Re: More HW from OpenMoko
Jay Vaughan [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: openmoko hardware? make a synthesizer platform. yes please, i'll take 2,000, thanks. Get a USB midisport or similar device and hook it up the freerunner's usb host port. Add Jack and some synths and you're good to go :-). The question now is how many synths use fixed point math and what their load is like. I recall many years ago doing some stuff on my 166Mhz pentium so it might work. Now if only Jack used fixed point math instead of representing samples as 32-bit floats (granted there are quality issues with switching to a fixed point representation when mixing a lot of audio sources, but a slight degradation would be acceptable and probably not noticable for performance work). -- Leebert: You don't listen to music. Leebert: You listen to the audio equivalent of /dev/urandom ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: More HW from OpenMoko
Get a USB midisport or similar device and hook it up the freerunner's usb host port. Add Jack and some synths and you're good to go :-). yup. emagic mt4 works great, btw, but i hate my dodgy cable. would love it if there were a more factory-made USB/Host+Slave cable that just plain worked. but yeah, i'm finding the neo1973 a very nice little screen to sit on the MIDI bus and tell me whats going on. the 19 rack full of synths suddely has a little window. ;) seq24 + neo1973 + MIDI + multitimbral synth==great fun! The question now is how many synths use fixed point math and what their load is like. I recall many years ago doing some stuff on my 166Mhz pentium so it might work. Now if only Jack used fixed point math instead of representing samples as 32-bit floats (granted there are quality issues with switching to a fixed point representation when mixing a lot of audio sources, but a slight degradation would be acceptable and probably not noticable for performance work). floats on ARM are pitiful, its true, but i think next-gen ARM may well address that issue nicely, so lets hope we keep seeing more ARM-army ARM farms out there on the end of peoples arms .. ; -- Jay Vaughan ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: More HW from OpenMoko
That's the reason I was posting about XCAS[1], a Computer Algebra System that runs in ARM devices, and the main developer know about programming for restricted resources devices (calculators). The main challenge is the User Interface (hardware and software): - Hardware: keypad? - Software: It must be easy and fast for first time users There are many other options[2], [1] http://www-fourier.ujf-grenoble.fr/~parisse/giac.html [2] http://code.google.com/p/sympy/ 2008/7/1, steve [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Mathematica would be cool -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Rodolphe Ortalo Sent: Tuesday, July 01, 2008 10:16 AM To: community@lists.openmoko.org Subject: RE: More HW from OpenMoko Given the freerunner hw, you can certainly do much better than that! I would expect something like mathematica in your pocket... ;-) (In fact, you sort of have already the rpn calculator via dc.) Hey, that's what I wanted as a second project after doing the current simple calculator. But I was short of time for trying to do it (plus the fact that it is not easy do decide between doing something entirely new and porting an existing software). Rodolphe Le samedi 28 juin 2008 à 11:36 -0700, steve a écrit : RPN please. Actually it would be cool to do retro versions of the old HP prgrammable calcs ( 12 etc etc) Hehe, like donkey kong on the PC. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Jose Manrique Lopez de la Fuente Sent: Saturday, June 28, 2008 8:39 AM To: List for Openmoko community discussion Subject: Re: More HW from OpenMoko Why not a powerful handeld graphic calculator? 