Re: GPRS and QTMoko
--- On Wed, 3/9/11, Wesley Frazier wrote: > I have recently discovered if I set (cut ritual) > GPRS data on end, until my next reboot. You ARE quite sure that it does not have to do with the phase of the moon, the number of mushrooms in your basement or anything the like? > The problem is this ritual is sub optimal. Obviously the > first > connection is initializing something that the "Always > Online" mode > fails to. Although I do not know what it could be. Haha, it is not the most optimal, but the results count. I will give it a try! Boudewijn > > -- Forwarded message -- > > From: Brian > > To: community@lists.openmoko.org > > Date: Wed, 9 Mar 2011 08:40:39 -0500 > > Subject: Re: GPRS and QTMoko > > On Wed, 9 Mar 2011 04:14:42 -0800 (PST) > > "W. B. Kranendonk" > wrote: > > > >> --- On Wed, 3/9/11, W. B. Kranendonk > wrote: > >> > --- On Tue, 3/8/11, Wesley Frazier > >> > > >> > wrote: > >> > > If I boot my freerunner up from a > >> > > cold boot and manually start GPRS it > >> > > works fine. (...) it seems to > >> > > stop > >> > I got the same issue on QTMoko 0.33. > >> > A while back GPRS came up as well; > >> came up on the list, that is. > >> > >> > run anything in the background > >> I tried one of the suggestions, run ping in the > background as keep > >> alive. > >> > >> For the last one and a half hour (or something), > ping has been > >> running happily with about 750ms for an answer; > count of icmp_req is > >> 2800 at the moment. > >> > > > > I left an irssi session running for ~12 hours which > never PTO'd. I did > > and still do have problems with GPRS staying connected > whether using on > > demand or always on unless I background something. > > > >> The usefulness of the connection seems to have > dropped though: the > >> first minutes NeronGPS would receive tiles > relatively fast, and > >> browsing websites mostly filled with text would be > OK. > >> > >> At the moment, downloading four tiles for one > screen of NeronGPS > >> takes close to half a minute (increasing icmp > answers to about 2 > >> seconds). > > > > My provider (T-Mobile) has an "unlimited" $1.49 data > day pass which > > slows to a crawl once it hits >30Mb of data. Does > your provider do > > something similar? > > > > I hadn't noticed any slowdowns until hitting this > limit while running > > irssi to keep the connection alive. Once it does slow > down it stays > > slow until I buy another day pass. Does your > connection speed ever > > increase again? > > > > Perhaps using mtr-tiny instead of ping might shed some > light on what's > > happening with your GPRS connection. > > > >> > >> All of this is symptom description of course, I > still have to find > >> out whether I am able to do anything useful with > the underlying code. > >> > >> Regards, > >> > >> Boudewijn > > > > This reminds me of the old days when AOL used to drop > connections which > > usually happened in the middle of a rather large > software update of > > course. > > > > Brian > > > > > > > > ___ > > Openmoko community mailing list > > community@lists.openmoko.org > > http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community > > > > > > > > -- > Wes Frazier > > "Nationalism is an infantile disease. It is the measles of > mankind." - > Albert Einstein > > > > > -- > Wes Frazier > > "Nationalism is an infantile disease. It is the measles of > mankind." - > Albert Einstein > > ___ > Openmoko community mailing list > community@lists.openmoko.org > http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community > ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: GPRS and QTMoko
I have recently discovered if I set the GPRS connection to "Only Connect When Needed" and then start and stop it. THEN switch it to "Always Online" after a fresh reboot, that I then can enjoy days of GPRS data on end, until my next reboot. The problem is this ritual is sub optimal. Obviously the first connection is initializing something that the "Always Online" mode fails to. Although I do not know what it could be. > > -- Forwarded message -- > From: Brian > To: community@lists.openmoko.org > Date: Wed, 9 Mar 2011 08:40:39 -0500 > Subject: Re: GPRS and QTMoko > On Wed, 9 Mar 2011 04:14:42 -0800 (PST) > "W. B. Kranendonk" wrote: > >> --- On Wed, 3/9/11, W. B. Kranendonk wrote: >> > --- On Tue, 3/8/11, Wesley Frazier >> > >> > wrote: >> > > If I boot my freerunner up from a >> > > cold boot and manually start GPRS it >> > > works fine. (...) it seems to >> > > stop >> > I got the same issue on QTMoko 0.33. >> > A while back GPRS came up as well; >> came up on the list, that is. >> >> > run anything in the background >> I tried one of the suggestions, run ping in the background as keep >> alive. >> >> For the last one and a half hour (or something), ping has been >> running happily with about 750ms for an answer; count of