Re: om2009/paroli status
On Mon, Aug 3, 2009 at 7:52 AM, Guillaume Chereaucharlie...@gmail.com wrote: Beside, even though I stopped working on paroli long before Mirko, I still understand how the core works ; contact me by email (or on this list) if you have any question about it, I can have a -quick- look at it. Thank you very much for your offer, I will compile my list of questions, and shoot at you;) Besides, I would like to talk with you, how can we more collaborate... Best regards, Laszlo ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: om2009/paroli status
On Mon, Aug 3, 2009 at 7:27 PM, Laszlo KREKACSlaszlo.krekacs.l...@gmail.com wrote: Thank you very much for your offer, I will compile my list of questions, and shoot at you;) Besides, I would like to talk with you, how can we more collaborate... No problem. You can sometime find me on freenode IRC as charlie137 (usually online around 1pm to 4pm GTM). Cheers, -- Guillaume Chéreau blogs : http://charlie137.blogspot.com/, http://charlie137-2.blogspot.com/ ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: om2009/paroli status
On Mon, Aug 3, 2009 at 12:42 AM, Laszlo KREKACSlaszlo.krekacs.l...@gmail.com wrote: On Fri, Jul 24, 2009 at 11:40 PM, Risto H. Kurppari...@kurppa.fi wrote: (I understand that Laszlo didn't get the support needed but got some of his code rejected - lost interest.. ) I would like to add my 2 cents here;) I didnt stopped working on paroli at all, just my attention was distracted by some hobby project (home-made electric bike) and I was on vacation in the last 2 weeks (hence the late reply). But I agree, what Mirko is doing, are the worst scenario of every possible act, ie. stating he is working on paroli, but his last real work on paroli was exactly two months ago on June 3, with commit 6b47ad3a17814105e7107dcf7cc30dc4f3584387. In addition to this he is not responding to emails, especially which contains programing questions regarding to paroli. (I know, because I shoot 10-15 emails already to him in these 2 months). I have read somewhere some years ago, how to best quit an open source project, but I cant locate it anymore (nor on the web nor in my computer). It addressed this very issue, how to avoid this kind of frustrations. I would like to suggest to Qi company (Mirko's bosses;), to allow (better word: force) Mirko to work on Paroli one hour per week. To answer questions, and integrate others' works. There are many ongoing work, which needs to be integrated into paroli. There are two branches by Dietrich, namely tacheles and rebase. Where tacheles needs some very deep (tichy/paroli) knowledge, to be able to integrate into paroli. Other seems mostly cleanup. We should really need some kind of communication platform, because I for example never met with Dietrich, but I really like his works (on pyneo.org, I based my gps program on his mappad work. It was he or josch) So there are two more possible contributors: Dietrich and josch. They need some attention, to not lost his interests in paroli. I for example have many more or less working programs, which needs some help to properly integrate into paroli. (I have shoot an email like 4 days ago to Mirko, but no answer;) These are: - calculator app (already usable) - gps app, and I would like to develop some predefined gui for it: walking, running, biking, driving, paragliding The basics works, I need edje (.edc file) gui for more advanced things like zoom in, out and panning;) - note taking app (almost working) - calendar app (I have some gui sketches) - some already done (or planned) gui improvements for paroli - I have some gui ideas, where I need consensus from Mirko and Angus, one of them is putting topbar at the bottom. Because the bottom is not really finger usable, so why waste the valuable space at the top (just under illume's topbar). And it makes little sense to have two topbars at the top. Mirko: If you want to step back from paroli for some time (months), please, please integrate people's work before it, and only leave after. There are many things, where we really need you. Im not able to help Dietrich integrate his dbus based multithreading programs. I (for example) need some tichy help. I think everybody got an idea about paroli status. Best regards, Laszlo So nobody here has any news from Mirko ? Neither QI-Hardware ? I really like Paroli and would love to see this effort congratulate for example by being integrated into SHR too... but if the maintainer remains w/o news... Laszlo what do you think about a fork to apply your patches ? a continue with welcomed contrib ? -- Steven Le Roux Jabber-ID : ste...@jabber.fr 0x39494CCB ste...@le-roux.info 2FF7 226B 552E 4709 03F0 6281 72D7 A010 3949 4CCB ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: om2009/paroli status
