Re: dead battery

2008-10-03 Thread Michael 'Mickey' Lauer
Am Donnerstag, den 02.10.2008, 12:28 -0600 schrieb Angus Ainslie:
 On Thu, Oct 2, 2008 at 12:04 PM, Vince M. Clark [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 wrote:
 I ran down to Batteries Plus and picked up a Rayovac
 replacement that fits. It doesn't come charged but has enough
 charge to at least jump start my fr. I put in the new battery,
 plugged in the usb cable, and was able to boot.
 
 Then I took out the Rayovac battery and put the original
 battery back in. Device stayed running and I am hoping the
 battery is charging. The power button is staying illuminated
 and is red. Any idea what that means?

See /etc/freesmartphone/rules.yaml to tweak the LED set up in the
fso-image. Right now it`s:

Power: Off while discharging, Red while charging, Blue when full, Red
blinking, when critical.

Soon:

Aux: Blinking on missed event (call, sms, alarm).

:M:

 


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Re: dead battery

2008-10-02 Thread Xavier Cremaschi
Sarton O'Brien a écrit :
 
 The 'leave it overnight' scenario is the best one I encounter for a dead 
 battery ;) ... I think you'll be right.
 
 Sarton

A good one is :
- Hold down the aux key.
- Put battery in.
- Put usb in.
- Hold down the power key.
- Release aux key.
- Wait for menu.


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Re: dead battery

2008-10-02 Thread Brock
On 2008.10.01.13.05, Vince M. Clark wrote:
| I've tried multiple times with no success. 

How about removing all SD and SIM cards, does that help?

--Brock


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Re: dead battery

2008-10-02 Thread Vince M. Clark
OK now you guys are just messing with me ;-) 

Nothing is working. I've taken everything out, tried all different combinations 
based on suggestions from the community. 

I'm sure at this point I have a totally dead battery and old u-boot. I'll get 
it jump started and update u-boot. 

- Original Message - 
From: Xavier Cremaschi [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
To: community@lists.openmoko.org 
Sent: Thursday, October 2, 2008 2:14:07 AM (GMT-0700) America/Denver 
Subject: Re: dead battery 

Sarton O'Brien a écrit : 
 
 The 'leave it overnight' scenario is the best one I encounter for a dead 
 battery ;) ... I think you'll be right. 
 
 Sarton 

A good one is : 
- Hold down the aux key. 
- Put battery in. 
- Put usb in. 
- Hold down the power key. 
- Release aux key. 
- Wait for menu. 


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Re: dead battery

2008-10-02 Thread Vince M. Clark
I ran down to Batteries Plus and picked up a Rayovac replacement that fits. It 
doesn't come charged but has enough charge to at least jump start my fr. I put 
in the new battery, plugged in the usb cable, and was able to boot. 

Then I took out the Rayovac battery and put the original battery back in. 
Device stayed running and I am hoping the battery is charging. The power button 
is staying illuminated and is red. Any idea what that means? 

- Original Message - 
From: Brock [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
To: List for Openmoko community discussion community@lists.openmoko.org 
Sent: Thursday, October 2, 2008 7:27:59 AM (GMT-0700) America/Denver 
Subject: Re: dead battery 

On 2008.10.01.13.05, Vince M. Clark wrote: 
| I've tried multiple times with no success. 

How about removing all SD and SIM cards, does that help? 

--Brock 


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Re: dead battery

2008-10-02 Thread Angus Ainslie
On Thu, Oct 2, 2008 at 12:04 PM, Vince M. Clark [EMAIL PROTECTED]wrote:

 I ran down to Batteries Plus and picked up a Rayovac replacement that fits.
 It doesn't come charged but has enough charge to at least jump start my fr.
 I put in the new battery, plugged in the usb cable, and was able to boot.

 Then I took out the Rayovac battery and put the original battery back in.
 Device stayed running and I am hoping the battery is charging. The power
 button is staying illuminated and is red. Any idea what that means?


I think you mean the AUX button is staying lit. That means its charging.

The power button is the round one.

Angus
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Re: dead battery

2008-10-02 Thread Vince M. Clark
No it is definitely the power button (the round one below the usb plug) staying 
lit red. I'm running the FSO image. 

- Original Message - 
From: Angus Ainslie [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
To: List for Openmoko community discussion community@lists.openmoko.org 
Sent: Thursday, October 2, 2008 12:28:19 PM (GMT-0700) America/Denver 
Subject: Re: dead battery 


On Thu, Oct 2, 2008 at 12:04 PM, Vince M. Clark  [EMAIL PROTECTED]  wrote: 




I ran down to Batteries Plus and picked up a Rayovac replacement that fits. It 
doesn't come charged but has enough charge to at least jump start my fr. I put 
in the new battery, plugged in the usb cable, and was able to boot. 

Then I took out the Rayovac battery and put the original battery back in. 
Device stayed running and I am hoping the battery is charging. The power button 
is staying illuminated and is red. Any idea what that means? 



I think you mean the AUX button is staying lit. That means its charging. 

The power button is the round one. 

Angus 

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Re: dead battery

2008-10-02 Thread Shawn prjktdtnt Thompson
Vince M. Clark wrote:
 No it is definitely the power button (the round one below the usb 
 plug) staying lit red. I'm running the FSO image.

 - Original Message -
 From: Angus Ainslie [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 To: List for Openmoko community discussion 
 community@lists.openmoko.org
 Sent: Thursday, October 2, 2008 12:28:19 PM (GMT-0700) America/Denver
 Subject: Re: dead battery

 On Thu, Oct 2, 2008 at 12:04 PM, Vince M. Clark [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
 mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 I ran down to Batteries Plus and picked up a Rayovac replacement
 that fits. It doesn't come charged but has enough charge to at
 least jump start my fr. I put in the new battery, plugged in the
 usb cable, and was able to boot.

 Then I took out the Rayovac battery and put the original battery
 back in. Device stayed running and I am hoping the battery is
 charging. The power button is staying illuminated and is red. Any
 idea what that means?


 I think you mean the AUX button is staying lit. That means its charging.

 The power button is the round one.