2008/6/28, Al Johnson [EMAIL PROTECTED]: On Saturday 28 June 2008, Robert Schuster wrote: Hi, Mickey writes: Openmoko is selling hardware products. Heck, why must OpenMoko only sell mobile phones? That's all they've sold direct so far, but it was said a long time ago that non-phone products may be in the pipeline I like Linux-based devices that are free as in freedom. So I would likely also buy a device from OpenMoko if it is a wireless router, a SOHO NAS (think NSLU2), a PDA or perhaps a gaming handheld. I would prefer Openmoko to fill holes where there aren't already free devices available. Most of the areas you mention already have hardware available that's as open as the Neo1973 and Freerunner: Routers - wireless or not: PC Engines ALIX series - http://www.pcengines.ch/ MicroTik RouterBOARDs - http://www.routerboard.com/comparison.html SOHO NAS: http://www.linuxdevices.com/news/NS5637467946.html Gaming handheld: Pandora Then there's the Neuros OSD which really needs a successor with a better output than composite video, but is otherwise rather nice. The PDA is one area there's a gap I would like filling. I want a modern incarnation of the Psion 5. I'll just have to see how the Freerunner plus a bluetooth keyboard do as a replacement. It might just be close enough... I would also like a less power-hungry version of the Chumby, available outside the US. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community -- J. Manrique López de la Fuente http://www.jsmanrique.es ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community -- J. Manrique López de la Fuente http://www.jsmanrique.es ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: More HW from OpenMoko
Maybe you have to take into account the fact that computations could probably run for much longer on the 11/780 than what could be possible on a battery-powered FreeRunner. But well, as far as I remember, it was also pretty difficult to get the the Vax 11/780 into one's pocket. ;-) Rodolphe Le mardi 01 juillet 2008 à 16:20 -0400, Ken Young a écrit : Rodolphe Ortalo: Given the freerunner hw, you can certainly do much better than that! I would expect something like mathematica in your pocket... ;-) The neo1973 has ~8 times the floating point performance of a VAX 11/780 (double precision). The initial version of Mathematica was developed on a VAX 11/750 - the Freerunner should be about 20 times faster than that machine in floating point. It was also rare to run across an 11/750 with more than 4 MByte of RAM. Ken Young ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: More HW from OpenMoko
Probably not so much effort. But the real challenge imo is: - the UI and the communication between that UI and the backend (scientific-oriented) software - the wise specification of that backend (numerical vs. symbolic vs. both, reusing existing software vs. new thing, simple vs. complex) Personnally, I thought I would be targeting a brand new implementation of some scientific calculator targetted at second-grade students; but given the wonderful (and often much more ambitious) software already existing, I have been wondering for several months if that's not re-inventing the wheel (aka as a dead-end project). Rodolphe Le mardi 01 juillet 2008 à 22:28 +0200, Francesco Cat a écrit : How much would a Octave port take??? :) 2008/7/1 Ken Young [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Rodolphe Ortalo: Given the freerunner hw, you can certainly do much better than that! I would expect something like mathematica in your pocket... ;-) The neo1973 has ~8 times the floating point performance of a VAX 11/780 (double precision). The initial version of Mathematica was developed on a VAX 11/750 - the Freerunner should be about 20 times faster than that machine in floating point. It was also rare to run across an 11/750 with more than 4 MByte of RAM. Ken Young ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: More HW from OpenMoko
Thanks for the links. I agree the main challenge is the UI. I think there is another challenge in defining the limits of the target implementation and the (not-too-wrong) selection of the appropriate scientific software to reuse. There is plenty of existing implementations to get inspiration from for the UI (all the real scientific calculators everyone used during his own studies); but none of these had the computing power and available mathematical software that modern Unix systems can have readily available. Is it possible (realistic) to have an UI flexible enough to take advantage of all these opportunities? joke Ah, if only the Freerunner was a closed computing device with only one supplier of computational software... /joke Well, maybe we could ask to some real mathematician: do you think a student should have raw access to Matlab+Mathematica+Octave +any-other-thing-you-can-thinkof or should be given a more uniform shell for scientific computations (with its inherent limitations)? Professors would probably say: different software (for different students and different grades). But well, I