Re: [Gta04-owner] New Phoronix article on Gta04
On Mon, Jul 16, 2012 at 3:31 AM, Joshua Judson Rosen roz...@geekspace.com wrote: Christ van Willegen cvwille...@gmail.com writes: On Mon, Jul 9, 2012 at 4:38 AM, Joshua Judson Rosen roz...@geekspace.com wrote: So, where are the $60 T-shirts? The ones saying 'I wanted to buy a GTA04 but all I got was this lousy T-shirt!' ? :-) for the humor-impaired. if it wasn't obvious, I was actually serious. I know, but I wasn't... I'd probably buy a T-shirt to go with the phone as well :-) Christ van Willegen -- 09 F9 11 02 9D 74 E3 5B D8 41 56 C5 63 56 88 C0 ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: [Gta04-owner] New Phoronix article on Gta04
Am 16.07.2012 um 03:31 schrieb Joshua Judson Rosen: Christ van Willegen cvwille...@gmail.com writes: On Mon, Jul 9, 2012 at 4:38 AM, Joshua Judson Rosen roz...@geekspace.com wrote: So, where are the $60 T-shirts? The ones saying 'I wanted to buy a GTA04 but all I got was this lousy T-shirt!' ? :-) for the humor-impaired. Well, I might pay $20 or $30 for one of *those*. For $60, I expect something with a logo ;) Like what I'd get in return for a donation to National Public Radio, Creative Commons, FreedomBox Foundation, or whatever. So, yeah-- if it wasn't obvious, I was actually serious. In general `T-shirt sales' terms, $60 is a little on the high side, but it's not really outlandish at all to `donate $60 to a cause and get a T-shirt as a thank-you gift', e.g.: https://creativecommons.net/donate/ ($50 min. donation to get a CC shirt) http://kck.st/hywKB2 ($75 min. donation to get a FreedomBox shirt) In all seriousness.., I really do wonder whether it'd be worthwhile for Nikolaus to try selling expensive T-shirts via zazzle.com or such. How much would you pay for a T-shirt that subsidised GTA04 development? And how expensive would they actually have to be in order to provide a minimally-useful financial subsidy? Well, what does not work is that we manage different sizes and colours and shipment ourselves. Therefore we are currently (again) looking into T-shirt services with worldwide presence where we can open a shop-in-a-shop. Some have quite problematic termsconditions (e.g. payment arrives up to 120 days and is void if they cancel for any reasons etc.). There'd need to be some sort of nice image to put on the shirts, of course--I'm pretty sure that someone here would be both willing and able to help produce that if it doesn't yet exist (e.g.: I would). There is a design that we did use at FOSDEM and other fairs (but we had ordered them only for the stand staff): http://freeyourphone.de/portal_v1/viewtopic.php?f=75t=1978p=18465hilit=fosdem#p18465 So, what do you say? Since I am personally not a collector of T-Shirts I wonder if it is so much important to combine donations with T-Shirts. Direct donations are always possible and welcome: http://www.handheld-linux.com/wiki.php?page=GTA04%3aDonation So if we just provide a T-Shirs design, everybody could donate on one side and submit the design files to a (local) T-Shirt shop to get it in his/her size. Nikolaus ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: [Gta04-owner] New Phoronix article on Gta04
Christ van Willegen cvwille...@gmail.com writes: On Mon, Jul 9, 2012 at 4:38 AM, Joshua Judson Rosen roz...@geekspace.com wrote: So, where are the $60 T-shirts? The ones saying 'I wanted to buy a GTA04 but all I got was this lousy T-shirt!' ? :-) for the humor-impaired. Well, I might pay $20 or $30 for one of *those*. For $60, I expect something with a logo ;) Like what I'd get in return for a donation to National Public Radio, Creative Commons, FreedomBox Foundation, or whatever. So, yeah-- if it wasn't obvious, I was actually serious. In general `T-shirt sales' terms, $60 is a little on the high side, but it's not really outlandish at all to `donate $60 to a cause and get a T-shirt as a thank-you gift', e.g.: https://creativecommons.net/donate/ ($50 min. donation to get a CC shirt) http://kck.st/hywKB2 ($75 min. donation to get a FreedomBox shirt) In all seriousness.., I really do wonder whether it'd be worthwhile for Nikolaus to try selling expensive T-shirts via zazzle.com or such. How much would you pay for a T-shirt that subsidised GTA04 development? And how expensive would they actually have to be in order to provide a minimally-useful financial subsidy? There'd need to be some sort of nice image to put on the shirts, of course--I'm pretty sure that someone here would be both willing and able to help produce that if it doesn't yet exist (e.g.: I would). So, what do you say? -- Don't be afraid to ask (λf.((λx.xx) (λr.f(rr. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: [Gta04-owner] New Phoronix article on Gta04
