant that data rates using a traditional modem connected to the phone would have been even lower than with older analogue systems. The Wikipedia article is somewhat misleading here. CSD is real data transfer over the GSM network which is translated via Gateways into PSTN modem calls. A service of the GSM network. Somehow they managed to mix that modem via voice stuff into the CSD article. (Or at least this is how i undrstood this. *g* ) ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Product Update
On 4/7/08, steve [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: As I explained a while back we had a few milestones to hit before beginning mass production. The First was DVT. Building phones and verifying the design. That's been completed and so we have Moved onto the next stage PVT. Verifying the design for Production. This stage is always a bit annoying Because the temptation is to throw the switch and build a billion phones. There are three PVT builds scheduled And the first has been completed. The completed handsets will be tested and then we will tweak the process and build two more PVT batches. It's the final push people so everybody keep your good humour. CONGRATULATIONS!!! Good luck with the PVT! -- Please don't send me Word or PowerPoint attachments. See http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/no-word-attachments.html Join the FSF as an Associate Member at: URL:http://www.fsf.org/register_form?referrer=5774 ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Loosing your moko
On 4/7/08, Didier Raboud [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: * If I loose or let my Moko being stolen, I can find my connection parameters (on the paper) and go to track.openmoko.com and there I can find 24 coordinates a day. This could help me find it back or help the police find it back. Of course, if the Moko is turned off, it won't be possible to track it. But as soon as it is turned on again (even if flashed with default image), it will restart to send coordinates to the default server with its SIM-change and flash-change prone ID. There is only one problem with this. If the phone is flashed, the the flash will be erased/overwritten and the program to transmit the coordinates will be gone. -- Please don't send me Word or PowerPoint attachments. See http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/no-word-attachments.html Join the FSF as an Associate Member at: URL:http://www.fsf.org/register_form?referrer=5774 ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Unofficial poll: Do you want 3G in the proposed successor, GTA03?
In the time since Openmoko originally announced it's phone without 3G support and now, as the Freerunner is approaching release, it has become more of an issue that it does not have 3G (how much of an issue we can debate, certainly). So please, *please* bear in mind that when talking about the next generation of Moko hardware, it's not merely the state of things now that we are concerned about. Will it be embarrassing if yet again Openmoko trails in the communications capabilities of it's device (compared to proprietary smartphones)? I really feel that the next generation should support HSDPA (sometimes called 3.5G). It does not have support in all countries but almost every new smartphone coming out supports it because there are plenty of countries that *do* offer it. In the UK T-Mobile now bundles 3G and HSDPA together in it's web n walk (unlimited data) packages - you don't get them in separate price plans. And lastly please bear in mind that a HSDPA modem still supports 3G, GPRS, GSM etc so nobody misses out. Justyn. On 07/04/2008, Mikko Rauhala [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On ma, 2008-04-07 at 14:00 +0200, Federico Lorenzi wrote: First off, this is by no means official in any way. Vote on [1] if you _think_ 3G is essential for a successor to FreeRunner Interesting choice of words; this discourages everyone who doesn't think 3G is essential from voting, even though the vote itself has other choices. :] Personally, for my two cents, for the successor it pretty much is essential. I will buy at least one if not two Freerunners into my family (having already one 1973). The GPRS will provide basic connectivity well enough; having a slow net is infinitely better than none at all. For the successor to be an attractive enough _upgrade_ to that, it'll pretty much have to have 3G (UMTS). EDGE, not really worth it, unless it's somehow a lot sexier in other ways. And there is the thing that they're already starting to talk about running down the 2G networks here in Finland... (Sure, it'll be just talk for years, but anyway, for confidence in longevity and all that jazz.) Oh yeah, in light of what they're talking about replacing it in rural areas, 900 MHz support for UMTS would be nice as well ;P Now, for HSDPA, it isn't really essential (though obviously _nice_). Basic old-school 384k UMTS would be quite an okay tradeoff. Anyway, for now, still anxious for the Freerunner. Cheerio. -- Mikko Rauhala [EMAIL PROTECTED] University of Helsinki ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Web Browser?
I will stick to links and go via my proxy server, to remove the spam:) But I know people have different needs. I think we should not say one option is the only correct one. I would love to see both links and more advanced browsers being supported over time. -- Please don't send me Word or PowerPoint attachments. See http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/no-word-attachments.html Join the FSF as an Associate Member at: URL:http://www.fsf.org/register_form?referrer=5774 ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Unofficial poll: Do you want 3G in the proposed successor, GTA03?