 Angus

 

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If you're running FSO the Power button turns orange while charging where 
in ASU the AUX button lights while charging.
-Shawn

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Re: dead battery

2008-10-01 Thread William Kenworthy
These are my understandings from lots of reading and previous posts
between myself and Andy Green and others on the subject - should all be
in the archives.  With 2007.2 I was hit one out of every 3 overnight
suspends ending in a flat battery.  At least with 2008.9 its rarer (but
does happen :(

With the later u-boots, usb default is 100ma as soon as its plugged in.
This unfortunately is less than a running Fr needs.  Normally as soon as
the operating system is up enough, it will negotiate up to 500ma with
the host, or in the case of the wall charger, read the sense resistor
and see that 1A is available.  When the OS is suspended, the PMU manages
the charge until the battery is charged whereupon it switches off - and
stays off.  If the OS is running, it will cycle back on when the battery
level falls to 10-20% (reports vary) as the OS can reset and renegotiate
the charge level.

If the battery is very low (i.e., the internal fail-safe disconnects
it), remove it from the phone for 30 seconds or so.  This allows the
fail-safe to reset (this is what I think happens based on my
observations) so the 100ma can get to the battery, and also reset the
phone hardware - in particular the GSM modem which is directly connected
to the battery and is thought to be root cause by Andy Green - possibly
goes into a wierd state as power drops as well, preventing restart until
reset.

The power rail of course drops due to the inrush current much more
during startup with a low battery than normal, causing one chip (USB I
think) to detect a dangerously low voltage and issue a shutdown.  So you
cant get the phone to boot until the battery has had a few minutes of
charge.

In my case, USB to my laptop or a desktop machine does it.
Remove/pause/replace battery
plug into USB for 5-10 minutes
remove/pause/replug USB cable and normal boot will happen within a few
seconds.

The wall charger should work as well, but on my one try it didnt -
possibly because the u-boot wasnt new enough at the time.

Recommendation - use a late (latest!) u-boot.

BillK



On Tue, 2008-09-30 at 22:13 -0700, Michael Shiloh wrote:
  Vince,
  When my battery died I plugged my phone into the OpenMoko supplied 
  charger, started it using NOR boot, leaving it at the boot menu until it 
  timed out (repeat that twice) then I was about to select boot from the 
  NOR menu and after a few extra seconds the phone booted.
  
  -Shawn
 
 
 I'm confused. I thought that we didn't turn on the charger until we 
 booted into Linux. Am I wrong? Do we charge in u-boot, even at a low rate?
 
 Michael
 
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Re: dead battery

2008-10-01 Thread Vince M. Clark
Well, I'm out of options. I left my fr plugged into the trickle charger 
overnight. Still won't boot. 

Then I read this last post, about removing the battery long enough for a reset, 
plugging into USB for 5-10 min, unplug/pause/plug back in. Still won't boot. 

The only thing I haven't done that was recommended in this last post is to use 
the latest u-boot. Unfortunately I cannot do this until I get it to boot. Guess 
I will wait for my external charger to arrive. 

Should I be concerned that this isn't just a battery issue and maybe my fr is 
dead? 

- Original Message - 
From: William Kenworthy [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
To: List for Openmoko community discussion community@lists.openmoko.org 
Sent: Wednesday, October 1, 2008 12:01:52 AM (GMT-0700) America/Denver 
Subject: Re: dead battery 

These are my understandings from lots of reading and previous posts 
between myself and Andy Green and others on the subject - should all be 
in the archives. With 2007.2 I was hit one out of every 3 overnight 
suspends ending in a flat battery. At least with 2008.9 its rarer (but 
does happen :( 

With the later u-boots, usb default is 100ma as soon as its plugged in. 
This unfortunately is less than a running Fr needs. Normally as soon as 
the operating system is up enough, it will negotiate up to 500ma with 
the host, or in the case of the wall charger, read the sense resistor 
and see that 1A is available. When the OS is suspended, the PMU manages 
the charge until the battery is charged whereupon it switches off - and 
stays off. If the OS is running, it will cycle back on when the battery 
level falls to 10-20% (reports vary) as the OS can reset and renegotiate 
the charge level. 

If the battery is very low (i.e., the internal fail-safe disconnects 
it), remove it from the phone for 30 seconds or so. This allows the 
fail-safe to reset (this is what I think happens based on my 
observations) so the 100ma can get to the battery, and also reset the 
phone hardware - in particular the GSM modem which is directly connected 
to the battery and is thought to be root cause by Andy Green - possibly 
goes into a wierd state as power drops as well, preventing restart until 
reset. 

The power rail of course drops due to the inrush current much more 
during startup with a low battery than normal, causing one chip (USB I 
think) to detect a dangerously low voltage and issue a shutdown. So you 
cant get the phone to boot until the battery has had a few minutes of 
charge. 

In my case, USB to my laptop or a desktop machine does it. 
Remove/pause/replace battery 
plug into USB for 5-10 minutes 
remove/pause/replug USB cable and normal boot will happen within a few 
seconds. 

The wall charger should work as well, but on my one try it didnt - 
possibly because the u-boot wasnt new enough at the time. 

Recommendation - use a late (latest!) u-boot. 

BillK 



On Tue, 2008-09-30 at 22:13 -0700, Michael Shiloh wrote: 
  Vince, 
  When my battery died I plugged my phone into the OpenMoko supplied 
  charger, started it using NOR boot, leaving it at the boot menu until it 
  timed out (repeat that twice) then I was about to select boot from the 
  NOR menu and after a few extra seconds the phone booted. 
  
  -Shawn 
  
 
 I'm confused. I thought that we didn't turn on the charger until we 
 booted into Linux. Am I wrong? Do we charge in u-boot, even at a low rate? 
 
 Michael 
 
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Home in Perth! 

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Re: dead battery

2008-10-01 Thread Tomas Riveros Schober
try again and it will eventually workthe usb cable connected to the 
computer is usually the way to go...and when it boots, quickly swap it 
to the ac charger...at least that's what i just did (my neo died during 
the night)


Vince M. Clark escribió:
 Well, I'm out of options. I left my fr plugged into the trickle 
 charger overnight. Still won't boot.

