Re: About the future of the freesmartphone.org middleware
Enrico Zini enr...@enricozini.org writes: This said, oFono does have one very compelling feature: on my N900, it works reliably. Far better than any version of FSO that I ever managed to put on my FreeRunner ever did. If you think that Nokia's N900 firmware is using oFono, you're wrong. Or do you mean something else? -- Be free, use free (http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/free-sw.html) software! mailto:fercer...@gmail.com ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: About the future of the freesmartphone.org middleware
Enrico Zini enr...@enricozini.org writes: What I think is needed now are components that give existing distributions capabilities they didn't have before. Then to see what people develop on top of them. +1 But to be appealing to developers who are new to the system (which basically means, all of them), such componends need to be: few, simple, reliable, stable, easy to deploy, and if not documented, at least coming with some working example code. Should I mention they should also be compilable with the *stable* release of the compiler they need? In the past, and for years, I would even have needed to mention that. I want to believe that at least that has already changed :) Arguably those two paragraphs are already well satisfied by oFono. oFono probably now has the advantage in terms of maturity and deployment, is compilable by a standard C compiler, and has a recent version packaged in Debian. The following may sound pointlessly controversial, but I don't intend it that way; I think it may help the FSO developers to review and understand more precisely their objectives. Why is FSO still needed at all, given that oFono exists and appears to have the development mindshare and advantages noted above? Would your objectives be achieved more quickly or easily by switching to oFono and contributing any needed additions to that? Regards, Neil ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: About the future of the freesmartphone.org middleware
Hi, Arguably those two paragraphs are already well satisfied by oFono. oFono probably now has the advantage in terms of maturity and deployment, is compilable by a standard C compiler, and has a recent version packaged in Debian. FSO is compilable with a standard C compiler as well. Every tarball release we did has been shipping C files. The following may sound pointlessly controversial, but I don't intend it that way; I think it may help the FSO developers to review and understand more precisely their objectives. Why is FSO still needed at all, given that oFono exists and appears to have the development mindshare and advantages noted above? Would your objectives be achieved more quickly or easily by switching to oFono and contributing any needed additions to that? Oh, FSO is so much more than oFono. If you want to compare, then compare oFono to fsogsmd alone. As for the comparison between those two, well, fsogsmd was first, has (IMO, of course) a better architecture, a better API, and supports other modems. And there's no agenda of a company behind – some people may view that as an advantage, rather than a disadvantage. I don't see why we should invest time in something we consider not being superior. Cheers, :M: ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: About the future of the freesmartphone.org middleware
Am 24.07.2012 11:27, schrieb Thomas Munker: Hi, i thought the ui is saving the volume values where it should (using opreference interface), but fso doesn't pick them up. There's an old bugreport in shr-track [0], that suggests it's fso's fault. Maybe this should be clarified. I've found a new bugreport too... [1] And it's been for some years in the fso-track, too: [2] Ok, will look into this bug reports. With the network-registration, i get alwas an error that this feature is not implemented for my modem. Maybe shr uses to old feeds of fso, i don't know. Hm, you're right. I got it wrong cause looking at the wrong place in the source code :) Sorry for that. I will implement this really soon. regards, Simon -- Simon Busch - http://mm.gravedo.de/blog/ ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: About the future of the freesmartphone.org middleware
Thanks a lot, you'r the greatest :) Am 24.07.2012 18:17, schrieb Simon Busch: Am 24.07.2012 11:27, schrieb Thomas Munker: Hi, i thought the ui is saving the volume values where it should (using opreference interface), but fso doesn't pick them up. There's an old bugreport in shr-track [0], that suggests it's fso's fault. Maybe this should be clarified. I've found a new bugreport too... [1] And it's been for some years in the fso-track, too: [2] Ok, will look into this bug reports. With the network-registration, i get alwas an error that this feature is not implemented for my modem. Maybe shr uses to old feeds of fso, i don't know. Hm, you're right. I got it wrong cause looking at the wrong place in the source code :) Sorry for that. I will implement this really soon. regards, Simon ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: About the future of the freesmartphone.org middleware
Am 21.07.2012 21:44, schrieb Thamos: Hi all. I've never seen someone using the conference-feature. I think selecting the provider is more important. (this one really annoys me, since i am near an border and simply can't phone until i get out auf alien range, if the phone switched one time, even reboot doesn't help...). I also miss the possibility to choose loudness of the ringtone reasonably. Most other phones are even able to choose a ringtone based of the caller! Ok, this are two things. The first one regarding switching a different provider should be already possible with the org.freesmartphone.GSM.Network API. Just take a look at the API documentation at [0]. You have to differentiate here. FSO efforts are not about the user experience on the UI side. It's just a middleware enables you to implement such things like loudness handling of the ringtone in your user experience. If you are talking about SHR in detail here just request your feature to the SHR developers. regards, Simon [0]: http://git.freesmartphone.org/?p=specs.git;a=blob_plain;f=html/org.freesmartphone.GSM.Network.html;hb=HEAD#RegisterWithProvider -- Simon Busch - http://mm.gravedo.de/blog/ ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: About the future of the freesmartphone.org middleware