On Mon, Apr 7, 2008 at 10:55 PM, Brad Midgley [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Guys It shouldn't be treated like an either-or for wifi and 3g. The phone should have both. [...] Everyone. I have to agree with Brad here. Wifi has other uses too! I'm sure I'm not the only one who wants/needs the Neo/Freerunner to connect to some private networks over Wifi. I don't want to have to go through my telco's network and back through my internet connection just to reach my network. Also, doing it that way would mean that I absolutely need some sort of VPN solution on top of the communications channel at all times. I don't necessarily want a data plan just to use the device on my own network. I *NEED* Wifi. A bonus would be to switch to a Wifi chipset that allows promisc and other similar uses. For me, removing Wifi from the device would be a deal breaker. Antoine -- Antoine Reid ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Data over normal GSM call
On Tue, April 8, 2008 18:02, Joe Pfeiffer wrote: Andy Green writes: -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Somebody in the thread at some point said: | On ti, 2008-04-08 at 16:02 +0100, Andy Green wrote: | I think you're right, but just a thought if you could issue ready-coded | GSM codec frames, you can put the data direct in there for 1KBytes/sec | | Yeah, but you can't. can't is pretty strong... isn't not without seriously hacking something around better? If I understand the limitation correctly, in this case, I think hacking something around involves hacking at least firmware and quite possibly hardware inside the gsm modem. That's close enough to can't that the difference really doesn't matter. Can't you initiate a voice call between to FreeRunners and then use the mic and mixer devs to modulate the data as sound? ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community -- Diego Fdez. Durán [EMAIL PROTECTED] | http://www.goedi.net GPG : 925C 9A21 7A11 3B13 6E43 50DB F579 D119 90D2 66BB ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Data over normal GSM call
Diego Fdez. Durán writes: On Tue, April 8, 2008 18:02, Joe Pfeiffer wrote: Andy Green writes: -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Somebody in the thread at some point said: | On ti, 2008-04-08 at 16:02 +0100, Andy Green wrote: | I think you're right, but just a thought if you could issue ready-coded | GSM codec frames, you can put the data direct in there for 1KBytes/sec | | Yeah, but you can't. can't is pretty strong... isn't not without seriously hacking something around better? If I understand the limitation correctly, in this case, I think hacking something around involves hacking at least firmware and quite possibly hardware inside the gsm modem. That's close enough to can't that the difference really doesn't matter. Can't you initiate a voice call between to FreeRunners and then use the mic and mixer devs to modulate the data as sound? Yes -- but that's the technique with the claimed limitation of roughly 1Kbps. It isn't inserting the raw gsm codec frames. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Unofficial poll: Do you want 3G in the proposed successor, GTA03?
On 4/8/08, Antoine Reid [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Mon, Apr 7, 2008 at 10:55 PM, Brad Midgley [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Guys It shouldn't be treated like an either-or for wifi and 3g. The phone should have both. [...] Everyone. I have to agree with Brad here. Wifi has other uses too! I'm sure I'm not the only one who wants/needs the Neo/Freerunner to connect to some private networks over Wifi. I don't want to have to go through my telco's network and back through my internet connection just to reach my network. Also, doing it that way would mean that I absolutely need some sort of VPN solution on top of the communications channel at all times. I don't necessarily want a data plan just to use the device on my own network. I *NEED* Wifi. A bonus would be to switch to a Wifi chipset that allows promisc and other similar uses. For me, removing Wifi from the device would be a deal breaker. I cannot agree more. I don't carry my laptop around whereever I go, and all places I am have free wireless. I do not need 3g. GPRS will do just fine, if I really need to send an e-mail. But, of course, 3g would be nice in addition to wifi. -- Please don't send me Word or PowerPoint attachments. See http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/no-word-attachments.html Join the FSF as an Associate Member at: URL:http://www.fsf.org/register_form?referrer=5774 ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Web Browser?