 Then I read this last post, about removing the battery long enough for 
 a reset, plugging into USB for 5-10 min, unplug/pause/plug back in. 
 Still won't boot.

 The only thing I haven't done that was recommended in this last post 
 is to use the latest u-boot. Unfortunately I cannot do this until I 
 get it to boot. Guess I will wait for my external charger to arrive.

 Should I be concerned that this isn't just a battery issue and maybe 
 my fr is dead?

 - Original Message -
 From: William Kenworthy [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 To: List for Openmoko community discussion 
 community@lists.openmoko.org
 Sent: Wednesday, October 1, 2008 12:01:52 AM (GMT-0700) America/Denver
 Subject: Re: dead battery

 These are my understandings from lots of reading and previous posts
 between myself and Andy Green and others on the subject - should all be
 in the archives.  With 2007.2 I was hit one out of every 3 overnight
 suspends ending in a flat battery.  At least with 2008.9 its rarer (but
 does happen :(

 With the later u-boots, usb default is 100ma as soon as its plugged in.
 This unfortunately is less than a running Fr needs.  Normally as soon as
 the operating system is up enough, it will negotiate up to 500ma with
 the host, or in the case of the wall charger, read the sense resistor
 and see that 1A is available.  When the OS is suspended, the PMU manages
 the charge until the battery is charged whereupon it switches off - and
 stays off.  If the OS is running, it will cycle back on when the battery
 level falls to 10-20% (reports vary) as the OS can reset and renegotiate
 the charge level.

 If the battery is very low (i.e., the internal fail-safe disconnects
 it), remove it from the phone for 30 seconds or so.  This allows the
 fail-safe to reset (this is what I think happens based on my
 observations) so the 100ma can get to the battery, and also reset the
 phone hardware - in particular the GSM modem which is directly connected
 to the battery and is thought to be root cause by Andy Green - possibly
 goes into a wierd state as power drops as well, preventing restart until
 reset.

 The power rail of course drops due to the inrush current much more
 during startup with a low battery than normal, causing one chip (USB I
 think) to detect a dangerously low voltage and issue a shutdown.  So you
 cant get the phone to boot until the battery has had a few minutes of
 charge.

 In my case, USB to my laptop or a desktop machine does it.
 Remove/pause/replace battery
 plug into USB for 5-10 minutes
 remove/pause/replug USB cable and normal boot will happen within a few
 seconds.

 The wall charger should work as well, but on my one try it didnt -
 possibly because the u-boot wasnt new enough at the time.

 Recommendation - use a late (latest!) u-boot.

 BillK



 On Tue, 2008-09-30 at 22:13 -0700, Michael Shiloh wrote:
   Vince,
   When my battery died I plugged my phone into the OpenMoko 
 supplied
   charger, started it using NOR boot, leaving it at the boot menu 
 until it
   timed out (repeat that twice) then I was about to select boot from 
 the
   NOR menu and after a few extra seconds the phone booted.
  
   -Shawn
  
 
  I'm confused. I thought that we didn't turn on the charger until we
  booted into Linux. Am I wrong? Do we charge in u-boot, even at a low 
 rate?
 
  Michael
 
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Re: dead battery

2008-10-01 Thread Vince M. Clark
I've tried multiple times with no success. 

- Original Message - 
From: Tomas Riveros Schober [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
To: List for Openmoko community discussion community@lists.openmoko.org 
Sent: Wednesday, October 1, 2008 8:26:57 AM (GMT-0700) America/Denver 
Subject: Re: dead battery 

try again and it will eventually workthe usb cable connected to the 
computer is usually the way to go...and when it boots, quickly swap it 
to the ac charger...at least that's what i just did (my neo died during 
the night) 


Vince M. Clark escribió: 
 Well, I'm out of options. I left my fr plugged into the trickle 
 charger overnight. Still won't boot. 
 
 Then I read this last post, about removing the battery long enough for 
 a reset, plugging into USB for 5-10 min, unplug/pause/plug back in. 
 Still won't boot. 
 
 The only thing I haven't done that was recommended in this last post 
 is to use the latest u-boot. Unfortunately I cannot do this until I 
 get it to boot. Guess I will wait for my external charger to arrive. 
 
 Should I be concerned that this isn't just a battery issue and maybe 
 my fr is dead? 
 
 - Original Message - 
 From: William Kenworthy [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
 To: List for Openmoko community discussion 
 community@lists.openmoko.org 
 Sent: Wednesday, October 1, 2008 12:01:52 AM (GMT-0700) America/Denver 
 Subject: Re: dead battery 
 
 These are my understandings from lots of reading and previous posts 
 between myself and Andy Green and others on the subject - should all be 
 in the archives. With 2007.2 I was hit one out of every 3 overnight 
 suspends ending in a flat battery. At least with 2008.9 its rarer (but 
 does happen :( 
 
 With the later u-boots, usb default is 100ma as soon as its plugged in. 
 This unfortunately is less than a running Fr needs. Normally as soon as 
 the operating system is up enough, it will negotiate up to 500ma with 
 the host, or in the case of the wall charger, read the sense resistor 
 and see that 1A is available. When the OS is suspended, the PMU manages 
 the charge until the battery is charged whereupon it switches off - and 
 stays off. If the OS is running, it will cycle back on when the battery 
 level falls to 10-20% (reports vary) as the OS can reset and renegotiate 
 the charge level. 
 
 If the battery is very low (i.e., the internal fail-safe disconnects 
 it), remove it from the phone for 30 seconds or so. This allows the 
 fail-safe to reset (this is what I think happens based on my 
 observations) so the 100ma can get to the battery, and also reset the 
 phone hardware - in particular the GSM modem which is directly connected 
 to the battery and is thought to be root cause by Andy Green - possibly 
 goes into a wierd state as power drops as well, preventing restart until 
 reset. 
 
 The power rail of course drops due to the inrush current much more 
 during startup with a low battery than normal, causing one chip (USB I 
 think) to detect a dangerously low voltage and issue a shutdown. So you 
 cant get the phone to boot until the battery has had a few minutes of 
 charge. 
 