Dr. H. Nikolaus Schaller h...@goldelico.com writes: Am 04.07.2012 um 05:06 schrieb Alishams Hassam: http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_itempx=MTEzMjI If you missed it. Sadly he doesn't make much constructive criticism; he [...] bashes the specs but it's not as if much can be done about that now. There is a typical misunderstanding with the specs. The most worrying statement I found was: for hardware that's slower than a $100 iPhone. I never did see a $100 iPhone (even on eBay and then it is broken)... Eh. You're not selling to the same market as iPhones. You know this. People who want an iPhone, or who would be satisfied by an iPhone, wouldn't buy a GTA04 even if you could sell it to them for $50. They probably wouldn't want one even if you could *give it to them for free*. Don't worry about them. By the same token, I bought the GTA02...; I wouldn't buy an iPhone for $25, but I'd pay a premium for a GTA04..., if only it wasn't *$1k*. And, I know--it's a fair price. I just don't have the money in my budget. I could afford to help subsidize *others'* GTA04 purchases, however, by buying a $60 T-shirt. I wonder how many other people are in the same situation as I am: we want to see this thing succeed, but we can't afford to buy one...; but we could afford to join the fan-club, if only there was one. So, where are the $60 T-shirts? -- Don't be afraid to ask (λf.((λx.xx) (λr.f(rr. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: [Gta04-owner] New Phoronix article on Gta04
On Mon, Jul 9, 2012 at 4:38 AM, Joshua Judson Rosen roz...@geekspace.com wrote: So, where are the $60 T-shirts? The ones saying 'I wanted to buy a GTA04 but all I got was this lousy T-shirt!' ? :-) for the humor-impaired. Christ van Willegen -- 09 F9 11 02 9D 74 E3 5B D8 41 56 C5 63 56 88 C0 ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: [Gta04-owner] New Phoronix article on Gta04
Hi, Am 04.07.2012 um 05:06 schrieb Alishams Hassam: http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_itempx=MTEzMjI If you missed it. Sadly he doesn't make much constructive criticism; he thanks for the link! bashes the specs but it's not as if much can be done about that now. There is a typical misunderstanding with the specs. The most worrying statement I found was: for hardware that's slower than a $100 iPhone. I never did see a $100 iPhone (even on eBay and then it is broken)... And a 1.5 GHz Dual Core Cortex A9 isn't necessarily much faster than a 800 MHz Cortex A8. Depends a lot on software, sd card/memory bandwidth and UMTS data rate. This also forgets that all such portable systems are not steadily running at the highest clock speeds. To save energy. I.e. it is a comparison of the peak CPU performance which is not at all necessary for reading a SMS or looking up a contact. Or watching the locked state :) And we never intended to compete with the tier one hardware - because we still have to learn building such devices and aren't able to purchase the latest chips before they are announced... As soon as we can, there will be a more hyped CPU and LTE... He does mention some good things such as where it is manufactured, being able to run debian/shr/qtmoko... and in his defense, I can't think of too many more good points. Maybe we can put up a 'feature list' of good points that reporters like him can use when writing articles on the GTA04. Please add them to http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Marketing_GTA04#Good_reasons_to_purchase_a_GTA04 or reply to this thread and I will add them to the page at the end of the week. To get the ball rolling I have: * Run qtmoko, SHR, Debian fully supported * Made in Germany under proper working conditions. some more material: * fully documented schematics * fully open bootloader, kernel - no secrets, no overprotection * replaceable battery * 3D CAD data available to design and 3D print your own case * FM receiver/transmitter option with RDS (that is rare) * complete set of sensors (barometer, compass, accelerometer, gyroscope, GPS) * B2B connector to use it as a System on Module * very high display resolution (282 ppi) [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_displays_by_pixel_density] * ... and a friendly community allowing for direct discussions with the core developers (ask for that for an iPhone or Samsung :) Nikolaus ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: [Gta04-owner] New Phoronix article on Gta04
On Wed, 2012-07-04 at 08:11 +0200, Dr. H. Nikolaus Schaller wrote:
Am 04.07.2012 um 05:06 schrieb Alishams Hassam:
http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_itempx=MTEzMjI If you
There is a typical misunderstanding with the specs.
I never did see a $100 iPhone (even on eBay and then it is broken)...
This also forgets that
I wouldn't worry too much about Phoronix. Their reporting is always
sub-par. And moveover, people know their reporting is sub-par. They
seem to be like a tabloid newspaper: they're not so concerned about the
accuracy of their reporting so long as you read the site. They'll quite
happily publish deliberately inflammatory articles to boost their
readership.
I used to have a link to Phoronix on the toolbar of my browser but I
removed it just recently because I got tired of all the nonsense they
write.