Hi, I am still alive and by no means agree that I am not doing anything. I would agree that I am not coding right now. I am in active contact with the pyneo crew, met with them in Hamburg and talked with fgau of epydial how to get the apps into paroli. MDT of pyneo who has started 2 branches has taken over the part of doing maintenance on paroli's core (formerly tichy) and this is still the plan. Adding features to paroli right now has been opted against as Angus and I still hope to be able to release Om2009. This requires bug- fixing not new features. I am also collaborating with Mirko from OpenWrt to get paroli fully supported on this platform as well. So nobody here has any news from Mirko ? Neither QI-Hardware ? Not on the mailinglists I admit, but I am online on irc regularly these days. Certainly less than during OM times and maybe difficult to catch due to changing nick names. I really like Paroli and would love to see this effort congratulate for example by being integrated into SHR too... but if the maintainer remains w/o news... Laszlo what do you think about a fork to apply your patches ? a continue with welcomed contrib ? I think a fork would be the worst case scenario. Laszlo also doesn't need to fork, if adding new features is desperately needed how about a branch? Certainly better than splitting the few resources that go into a project. I take part of the blame as I am heavily involved with Qi Hardware at the moment and also do like to socialize and enjoy the sun every now and again. I see a future for paroli and am interested in and working for a revival of a python based multi-purpose device UI. /mirko___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: om2009/paroli status
On Mon, Aug 3, 2009 at 6:04 PM, Mirko Lindnervegyra...@paroli-project.org wrote: Hi, I am still alive and by no means agree that I am not doing anything. I would agree that I am not coding right now. I am in active contact with the pyneo crew, met with them in Hamburg and talked with fgau of epydial how to get the apps into paroli. MDT of pyneo who has started 2 branches has taken over the part of doing maintenance on paroli's core (formerly tichy) and this is still the plan. Adding features to paroli right now has been opted against as Angus and I still hope to be able to release Om2009. This requires bug-fixing not new features. I am also collaborating with Mirko from OpenWrt to get paroli fully supported on this platform as well. So nobody here has any news from Mirko ? Neither QI-Hardware ? Not on the mailinglists I admit, but I am online on irc regularly these days. Certainly less than during OM times and maybe difficult to catch due to changing nick names. Good to know :) I really like Paroli and would love to see this effort congratulate for example by being integrated into SHR too... but if the maintainer remains w/o news... Laszlo what do you think about a fork to apply your patches ? a continue with welcomed contrib ? I think a fork would be the worst case scenario. And you're right ! It was the last possible scenario to adopt... Laszlo also doesn't need to fork, if adding new features is desperately needed how about a branch? Certainly better than splitting the few resources that go into a project. I take part of the blame as I am heavily involved with Qi Hardware at the moment and also do like to socialize and enjoy the sun every now and again. I see a future for paroli and am interested in and working for a revival of a python based multi-purpose device UI. There is no pb being off for a while... but mails was looking like you're dead 2 month ago ;). So let's stabilize and what non-coding user can do more then adding tickets to the Trac ? /mirko -- Steven Le Roux Jabber-ID : ste...@jabber.fr 0x39494CCB ste...@le-roux.info 2FF7 226B 552E 4709 03F0 6281 72D7 A010 3949 4CCB ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: om2009/paroli status
Hey again, On 3 Aug 2009, at 19:01, Steven Le Roux wrote: On Mon, Aug 3, 2009 at 6:04 PM, Mirko Lindnervegyra...@paroli-project.org wrote: Hi, I am still alive and by no means agree that I am not doing anything. I would agree that I am not coding right now. I am in active contact with the pyneo crew, met with them in Hamburg and talked with fgau of epydial how to get the apps into paroli. MDT of pyneo who has started 2 branches has taken over the part of doing maintenance on paroli's core (formerly tichy) and this is still the plan. Adding features to paroli right now has been opted against as Angus and I still hope to be able to release Om2009. This requires bug-fixing not new features. I am also collaborating with Mirko from OpenWrt to get paroli fully supported on this platform as well. So nobody here has any news from Mirko ? Neither QI-Hardware ? Not on the mailinglists I admit, but I am online on irc regularly these days. Certainly less than during OM times and maybe difficult to catch due to changing nick names. Good to know :) For the record: vegyraupe, mirko-paroli, mirkolindner on irc :) I really like Paroli and would love to see this effort congratulate for example by being integrated into SHR too... but if the maintainer remains w/o news... Laszlo what do you think about a fork to apply your patches ? a continue with welcomed contrib ? I think a fork would be the worst case scenario. And you're right ! It was the last possible scenario to adopt... Laszlo also doesn't need to fork, if adding new features is desperately needed how about a branch? Certainly better than splitting the few resources that go into a project. I take part of the blame as I am heavily involved with Qi Hardware at the moment and also do like to socialize and