 In my case, USB to my laptop or a desktop machine does it. 
 Remove/pause/replace battery 
 plug into USB for 5-10 minutes 
 remove/pause/replug USB cable and normal boot will happen within a few 
 seconds. 
 
 The wall charger should work as well, but on my one try it didnt - 
 possibly because the u-boot wasnt new enough at the time. 
 
 Recommendation - use a late (latest!) u-boot. 
 
 BillK 
 
 
 
 On Tue, 2008-09-30 at 22:13 -0700, Michael Shiloh wrote: 
   Vince, 
   When my battery died I plugged my phone into the OpenMoko 
 supplied 
   charger, started it using NOR boot, leaving it at the boot menu 
 until it 
   timed out (repeat that twice) then I was about to select boot from 
 the 
   NOR menu and after a few extra seconds the phone booted. 
   
   -Shawn 
   
  
  I'm confused. I thought that we didn't turn on the charger until we 
  booted into Linux. Am I wrong? Do we charge in u-boot, even at a low 
 rate? 
  
  Michael 
  
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 Home in Perth! 
 
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Re: dead battery

2008-10-01 Thread Linus Gasser
Vince M. Clark a écrit :
 My battery is completely drained so I cannot boot to charge it. 

I usually just take out the battery and try to start it with the charger 
plugged in (never tried with the USB). A combination of

- letting it without power for 30 seconds (no battery and no charger)
- switching it on with: Press AUX - Press Powerbutton - Release AUX - 
Release Powerbutton using various timings
- putting back in the battery anyway

usually does the trick. As this sounds a bit like black magick, I'm sure 
there is somewhere a proper explanation and a scientific way to do 
it... Until that I stick to that what I know. Let there be light ;)

Linus

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Re: dead battery

2008-10-01 Thread Al Johnson
On Wednesday 01 October 2008, Vince M. Clark wrote:
 I've tried multiple times with no success.

If the various 'leave it charging' methods don't work then your best bet is 
the nokia battery or charger for nokia battery.

Stick the charged nokia battery in the freerunner, plug in the usb lead or 
power adapter, and boot. Once it has booted remove the nokia battery and put 
in the original one that's dead. This will now start charging as normal.

You can also connect up more or less any other single cell Li-Ion battery or 
suitable external PSU to do the initial boot, then remove and plug in the 
dead battery. If you think this method needs more detailed instructions you 
shouldn't be attempting it ;-)

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Re: dead battery

2008-10-01 Thread William Kenworthy
On Wed, 2008-10-01 at 08:16 -0600, Vince M. Clark wrote:
 Well, I'm out of options. I left my fr plugged into the trickle
 charger overnight. Still won't boot.
 
Can you jump start it as per the wiki?

Borrow (friend/partners/... phone) a nokia bl4c, bl5c or bl6c battery?
Boot the FR using this.  Once up you can safely remove the battery while
still connected and replace it with yours which should happily charge.
The PMU will have negotiated 500ma so the phone will stay up.

I have not actually heard of a dead FR without prior cause (dropped etc)
and the symptoms fit with an over-discharged battery and early u-boot so
I doubt its actually dead.

BillK




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Re: dead battery

2008-09-30 Thread Joel Newkirk
A desktop charger for a Nokia BL-5c or BL-6c battery will do the job, at
least the two non-Nokia ones I've tried.  I've done it a few times.  I've
never let it sit on the charger until full, so I don't know if the charger
can recognize full charge on the FreeRunner battery or not, but left on the
charger for 15-20 minutes it will boot the FreeRunner.

The most readily-accessible source is likely to be a friend with a Nokia
phone using one of those batteries - several models over the past six or
eight years. (mine is a 6600)  If you know anyone with a nokia phone (now
or the past several years) it's worth asking them what battery it uses, if
they have a desktop charger, and if you can borrow it. (or keep it - if
they're not using the phone ask for the charger and battery ;)

j


On Tue, 30 Sep 2008 13:04:07 -0600 (MDT), Vince M. Clark
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 My battery is completely drained so I cannot boot to charge it.
 
 The following thread offered three possible solutions:

http://n2.nabble.com/Can%27t-boot-Freerunner-without-battery---Was:-Re:-unable-to-start-up-freerunner-after-batterie-was-full-down-td526783.html
 
 Does anyone know where I can get an external charger that will work with
 the Freerunner battery?
 
 Vince Clark
 [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 (303) 493-6723


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Re: dead battery

2008-09-30 Thread Paul
Joel Newkirk wrote:
 A desktop charger for a Nokia BL-5c or BL-6c battery will do the job, at
 least the two non-Nokia ones I've tried.  I've done it a few times.  I've
 never let it sit on the charger until full, so I don't know if the charger
 can recognize full charge on the FreeRunner battery or not, but left on the
 charger for 15-20 minutes it will boot the FreeRunner.
   

Very useful to know, thank you. I am anxiously waiting for my FR to arrive.

I wonder about something: does a FR come with charged batteries?? One 
would expect so, otherwise it can never be started/used.

Am I correct in this?

Paul

-- 
If you reject the food, ignore the customs, fear the 
religion and avoid the people, you might better stay home.
-James Michener

http://www.nlpagan.net
Running on Mandriva Linux 2008 and Ubuntu 8.04


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Re: dead battery

2008-09-30 Thread Vince M. Clark
Thanks Joel. I'll go digging thru my box of old phones. I know there are a 
couple of Nokias in there. 

- Original Message - 
From: Joel Newkirk [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
To: List for Openmoko community discussion community@lists.openmoko.org 
Sent: Tuesday, September 30, 2008 1:25:36 PM (GMT-0700) America/Denver 
Subject: Re: dead battery 

A desktop charger for a Nokia BL-5c or BL-6c battery will do the job, at 
least the two non-Nokia ones I've tried. I've done it a few times. I've 
never let it sit on the charger until full, so I don't know if the charger 
can recognize full charge on the FreeRunner battery or not, but left on the 
charger for 15-20 minutes it will boot the FreeRunner. 