would certainly try to avoid implementing several UIs... endless-dilemma Sadly, I am both an engineer and a teacher. Argh... /endless-dilemna Rodolphe Le mercredi 02 juillet 2008 à 12:41 +0200, Jose Manrique Lopez de la Fuente a écrit : That's the reason I was posting about XCAS[1], a Computer Algebra System that runs in ARM devices, and the main developer know about programming for restricted resources devices (calculators). The main challenge is the User Interface (hardware and software): - Hardware: keypad? - Software: It must be easy and fast for first time users There are many other options[2], [1] http://www-fourier.ujf-grenoble.fr/~parisse/giac.html [2] http://code.google.com/p/sympy/ 2008/7/1, steve [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Mathematica would be cool -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Rodolphe Ortalo Sent: Tuesday, July 01, 2008 10:16 AM To: community@lists.openmoko.org Subject: RE: More HW from OpenMoko Given the freerunner hw, you can certainly do much better than that! I would expect something like mathematica in your pocket... ;-) (In fact, you sort of have already the rpn calculator via dc.) Hey, that's what I wanted as a second project after doing the current simple calculator. But I was short of time for trying to do it (plus the fact that it is not easy do decide between doing something entirely new and porting an existing software). Rodolphe Le samedi 28 juin 2008 à 11:36 -0700, steve a écrit : RPN please. Actually it would be cool to do retro versions of the old HP prgrammable calcs ( 12 etc etc) Hehe, like donkey kong on the PC. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Jose Manrique Lopez de la Fuente Sent: Saturday, June 28, 2008 8:39 AM To: List for Openmoko community discussion Subject: Re: More HW from OpenMoko Why not a powerful handeld graphic calculator? 2008/6/28, Al Johnson [EMAIL PROTECTED]: On Saturday 28 June 2008, Robert Schuster wrote: Hi, Mickey writes: Openmoko is selling hardware products. Heck, why must OpenMoko only sell mobile phones? That's all they've sold direct so far, but it was said a long time ago that non-phone products may be in the pipeline I like Linux-based devices that are free as in freedom. So I would likely also buy a device from OpenMoko if it is a wireless router, a SOHO NAS (think NSLU2), a PDA or perhaps a gaming handheld. I would prefer Openmoko to fill holes where there aren't already free devices available. Most of the areas you mention already have hardware available that's as open as the Neo1973 and Freerunner: Routers - wireless or not: PC Engines ALIX series - http://www.pcengines.ch/ MicroTik RouterBOARDs - http://www.routerboard.com/comparison.html SOHO NAS: http://www.linuxdevices.com/news/NS5637467946.html Gaming handheld: Pandora Then there's the Neuros OSD which really needs a successor with a better output than composite video, but is otherwise rather nice. The PDA is one area there's a gap I would like filling. I want a modern incarnation of the Psion 5. I'll just have to see how the Freerunner plus a bluetooth keyboard do as a replacement. It might just be close enough... I would also like a less power-hungry version of the Chumby, available outside the US. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community -- J. Manrique López de la Fuente
Re: More HW from OpenMoko
Rodolphe Ortalo [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: do you think a student should have raw access to Matlab+Mathematica+Octave +any-other-thing-you-can-thinkof I'm an engineering student and I've been looking everywhere for a calculator with a bigger screen and better dot pitch with colors and being able to tilt the screen or attach a usb screen so I don't have to lean forward and get neck injuries. There is a free project out there aiming to produce a free hardware calculator. The big problem is that even if I found one, I might not be able to use it, because a calculator has to be certified by the state. It's really not good to use one calculator for working, then have to use a normal crappy calculator for exams. It's a problem to think of, if we're putting r and octave into a device marketed as a calculator. There's definitely a market, though, cause all calculators on the market are so damn crappy, it's a joke. -- Esben Stien is [EMAIL PROTECTED] s a http://www. s tn m irc://irc. b - i . e/%23contact sip:b0ef@ e e jid:b0ef@n n ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