Am 22.07.2012 02:24, schrieb Kai Lüke: Hello, I think these all together will be fine. The only thing I have in my mind beside these is something I ever wanted to try but never did: redirecting sound (e.g. a sound file with pause melody or answerphone) to the call input. It depends a lot on the phone you're using if this is possible and it's nothing I really see in the FSO middleware in the next time as there are other feature which are quite more essential. But if you have time and a good idea how to integrate this please speak up. regards, Simon -- Simon Busch - http://mm.gravedo.de/blog/ ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: About the future of the freesmartphone.org middleware
Am 22.07.2012 03:39, schrieb Pierre Pronchery: Hi Simon, lists, On 21/07/2012 20:45, Simon Busch wrote: as a lot of you may have noticed we did two releases in the past months of the FSO stack. Both were related to bring stability and consistence to the stack. Now I want to talk with you about the future of the stack. [...] Good to hear, thanks for the heads up. For fsogsmd there are the following things on my list: [...] 5. Multi device support: While working in HFP HF support in fsogsmd I discovered that things would be easier if we can control more than one modem with the same daemon at the same time. Think about phone with support for more than one SIM card. Work has already started for this in the morphis/multi-device branch of the cornucopia repository. I fully agree to this, and I have started work to support this in DeforaOS Phone. More specifically, my goal is to be able to support (and integrate) an AT-based modem together with VoIP account(s), Instant Messaging and so on. To help me with this task I am using libpurple (from Pidgin) and sofia-sip (for SIP, obviously). Ok, we're talking here about two different things. My effort for multi device support in fsogsmd is a a step before what you describe. It's not about using VoIP and a AT based modem together. Think about situations where you have more than one modem (and really a modem) to control like in a phone with more than one SIM card or on a laptop where you have a phone connected via HFP HF and a UMTS stick for your data connection. Controlling VoIP and a modem together with the same API is definitely nothing we should do in fsogsmd itself but in telepathy or a fsophoned. regards, Simon -- Simon Busch - http://mm.gravedo.de/blog/ ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: About the future of the freesmartphone.org middleware
Hi all. I've never seen someone using the conference-feature. I think selecting the provider is more important. (this one really annoys me, since i am near an border and simply can't phone until i get out auf alien range, if the phone switched one time, even reboot doesn't help...). I also miss the possibility to choose loudness of the ringtone reasonably. Most other phones are even able to choose a ringtone based of the caller! Apart from that i comply with you. kind regards, Thamos Am 21.07.2012 20:45, schrieb Simon Busch: Hey everybody, as a lot of you may have noticed we did two releases in the past months of the FSO stack. Both were related to bring stability and consistence to the stack. Now I want to talk with you about the future of the stack. In the past we were only concentrating on getting new hardware supported and lost our real focus on creating a middleware suitable for embedded/specific-purpose devices. This is where I want to go back to and get into development again. In the last weeks I looked over several parts we have in our stack and tried to find out where we can improve and get into development of new features again. A lot of you have stability in mind as you want to use something with FSO on your daily phone. Thats the second peace which should be part of the core development focus of the Freesmartphone.org middleware. Getting new features is fast said but I have several things on my list where I want to improve FSO in the next weeks and months. Everything is focused on the core stack which is formed by our framework libraries and the three daemons fsodeviced, fsogsmd and fsousaged. We have other daemons like fsotdld as well but that will be not on my focus. If someone wants to step up with further development of these just go on and get in contact. But please don't get me wrong: I will support all other daemons like fsoaudiod and fsotdld in the next releases too but just not doing any development related work for them. For fsogsmd there are the following things on my list: 1. Get the last peaces of not implemented things in like conference or emergency calls 2. Several API cleanups 3. Get several bugs fixed 4. Do integration testing with a remote controlled phonesim so we can simulate incoming calls etc. This will also included integration testing with a remote controlled fsogsmd on another device 5. Multi device support: While working in HFP HF support in fsogsmd I discovered that things would be easier if we can control more than one modem with the same daemon at the same time. Think about phone with support for more than one SIM card. Work has already started for this in the morphis/multi-device branch of the cornucopia repository. 