--
Bob Ham r...@settrans.net
for (;;) { ++pancakes; }
signature.asc
Description: This is a digitally signed message part
___
Openmoko community mailing list
community@lists.openmoko.org
http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: [Gta04-owner] New Phoronix article on Gta04
On Tue, Jul 3, 2012 at 11:41 PM, Bob Ham r...@settrans.net wrote: I wouldn't worry too much about Phoronix. Their reporting is always sub-par. And moveover, people know their reporting is sub-par. They seem to be like a tabloid newspaper: they're not so concerned about the accuracy of their reporting so long as you read the site. They'll quite happily publish deliberately inflammatory articles to boost their readership. I agree that certainly there articles that are shit. However they also have many good articles and many examples of exemplary reporting. In this case, I would say the article is sub-par, however it is just as much our fault as Phoronix's. My goal with collecting these 'good reasons' is that when future articles are published, the writer won't have to dig through the mailing lists and bug developers for good points. Perhaps the writer tried and those are the best that could be found. Perhaps the writer didn't do enough research; however with the very low amount of press coverage the GTA04 has received, we need to make it easier for those who want to write about it. If Phoronix publishes another article bashing the GTA04 after we have made our case easy to represent, I will agree with your conclusion ;) ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: [Gta04-owner] New Phoronix article on Gta04
On Wednesday, July 04, 2012 05:06:30 AM Alishams Hassam wrote: Maybe we can put up a 'feature list' of good points that reporters like him can use when writing articles on the GTA04. Please add them to http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Marketing_GTA04#Good_reasons_to_purchase_a_G TA04 or reply to this thread and I will add them to the page at the end of the week. I think this is nice idea, but i am afraid noone will find this page. Nicolaus: can we have link straight on gta04.org? I think having good reasons listed somewhere visible is needed, because on mailing lists are discussed mainly problems. To get the ball rolling I have: * Run qtmoko, SHR, Debian fully supported * Made in Germany under proper working conditions. Here are mine: * no online accounts and registration required * offline gps navigation and dictionaries * all applications are free and open source * fast processor and big RAM is not needed - we have fast non bloated software * long term support - freerunner is after 4 years still actively supported phone * gta04 kernel is exceptionally good - most of drivers are in mainline kernel and gta04 kernels are updated with every linux release Regards Radek ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: [Gta04-owner] New Phoronix article on Gta04
Am 04.07.2012 um 10:52 schrieb Radek Polak: On Wednesday, July 04, 2012 05:06:30 AM Alishams Hassam wrote: Maybe we can put up a 'feature list' of good points that reporters like him can use when writing articles on the GTA04. Please add them to http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Marketing_GTA04#Good_reasons_to_purchase_a_G TA04 or reply to this thread and I will add them to the page at the end of the week. I think this is nice idea, but i am afraid noone will find this page. Nicolaus: can we have link straight on gta04.org? Yes, no problem. There is a Wiki behind www.gta04.org and I think everyone who is subscribed can modify it (except the main page). If not, please let me know and I can enable write permission. I have added a Facts and Reasons page: http://projects.goldelico.com/p/gta04-main/page/FactsAndReasons/ I think having good reasons listed somewhere visible is needed, because on mailing lists are discussed mainly problems. To get the ball rolling I have: * Run qtmoko, SHR, Debian fully supported * Made in Germany under proper working conditions. Here are mine: * no online accounts and registration required * offline gps navigation and dictionaries * all applications are free and open source * fast processor and big RAM is not needed - we have fast non bloated software * long term support - freerunner is after 4 years still actively supported phone * gta04 kernel is exceptionally good - most of drivers are in mainline kernel and gta04 kernels are updated with every linux release Regards Radek BR, Nikolaus ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: [Gta04-owner] New Phoronix article on Gta04
On Wed, 2012-07-04 at 00:01 -0700, Alishams Hassam wrote:
On Tue, Jul 3, 2012 at 11:41 PM, Bob Ham r...@settrans.net wrote:
I wouldn't worry too much about Phoronix. Their reporting is always
sub-par. And moveover, people know their reporting is sub-par. They
seem to be like a tabloid newspaper: they're not so concerned about the
accuracy of their reporting so long as you read the site. They'll quite
happily publish deliberately inflammatory articles to boost their
readership.
I agree that certainly there articles that are shit. However they also
have many good articles and many examples of exemplary reporting.
I must say I'm quite surprised by this. I would love to ask for
examples of what you consider to be an examplary article on the site.
However, I think it's probably best if we just agree to disagree :-)
In
this case, I would say the article is sub-par, however it is just as
much our fault as Phoronix's.
Again I'm going to have to disagree; I think it's all Phoronix's
fault :-)
My goal with collecting these 'good
reasons' is that when future articles are published, the writer won't
have to dig through the mailing lists and bug developers for good
points.
You mean they won't have to.. do their job? :-)
If Phoronix publishes another article bashing the GTA04 after we have
made our case easy to represent, I will agree with your conclusion ;)
I'll hold you to you to that :-) But I wouldn't worry about if.
Given Phoronix's usual modus operandi, you can rest assured that a
string of negative, similarly sub-par articles will now ensue.
--
Bob Ham r...@settrans.net
for (;;) { ++pancakes; }
signature.asc
Description: This is a digitally signed message part
___
Openmoko community mailing list
community@lists.openmoko.org
http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