The most readily-accessible source is likely to be a friend with a Nokia 
phone using one of those batteries - several models over the past six or 
eight years. (mine is a 6600) If you know anyone with a nokia phone (now 
or the past several years) it's worth asking them what battery it uses, if 
they have a desktop charger, and if you can borrow it. (or keep it - if 
they're not using the phone ask for the charger and battery ;) 

j 


On Tue, 30 Sep 2008 13:04:07 -0600 (MDT), Vince M. Clark 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: 
 My battery is completely drained so I cannot boot to charge it. 
 
 The following thread offered three possible solutions: 
 
http://n2.nabble.com/Can%27t-boot-Freerunner-without-battery---Was:-Re:-unable-to-start-up-freerunner-after-batterie-was-full-down-td526783.html
 
 
 Does anyone know where I can get an external charger that will work with 
 the Freerunner battery? 
 
 Vince Clark 
 [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
 (303) 493-6723 


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Re: dead battery

2008-09-30 Thread Vince M. Clark
One more question. Maybe it will be obvious once I get my hands on a charger, 
but how do you actually connect the battery? Will it fit in an old Nokia phone? 
Or do you somehow connect the battery directly to the charger? 

- Original Message - 
From: Joel Newkirk [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
To: List for Openmoko community discussion community@lists.openmoko.org 
Sent: Tuesday, September 30, 2008 1:25:36 PM (GMT-0700) America/Denver 
Subject: Re: dead battery 

A desktop charger for a Nokia BL-5c or BL-6c battery will do the job, at 
least the two non-Nokia ones I've tried. I've done it a few times. I've 
never let it sit on the charger until full, so I don't know if the charger 
can recognize full charge on the FreeRunner battery or not, but left on the 
charger for 15-20 minutes it will boot the FreeRunner. 

The most readily-accessible source is likely to be a friend with a Nokia 
phone using one of those batteries - several models over the past six or 
eight years. (mine is a 6600) If you know anyone with a nokia phone (now 
or the past several years) it's worth asking them what battery it uses, if 
they have a desktop charger, and if you can borrow it. (or keep it - if 
they're not using the phone ask for the charger and battery ;) 

j 


On Tue, 30 Sep 2008 13:04:07 -0600 (MDT), Vince M. Clark 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: 
 My battery is completely drained so I cannot boot to charge it. 
 
 The following thread offered three possible solutions: 
 
http://n2.nabble.com/Can%27t-boot-Freerunner-without-battery---Was:-Re:-unable-to-start-up-freerunner-after-batterie-was-full-down-td526783.html
 
 
 Does anyone know where I can get an external charger that will work with 
 the Freerunner battery? 
 
 Vince Clark 
 [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
 (303) 493-6723 


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Re: dead battery

2008-09-30 Thread Tomas Riveros Schober
well whenever im hit with a dead battery i just plug the freerunner to 
the computer's usb port and let it sit for a few minutes then turn it on 
to NOR...or NAND whichever one works first

Paul escribió:
 Joel Newkirk wrote:
   
 A desktop charger for a Nokia BL-5c or BL-6c battery will do the job, at
 least the two non-Nokia ones I've tried.  I've done it a few times.  I've
 never let it sit on the charger until full, so I don't know if the charger
 can recognize full charge on the FreeRunner battery or not, but left on the
 charger for 15-20 minutes it will boot the FreeRunner.
   
 

 Very useful to know, thank you. I am anxiously waiting for my FR to arrive.

 I wonder about something: does a FR come with charged batteries?? One 
 would expect so, otherwise it can never be started/used.

 Am I correct in this?

 Paul

   

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Re: dead battery

2008-09-30 Thread Petr Vanek
On Tue, 30 Sep 2008 21:32:26 +0200
Paul [EMAIL PROTECTED] (P) wrote:

Joel Newkirk wrote:
 A desktop charger for a Nokia BL-5c or BL-6c battery will do the
 job, at least the two non-Nokia ones I've tried.  I've done it a few
 times.  I've never let it sit on the charger until full, so I don't
 know if the charger can recognize full charge on the FreeRunner
 battery or not, but left on the charger for 15-20 minutes it will
 boot the FreeRunner. 

Very useful to know, thank you. I am anxiously waiting for my FR to
arrive.

I wonder about something: does a FR come with charged batteries?? One 
would expect so, otherwise it can never be started/used.

Am I correct in this?

yes. i got fr plus the spares kit (two extra batteries (very handy
btw)) and all came charged up.


--
Petr Vaněk
http://biodynamika.cz




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Re: dead battery

2008-09-30 Thread Paul
Tomas Riveros Schober wrote:
 well whenever im hit with a dead battery i just plug the freerunner to 
 the computer's usb port and let it sit for a few minutes then turn it on 
 to NOR...or NAND whichever one works first
   

Well, that is a very simple solution.  :-)
Thank you!

Paul

-- 
If you reject the food, ignore the customs, fear the 
religion and avoid the people, you might better stay home.
-James Michener

http://www.nlpagan.net
Running on Mandriva Linux 2008 and Ubuntu 8.04


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Re: dead battery

2008-09-30 Thread Vince M. Clark
I've tried that, as well as the wall charger. The battery is totally dead and 
my fr will not boot, regardless of how long I leave it plugged in. 

- Original Message - 
From: Paul [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
To: List for Openmoko community discussion community@lists.openmoko.org 
Sent: Tuesday, September 30, 2008 1:52:02 PM (GMT-0700) America/Denver 
Subject: Re: dead battery 

Tomas Riveros Schober wrote: 
 well whenever im hit with a dead battery i just plug the freerunner to 
 the computer's usb port and let it sit for a few minutes then turn it on 
 to NOR...or NAND whichever one works first 
 

Well, that is a very simple solution. :-) 
Thank you! 

Paul 

-- 
If you reject the food, ignore the customs, fear the 
religion and avoid the people, you might better stay home. 
-James Michener 

http://www.nlpagan.net 
Running on Mandriva Linux 2008 and Ubuntu 8.04 


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Re: dead battery

2008-09-30 Thread Joel Newkirk
On Tue, 30 Sep 2008 13:35:56 -0600 (MDT), Vince M. Clark
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 One more question. Maybe it will be obvious once I get my hands on a
 charger, but how do you actually connect the battery? Will it fit in an
old
 Nokia phone? Or do you somehow connect the battery directly to the
charger?


