Re: HTC Dream Developer Edition / T-Mobile G1
On Thu, 2009-02-19 at 13:51 -0500, Daniel Benoy wrote: On Wednesday 18 February 2009 16:42:52 you wrote: 2009/2/18 Daniel Benoy dan...@benoy.name If I were to get this I would gladly act as a beta tester. I could also set it up on my network and give developers shell access, if that's what's needed. However, my primary concern if it's actually open, or if it's filled with super secret patented stuff or otherwise tries to lock me down. I'd need to know that before I even considered it. I'm not an expert, but as others have pointed out, the G1 hardware is not open. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community In the case of the developer version, what specifically is closed? I assume this is a reference to the possibility of binary blobs for drivers or any other non open-source code that is required to make it work. That being said, I would definitely buy the developer's phone over the locked down G1. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: HTC Dream Developer Edition / T-Mobile G1
On Wednesday 18 February 2009 16:42:52 you wrote: 2009/2/18 Daniel Benoy dan...@benoy.name If I were to get this I would gladly act as a beta tester. I could also set it up on my network and give developers shell access, if that's what's needed. However, my primary concern if it's actually open, or if it's filled with super secret patented stuff or otherwise tries to lock me down. I'd need to know that before I even considered it. I'm not an expert, but as others have pointed out, the G1 hardware is not open. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community In the case of the developer version, what specifically is closed? -- Daniel Benoy http://daniel.benoy.name ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: HTC Dream Developer Edition / T-Mobile G1
The name of the device is ADP1 , and the hardware is the same as HTC G1, exclude unlocked boot loader. you can buy the device from google , and it's the developer edition for the G1 . it is not a free hardware and the os is android . - doron Daniel Benoy wrote: I've heard that there's a special developer edition of the HTC Dream (Marketed in the US and Europe under the name 'T-Mobie G1'), which includes an unlocked boot loader and carrier agnostic GSM access. Does anyone know anything about this device and how it compares to the GTA02 and current plans for the GTA03? I'm interested from a freedom perspective, as well as a hardware and software perspective. Is this phone an option if you want to support open hardware? Does anyone know if its bootloader is capable of booting from SD with arbitrary kernel options and able to recover from screwing around with it like my freerunner/u-boot? Are there any plans to make the FSO framework compatible with the hardware in this device (and, by extension, make Debian and current/future openmoko distributions compatible)? Are there any other freedom issues surrounding this device that I should know about before I consider getting one? -- ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: HTC Dream Developer Edition / T-Mobile G1
Hello. On Wed, 2009-02-18 at 14:46, Daniel Benoy wrote: Are there any plans to make the FSO framework compatible with the hardware in this device (and, by extension, make Debian and current/future openmoko distributions compatible)? Funny, I was thinking about exactly this again today. We, FSO, are always looking for promising new devices that gives us the freedom put FSO on it and make it usable. The sad downside is that the G1 dev phone costs around 600USD all in all (399$ device, 180$ shipping to .de, 25$ google developer account. :/) And even if I'm willing to spent time testing FSO out on it I'm not willing to pay such an amount next to the time I had to invest on working with it. One good thing is that we have already have support on the gsm modem side for other HTC devices with a similar chipset and the HTC hacker tell me that it should already work (not tested). regards Stefan Schmidt ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: HTC Dream Developer Edition / T-Mobile G1
Daniel Benoy dan...@benoy.name writes: I've heard that there's a special developer edition of the HTC Dream (Marketed in the US and Europe under the name 'T-Mobie G1'), which includes an unlocked boot loader and carrier agnostic GSM access. Does anyone know anything about this device and how it compares to the GTA02 and current plans for the GTA03? I'm interested from a freedom perspective, as well as a hardware and software perspective. Is this phone an option if you want to support open hardware? Does anyone know if its bootloader is capable of booting from SD with arbitrary kernel options and able to recover from screwing around with it like my freerunner/u-boot? Are there any plans to make the FSO framework compatible with the hardware in this device (and, by extension, make Debian and current/future openmoko distributions compatible)? Are there any other freedom issues surrounding this device that I should know about before I consider getting one? I have a Freerunner and a G1 developer phone. I havent had time to play with the g1 too much yet but heres some quick impressions: - The Freerunner has a vastly better screen than the G1 - The Android gui is quite polished and slick, but not overly customizable IMHO. - The G1 has a nice keyboard and a little trackball which is surprisingly usable. - The G1 seems to have better charging, so less aargh factor. - 3g is very nice. The selling point for me when buying the G1 is that I read that its possible to boot debian on it, just like the Freerunner. This should mean that the machine is mostly free, even though I havent been able to research this fully yet. My current which phone would be G1 hardware with Freerunner screen, running Debian with a working FSO stack, I think. I would then use Emacs as Pim dialer etc. -- Joakim Verona ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: HTC Dream Developer Edition / T-Mobile G1