icmp_req is >> 2800 at the moment. >> > > I left an irssi session running for ~12 hours which never PTO'd. I did > and still do have problems with GPRS staying connected whether using on > demand or always on unless I background something. > >> The usefulness of the connection seems to have dropped though: the >> first minutes NeronGPS would receive tiles relatively fast, and >> browsing websites mostly filled with text would be OK. >> >> At the moment, downloading four tiles for one screen of NeronGPS >> takes close to half a minute (increasing icmp answers to about 2 >> seconds). > > My provider (T-Mobile) has an "unlimited" $1.49 data day pass which > slows to a crawl once it hits >30Mb of data. Does your provider do > something similar? > > I hadn't noticed any slowdowns until hitting this limit while running > irssi to keep the connection alive. Once it does slow down it stays > slow until I buy another day pass. Does your connection speed ever > increase again? > > Perhaps using mtr-tiny instead of ping might shed some light on what's > happening with your GPRS connection. > >> >> All of this is symptom description of course, I still have to find >> out whether I am able to do anything useful with the underlying code. >> >> Regards, >> >> Boudewijn > > This reminds me of the old days when AOL used to drop connections which > usually happened in the middle of a rather large software update of > course. > > Brian > > > > ___ > Openmoko community mailing list > community@lists.openmoko.org > http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community > > -- Wes Frazier "Nationalism is an infantile disease. It is the measles of mankind." - Albert Einstein -- Wes Frazier "Nationalism is an infantile disease. It is the measles of mankind." - Albert Einstein ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: GPRS and QTMoko
On Wed, 9 Mar 2011 04:14:42 -0800 (PST) "W. B. Kranendonk" wrote: > --- On Wed, 3/9/11, W. B. Kranendonk wrote: > > --- On Tue, 3/8/11, Wesley Frazier > > > > wrote: > > > If I boot my freerunner up from a > > > cold boot and manually start GPRS it > > > works fine. (...) it seems to > > > stop > > I got the same issue on QTMoko 0.33. > > A while back GPRS came up as well; > came up on the list, that is. > > > run anything in the background > I tried one of the suggestions, run ping in the background as keep > alive. > > For the last one and a half hour (or something), ping has been > running happily with about 750ms for an answer; count of icmp_req is > 2800 at the moment. > I left an irssi session running for ~12 hours which never PTO'd. I did and still do have problems with GPRS staying connected whether using on demand or always on unless I background something. > The usefulness of the connection seems to have dropped though: the > first minutes NeronGPS would receive tiles relatively fast, and > browsing websites mostly filled with text would be OK. > > At the moment, downloading four tiles for one screen of NeronGPS > takes close to half a minute (increasing icmp answers to about 2 > seconds). My provider (T-Mobile) has an "unlimited" $1.49 data day pass which slows to a crawl once it hits >30Mb of data. Does your provider do something similar? I hadn't noticed any slowdowns until hitting this limit while running irssi to keep the connection alive. Once it does slow down it stays slow until I buy another day pass. Does your connection speed ever increase again? Perhaps using mtr-tiny instead of ping might shed some light on what's happening with your GPRS connection. > > All of this is symptom description of course, I still have to find > out whether I am able to do anything useful with the underlying code. > > Regards, > > Boudewijn This reminds me of the old days when AOL used to drop connections which usually happened in the middle of a rather large software update of course. Brian ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: GPRS and QTMoko
--- On Wed, 3/9/11, W. B. Kranendonk wrote: > --- On Tue, 3/8/11, Wesley Frazier > > wrote: > > If I boot my freerunner up from a > > cold boot and manually start GPRS it > > works fine. (...) it seems to > > stop > I got the same issue on QTMoko 0.33. > A while back GPRS came up as well; came up on the list, that is. > run anything in the background I tried one of the suggestions, run ping in the background as keep alive. For the last one and a half hour (or something), ping has been running happily with about 750ms for an answer; count of icmp_req is 2800 at the moment. The usefulness of the connection seems to have dropped though: the first minutes NeronGPS would receive tiles relatively fast, and browsing websites mostly filled with text would be OK. At the moment, downloading four tiles for one screen of NeronGPS takes close to half a minute (increasing icmp answers to about 2 seconds). All of this is symptom description of course, I still have to find out whether I am able to do anything useful with the underlying code. Regards, Boudewijn ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: GPRS and QTMoko