enjoy the sun every now and again. I see a future for paroli and am interested in and working for a revival of a python based multi-purpose device UI. There is no pb being off for a while... but mails was looking like you're dead 2 month ago ;). Hehe, I did talk with Laszlo every now and again so there was communication, but I completely understand his frustration. So let's stabilize and what non-coding user can do more then adding tickets to the Trac ? Yes and trying to figure out when which errors appear that allows us (coders) to fix the problems faster. There was a problem with the suspend on the last OWrt image which meant I couldn't use the phone as my daily but I am optimistic that this will be solved soon and thus enjoy my own bugs on a daily basis and fix them :) /mirko -- Steven Le Roux Jabber-ID : ste...@jabber.fr 0x39494CCB ste...@le-roux.info 2FF7 226B 552E 4709 03F0 6281 72D7 A010 3949 4CCB ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: om2009/paroli status
On Fri, Jul 24, 2009 at 11:40 PM, Risto H. Kurppari...@kurppa.fi wrote: (I understand that Laszlo didn't get the support needed but got some of his code rejected - lost interest.. ) I would like to add my 2 cents here;) I didnt stopped working on paroli at all, just my attention was distracted by some hobby project (home-made electric bike) and I was on vacation in the last 2 weeks (hence the late reply). But I agree, what Mirko is doing, are the worst scenario of every possible act, ie. stating he is working on paroli, but his last real work on paroli was exactly two months ago on June 3, with commit 6b47ad3a17814105e7107dcf7cc30dc4f3584387. In addition to this he is not responding to emails, especially which contains programing questions regarding to paroli. (I know, because I shoot 10-15 emails already to him in these 2 months). I have read somewhere some years ago, how to best quit an open source project, but I cant locate it anymore (nor on the web nor in my computer). It addressed this very issue, how to avoid this kind of frustrations. I would like to suggest to Qi company (Mirko's bosses;), to allow (better word: force) Mirko to work on Paroli one hour per week. To answer questions, and integrate others' works. There are many ongoing work, which needs to be integrated into paroli. There are two branches by Dietrich, namely tacheles and rebase. Where tacheles needs some very deep (tichy/paroli) knowledge, to be able to integrate into paroli. Other seems mostly cleanup. We should really need some kind of communication platform, because I for example never met with Dietrich, but I really like his works (on pyneo.org, I based my gps program on his mappad work. It was he or josch) So there are two more possible contributors: Dietrich and josch. They need some attention, to not lost his interests in paroli. I for example have many more or less working programs, which needs some help to properly integrate into paroli. (I have shoot an email like 4 days ago to Mirko, but no answer;) These are: - calculator app (already usable) - gps app, and I would like to develop some predefined gui for it: walking, running, biking, driving, paragliding The basics works, I need edje (.edc file) gui for more advanced things like zoom in, out and panning;) - note taking app (almost working) - calendar app (I have some gui sketches) - some already done (or planned) gui improvements for paroli - I have some gui ideas, where I need consensus from Mirko and Angus, one of them is putting topbar at the bottom. Because the bottom is not really finger usable, so why waste the valuable space at the top (just under illume's topbar). And it makes little sense to have two topbars at the top. Mirko: If you want to step back from paroli for some time (months), please, please integrate people's work before it, and only leave after. There are many things, where we really need you. Im not able to help Dietrich integrate his dbus based multithreading programs. I (for example) need some tichy help. I think everybody got an idea about paroli status. Best regards, Laszlo ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: om2009/paroli status
Hi! On Mon, Jul 27, 2009 at 4:41 PM, Angus Ainslienyt...@openmoko.org wrote: 3 issues that need solving SIM card full when it's not really full as the messages are stored in the rootfs. Need to look into how to fake incoming sms', because, I dont use sms at all. Contacts disappearing Like loosing contacts permanently? I workarounded it by auto-backup phone contacts. Is this the same issue? I remember Mirko promised he is looking more deeply into opimd, and incorporate into paroli or, develop further paroli's solution. Dunno what is his plan. Display menu is gone. From the settings? I should install the newest unstable image, to see what happened... works for me;) But Im like a month old image. Angus Laszlo ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: om2009/paroli status