RE: More HW from OpenMoko
Given the freerunner hw, you can certainly do much better than that! I would expect something like mathematica in your pocket... ;-) (In fact, you sort of have already the rpn calculator via dc.) Hey, that's what I wanted as a second project after doing the current simple calculator. But I was short of time for trying to do it (plus the fact that it is not easy do decide between doing something entirely new and porting an existing software). Rodolphe Le samedi 28 juin 2008 à 11:36 -0700, steve a écrit : RPN please. Actually it would be cool to do retro versions of the old HP prgrammable calcs ( 12 etc etc) Hehe, like donkey kong on the PC. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Jose Manrique Lopez de la Fuente Sent: Saturday, June 28, 2008 8:39 AM To: List for Openmoko community discussion Subject: Re: More HW from OpenMoko Why not a powerful handeld graphic calculator? 2008/6/28, Al Johnson [EMAIL PROTECTED]: On Saturday 28 June 2008, Robert Schuster wrote: Hi, Mickey writes: Openmoko is selling hardware products. Heck, why must OpenMoko only sell mobile phones? That's all they've sold direct so far, but it was said a long time ago that non-phone products may be in the pipeline I like Linux-based devices that are free as in freedom. So I would likely also buy a device from OpenMoko if it is a wireless router, a SOHO NAS (think NSLU2), a PDA or perhaps a gaming handheld. I would prefer Openmoko to fill holes where there aren't already free devices available. Most of the areas you mention already have hardware available that's as open as the Neo1973 and Freerunner: Routers - wireless or not: PC Engines ALIX series - http://www.pcengines.ch/ MicroTik RouterBOARDs - http://www.routerboard.com/comparison.html SOHO NAS: http://www.linuxdevices.com/news/NS5637467946.html Gaming handheld: Pandora Then there's the Neuros OSD which really needs a successor with a better output than composite video, but is otherwise rather nice. The PDA is one area there's a gap I would like filling. I want a modern incarnation of the Psion 5. I'll just have to see how the Freerunner plus a bluetooth keyboard do as a replacement. It might just be close enough... I would also like a less power-hungry version of the Chumby, available outside the US. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community -- J. Manrique López de la Fuente http://www.jsmanrique.es ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
RE: More HW from OpenMoko
Mathematica would be cool -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Rodolphe Ortalo Sent: Tuesday, July 01, 2008 10:16 AM To: community@lists.openmoko.org Subject: RE: More HW from OpenMoko Given the freerunner hw, you can certainly do much better than that! I would expect something like mathematica in your pocket... ;-) (In fact, you sort of have already the rpn calculator via dc.) Hey, that's what I wanted as a second project after doing the current simple calculator. But I was short of time for trying to do it (plus the fact that it is not easy do decide between doing something entirely new and porting an existing software). Rodolphe Le samedi 28 juin 2008 à 11:36 -0700, steve a écrit : RPN please. Actually it would be cool to do retro versions of the old HP prgrammable calcs ( 12 etc etc) Hehe, like donkey kong on the PC. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Jose Manrique Lopez de la Fuente Sent: Saturday, June 28, 2008 8:39 AM To: List for Openmoko community discussion Subject: Re: More HW from OpenMoko Why not a powerful handeld graphic calculator? 2008/6/28, Al Johnson [EMAIL PROTECTED]: On Saturday 28 June 2008, Robert Schuster wrote: Hi, Mickey writes: Openmoko is selling hardware products. Heck, why must OpenMoko only sell mobile phones? That's all they've sold direct so far, but it was said a long time ago that non-phone products may be in the pipeline I like Linux-based devices that are free as in freedom. So I would likely also buy a device from OpenMoko if it is a wireless router, a SOHO NAS (think NSLU2), a PDA or perhaps a gaming handheld. I would prefer Openmoko to fill holes where there aren't already free devices available. Most of the areas you mention already have hardware available that's as open as the Neo1973 and Freerunner: Routers - wireless or not: PC Engines ALIX series - http://www.pcengines.ch/ MicroTik RouterBOARDs - http://www.routerboard.com/comparison.html SOHO NAS: http://www.linuxdevices.com/news/NS5637467946.html Gaming handheld: Pandora Then there's the Neuros OSD which really needs a successor with a better output than composite video, but is otherwise rather nice. The PDA is one area there's a gap I would like filling. I want a modern incarnation of the Psion 5. I'll just have to see how the Freerunner plus a bluetooth keyboard do as a replacement. It might just be close enough... I would also like a less power-hungry version of the Chumby, available outside the US. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community -- J. Manrique López de la Fuente http://www.jsmanrique.es ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: More HW from OpenMoko
How much would a Octave port take??? :) 2008/7/1 Ken Young [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Rodolphe Ortalo: Given the freerunner hw, you can certainly do much better than that! I would expect something like mathematica in your pocket... ;-) The neo1973 has ~8 times the floating point performance of a VAX 11/780 (double precision). The initial version of Mathematica was developed on a VAX 11/750 - the Freerunner should be about 20 times faster than that machine in floating point. It was also rare to run across an 11/750 with more than 4 MByte of RAM. Ken Young ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: More HW from OpenMoko
Wouldn't it be better to first concentrate on getting the Freerunner out and then look what's up with GTA03/04/whatever? Designing a whole new device takes a very long time, as you can perfectly see here... -Marcel Am Samstag 28 Juni 2008 17:38:47 schrieb Jose Manrique Lopez de la Fuente: Why not a powerful handeld graphic calculator? 2008/6/28, Al Johnson [EMAIL PROTECTED]: On Saturday 28 June 2008, Robert Schuster wrote: Hi, Mickey writes: Openmoko is selling hardware products. Heck, why must OpenMoko only sell mobile phones? That's all they've sold direct so far, but it was said a long time ago that non-phone products may be in the pipeline I like Linux-based devices that are free as in freedom. So I would likely also buy a device from OpenMoko if it is a wireless router, a SOHO NAS (think NSLU2), a PDA or perhaps a gaming handheld. I would prefer Openmoko to fill holes where there aren't already free devices available. Most of the areas you mention already have hardware available that's as open as the Neo1973 and Freerunner: Routers - wireless or not: PC Engines ALIX series - http://www.pcengines.ch/ MicroTik RouterBOARDs - http://www.routerboard.com/comparison.html SOHO NAS: http://www.linuxdevices.com/news/NS5637467946.html Gaming handheld: Pandora Then there's the Neuros OSD which really needs a successor with a better output than composite video, but is otherwise rather nice. The PDA is one area there's a gap I would like filling. I want a modern incarnation of the Psion 5. I'll just have to see how the Freerunner plus a bluetooth keyboard do as a replacement. It might just be close enough... I would also like a less power-hungry version of the Chumby, available outside the US. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: More HW from OpenMoko
Some bytes for the software side: http://nonpareil.brouhaha.com/ http://www.hpcalc.org/details.php?id=4382 http://www-fourier.ujf-grenoble.fr/~parisse/giac.html 2008/6/28, Joerg Reisenweber [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Am Sa 28. Juni 2008 schrieb steve: RPN please. Actually it would be cool to do retro versions of the old HP prgrammable calcs ( 12 etc etc) Hehe, like donkey kong on the PC. ACK. Though it's hard to emulate the really lovely keys those calculators (25, 41) had, tactile feedback and all. (TI otoh had bouncing keys that made me smash some of their calculators. more fun to smash than to use ;-) Waah, my 41CV went up in smoke recently, stored in my bookshelf that burned down ;.