--- On Tue, 3/8/11, Wesley Frazier wrote: > If I boot my freerunner up from a > cold boot and manually start GPRS it > works fine. (...) it seems to > stop > working,(...)Regardless of whether or not it is set to "On > Demand" or > not. I got the same issue on QTMoko 0.33. I can prevent it by turning on multiplexing under modem settings in NeoControl: then it won't connect at all. A while back GPRS came up as well; anyone with an uninterrupted connection, could you tell whether you run anything in the background or prevent bursts of activity, or anything the like? Boudewijn ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
GPRS and QTMoko
If I boot my freerunner up from a cold boot and manually start GPRS it works fine. But if I am idle too long on GPRS it seems to stop working, Aurora wont be able to connect and my email will stop checking. Regardless of whether or not it is set to "On Demand" or not. WiFi does not seem to have this issue. Any suggestions? -- Wes Frazier "Nationalism is an infantile disease. It is the measles of mankind." - Albert Einstein ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: GPRS and QtMoko (v32): can't
Il 11/02/2011 09:35, Radek Polak ha scritto: Yup, i just select new GPRS connection, fill APN=internet username=1 password=1 then i do Connect and it's connected. Sometimes i had to press Connect twice. But i works here. Maybe problem is when username or password is not filled. I tried the following settings (Vodafone sim): APN= mobile.vodafone.it username=a password=a (random user and pass) I'll buy a Wind sim, some italian users have no trouble with it! Regards Radek Kind regards, Ugo Raffaele ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: GPRS and QtMoko (v32): can't
On Thursday 10 February 2011 11:50:28 Ugo Raffaele Piemontese wrote: > you are able to connect to the internet via gprs somehow (even if it > hangs later)? Yup, i just select new GPRS connection, fill APN=internet username=1 password=1 then i do Connect and it's connected. Sometimes i had to press Connect twice. But i works here. Maybe problem is when username or password is not filled. Regards Radek ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: GPRS and QtMoko (v32): can't
Ugo Raffaele Piemontese píše v Čt 10. 02. 2011 v 11:50 +0100: > Il 10/02/2011 09:24, Radek Polak ha scritto: > > On Wednesday 09 February 2011 18:28:48 Timo Juhani Lindfors wrote: > >> This is http://docs.openmoko.org/trac/ticket/2264 which has been > >> worked around 4 months ago. Nobody has complained that the fix > >> wouldn't work :-) > > This fix is in qtmoko for long time. I tried it and i looked ok. But this > > weekend i was using FR for sharing internet with PC and the GPRS always > > hanged > > up somehow - it was ok for some web pages but i was unable to transfer > > anything bigger. I was trying ~2MB file transfer over sftp and after many > > attempts i had to give up. I also tried to limit sfpt upload to 1kb/s but > > that > > didnt help either - so did it over wifi ;-) > > > > Regards > > > > Radek > > So Radek, > > you are able to connect to the internet via gprs somehow (even if it > hangs later)? > I can connect via GPRS (T-mobile CZ) also. But connection is not very stable - I'm not able to stay OnLine longer than cca 1 minute. Zb. > Ugo Raffaele > > ___ > Openmoko community mailing list > community@lists.openmoko.org > http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community > ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: GPRS and QtMoko (v32): can't
Il 10/02/2011 09:24, Radek Polak ha scritto: On Wednesday 09 February 2011 18:28:48 Timo Juhani Lindfors wrote: This is http://docs.openmoko.org/trac/ticket/2264 which has been worked around 4 months ago. Nobody has complained that the fix wouldn't work :-) This fix is in qtmoko for long time. I tried it and i looked ok. But this weekend i was using FR for sharing internet with PC and the GPRS always hanged up somehow - it was ok for some web pages but i was unable to transfer anything bigger. I was trying ~2MB file transfer over sftp and after many attempts i had to give up. I also tried to limit sfpt upload to 1kb/s but that didnt help either - so did it over wifi ;-) Regards Radek So Radek, you are able to connect to the internet via gprs somehow (even if it hangs later)? Ugo Raffaele ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: GPRS and QtMoko (v32): can't
Radek Polak writes: > Ahh sorry i wasnt clear. When i applied your patch i tested downloads. But > this weekend when i had hangs i was actually uploading. Can you verify that "tc qdisc" really shows the tbf? ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: GPRS and QtMoko (v32): can't