On Mon, Aug 3, 2009 at 6:42 AM, Laszlo KREKACSlaszlo.krekacs.l...@gmail.com wrote: There are many ongoing work, which needs to be integrated into paroli. There are two branches by Dietrich, namely tacheles and rebase. Where tacheles needs some very deep (tichy/paroli) knowledge, to be able to integrate into paroli. Hello Laszlo, at least for some of the issues concerning tichy, you can look into the actual tichy code, still hosted on its google code website [1]. I don't think you will be able to directly merge from tichy to paroli, for both projects have diverged too much, but I am sure you can get some ideas from it. Beside, even though I stopped working on paroli long before Mirko, I still understand how the core works ; contact me by email (or on this list) if you have any question about it, I can have a -quick- look at it. Regards, -Gui [1] http://code.google.com/p/tichy/ -- Guillaume Chéreau blogs : http://charlie137.blogspot.com/, http://charlie137-2.blogspot.com/ ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: om2009/paroli status
Hi, On Fri, 24.07.2009 at 08:40:45 +0200, Mirko Lindner vegyra...@paroli-project.org wrote: There still is the plan to release a final version of Om2009. It would be good if we could assemble a list of problems in paroli that need fixing for the release. I'm a bit out-of-sync with all of you, due to other work, but still have problems in Om2009r5 that I've just flashed my FR A6. These are my first impressions: 1. Booting is _very_slow_. I didn't measure it, but it feels much slower than with Om2009r4 (which had a whole lot of other problems, though, including no keyboard after a while in the dialer). 2. I've changed the profile to Illume on the first boot after flashing. On the second boot, when it asks for a PIN, the following problems manifest: 2.1 There is a strip of rainbow colours (much like a garbled C64 screen) on the top of the screen. 2.2 The string Enter PIN is cut off at the lower half. 2.3 The profile was reset to Paroli. 3. I changed the profile setting to paroli-serenity. This resultet in an error message about a missing module that could not be loaded. 4. If I call myself to test, although sound quality is _poor_ (like an old military radio device - I think I need the buzz fix), there's immediate, and increasing, acoustic feedback. I have to go several meters away from the other phone to stop it. 5. I didn't yet find out how to adjust the keyboard to eg. German. Preferably, I'd have the Terminal keyboard (not that magic I guess and scramble your writing-keyboard) plus a method to enter accented characters. 6. When conducting a phone call, there's a weird mixed call-and-hangup sign which looks like if the two images were overlayed as transparencies. 7. Keyboard reaction is MUCH slower than it was in r4 while I had a keyboard there. Some general remarks: * I didn't yet find out where my data goes. With r4, I had some messages, and, in theory, GPS tracks that I tried to recover using SSH, but I could not locate them on the file system. So I lost it all after re-flashing. * There should be an easy way to inspect and manipulate backup images (eg. jffs2 format) in a regular Linux desktop machine. Maybe this is in the wiki already, but I'd like something along pmount image-file directory to mount an image and work with the contents. * So far, I'm only able to use half of my 8gig micro SD card in the phone, but all of it in a regular computer's card reader. * Battery life appears to be very low. Just dabbling a bit with the new image drained three quarters of the battery, according to Illume's status display, but the can battery icon appeared to suggested the * battery to be half full. Kind regards, --Toni++ ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: om2009/paroli status
Hi, I meant to say On Wed, 29.07.2009 at 22:04:16 +0200, Toni Mueller supp...@oeko.net wrote: I'm a bit out-of-sync with all of you, due to other work, that I'm sorry if there's a bit of duplication, and I also don't expect a quick fix. I have one feature request, though: * Ability to explicitly refuse to accept a call, so it does not go to the voice mailbox (my normal configuration for calls I don't accept), either. Draining the voice mailbox is both expensive and very time consuming. Kind regards, --Toni++ ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: om2009/paroli status
Less man power is the right way of putting it. There still is development on both projects but less than before. Laszlo is doing a great job improving things in paroli which I am very thankful for. There still is the plan to release a final version of Om2009. It would be good if we could assemble a list of problems in paroli that need fixing for the release. I must admit this whole thread is starting to worry me. I don`t mean to pester but could someone please provide some clarrification on the status of Om2009 / Paroli? If it is a case of not enough man power, It might be good to assemble a list, as mirko suggested, of tasks that still need to be done for a release. Then we can start knocking them down. regards, Adolph -- Adolph J. Vogel BEng(Hons) ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: om2009/paroli status