6. Cleanup of the modem status handling: right now the modem status and SIM/network status are too much tight together. We have cleanly separate them. 7. Internally we don't separate a modem from a AT based modem; that needs to be fixed 8. A lock-down mechanism to keep anyone out when doing a firmware upgrade. When doing a firmware upgrade of a modem we have the problem that nobody should access the modem while this is in progress. The idea is now to implement a dbus API to lock the modem by requesting a lock and only the requesting program can unlock the modem again. While the modem is locked nobody else can access the modem via fsogsmd. fsousaged: - nothing right now fsodeviced: - nothing right now lib*: - I am thinking about grouping all libraries together so just have one single framework library and don't need to maintain several small libraries which increases the complexity of release testing, ABI refinements, etc. Just one libfsoframework; this is only a thought in my head right and nothing concrete. That are some of my toughs were I want to go with FSO in the next months. So no focus on concrete devices but getting the stack itself forward to be ready for every kind of a device. I would be really happy to hear what other people are thinking about the idea behind FSO since it was started back in 2008. What are your missing features? What do you like and what not? regards, Simon ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: About the future of the freesmartphone.org middleware
Hello, I think these all together will be fine. The only thing I have in my mind beside these is something I ever wanted to try but never did: redirecting sound (e.g. a sound file with pause melody or answerphone) to the call input. But just an idea, thanks! Kai Am 21.07.2012 21:44, schrieb Thamos: Hi all. I've never seen someone using the conference-feature. I think selecting the provider is more important. (this one really annoys me, since i am near an border and simply can't phone until i get out auf alien range, if the phone switched one time, even reboot doesn't help...). I also miss the possibility to choose loudness of the ringtone reasonably. Most other phones are even able to choose a ringtone based of the caller! Apart from that i comply with you. kind regards, Thamos Am 21.07.2012 20:45, schrieb Simon Busch: Hey everybody, as a lot of you may have noticed we did two releases in the past months of the FSO stack. Both were related to bring stability and consistence to the stack. Now I want to talk with you about the future of the stack. In the past we were only concentrating on getting new hardware supported and lost our real focus on creating a middleware suitable for embedded/specific-purpose devices. This is where I want to go back to and get into development again. In the last weeks I looked over several parts we have in our stack and tried to find out where we can improve and get into development of new features again. A lot of you have stability in mind as you want to use something with FSO on your daily phone. Thats the second peace which should be part of the core development focus of the Freesmartphone.org middleware. Getting new features is fast said but I have several things on my list where I want to improve FSO in the next weeks and months. Everything is focused on the core stack which is formed by our framework libraries and the three daemons fsodeviced, fsogsmd and fsousaged. We have other daemons like fsotdld as well but that will be not on my focus. If someone wants to step up with further development of these just go on and get in contact. But please don't get me wrong: I will support all other daemons like fsoaudiod and fsotdld in the next releases too but just not doing any development related work for them. For fsogsmd there are the following things on my list: 1. Get the last peaces of not implemented things in like conference or emergency calls 2. Several API cleanups 3. Get several bugs fixed 4. Do integration testing with a remote controlled phonesim so we can simulate incoming calls etc. This will also included integration testing with a remote controlled fsogsmd on another device 5. Multi device support: While working in HFP HF support in fsogsmd I discovered that things would be easier if we can control more than one modem with the same daemon at the same time. Think about phone with support for more than one SIM card. Work has already started for this in the morphis/multi-device branch of the cornucopia repository. 6. Cleanup of the modem status handling: right now the modem status and SIM/network status are too much tight together. We have cleanly separate them. 7. Internally we don't separate a modem from a AT based modem; that needs to be fixed 8. A lock-down mechanism to keep anyone out when doing a firmware upgrade. When doing a firmware upgrade of a modem we have the problem that nobody should access the modem while this is in progress. The idea is now to implement a dbus API to lock the modem by requesting a lock and only the requesting program can unlock the modem again. While the modem is locked nobody else can access the modem via fsogsmd. fsousaged: - nothing right now fsodeviced: - nothing right now lib*: - I am thinking about grouping all libraries together so just have one single framework library and don't need to maintain several small libraries which increases the complexity of release testing, ABI refinements, etc. Just one libfsoframework; this is only a thought in my head right and nothing concrete. That are some of my toughs were I want to go with FSO in the next months. So no focus on concrete devices but getting the stack itself forward to be ready for every kind of a device. I would be really happy to hear what other people are thinking about the idea behind FSO since it was started back in 2008. What are your missing features? What do you like and what not? regards, Simon ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