( *sigh* Also the info function (HP41 only?) on any keypress longer 2sec was *very* smart, probably a patent of HP. (you remember? hold key down to show what's going to happen when you release it. Hold down for 2sec to pre-cancel the actual pending release action, in case info shows this wasn't what you intended to do) /jOERG http://www.hpmuseum.org/simulate/sim45.htm press 'run' http://www.linuxfocus.org/common/src/article319/ http://www.linuxfocus.org/common/src/article319/rpnjcalc.html http://www.linuxfocus.org/common/src/article319/hp-35/launch.html http://www.linuxfocus.org/common/src/article319/hp-35.zip http://www.linuxfocus.org/common/src/article319/x48.html http://www.hpcalc.org/details.php?id=4524 http://www.ibiblio.org/pub/Linux/apps/math/calc http://directory.fsf.org/project/rpncalc/ recommended: http://www.hpmuseum.org/hp35.htm A few bugs got through this process. For example: 2.02 ln ex resulted in 2 rather than 2.02. When the bug was discovered, HP had already sold 25,000 units which was a huge volume for the company. In a meeting, Dave Packard asked what they were going to do about the units already in the field and someone in the crowd said Don't tell? At this Packard's pencil snapped and he said: Who said that? We're going to tell everyone and offer them, a replacement. It would be better to never make a dime of profit than to have a product out there with a problem. It turns out that less than a quarter of the units were returned. Most people preferred to keep their buggy calculator and the notice from HP offering the replacement. -- J. Manrique López de la Fuente http://www.jsmanrique.es ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: More HW from OpenMoko
openmoko hardware? make a synthesizer platform. yes please, i'll take 2,000, thanks. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: More HW from OpenMoko
Am Sonntag 29 Juni 2008 14:05:45 schrieb Jay Vaughan: openmoko hardware? make a synthesizer platform. yes please, i'll take 2,000, thanks. FULL ACK. That has so much potential. I'd love to be working on that. (after completing the framework of course) -- :M: ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: More HW from OpenMoko
There's nothing stopping the community from trying to design some hardware. Take a look at the Wikipedia page on open hardware http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Open_source_hardware. There's lots of stuff out there to get folks started. We could try to create a new device, but I would rather create something that augments the Freerunner like some microcontroller sensor hardware that connects via USB. For example, a USB or bluetooth version of http://www.liberlab.net/ in a package that snaps onto the back of a Freerunner could be pretty nifty. How about a bluetooth or USB barcode scanner and RFID reader/writer that snaps on the back in place of the regular back cover. That's something we can do as a community. It's something that is also more likely to eventually see support from the official Freerunner folks in the form of manufacturing or just giving a professional opinion on the design. -Charles ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: More HW from OpenMoko
Actually, do we have schematics for Freerunner? I know we have some CAD files. Do they include schematics for the elements? On 6/29/08, Charles Pax [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: There's nothing stopping the community from trying to design some hardware. Take a look at the Wikipedia page on open hardware http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Open_source_hardware. There's lots of stuff out there to get folks started. We could try to create a new device, but I would rather create something that augments the Freerunner like some microcontroller sensor hardware that connects via USB. For example, a USB or bluetooth version of http://www.liberlab.net/ in a package that snaps onto the back of a Freerunner could be pretty nifty. How about a bluetooth or USB barcode scanner and RFID reader/writer that snaps on the back in place of the regular back cover. That's something we can do as a community. It's something that is also more likely to eventually see support from the official Freerunner folks in the form of manufacturing or just giving a professional opinion on the design. -Charles ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: More HW from OpenMoko
very cool : ) Robert Schuster wrote: Hi, Mickey writes: Openmoko is selling hardware products. Heck, why must OpenMoko only sell mobile phones? I like Linux-based devices that are free as in freedom. So I would likely also buy a device from OpenMoko if it is a wireless router, a SOHO NAS (think NSLU2), a PDA or perhaps a gaming handheld. What is OpenMoko thinking about this? Regards Robert ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: More HW from OpenMoko