[cut] You should feel the air. As in the past testing was only a snapshot and AFAIK I never saw a [...] guess why their software crashes on latest shr, rebuild and upload again on opkg.org and so on). Well, Sebastian, i have to say Nicola has a point here. I agree. [cut] -- Kind Regards Patryk Benderz IT Specialist Linux Registered User #377521 +48 22 538 6292 ERSTE Securities Polska S.A. ul. Królewska 16 Warszawa 00-103 KRS 065121 NIP 526-10-27-638 REGON 011136053 Kapitał akcyjny: 15.500.000 złotych (w pełni opłacony) This message and any attached files are confidential and intended solely for the addressee(s). Any publication, transmission or other use of the information by a person or entity other than the intended addressee is prohibited. If you receive this in error please contact the sender and delete the material. The sender does not accept liability for any errors or omissions as a result of the transmission. Email secured by Check Point ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: om2009/paroli status
On Mon, Jul 27, 2009 at 12:41, Patryk Benderzpatryk.bend...@esp.pl wrote: [cut] You should feel the air. As in the past testing was only a snapshot and AFAIK I never saw a [...] guess why their software crashes on latest shr, rebuild and upload again on opkg.org and so on). Well, Sebastian, i have to say Nicola has a point here. I agree. [cut] No, I don't agree. It's natural than packages builded on your own will be outdated some time in future. That's why I think opkg.org is bad idea as www repo (it should be rather app overview). If someone wants to have his package available in SHR, then we're accepting bb files, and if they builds - then packages are added to feed. And author of app doesn't have to care about packaging, and everyone is happy. Packaging apps on your own is bad by design (unless you're packaging closed source apps, but they are also bad :P), not changes in SHR. -- Sebastian Krzyszkowiak dos ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: om2009/paroli status
2009/7/27 Sebastian Krzyszkowiak seba.d...@gmail.com Packaging apps on your own is bad by design (unless you're packaging closed source apps, but they are also bad :P), not changes in SHR. No it's not bad by design, because some people use other distros than SHR, like Om2008. Plus if someone publishes a new app or a new version, everyone can just 'opkg install url' instead of waiting for SHR developers to include the app in their repository (assuming everyone uses SHR). ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: om2009/paroli status
On Mon, Jul 27, 2009 at 13:14, Michal Brzozowskiruso...@poczta.fm wrote: 2009/7/27 Sebastian Krzyszkowiak seba.d...@gmail.com Packaging apps on your own is bad by design (unless you're packaging closed source apps, but they are also bad :P), not changes in SHR. No it's not bad by design, because some people use other distros than SHR, like Om2008. Having one package for few incompatible systems is even worse :P Plus if someone publishes a new app or a new version, everyone can just 'opkg install url' instead of waiting for SHR developers to include the app in their repository (assuming everyone uses SHR). For interesting apps from Openmoko community we're setting AUTOREV, so it's always the newest version. -- Sebastian Krzyszkowiak dos ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: om2009/paroli status
On Mon, Jul 27, 2009 at 01:14:45PM +0200, Michal Brzozowski wrote: 2009/7/27 Sebastian Krzyszkowiak seba.d...@gmail.com Packaging apps on your own is bad by design (unless you're packaging closed source apps, but they are also bad :P), not changes in SHR. No it's not bad by design, because some people use other distros than SHR, like Om2008. Yes, it is *very* bad by design. It would be much better if opkg.org would contain several repo's, each oriented to a specific distro, and when one ould upload a package one would specify the distros it will work on, and then it get's added to the local repo. Plus if someone publishes a new app or a new version, everyone can just 'opkg install url' instead of waiting for SHR developers to include the app in their repository (assuming everyone uses SHR). You don't have to use only the pre-defined repo's, you can set your own repo and point at it. No need to wait for the distro developers, this is not Apple Store :) Rui ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: om2009/paroli status
Dnia 2009-07-27, pon o godzinie 13:01 +0200, Sebastian Krzyszkowiak pisze: On Mon, Jul 27, 2009 at 12:41, Patryk Benderzpatryk.bend...@esp.pl wrote: [cut] You should feel the air. As in the past testing was only a snapshot and AFAIK I never saw a [...] guess why their software crashes on latest shr, rebuild and upload again on opkg.org and so on). Well, Sebastian, i have to say Nicola has a point here. I agree. [cut] No, I don't agree. It's natural than packages builded on your own will be outdated some time in future. That's why I think opkg.org is bad idea as www repo (it should be rather app overview). Read again what Nicola wrote: *I never saw a backport to testing... I neither saw, did you? *actually shr is...way...to use...FR in a modern way out of the box again agree and I think you agree too :) *please provide a really supported testing *branch* and not a snapshot Do you think SHR devs shouldn't provide genuine testing branch? These are the points i agree with. Probably you just looked at the last sentence, cause i have cited whole paragraph? [cut] -- Kind Regards Patryk Benderz IT Specialist Linux Registered User #377521 +48 22 538 6292 ERSTE Securities Polska S.A. ul. Królewska 16 Warszawa 00-103 KRS 065121 NIP 526-10-27-638 REGON 011136053 Kapitał akcyjny: 15.500.000 złotych (w pełni opłacony) This message and any attached files are confidential and intended solely for the addressee(s). Any publication, transmission or other use of the information by a person or entity other than the intended addressee is prohibited. If you receive this in error please contact the sender and delete the material. The sender does not accept liability for any errors or omissions as a result of the transmission. Email secured by Check Point ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: om2009/paroli status