On Thursday 10 February 2011 10:00:43 Timo Juhani Lindfors wrote: > So you are talking about downloads here? Ahh sorry i wasnt clear. When i applied your patch i tested downloads. But this weekend when i had hangs i was actually uploading. Regards Radek ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: GPRS and QtMoko (v32): can't
Radek Polak writes: > This fix is in qtmoko for long time. I tried it and i looked ok. But this > weekend i was using FR for sharing internet with PC and the GPRS always > hanged > up somehow - it was ok for some web pages but i was unable to transfer > anything bigger. So you are talking about downloads here? /sbin/tc qdisc add dev ppp0 root tbf rate 7kbit latency 4500ms burst 3200 only affects uploads! I didn't know that downloads could cause a problem. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: GPRS and QtMoko (v32): can't
Hi All, I have had the same problem since i bought the freerunner, with all distros (OM200x, gentoo, qtmoko) The way i work arround it is by disabling the multiplexer and use the modem directly. That way i have a stable gprs connection. And when i am done using the gprs connection i restart the multiplexer again. Kind regards, Ed On Thursday 10 February 2011 09:24:58 Radek Polak wrote: > On Wednesday 09 February 2011 18:28:48 Timo Juhani Lindfors wrote: > > This is http://docs.openmoko.org/trac/ticket/2264 which has been > > worked around 4 months ago. Nobody has complained that the fix > > wouldn't work :-) > > This fix is in qtmoko for long time. I tried it and i looked ok. But this > weekend i was using FR for sharing internet with PC and the GPRS always > hanged up somehow - it was ok for some web pages but i was unable to > transfer anything bigger. I was trying ~2MB file transfer over sftp and > after many attempts i had to give up. I also tried to limit sfpt upload to > 1kb/s but that didnt help either - so did it over wifi ;-) > > Regards > > Radek > > ___ > Openmoko community mailing list > community@lists.openmoko.org > http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: GPRS and QtMoko (v32): can't
On Wednesday 09 February 2011 18:28:48 Timo Juhani Lindfors wrote: > This is http://docs.openmoko.org/trac/ticket/2264 which has been > worked around 4 months ago. Nobody has complained that the fix > wouldn't work :-) This fix is in qtmoko for long time. I tried it and i looked ok. But this weekend i was using FR for sharing internet with PC and the GPRS always hanged up somehow - it was ok for some web pages but i was unable to transfer anything bigger. I was trying ~2MB file transfer over sftp and after many attempts i had to give up. I also tried to limit sfpt upload to 1kb/s but that didnt help either - so did it over wifi ;-) Regards Radek ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: GPRS and QtMoko (v32): can't
On 9 February 2011 17:54, Gennady Kupava wrote: > So, now one who want to archive stable GPRS should: > 3. manage rate on interface according to description in that PR. :) Is there a package containing tc for SHR? I don't have tc already installed on my SHR-T, and a few quick google attempts didn't turn up a package name. Thanks, Neil ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: GPRS and QtMoko (v32): can't
В Срд, 09/02/2011 в 19:28 +0200, Timo Juhani Lindfors пишет: > Gennady Kupava writes: > > 3. Also sometimes session hangs (usually while heavy traffic, probably > > due some bug in gsm chip), so you have to restart all pppd. > > This is http://docs.openmoko.org/trac/ticket/2264 which has been > worked around 4 months ago. Nobody has complained that the fix > wouldn't work :-) > Ah, excellent job! I just missed it/forgot it somehow. Last time I checked GPRS in summer. So, now one who want to archive stable GPRS should: 3. manage rate on interface according to description in that PR. :) Gennady ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: GPRS and QtMoko (v32): can't
Gennady Kupava writes: > 3. Also sometimes session hangs (usually while heavy traffic, probably > due some bug in gsm chip), so you have to restart all pppd. This is http://docs.openmoko.org/trac/ticket/2264 which has been worked around 4 months ago. Nobody has complained that the fix wouldn't work :-) ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: GPRS and QtMoko (v32): can't
Il 09/02/2011 17:30, David M. Danielsson ha scritto: Hi. Sorry, my cat stepped on the keyboard (the previous empty mail). I'm using QtMoko v31 and can't get online with gprs either. I have been trying since v26 and no luck. Thanks for the feedback, guys! Now, this is a big problem for me... I am developing an app for GPS tracking on QtMoko (since sms-sentry has never worked on SHR on my phone) and this bug is a show-stopper! :( I've never used pppd so I'm not familiar with it. Is there someone skilled to help me and, eventually, fix the bug in QtMoko? Kind regards, Ugo Raffaele ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: GPRS and QtMoko (v32): can't