On Saturday 28 June 2008, Robert Schuster wrote: Hi, Mickey writes: Openmoko is selling hardware products. Heck, why must OpenMoko only sell mobile phones? That's all they've sold direct so far, but it was said a long time ago that non-phone products may be in the pipeline I like Linux-based devices that are free as in freedom. So I would likely also buy a device from OpenMoko if it is a wireless router, a SOHO NAS (think NSLU2), a PDA or perhaps a gaming handheld. I would prefer Openmoko to fill holes where there aren't already free devices available. Most of the areas you mention already have hardware available that's as open as the Neo1973 and Freerunner: Routers - wireless or not: PC Engines ALIX series - http://www.pcengines.ch/ MicroTik RouterBOARDs - http://www.routerboard.com/comparison.html SOHO NAS: http://www.linuxdevices.com/news/NS5637467946.html Gaming handheld: Pandora Then there's the Neuros OSD which really needs a successor with a better output than composite video, but is otherwise rather nice. The PDA is one area there's a gap I would like filling. I want a modern incarnation of the Psion 5. I'll just have to see how the Freerunner plus a bluetooth keyboard do as a replacement. It might just be close enough... I would also like a less power-hungry version of the Chumby, available outside the US. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: More HW from OpenMoko
Why not a powerful handeld graphic calculator? 2008/6/28, Al Johnson [EMAIL PROTECTED]: On Saturday 28 June 2008, Robert Schuster wrote: Hi, Mickey writes: Openmoko is selling hardware products. Heck, why must OpenMoko only sell mobile phones? That's all they've sold direct so far, but it was said a long time ago that non-phone products may be in the pipeline I like Linux-based devices that are free as in freedom. So I would likely also buy a device from OpenMoko if it is a wireless router, a SOHO NAS (think NSLU2), a PDA or perhaps a gaming handheld. I would prefer Openmoko to fill holes where there aren't already free devices available. Most of the areas you mention already have hardware available that's as open as the Neo1973 and Freerunner: Routers - wireless or not: PC Engines ALIX series - http://www.pcengines.ch/ MicroTik RouterBOARDs - http://www.routerboard.com/comparison.html SOHO NAS: http://www.linuxdevices.com/news/NS5637467946.html Gaming handheld: Pandora Then there's the Neuros OSD which really needs a successor with a better output than composite video, but is otherwise rather nice. The PDA is one area there's a gap I would like filling. I want a modern incarnation of the Psion 5. I'll just have to see how the Freerunner plus a bluetooth keyboard do as a replacement. It might just be close enough... I would also like a less power-hungry version of the Chumby, available outside the US. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community -- J. Manrique López de la Fuente http://www.jsmanrique.es ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: More HW from OpenMoko
On 6/28/08 Robert Schuster wrote: Mickey writes: Openmoko is selling hardware products. Heck, why must OpenMoko only sell mobile phones? I like Linux-based devices that are free as in freedom. So I would likely also buy a device from OpenMoko if it is a wireless router, a SOHO NAS (think NSLU2), a PDA or perhaps a gaming handheld. What is OpenMoko thinking about this? We agree with you. And we're thinking. Working. ;-) -- -Sean ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: More HW from OpenMoko
Sean Moss-Pultz schrieb: On 6/28/08 Robert Schuster wrote: Mickey writes: Openmoko is selling hardware products. Heck, why must OpenMoko only sell mobile phones? I like Linux-based devices that are free as in freedom. So I would likely also buy a device from OpenMoko if it is a wireless router, a SOHO NAS (think NSLU2), a PDA or perhaps a gaming handheld. What is OpenMoko thinking about this? I'm not a hardcore gamer myself but I think that the gaming haldheld could be awesome success (with proper 3D acceleration of course) since it would be first-of-its-kind. There are so many good open-source games available which could be ported, and really IMHO rival proprietary platforms where every game costs about 50€/70$. If it had WLAN for online games and even more a possibility to connect a mouse (USB host or bluetooth) for FPS and Strategy games it would be even better. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: More HW from OpenMoko