On July 27, 2009 03:04:30 am Adolph J. Vogel wrote: I must admit this whole thread is starting to worry me. I don`t mean to pester but could someone please provide some clarrification on the status of Om2009 / Paroli? Om2009 is moving forward very slowly at the moment. My time is currently very limited for this volunteer project. The current issue I'm trying to solve is WSOD with the 2.6.29-rc2 kernel by jumping to the 2.6.30 kernel. This work is going on in the experimental branch and will be pushed into unstable at some point. If it is a case of not enough man power, It might be good to assemble a list, as mirko suggested, of tasks that still need to be done for a release. Then we can start knocking them down. 3 issues that need solving SIM card full when it's not really full as the messages are stored in the rootfs. Contacts disappearing Display menu is gone. Fixes for these and other problems you may find can be sent as patches, Angus ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: om2009/paroli status
On Mon, Jul 27, 2009 at 14:00, Patryk Benderzpatryk.bend...@esp.pl wrote: Dnia 2009-07-27, pon o godzinie 13:01 +0200, Sebastian Krzyszkowiak pisze: On Mon, Jul 27, 2009 at 12:41, Patryk Benderzpatryk.bend...@esp.pl wrote: [cut] You should feel the air. As in the past testing was only a snapshot and AFAIK I never saw a [...] guess why their software crashes on latest shr, rebuild and upload again on opkg.org and so on). Well, Sebastian, i have to say Nicola has a point here. I agree. [cut] No, I don't agree. It's natural than packages builded on your own will be outdated some time in future. That's why I think opkg.org is bad idea as www repo (it should be rather app overview). Read again what Nicola wrote: *I never saw a backport to testing... I neither saw, did you? *actually shr is...way...to use...FR in a modern way out of the box again agree and I think you agree too :) *please provide a really supported testing *branch* and not a snapshot Do you think SHR devs shouldn't provide genuine testing branch? These are the points i agree with. Probably you just looked at the last sentence, cause i have cited whole paragraph? [cut] But these are the points I already said I agree with, and I also said that SHR is going this way. I thought I don't have to repeat it :x -- Sebastian Krzyszkowiak dos ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: om2009/paroli status
On Friday 24 July 2009 23:40:14 Risto H. Kurppa wrote: I actually tried Zhone the other day (when Paroli or FSO failed to delete SMS's from the SIM) and was very pleased with it - I'd really like to see it developed further! I heard that multiple times now, I think the UI really has something to it. Unfortunately the problem with Zhone's software design is that it hasn't any -- while I accept patches, I kind of refuse to add more to it on my own. Then again, I'd love to get back into doing actual applications again (middleware is so boring... ;), which means I'm going to write something like Zhone is now -- this time in Vala and covering more features though. :M: ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: om2009/paroli status
On Sat, Jul 25, 2009 at 04:11, Nicola Mfbnicola@gmail.com wrote: On Fri, Jul 24, 2009 at 11:40 PM, Risto H. Kurppari...@kurppa.fi wrote: [...] r - someone unhappy feeling that no-one is working on Paroli or bugfixing it.. I actually tried Zhone the other day (when Paroli or FSO failed to delete SMS's from the SIM) and was very pleased with it - I'd really like to see it developed further! Hi Risto, If I remember well Mickey announced that zhone will not get anymore improvements and the one in fso 5.5 is basically the same of 5.1 :(. I suppose that FSO/SHR joint will mean that while FSO will be improved and extended SHR applications will be the natural candidate for their testing and reference implementation. As there is a distro based on zhone I do not know if at least their guys will improve it. The problem is that SHR promised on late 2008 a stable milestone, after that it was forgotten, they promised again on 22 may 2009, a lot of unstable to test fork where done and abandoned. Finally I just realized that it's a real nice hacking distro with tons of bleeding edge and regular breaking updates and there is no real interesting on stabilize it. I do not want to hurt anyone is only my opinion. With om2009 release plan I just thought: SHR has no man power or will to maintain two different branch, the stable and the developing at least