The battery usually lays in just like it does in the phone.  The battery
will fit into the Nokia, but I'd be surprised if the Nokia agreed to charge
it, since it won't recognize it.

j






 
 - Original Message -
 From: Joel Newkirk [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 To: List for Openmoko community discussion
 community@lists.openmoko.org
 Sent: Tuesday, September 30, 2008 1:25:36 PM (GMT-0700) America/Denver
 Subject: Re: dead battery
 
 A desktop charger for a Nokia BL-5c or BL-6c battery will do the job, at
 least the two non-Nokia ones I've tried. I've done it a few times. I've
 never let it sit on the charger until full, so I don't know if the
charger
 can recognize full charge on the FreeRunner battery or not, but left on
 the
 charger for 15-20 minutes it will boot the FreeRunner.
 
 The most readily-accessible source is likely to be a friend with a Nokia
 phone using one of those batteries - several models over the past six or
 eight years. (mine is a 6600) If you know anyone with a nokia phone (now
 or the past several years) it's worth asking them what battery it uses,
if
 they have a desktop charger, and if you can borrow it. (or keep it - if
 they're not using the phone ask for the charger and battery ;)
 
 j
 
 
 On Tue, 30 Sep 2008 13:04:07 -0600 (MDT), Vince M. Clark
 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 My battery is completely drained so I cannot boot to charge it.

 The following thread offered three possible solutions:


http://n2.nabble.com/Can%27t-boot-Freerunner-without-battery---Was:-Re:-unable-to-start-up-freerunner-after-batterie-was-full-down-td526783.html

 Does anyone know where I can get an external charger that will work with
 the Freerunner battery?

 Vince Clark
 [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 (303) 493-6723
 
 
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 community@lists.openmoko.org
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Charging a Neo battery in a Nokia charger or phone (was: Re: dead battery)

2008-09-30 Thread Michael Shiloh

 The battery usually lays in just like it does in the phone.  The battery
 will fit into the Nokia, but I'd be surprised if the Nokia agreed to charge
 it, since it won't recognize it.

Exactly right. My understanding is this:

Nokia devices (phones and stand-alone chargers) will not charge 
non-Nokia batteries, most likely because they can't be sure they have 
the correct charging parameters.

Most after-market or no-name brands of Nokia-compatible chargers don't 
test the make of the battery, most likely because adding the capability 
to perform this test would add to the cost of the charger.

Thus:

* You can use a Nokia or Nokia-compatible BL-4C, BL-5C, or BL-6C in the Neo

* You can charge the Neo battery in a Nokia-compatible charger that is 
not Nokia branded

* You can NOT charge the Neo battery in a Nokia branded phone or charger

Michael

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Re: Charging a Neo battery in a Nokia charger or phone (was: Re: dead battery)

2008-09-30 Thread Nick Matteo
On Tue, Sep 30, 2008 at 5:11 PM, Michael Shiloh [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 Exactly right. My understanding is this:

 Nokia devices (phones and stand-alone chargers) will not charge
 non-Nokia batteries, most likely because they can't be sure they have
 the correct charging parameters.

 Most after-market or no-name brands of Nokia-compatible chargers don't
 test the make of the battery, most likely because adding the capability
 to perform this test would add to the cost of the charger.

 Thus:

 * You can use a Nokia or Nokia-compatible BL-4C, BL-5C, or BL-6C in the Neo

 * You can charge the Neo battery in a Nokia-compatible charger that is
 not Nokia branded

 * You can NOT charge the Neo battery in a Nokia branded phone or charger

 Michael

Thanks for this helpfully complete characterization.
Do you happen to know if a Nokia battery (such as the BL-5c) will
charge in the FreeRunner?

Thanks,
Nick

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Re: dead battery

2008-09-30 Thread Sarton O'Brien
On Wednesday 01 October 2008 05:52:38 Vince M. Clark wrote:
 I've tried that, as well as the wall charger. The battery is totally dead
 and my fr will not boot, regardless of how long I leave it plugged in.

6 - 8 hours on the wall charger is not unusual for my dead battery to start to 
function. How long have you left it?

Sarton

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Re: dead battery

2008-09-30 Thread Shawn prjktdtnt Thompson
Vince M. Clark wrote:
 My battery is completely drained so I cannot boot to charge it.

 The following thread offered three possible solutions:
 http://n2.nabble.com/Can%27t-boot-Freerunner-without-battery---Was:-Re:-unable-to-start-up-freerunner-after-batterie-was-full-down-td526783.html

 Does anyone know where I can get an external charger that will work 
 with the Freerunner battery?

 Vince Clark
 [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 (303) 493-6723
 

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Vince,
When my battery died I plugged my phone into the OpenMoko supplied 
charger, started it using NOR boot, leaving it at the boot menu until it 
timed out (repeat that twice) then I was about to select boot from the 
NOR menu and after a few extra seconds the phone booted.

-Shawn

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Re: dead battery

2008-09-30 Thread Vince M. Clark
Not that long on the wall charger. I'll leave it overnight and see what 
happens. 

I have left in on the USB charger for a few hours with no luck. 

- Original Message - 
From: Sarton O'Brien [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
To: List for Openmoko community discussion community@lists.openmoko.org 
Sent: Tuesday, September 30, 2008 5:27:57 PM (GMT-0700) America/Denver 
Subject: Re: dead battery 

On Wednesday 01 October 2008 05:52:38 Vince M. Clark wrote: 
 I've tried that, as well as the wall charger. The battery is totally dead 
 and my fr will not boot, regardless of how long I leave it plugged in. 

6 - 8 hours on the wall charger is not unusual for my dead battery to start to 
function. How long have you left it? 