Flemming Richter Mikkelsen said: I will stick to links and go via my proxy server, to remove the spam:) But I know people have different needs. I think we should not say one option is the only correct one. I would love to see both links and more advanced browsers being supported over time. Can you tell me more about using proxy for this stuff. How to configure one? ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Data over normal GSM call
Am Di 8. April 2008 schrieb Tilman Baumann: Tilman Baumann wrote: Maybe CSD is billed like a voice call. I never used it, but i don't remember any special charges for that. I dug deeper. Seems like this is true. But this raises the question if the Neo can do CSD. Probably it does, since the GSM module does not appear to be somehow intentionally crippled. 9.6 kBit/s is no fun though... Right, the Neo calypso modem speaks AT on the internal serial interface. I don't think there is any problem with the very much Hayes standard AT-commands for CSD. Nearly every phone could do this even 1999. IIRC there even is a 14400B/s mode (at least for networks/areas with support for EFR-codec), and I'm quite sure this isn't charged differently for mobile-originated calls. For Mobile-Terminated calls however, you usually need a second special data number linked to your simcard. Otherwise the GSM.network wouldn't know whether or not to set the data-flag for the connection, what means they send the POTS-modem's sound over GSM as is, instead of recoding it to digital prior to sending it over the air. This might not apply for MT-ISDN-calls, with data-service flag set for the originating device. HTH cheers jOERG ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
RE: Loosing your moko
Just my 2C. I have been following this thread for some time. I think the idea is GREAT...Knowing I have phones somewhere, 2 in the US, 1 in Germany and I think one in the UK. What if we start it out simple? Each device owner can choose to register their MAC, modem serial number or other unique component ID that will not change unless hardware is reconfigured. Then if the device is lost or stolen, the registered owner can request a track with the registered units ID. Even if the device is re-flashed at some time in the device's life, I am sure the new user(s) or lucky finder will attempt to use it as intended and connect via WiFi and broadcast. It will at least get the ball rolling. As the tracking development gathers more interested users, the tracker can start to gather may be SIM info, New SIM info, user call log, send me it's new number so I can call it, etc., but it all starts with the unique component ID if there is one :-) _ From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Flemming Richter Mikkelsen Sent: Tuesday, April 08, 2008 11:13 AM To: List for Openmoko community discussion Subject: Re: Loosing your moko On 4/7/08, Didier Raboud [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: * If I loose or let my Moko being stolen, I can find my connection parameters (on the paper) and go to track.openmoko.com and there I can find 24 coordinates a day. This could help me find it back or help the police find it back. Of course, if the Moko is turned off, it won't be possible to track it. But as soon as it is turned on again (even if flashed with default image), it will restart to send coordinates to the default server with its SIM-change and flash-change prone ID. There is only one problem with this. If the phone is flashed, the the flash will be erased/overwritten and the program to transmit the coordinates will be gone. -- Please don't send me Word or PowerPoint attachments. See http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/no-word-attachments.html Join the FSF as an Associate Member at: URL:http://www.fsf.org/register_form?referrer=5774 ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Web Browser?
On 4/8/08, christooss [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Flemming Richter Mikkelsen said: I will stick to links and go via my proxy server, to remove the spam:) But I know people have different needs. I think we should not say one option is the only correct one. I would love to see both links and more advanced browsers being supported over time. Can you tell me more about using proxy for this stuff. How to configure one? I am no expert. I have only configured it once, so this is only how I did it. I assume there is many that has a much better setup, but this is working:) Well, first you need a server with public IP. Then you need to run a proxy server on it. squid is great proxy server that comes with most Linux distros. In the proxy config file, everything is well documented. Secondly you would need a helper script for the proxy server. This is because you want to replace urls (e.g urls that contain ad.*, *.ad.*, *.advert*, advert*) with a url to a blank page (the url can be file:///spam.html and be a local file on your neo, so that you don't have to download it) to remove the spam from the page. For this you can use squidguard. Configure your proxy to filter flash and advertisement with acl rules: # TAG: acl acl all src 0.0.0.0/0.0.0.0 acl manager proto cache_object acl localhost src 127.0.0.1/255.255.255.255 acl to_localhost dst 127.0.0.0/8 acl advertise1 url_regex ad\. ads\. advertis pagead /adsnew /adframe acl advertise3 url_regex tearswep/something/adsenseSide2\.html acl google-analytics url_regex www\.google\-analytics\.com/urchin\.js acl annoying2 url_regex static\.ak\.facebook\.com/js/swfobject\.js \.adicate\. acl microsoft_crap1 dstdom_regex live\.com hotmail \.msn\.com acl microsoft_crap2 dstdomain http://msn.com # TAG: http_access http_access allow manager localhost http_access deny manager # Only allow purge requests from localhost http_access allow purge localhost http_access deny purge # Deny requests to unknown ports http_access deny !Safe_ports http_access deny advertise1 http_access deny advertise3 http_access deny google-analytics http_access deny annoying2 http_access deny microsoft_crap1 http_access deny microsoft_crap2 You need to read everything in /etc/squid.conf and check what else you need. I am not the best person to ask about this, but I hope it gives you an idea. You also want to play with the cache sizes, etc. -- Please don't send me Word or PowerPoint attachments. See http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/no-word-attachments.html Join the FSF as an Associate Member at: URL:http://www.fsf.org/register_form?referrer=5774 ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Web Browser?