now, the same for OM guys with OM2009, but I'm lucky and I may have OM2009 on the flash to have a stable working device, and shr on the SD to test and enjoy bleeding edge. I'm really afraid of all the shots that our device is taking while I think that the community is completely unorganized and the term community driven completely abused. m2c Nicola We just don't want to release crap as stable. There were problems with either FSO, SHR, build system etc. We wanted to start releasing testing images regular every week... week ago. But there is opkg problem, which is preventing us from doing that. Do you really want buggy and unstable system marked as stable, only due to deadline? And unstable is bleeding-edge. As it should be. -- Sebastian Krzyszkowiak dos ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: om2009/paroli status
On Sat, Jul 25, 2009 at 12:38 PM, Sebastian Krzyszkowiakseba.d...@gmail.com wrote: [...] We just don't want to release crap as stable. There were problems with either FSO, SHR, build system etc. We wanted to start releasing testing images regular every week... week ago. But there is opkg problem, which is preventing us from doing that. Do you really want buggy and unstable system marked as stable, only due to deadline? And unstable is bleeding-edge. As it should be. You should feel the air. As in the past testing was only a snapshot and AFAIK I never saw a backport to testing, peoples are inclined to use unstable in every case (and I really hope your future effort on testing will go differently). Add the fact that actually shr is the unique way for the *average* user to use its freerunner in a modern way out of the box, add the fact that some software run only on shr and you'll get shr-unstable everywhere. You cannot ignore all that with it's unstable, flash another distro if you do not like it shr has just now the great task to realize an happy community, so if unstable is bleeding-edge please provide a really supported testing *branch* and not a snapshot, demonstrating it's a really Community Driven distro (and avoiding boring threads from me and other users and developers that instead of coding has to guess why their software crashes on latest shr, rebuild and upload again on opkg.org and so on). About crap/stability, why all the the OE problems comes in SHR as their appears? it may be better to focus only on FSO and SHR phone applications, backporting that to testing or the wished stable may be easy instead of taking care of all the git commits. You may consider stable OE branches too as a source. Please do not repeat OM mistakes wasting time on too many tasks, they returned to the basic to improve user experience demonstrating at least to listen the community in some cases, shr is Community Driven, so please perform better :) Again m2c. Nicola ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: om2009/paroli status
On Sat, Jul 25, 2009 at 17:21, Nicola Mfbnicola@gmail.com wrote: On Sat, Jul 25, 2009 at 12:38 PM, Sebastian Krzyszkowiakseba.d...@gmail.com wrote: [...] We just don't want to release crap as stable. There were problems with either FSO, SHR, build system etc. We wanted to start releasing testing images regular every week... week ago. But there is opkg problem, which is preventing us from doing that. Do you really want buggy and unstable system marked as stable, only due to deadline? And unstable is bleeding-edge. As it should be. You should feel the air. As in the past testing was only a snapshot and AFAIK I never saw a backport to testing, peoples are inclined to use unstable in every case (and I really hope your future effort on testing will go differently). That's exactly what we want to change now and what i said, but making -testing which is can't be upgraded doesn't make sense. So for -testing you have to wait until actual problems with opkg are solved (and that's unfortunately our fault, not OE or someone else). ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: om2009/paroli status
On Sat, Jul 25, 2009 at 12:40:14AM +0300, Risto H. Kurppa wrote: On Fri, Jul 24, 2009 at 9:40 AM, Mirko Lindnervegyra...@paroli-project.org wrote: Less man power is the right way of putting it. There still is development on both projects but less than before. Laszlo is doing a great job improving things in paroli which I am very thankful for. Hard to believe: http://git.paroli-project.org/?p=paroli.git;a=summary - last changes 12 days ago, the commits before that are from 3 weeks ago.. (I understand that Laszlo didn't get the support needed but got some of his code rejected - lost interest.. ) This is precisely why I think I decided to follow SHR from now on (unless something dramatically changes, with all the work at Qi I don't know how much time Mirko will have for Paroli, as much as might like it. A core app like Telephony for the Freerunner should not depend on one or two people... :( Rui -- ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: om2009/paroli status