Sarton 

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Re: dead battery

2008-09-30 Thread Vince M. Clark
Thanks Shawn. I have tried NOR boot (holding aux button while pressing power 
button, then releasing aux button.) I cannot even get that far. I'm going to 
leave it plugged into the wall charger overnight and see what happens. In the 
meantime i ordered an after market Nokia battery charger. They are cheap but it 
looks like it may take a week or so to get it. 

- Original Message - 
From: Shawn \prjktdtnt\ Thompson [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
To: List for Openmoko community discussion community@lists.openmoko.org 
Sent: Tuesday, September 30, 2008 5:31:17 PM (GMT-0700) America/Denver 
Subject: Re: dead battery 

Vince M. Clark wrote: 
 My battery is completely drained so I cannot boot to charge it. 
 
 The following thread offered three possible solutions: 
 http://n2.nabble.com/Can%27t-boot-Freerunner-without-battery---Was:-Re:-unable-to-start-up-freerunner-after-batterie-was-full-down-td526783.html
  
 
 Does anyone know where I can get an external charger that will work 
 with the Freerunner battery? 
 
 Vince Clark 
 [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
 (303) 493-6723 
  
 
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 http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community 
 
Vince, 
When my battery died I plugged my phone into the OpenMoko supplied 
charger, started it using NOR boot, leaving it at the boot menu until it 
timed out (repeat that twice) then I was about to select boot from the 
NOR menu and after a few extra seconds the phone booted. 

-Shawn 

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Re: dead battery

2008-09-30 Thread Shawn prjktdtnt Thompson
Vince M. Clark wrote:
 Thanks Shawn. I have tried NOR boot (holding aux button while pressing 
 power button, then releasing aux  button.) I cannot even get that far. 
 I'm going to leave it plugged into the wall charger overnight and see 
 what happens. In the meantime i ordered an after market Nokia battery 
 charger. They are cheap but it looks like it may take a week or so to 
 get it.

 - Original Message -
 From: Shawn \prjktdtnt\ Thompson [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 To: List for Openmoko community discussion 
 community@lists.openmoko.org
 Sent: Tuesday, September 30, 2008 5:31:17 PM (GMT-0700) America/Denver
 Subject: Re: dead battery

 Vince M. Clark wrote:
  My battery is completely drained so I cannot boot to charge it.
 
  The following thread offered three possible solutions:
  
 http://n2.nabble.com/Can%27t-boot-Freerunner-without-battery---Was:-Re:-unable-to-start-up-freerunner-after-batterie-was-full-down-td526783.html
 
  Does anyone know where I can get an external charger that will work
  with the Freerunner battery?
 
  Vince Clark
  [EMAIL PROTECTED]
  (303) 493-6723
  
 
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 Vince,
 When my battery died I plugged my phone into the OpenMoko supplied
 charger, started it using NOR boot, leaving it at the boot menu until it
 timed out (repeat that twice) then I was about to select boot from the
 NOR menu and after a few extra seconds the phone booted.

 -Shawn

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When trying to get into NOR do you already have it plugged into your 
charger? That is how I was able to finally get mine to boot, you only 
need the actual OpenMoko charger until it starts up then you can use 
whatever USB charger you prefer. Just plug into wall-socket and phone, 
start NOR twice, viola.

-Shawn

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Re: dead battery

2008-09-30 Thread Vince M. Clark
Yes. I have my fr plugged into the OpenMoko wall charger. Then I try NOR boot 
but nothing happens. I have tried NOR boot plugged in and not plugged in. 

- Original Message - 
From: Shawn \prjktdtnt\ Thompson [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
To: List for Openmoko community discussion community@lists.openmoko.org 
Sent: Tuesday, September 30, 2008 5:37:22 PM (GMT-0700) America/Denver 
Subject: Re: dead battery 

Vince M. Clark wrote: 
 Thanks Shawn. I have tried NOR boot (holding aux button while pressing 
 power button, then releasing aux button.) I cannot even get that far. 
 I'm going to leave it plugged into the wall charger overnight and see 
 what happens. In the meantime i ordered an after market Nokia battery 
 charger. They are cheap but it looks like it may take a week or so to 
 get it. 
 
 - Original Message - 
 From: Shawn \prjktdtnt\ Thompson [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
 To: List for Openmoko community discussion 
 community@lists.openmoko.org 
 Sent: Tuesday, September 30, 2008 5:31:17 PM (GMT-0700) America/Denver 
 Subject: Re: dead battery 
 
 Vince M. Clark wrote: 
  My battery is completely drained so I cannot boot to charge it. 
  
  The following thread offered three possible solutions: 
  
 http://n2.nabble.com/Can%27t-boot-Freerunner-without-battery---Was:-Re:-unable-to-start-up-freerunner-after-batterie-was-full-down-td526783.html
  
  
  Does anyone know where I can get an external charger that will work 
  with the Freerunner battery? 
  
  Vince Clark 
  [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
  (303) 493-6723 
   
  
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 Vince, 
 When my battery died I plugged my phone into the OpenMoko supplied 
 charger, started it using NOR boot, leaving it at the boot menu until it 
 timed out (repeat that twice) then I was about to select boot from the 
 NOR menu and after a few extra seconds the phone booted. 
 
 -Shawn 
 
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When trying to get into NOR do you already have it plugged into your 
charger? That is how I was able to finally get mine to boot, you only 
need the actual OpenMoko charger until it starts up then you can use 
whatever USB charger you prefer. Just plug into wall-socket and phone, 
start NOR twice, viola. 

-Shawn 

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Re: dead battery

2008-09-30 Thread Sarton O'Brien
On Wednesday 01 October 2008 09:31:22 Vince M. Clark wrote:
 Not that long on the wall charger. I'll leave it overnight and see what
 happens.

 I have left in on the USB charger for a few hours with no luck.

The 'leave it overnight' scenario is the best one I encounter for a dead 
battery ;) ... I think you'll be right.

Sarton

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Re: dead battery

2008-09-30 Thread Shawn prjktdtnt Thompson
Vince M. Clark wrote:
 Yes. I have my fr plugged into the OpenMoko wall charger. Then I try 
 NOR boot but nothing happens. I have tried NOR boot plugged in and not 
 plugged in.