To me come in mind this: http://openpandora.org/ Michael Stather wrote: Sean Moss-Pultz schrieb: On 6/28/08 Robert Schuster wrote: Mickey writes: Openmoko is selling hardware products. Heck, why must OpenMoko only sell mobile phones? I like Linux-based devices that are free as in freedom. So I would likely also buy a device from OpenMoko if it is a wireless router, a SOHO NAS (think NSLU2), a PDA or perhaps a gaming handheld. What is OpenMoko thinking about this? I'm not a hardcore gamer myself but I think that the gaming haldheld could be awesome success (with proper 3D acceleration of course) since it would be first-of-its-kind. There are so many good open-source games available which could be ported, and really IMHO rival proprietary platforms where every game costs about 50€/70$. If it had WLAN for online games and even more a possibility to connect a mouse (USB host or bluetooth) for FPS and Strategy games it would be even better. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
RE: More HW from OpenMoko
Nothing stops anybody from approaching me with this idea to build their own business. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Michael Stather Sent: Saturday, June 28, 2008 9:48 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; List for Openmoko community discussion Subject: Re: More HW from OpenMoko Sean Moss-Pultz schrieb: On 6/28/08 Robert Schuster wrote: Mickey writes: Openmoko is selling hardware products. Heck, why must OpenMoko only sell mobile phones? I like Linux-based devices that are free as in freedom. So I would likely also buy a device from OpenMoko if it is a wireless router, a SOHO NAS (think NSLU2), a PDA or perhaps a gaming handheld. What is OpenMoko thinking about this? I'm not a hardcore gamer myself but I think that the gaming haldheld could be awesome success (with proper 3D acceleration of course) since it would be first-of-its-kind. There are so many good open-source games available which could be ported, and really IMHO rival proprietary platforms where every game costs about 50€/70$. If it had WLAN for online games and even more a possibility to connect a mouse (USB host or bluetooth) for FPS and Strategy games it would be even better. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
RE: More HW from OpenMoko
RPN please. Actually it would be cool to do retro versions of the old HP prgrammable calcs ( 12 etc etc) Hehe, like donkey kong on the PC. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Jose Manrique Lopez de la Fuente Sent: Saturday, June 28, 2008 8:39 AM To: List for Openmoko community discussion Subject: Re: More HW from OpenMoko Why not a powerful handeld graphic calculator? 2008/6/28, Al Johnson [EMAIL PROTECTED]: On Saturday 28 June 2008, Robert Schuster wrote: Hi, Mickey writes: Openmoko is selling hardware products. Heck, why must OpenMoko only sell mobile phones? That's all they've sold direct so far, but it was said a long time ago that non-phone products may be in the pipeline I like Linux-based devices that are free as in freedom. So I would likely also buy a device from OpenMoko if it is a wireless router, a SOHO NAS (think NSLU2), a PDA or perhaps a gaming handheld. I would prefer Openmoko to fill holes where there aren't already free devices available. Most of the areas you mention already have hardware available that's as open as the Neo1973 and Freerunner: Routers - wireless or not: PC Engines ALIX series - http://www.pcengines.ch/ MicroTik RouterBOARDs - http://www.routerboard.com/comparison.html SOHO NAS: http://www.linuxdevices.com/news/NS5637467946.html Gaming handheld: Pandora Then there's the Neuros OSD which really needs a successor with a better output than composite video, but is otherwise rather nice. The PDA is one area there's a gap I would like filling. I want a modern incarnation of the Psion 5. I'll just have to see how the Freerunner plus a bluetooth keyboard do as a replacement. It might just be close enough... I would also like a less power-hungry version of the Chumby, available outside the US. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community -- J. Manrique López de la Fuente http://www.jsmanrique.es ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: More HW from OpenMoko
-[ Sat, Jun 28, 2008 at 08:25:42PM +0200, Michele Renda ] To me come in mind this: http://openpandora.org/ Last time I checked hardware was not free neither - it uses powerVR instead of ATI, for instance. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
