Re: OpenMoko != Neo1973 (Was: Openness (was RE: Concern for usability and ergonomics))

2007-06-13 Thread Shawn Rutledge
Would you post more details about this please? I have used JTAG for programming Atmel micros but am not yet very familiar with how it is used for system exploration when there are multiple devices on the bus. What is your favorite hardware and software for doing this? On 6/12/07, [EMAIL

Re: OpenMoko != Neo1973 (Was: Openness (was RE: Concern for usability and ergonomics))

2007-06-13 Thread Werner Almesberger
Shawn Rutledge wrote: used for system exploration when there are multiple devices on the bus. We only have the Samsung MCU in the JTAG chain. What is your favorite hardware and software for doing this? We use our own debug board. You need a special flexible cable to connect to JTAG (*), and

Re: OpenMoko != Neo1973 (Was: Openness (was RE: Concern for usability and ergonomics))

2007-06-13 Thread michael
JTAG is basically a way to inspect and/or set each and every register on the processor, not only the registers you're familiar with from a programmer's point of view, but also registers that might hold the state of input and output pins, etc. Also since you can control each register and single

Re: OpenMoko != Neo1973 (Was: Openness (was RE: Concern for usability and ergonomics))

2007-06-13 Thread Bryan Larsen
Marcin Juszkiewicz wrote: Dnia środa, 13 czerwca 2007, Werner Almesberger napisał: Shawn Rutledge wrote: What is your favorite hardware and software for doing this? We use our own debug board. You need a special flexible cable to connect to JTAG (*), and our board has the corresponding

OpenMoko != Neo1973 (Was: Openness (was RE: Concern for usability and ergonomics))

2007-06-12 Thread Rod Whitby
kenneth marken wrote: but the neo seems to be designed from day one to be made from virtually of the shelf parts. FIC is just the hired factory (like how apple do for their stuff or microsoft does for the xbox's), they hold no copyright or patent on the neo iirc. so if FIC comes up short, one

Re: OpenMoko != Neo1973 (Was: Openness (was RE: Concern for usability and ergonomics))

2007-06-12 Thread Joe Friedrichsen
On 6/12/07, Rod Whitby [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: OpenMoko (the registered organisation, separate from FIC the company who is creating the first piece of hardware designed for the OpenMoko software) never promised open hardware. They promised open software (the OpenMoko software, which is being

Re: OpenMoko != Neo1973 (Was: Openness (was RE: Concern for usability and ergonomics))

2007-06-12 Thread Werner Almesberger
Joe Friedrichsen wrote: Yes, most of the hardware designs and schematics aren't distributed, Actually, I hope that we can release at least schematics of the debug board and the immediate surroundings of the MCU. There seems to be a lot of red tape surrounding all this, though :-( but there are

Re: OpenMoko != Neo1973 (Was: Openness (was RE: Concern for usability and ergonomics))

2007-06-12 Thread Rod Whitby
Joe Friedrichsen wrote: Given that this phone is meant to be opened and tinkered with I'm not sure that that is actually the case. (Sean, please correct me if I am wrong in the following - I will be pleasantly surprised if you are able to do so). Yes, the OpenMoko software is meant to be fully

Re: OpenMoko != Neo1973 (Was: Openness (was RE: Concern for usability and ergonomics))

2007-06-12 Thread michael
On Tue, 12 Jun 2007, Joe Friedrichsen wrote: On 6/12/07, Rod Whitby [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: OpenMoko (the registered organisation, separate from FIC the company who is creating the first piece of hardware designed for the OpenMoko software) never promised open hardware. They promised