Also, remember to set: # TAG: redirect_program redirect_program /usr/bin/squidGuard and to filter flash (I forgot), you can create a rule like this: acl annoying3 url_regex \.flv \.swf and use the rule: http_access deny annoying3 -- Please don't send me Word or PowerPoint attachments. See http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/no-word-attachments.html Join the FSF as an Associate Member at: URL:http://www.fsf.org/register_form?referrer=5774 ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
RE: Hardware update
The FreeRunner uses a 500 Mhz CPU. The board design is rated to 400 Mhz. So, if people check CPU processing specs they will see 500MHz. Operationally, we limit it to 400 Mhz. For a varety of reasons. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Joe Pfeiffer Sent: Monday, April 07, 2008 12:43 PM To: community@lists.openmoko.org Subject: Re: Hardware update Alexander Frøyseth writes: Soo 400/500 MHz is no more? I've never heard any projection that openmoko was ever going to run on 400 or 500 MHz -- in fact, I'd never heard of that GSM band, and googled to find it! ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Data over normal GSM call
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Somebody in the thread at some point said: | Diego Fdez. Durán writes: | On Tue, April 8, 2008 18:02, Joe Pfeiffer wrote: | Andy Green writes: | -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- | Hash: SHA1 | | Somebody in the thread at some point said: | | On ti, 2008-04-08 at 16:02 +0100, Andy Green wrote: | | I think you're right, but just a thought if you could issue | ready-coded | | GSM codec frames, you can put the data direct in there for | 1KBytes/sec | | | | Yeah, but you can't. | | can't is pretty strong... isn't not without seriously hacking | something around better? | If I understand the limitation correctly, in this case, I think | hacking something around involves hacking at least firmware and | quite possibly hardware inside the gsm modem. That's close enough to | can't that the difference really doesn't matter. | | Can't you initiate a voice call between to FreeRunners and then use the | mic and mixer devs to modulate the data as sound? | | Yes -- but that's the technique with the claimed limitation of roughly | 1Kbps. It isn't inserting the raw gsm codec frames. Right... but there is a guy in Openmoko .tw who recompiles our firmware, subject to whatever license agreement we have, he does actually change it. The can't reduces to the architecture of the data pump in the chips and the licence agreement in this case. Just saying that can't makes some assumptions about, eg, who is trying. (I seriously doubt we consider for one second to target this case, just making a philosophical point about the absolute dangers of absolutism ;-) ) - -Andy -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.9 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Fedora - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iEYEARECAAYFAkf77aYACgkQOjLpvpq7dMr07QCfY9SR+67SuapUy9jcS/0EnPvS L/8AnjWCYHFxR4fdJGLr0Jk8RpoQXJ49 =W1Te -END PGP SIGNATURE- ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
CAD file
I have downloaded SolidWorks package from the page. The problem I see is all files have .1 on the end of a name. Example gtc02-msh01.prt.1 Is this my problem or packaging problem? Tnx for anwser ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Unofficial poll: Do you want 3G in the proposed successor, GTA03?