В Срд, 09/02/2011 в 16:17 +, David M. Danielsson пишет: > > I can't reach the net from my OpenMoko GTA02 phone via GPRS, both in "Always > > online" and "When needed" modes. > > I'm currently using QtMoko v32 and Vodafone Italy is my provider (the apn is > > mobile.vodafone.it on my Android phone). > > > > Is someone having the same issue? Could you help me, please? > > For me it never worked, but i tested loong ago. I guess qtmoko needs someone to review GPRS and wifi GUIs. But atm, as fall-back, you can pure pppd, this is not as easy, but should work. I don't know if you familiar with GPRS in FR, so here is list of things to consider (from my experience of using GPRS in plain debian): 1. Unusual part is 'gsm mux' which is need to have gprs and gsm at once (i think neotool has such setting). 2. Also, due to some bugs here i have to do ping -i 10 in parallel to GPRS to have stable session. 3. Also sometimes session hangs (usually while heavy traffic, probably due some bug in gsm chip), so you have to restart all pppd. Guys with more experience can point to trac i guess :) Gennady. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: GPRS and QtMoko (v32): can't
Hi. Sorry, my cat stepped on the keyboard (the previous empty mail). I'm using QtMoko v31 and can't get online with gprs either. I have been trying since v26 and no luck. I have been able to get online with SHR, so this should not be a problem with my provider. The following is from syslog, when I try to connect using the "internet" interface: Feb 9 15:58:59 neo pppd[2868]: pppd 2.4.4 started by root, uid 0 Feb 9 15:59:02 neo chat[2872]: send (\K\K\K\d+++ATH^M) Feb 9 15:59:03 neo chat[2872]: abort on (NO CARRIER) Feb 9 15:59:03 neo chat[2872]: abort on (NO DIALTONE) Feb 9 15:59:03 neo chat[2872]: abort on (BUSY) Feb 9 15:59:03 neo chat[2872]: timeout set to 30 seconds Feb 9 15:59:03 neo chat[2872]: expect (OK) Feb 9 15:59:33 neo chat[2872]: alarm Feb 9 15:59:33 neo chat[2872]: Failed Feb 9 15:59:35 neo pppd[2868]: Connect script failed Feb 9 15:59:35 neo pppd[2868]: Exit. So, there seems to be a problem with the chat scripts. I'm currently trying to get more debug output from pppd and try to figure this out. I have tried to remove the first line from the chat script, as someone suggested, but with no changes. Best regards, David. On Wed, 2011-02-09 at 16:17 +, David M. Danielsson wrote: > On Wed, 2011-02-09 at 07:40 -0800, UgoRaffaele wrote: > > Hi, > > > > I can't reach the net from my OpenMoko GTA02 phone via GPRS, both in "Always > > online" and "When needed" modes. > > I'm currently using QtMoko v32 and Vodafone Italy is my provider (the apn is > > mobile.vodafone.it on my Android phone). > > > > Is someone having the same issue? Could you help me, please? > > > > Kind regards, > > Ugo Raffaele > > > > ___ > Openmoko community mailing list > community@lists.openmoko.org > http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: GPRS and QtMoko (v32): can't
On Wed, 2011-02-09 at 07:40 -0800, UgoRaffaele wrote: > Hi, > > I can't reach the net from my OpenMoko GTA02 phone via GPRS, both in "Always > online" and "When needed" modes. > I'm currently using QtMoko v32 and Vodafone Italy is my provider (the apn is > mobile.vodafone.it on my Android phone). > > Is someone having the same issue? Could you help me, please? > > Kind regards, > Ugo Raffaele ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: GPRS and QtMoko (v32): can't
Same here I could never connect to movistar.es (spanish operator) from qtmoko (any version I tried) I can connect perfectly with the same data from shr On Miércoles 09 Febrero 2011 16:40:17 UgoRaffaele escribió: > Hi, > > I can't reach the net from my OpenMoko GTA02 phone via GPRS, both in > "Always online" and "When needed" modes. > I'm currently using QtMoko v32 and Vodafone Italy is my provider (the apn > is mobile.vodafone.it on my Android phone). > > Is someone having the same issue? Could you help me, please? > > Kind regards, > Ugo Raffaele signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
GPRS and QtMoko (v32): can't
Hi, I can't reach the net from my OpenMoko GTA02 phone via GPRS, both in "Always online" and "When needed" modes. I'm currently using QtMoko v32 and Vodafone Italy is my provider (the apn is mobile.vodafone.it on my Android phone). Is someone having the same issue? Could you help me, please? Kind regards, Ugo Raffaele -- View this message in context: http://openmoko-public-mailinglists.1958.n2.nabble.com/GPRS-and-QtMoko-v32-can-t-tp6008107p6008107.html Sent from the Openmoko Community mailing list archive at Nabble.com. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