I have one of these. I needed something a little more stable than my FR that allowed me to screw up the os. Other than changes for HW support, I see no reason that it couldn't run FSO. Although I imagine that HTC wouldn't prove helpful in getting the needed information. The problem is, the dev version is out of channel. And I see no chance of anyone building a version like this for public consumption. And the HTC contracts with carrriers will probably keep them from building consumer available unlocked versions for some time, if ever. Android is built to support carrier control and lock in. The cool thing is someone has already hacked together multi touch support and made the code available online. You can even hack it into a locked phone. I doubt google will add his patches upstream. Maybe time to branch android to allow for things google won't allow. I would love to see this kind of hard touchscreen in the GTA03. On Wed, Feb 18, 2009 at 2:46 PM, Daniel Benoy dan...@benoy.name wrote: I've heard that there's a special developer edition of the HTC Dream (Marketed in the US and Europe under the name 'T-Mobie G1'), which includes an unlocked boot loader and carrier agnostic GSM access. Does anyone know anything about this device and how it compares to the GTA02 and current plans for the GTA03? I'm interested from a freedom perspective, as well as a hardware and software perspective. Is this phone an option if you want to support open hardware? Does anyone know if its bootloader is capable of booting from SD with arbitrary kernel options and able to recover from screwing around with it like my freerunner/u-boot? Are there any plans to make the FSO framework compatible with the hardware in this device (and, by extension, make Debian and current/future openmoko distributions compatible)? Are there any other freedom issues surrounding this device that I should know about before I consider getting one? ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: HTC Dream Developer Edition / T-Mobile G1
If I were to get this I would gladly act as a beta tester. I could also set it up on my network and give developers shell access, if that's what's needed. However, my primary concern if it's actually open, or if it's filled with super secret patented stuff or otherwise tries to lock me down. I'd need to know that before I even considered it. On Wednesday 18 February 2009 15:05:04 you wrote: Hello. On Wed, 2009-02-18 at 14:46, Daniel Benoy wrote: Are there any plans to make the FSO framework compatible with the hardware in this device (and, by extension, make Debian and current/future openmoko distributions compatible)? Funny, I was thinking about exactly this again today. We, FSO, are always looking for promising new devices that gives us the freedom put FSO on it and make it usable. The sad downside is that the G1 dev phone costs around 600USD all in all (399$ device, 180$ shipping to .de, 25$ google developer account. :/) And even if I'm willing to spent time testing FSO out on it I'm not willing to pay such an amount next to the time I had to invest on working with it. One good thing is that we have already have support on the gsm modem side for other HTC devices with a similar chipset and the HTC hacker tell me that it should already work (not tested). regards Stefan Schmidt ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community -- Daniel Benoy http://daniel.benoy.name -- Daniel Benoy http://daniel.benoy.name ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: HTC Dream Developer Edition / T-Mobile G1
2009/2/18 Daniel Benoy dan...@benoy.name If I were to get this I would gladly act as a beta tester. I could also set it up on my network and give developers shell access, if that's what's needed. However, my primary concern if it's actually open, or if it's filled with super secret patented stuff or otherwise tries to lock me down. I'd need to know that before I even considered it. I'm not an expert, but as others have pointed out, the G1 hardware is not open. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: HTC Dream Developer Edition / T-Mobile G1
joakim wrote: The selling point for me when buying the G1 is that I read that its possible to boot debian on it, just like the Freerunner. Unfortunately that's not quite true, at present. What people have done is to loop mount a canned debian filesystem and chroot to it, allowing you to use most of the debian userspace. At least one guy took it further and used unionfs to achieve a sort-of merged debian and android filesystem. As yet I'm unaware of debian actually being able to install/boot on G1. I looked into this as I was interested in a merged debian/android on FR, using android UI but with debian underneath. No joy yet. -- View this message in context: http://n2.nabble.com/HTC-Dream-Developer-Edition---T-Mobile-G1-tp2348982p2350138.html Sent from the Openmoko Community mailing list archive at Nabble.com. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: HTC Dream Developer Edition / T-Mobile G1
scholbert wrote: joakim wrote: The selling point for me when buying the G1 is that I read that its possible to boot debian on it, just like the Freerunner. Unfortunately that's not quite true, at present. What people have done is to loop mount a canned debian filesystem and chroot to it, allowing you to use most of the debian userspace. At least one guy took it further and used unionfs to achieve a sort-of merged debian and android filesystem. As yet I'm unaware of debian actually being able to install/boot on G1. I looked into this as I was interested in a merged debian/android on FR, using android UI but with debian underneath. No joy yet. How bizarre, if you forget to login it posts as scholbert -- View this message in context: http://n2.nabble.com/HTC-Dream-Developer-Edition---T-Mobile-G1-tp2348982p2350151.html Sent from the Openmoko Community mailing list archive at Nabble.com. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