I whip out my A780 and browse the net/read e-mail/update remote todo lists/ssh into my home network nearly everywhere I go. I use my phone's EDGE capabilities while riding across Texas to the next family event. I use it to check my personal e-mail during downtimes at work (restrictions against doing that on company computers). I do the same while waiting for kids sporting events to start or at the dentist's office. I pull it out after band practice in the middle of nowhere to check my family's Google calendars for potential conflicts. As it is, I don't use Wifi much (of course, I don't have it on my phone yet). There are very few free places to use it around here, and their ranges are rather limited. Traveling at 75 mph down a highway means hotspots come and go in a few seconds, so that's not even a potential problem solver for me. So, I will vote for 3G, but if a new board is being designed, it only makes sense to go for the next big thing. Remember, it takes a year or more to get one of these out to market, so the real question will be: how will you use your mobile phone a year from now. --Mark Arvidson ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Toolchain on Ubuntu 7.10
I've just done a clean install of Ubuntu 7.10 and am trying to follow the instructions from the Toolchain wiki page. When I try the command: sudo apt-get install gcc g++ autoconf automake binutils libtools ... I get this error message: *Package autoconf is not available, but is referred to by another package. This may mean that the package is missing, has been obsoleted, or is only available from another source E: Pacakge autoconf has no installation candidate* Since this is a fresh install, I expect I may not have the right setup to install all the developer goodies. Can someone suggest a clean way to resolve this issue? I would be happy to update the wiki page with better instructions once my issue is resolved. Thanks! ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Toolchain on Ubuntu 7.10
i'm not on an ubuntu box now, but try automake1.9 instead of automake, i think that's the newest version 2008/4/9 Dale Schumacher [EMAIL PROTECTED]: I've just done a clean install of Ubuntu 7.10 and am trying to follow the instructions from the Toolchain wiki page. When I try the command: sudo apt-get install gcc g++ autoconf automake binutils libtools ... I get this error message: Package autoconf is not available, but is referred to by another package. This may mean that the package is missing, has been obsoleted, or is only available from another source E: Pacakge autoconf has no installation candidate Since this is a fresh install, I expect I may not have the right setup to install all the developer goodies. Can someone suggest a clean way to resolve this issue? I would be happy to update the wiki page with better instructions once my issue is resolved. Thanks! ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Toolchain on Ubuntu 7.10
apt-cache search autoconf will show possible packages that contain the string autoconf. apt-cache show packagename will give you a description of the package. Stefanie Robin Paulson wrote: i'm not on an ubuntu box now, but try automake1.9 instead of automake, i think that's the newest version 2008/4/9 Dale Schumacher [EMAIL PROTECTED]: I've just done a clean install of Ubuntu 7.10 and am trying to follow the instructions from the Toolchain wiki page. When I try the command: sudo apt-get install gcc g++ autoconf automake binutils libtools ... I get this error message: Package autoconf is not available, but is referred to by another package. This may mean that the package is missing, has been obsoleted, or is only available from another source E: Pacakge autoconf has no installation candidate Since this is a fresh install, I expect I may not have the right setup to install all the developer goodies. Can someone suggest a clean way to resolve this issue? I would be happy to update the wiki page with better instructions once my issue is resolved. Thanks! ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: CAD file
On Tue, Apr 8, 2008 at 9:21 PM, christooss [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I have downloaded SolidWorks package from the page. The problem I see is all files have .1 on the end of a name. Example gtc02-msh01.prt.1 Is this my problem or packaging problem? Tnx for anwser As the file name should indicate these are ProE [1] files, not SolidWorks models. SolidWorks is able to open ProE files, so be sure to select ProE Part (*.prt,*.prt.*,*.xpr) from the Files of type: pop-up menu. The other thing is your version of SolidWorks may not be able to import ProE files of this version. For example, SolidWorks 2005 can only import ProE files from versions 17 through 2001, and Wildfire versions 1 and 2, whereas the Freerunner ProE files appear to be Wildfire 3.0. Check the SolidWorks Online User's Guide from the Help menu and search for ProE to verify what versions it can support. SolidWorks can import STEP or IGES just fine, so maybe you could convince them to also release STEP or IGES versions of the Freerunner as they have the 1973. -Mark [1] http://www.ptc.com/products/proengineer ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Toolchain on Ubuntu 7.10
Hi, have you changed your repositories and reload the paket list? you might remove the cdrom and add at least the main repository in settings-Repositiories and click on the upper left reload button. if you have still problems ask in your local IRC channel on irc.freenode.net. regards, frederik Am Dienstag, den 08.04.2008, 21:40 -0500 schrieb Dale Schumacher: I've just done a clean install of Ubuntu 7.10 and am trying to follow the instructions from the Toolchain wiki page. When I try the command: sudo apt-get install gcc g++ autoconf automake binutils libtools ... I get this error message: Package autoconf is not available, but is referred to by another package. This may mean that the package is missing, has been obsoleted, or is only available from another source E: Pacakge autoconf has no installation candidate Since this is a fresh install, I expect I may not have the right setup to install all the developer goodies. Can someone suggest a clean way to resolve this issue? I would be happy to update the wiki page with better instructions once my issue is resolved. Thanks! ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
