Re: Lipstick on a fetus
Harald Welte wrote: > So please exercise patience. When we started selling phase1, I made an > internal comment that I don't think the software stack will mature a lot > during the first 2-3 months after the hardware release. Compared to > that, there was actually quite a lot of progress, mainly thanks to > Mickey, Stefan, Daniel and O-Hand. I might add that even this went on the cost of me working more on the thorough planning of the entire OpenMoko platform roadmap -- which is pretty important work as well and which I will immediately continue with once the most pressuring issues for P1 buyers have been resolved. Which -- considering where we've been 6 months before -- will be hopefully soon enough. -- - Michael Lauer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> http://openmoko.org/ Software for the worlds' first truly open Free Software mobile phone ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Lipstick on a fetus
On Wed, Aug 22, 2007 at 12:56:00AM -0400, Ken Young wrote: >I've really enjoyed playing with my neo1973, and I'm very glad I bought > it. I've written a little PDA application for it which I hope other > people will eventually have fun with. But I must say I'm a bit worried > by the implications of the effort that has been put into the new 2007.2 > interface. > >I have made perhaps 6 successful phone calls with my neo. > I have *never* been able to use the data service. I have *never* > successfully received a phone call. I have *always* had to reboot the > neo after placing a phone call, before I could make a second phone call. > After the reboot, I must run alsactl. I have an AT&T SIM which > occasionally works, and a known-good T-Mobile SIM which has never worked > once in the neo. Perhaps a few more hours looking through the Wiki > would allow me to find solutions to all of these problems. Perhaps > a few well-timed questions on the IRC channel would enlighten me. I > have not really cared, because the fact that I can occasionally make > a call means my hardware is almost certainly OK, and I had assumed that > the high-level developers would fairly quickly (since the "Mass Market" > version is scheduled for October) fix up the problems with the phone > application. I'm primarily interested in the neo as a PDA and GPS > device. But as far as I can tell, the usability of the phone > software has not improved at all in the few weeks I've had the phone > (I've tried several different builds of the code). We are very well aware of this situation, but please let me emphasize once again that we are a _really_ small team that builds everything, from hardware design through hardware implementation, testing, production process, logistics, UI design, framework, applications, distribution management, software packaging, hardware packaging, webshop, sales, ... I don't really know if those numbers are public, but the last time I've seen our list of employees in the Taipei office, there are something like 25 people on the openmoko side, and about the same number on the FIC Mobility hardware side. Of both the hardware and software R&D team, only half of them are actually working on GTA01/GTA02. So any progress will inevitably be slow. And everybody has many different tasks/jobs inside the company. Since the whole idea of GTA02 was introduced very late in the project progress, it meant that a significant amount of resources had to be put into the GTA02 hardware design, verification, production process, system level software. Those are all resources that were taken away from finishing the software side, especially on the GSM part. The issue is like this: The more effort we put into the GTA02 hardware, the higher the chance is that we won't have any serious hardware problems. The GSM software side (and actually hardware side) of GTA01 and GTA02 are identical. We have verified the GSM part up to a point where we are confident that there are no hardware bugs. This means there is no urgent need to work on the GSM side. However, if we reduce our GTA02 hardware design and verification efforts, then we might get the GSM side running faster. But at what expense? At a delayed GTA02 hardware, potential liabilities, or god beware even re-calls or lots of failing units. This combined with the fact that openmoko is being spun off into a separate company (actually a whole series of companies in various countries), the entire company moving into new offices - which again drew significant R&D resources away. So please exercise patience. When we started selling phase1, I made an internal comment that I don't think the software stack will mature a lot during the first 2-3 months after the hardware release. Compared to that, there was actually quite a lot of progress, mainly thanks to Mickey, Stefan, Daniel and O-Hand. -- - Harald Welte <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> http://openmoko.org/ Software for the world's first truly open Free Software mobile phone ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Lipstick on a fetus
Hi Ken, I hope once you've tested 2007.2 you will find there have been many improvements in the Dialer. We have re-written large parts of it in an effort to make it simpler and more stable. There are still teething problems lower down the stack (gsmd for example), but significant progress is being made. One of the aims of 2007.2 was to simplify our approach so we could concentrate on getting the core features working well (such as making and receiving calls). Please help us by testing the snapshots and filing bugs on bugzilla.openmoko.org. Regards, Thomas -- OpenedHand Ltd. Unit R Homesdale Business Center / 216-218 Homesdale Road / Bromley / BR1 2QZ / UK Tel: +44 (0)20 8819 6559 Expert Open Source For Consumer Devices - http://o-hand.com/ ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Lipstick on a fetus
I've really enjoyed playing with my neo1973, and I'm very glad I bought it. I've written a little PDA application for it which I hope other people will eventually have fun with. But I must say I'm a bit worried by the implications of the effort that has been put into the new 2007.2 interface. I have made perhaps 6 successful phone calls with my neo. I have *never* been able to use the data service. I have *never* successfully received a phone call. I have *always* had to reboot the neo after placing a phone call, before I could make a second phone call. After the reboot, I must run alsactl. I have an AT&T SIM which occasionally works, and a known-good T-Mobile SIM which has never worked once in the neo. Perhaps a few more hours looking through the Wiki would allow me to find solutions to all of these problems. Perhaps a few well-timed questions on the IRC channel would enlighten me. I have not really cared, because the fact that I can occasionally make a call means my hardware is almost certainly OK, and I had assumed that the high-level developers would fairly quickly (since the "Mass Market" version is scheduled for October) fix up the problems with the phone application. I'm primarily interested in the neo as a PDA and GPS device. But as far as I can tell, the usability of the phone software has not improved at all in the few weeks I've had the phone (I've tried several different builds of the code). It seems obvious to me that before a cell phone can be released to the Mass Market, the instructions for using it as a phone must be no more complicated than 1) Acquire a SIM from a supported carrier 2) Insert SIM 3) Turn on phone 4) Dial phone number. No ATDT commands. No trips to the Wiki. No new friends on IRC. I'm pretty sure that the reason my neo does not work this smoothly is not a UI design problem. I think a cell phone could be marketed without a pretty UI, and kinetic scrolling. I think it could be sold even if the GPS feature is still not usable. But it better make phone calls reliably, and I've loaded the 2007.2 rootfs, and it is no better than 2007.1 in that regard. Just my two cents - I hope I'm not sounding like a grouch. I like the neo, and appreciate very much the effort that has gone into developing it. Ken Young ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community