Hi, On 24 Jul 2009, at 02:04, Nicola Mfb wrote: Hi! Is om2009 and paroli in a temporary sleeping status or was development terminated? Somethings changed in the last days and may be now there is less man power to improve them. Less man power is the right way of putting it. There still is development on both projects but less than before. Laszlo is doing a great job improving things in paroli which I am very thankful for. There still is the plan to release a final version of Om2009. It would be good if we could assemble a list of problems in paroli that need fixing for the release. Regards, /mirko ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: om2009/paroli status
On Fri, Jul 24, 2009 at 8:40 AM, Mirko Lindnervegyra...@paroli-project.org wrote: Hi, On 24 Jul 2009, at 02:04, Nicola Mfb wrote: Hi! Is om2009 and paroli in a temporary sleeping status or was development terminated? Somethings changed in the last days and may be now there is less man power to improve them. Less man power is the right way of putting it. There still is development on both projects but less than before. Laszlo is doing a great job improving things in paroli which I am very thankful for. There still is the plan to release a final version of Om2009. It would be good if we could assemble a list of problems in paroli that need fixing for the release. Hi! Mirko, I really like to see the final version of Om2009, so I'm happy there is still the plan to release it. We need a legacy milestone for some reasons: *) we of course may choose between different distros, but the great part are not easy to setup correctly while other are bleeding edge and breaks things every week, we need to give a sort of stability to users. *) developers wastes their time doing self distro mantaining and struggling with a fast changing underlying system, it may be better that they will focus on code, instead of rebuilding software, caring of api/library changes and so on. Om2009 should so take the place of Om2008, developers may target it and support users in a decent way instead of guessing problem that are distro related. *) in this dark phase that will help the reorganization of community Best Regards p.s. good luck for the new job/company :) Nicola ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: om2009/paroli status
On Fri, Jul 24, 2009 at 9:40 AM, Mirko Lindnervegyra...@paroli-project.org wrote: Less man power is the right way of putting it. There still is development on both projects but less than before. Laszlo is doing a great job improving things in paroli which I am very thankful for. Hard to believe: http://git.paroli-project.org/?p=paroli.git;a=summary - last changes 12 days ago, the commits before that are from 3 weeks ago.. (I understand that Laszlo didn't get the support needed but got some of his code rejected - lost interest.. ) There still is the plan to release a final version of Om2009. It would be good if we could assemble a list of problems in paroli that need fixing for the release. How about http://www.paroli-project.org/trac/report/1 or http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Paroli-issues ? r - someone unhappy feeling that no-one is working on Paroli or bugfixing it.. I actually tried Zhone the other day (when Paroli or FSO failed to delete SMS's from the SIM) and was very pleased with it - I'd really like to see it developed further! -- | risto h. kurppa | risto at kurppa dot fi | http://risto.kurppa.fi ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: om2009/paroli status
On Fri, Jul 24, 2009 at 11:40 PM, Risto H. Kurppari...@kurppa.fi wrote: [...] r - someone unhappy feeling that no-one is working on Paroli or bugfixing it.. I actually tried Zhone the other day (when Paroli or FSO failed to delete SMS's from the SIM) and was very pleased with it - I'd really like to see it developed further! Hi Risto, If I remember well Mickey announced that zhone will not get anymore improvements and the one in fso 5.5 is basically the same of 5.1 :(. I suppose that FSO/SHR joint will mean that while FSO will be improved and extended SHR applications will be the natural candidate for their testing and reference implementation. As there is a distro based on zhone I do not know if at least their guys will improve it. The problem is that SHR promised on late 2008 a stable milestone, after that it was forgotten, they promised again on 22 may 2009, a lot of unstable to test fork where done and abandoned. Finally I just realized that it's a real nice hacking distro with tons of bleeding edge and regular breaking updates and there is no real interesting on stabilize it. I do not want to hurt anyone is only my opinion. With om2009 release plan I just thought: SHR has no man power or will to maintain two different branch, the stable and the developing at least now, the same for OM guys with OM2009, but I'm lucky and I may have OM2009 on the flash to have a stable working device, and shr on the SD to test and enjoy bleeding edge. I'm really afraid of all the shots that our device is taking while I think that the community is completely unorganized and the term community driven completely abused. m2c Nicola ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
om2009/paroli status
Hi! Is om2009 and paroli in a temporary sleeping status or was development terminated? Somethings changed in the last days and may be now there is less man power to improve them. Regards Nicola ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