 - Original Message -
 From: Shawn \prjktdtnt\ Thompson [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 To: List for Openmoko community discussion 
 community@lists.openmoko.org
 Sent: Tuesday, September 30, 2008 5:37:22 PM (GMT-0700) America/Denver
 Subject: Re: dead battery

 Vince M. Clark wrote:
  Thanks Shawn. I have tried NOR boot (holding aux button while pressing
  power button, then releasing aux  button.) I cannot even get that far.
  I'm going to leave it plugged into the wall charger overnight and see
  what happens. In the meantime i ordered an after market Nokia battery
  charger. They are cheap but it looks like it may take a week or so to
  get it.
 
  - Original Message -
  From: Shawn \prjktdtnt\ Thompson [EMAIL PROTECTED]
  To: List for Openmoko community discussion
  community@lists.openmoko.org
  Sent: Tuesday, September 30, 2008 5:31:17 PM (GMT-0700) America/Denver
  Subject: Re: dead battery
 
  Vince M. Clark wrote:
   My battery is completely drained so I cannot boot to charge it.
  
   The following thread offered three possible solutions:
  
  
 http://n2.nabble.com/Can%27t-boot-Freerunner-without-battery---Was:-Re:-unable-to-start-up-freerunner-after-batterie-was-full-down-td526783.html
  
   Does anyone know where I can get an external charger that will work
   with the Freerunner battery?
  
   Vince Clark
   [EMAIL PROTECTED]
   (303) 493-6723
   
 
  
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  Vince,
  When my battery died I plugged my phone into the OpenMoko supplied
  charger, started it using NOR boot, leaving it at the boot menu until it
  timed out (repeat that twice) then I was about to select boot from the
  NOR menu and after a few extra seconds the phone booted.
 
  -Shawn
 
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 When trying to get into NOR do you already have it plugged into your
 charger? That is how I was able to finally get mine to boot, you only
 need the actual OpenMoko charger until it starts up then you can use
 whatever USB charger you prefer. Just plug into wall-socket and phone,
 start NOR twice, viola.

 -Shawn

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Odd. Sadly that is the only way I was able to get mine going again, 
would be nice to see a patch that corrects the issue somehow so that 
people don't have to use workarounds in the future.
-Shawn

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Re: dead battery

2008-09-30 Thread Sarton O'Brien
On Wednesday 01 October 2008 09:37:22 Shawn prjktdtnt Thompson wrote:
 Vince M. Clark wrote:
  Thanks Shawn. I have tried NOR boot (holding aux button while pressing
  power button, then releasing aux  button.) I cannot even get that far.
  I'm going to leave it plugged into the wall charger overnight and see
  what happens. In the meantime i ordered an after market Nokia battery
  charger. They are cheap but it looks like it may take a week or so to
  get it.
 
  Vince,
  When my battery died I plugged my phone into the OpenMoko supplied
  charger, started it using NOR boot, leaving it at the boot menu until it
  timed out (repeat that twice) then I was about to select boot from the
  NOR menu and after a few extra seconds the phone booted.

 When trying to get into NOR do you already have it plugged into your
 charger? That is how I was able to finally get mine to boot, you only
 need the actual OpenMoko charger until it starts up then you can use
 whatever USB charger you prefer. Just plug into wall-socket and phone,
 start NOR twice, viola.

Not to be a killjoy but I think there may be varied levels of 'dead'. I've had 
a similar situation but it's not always he case.

When you can't get anything to happen, the only solution is to plug it in and 
go to bed (assuming you have no other options at hand).

Sarton

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Re: dead battery

2008-09-30 Thread Sarton O'Brien
On Wednesday 01 October 2008 09:45:08 Shawn prjktdtnt Thompson wrote:
 Odd. Sadly that is the only way I was able to get mine going again,
 would be nice to see a patch that corrects the issue somehow so that
 people don't have to use workarounds in the future.
 -Shawn

I don't think it is as complicated as that. I think it's merely the amount of 
charge the FR is able to negotiate when powered off. Depending on the level of 
'dead' determines how long you need to trickle charge it before anything 
useful occurs.

I'd say battery maintenance and usage patterns may contribute also.

From what I have seen on this list, I don't think this situation will change 
in a hurry, if ever.

Sarton

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Re: dead battery

2008-09-30 Thread Shawn prjktdtnt Thompson
Sarton O'Brien wrote:
 On Wednesday 01 October 2008 09:45:08 Shawn prjktdtnt Thompson wrote:
   
 Odd. Sadly that is the only way I was able to get mine going again,
 would be nice to see a patch that corrects the issue somehow so that
 people don't have to use workarounds in the future.
 -Shawn
 

 I don't think it is as complicated as that. I think it's merely the amount of 
 charge the FR is able to negotiate when powered off. Depending on the level 
 of 
 'dead' determines how long you need to trickle charge it before anything 
 useful occurs.

 I'd say battery maintenance and usage patterns may contribute also.

 From what I have seen on this list, I don't think this situation will change 
 in a hurry, if ever.

 Sarton

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What I had meant is that I hope they find away to allow 1000mA charging 
while powered off so that you don't have to let it tricle charge for the 
entire night to power it on at only partial power. Of all the phones 
I've owned none of them had this problem and it's probably the most 
annoying problem I can think of with the OpenMoko. Lucikly for me I'm 
the type to plug in my phone daily so it isn't a problem but I could see 
it becoming one in the future when more and more people start using the 
OpenMoko products.

-Shawn

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Re: dead battery

2008-09-30 Thread Vince M. Clark
As long as it eventually comes back on I'm fine. I didn't realize that the wall 
charger would eventually get enough charge in the battery to boot it. My 
impression from the other thread was that once the battery was dead you were 
screwed without an external charger or extra battery. 

- Original Message - 
From: Sarton O'Brien [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
To: List for Openmoko community discussion community@lists.openmoko.org 
Sent: Tuesday, September 30, 2008 5:52:32 PM (GMT-0700) America/Denver 
Subject: Re: dead battery 

On Wednesday 01 October 2008 09:45:08 Shawn prjktdtnt Thompson wrote: 
 Odd. Sadly that is the only way I was able to get mine going again, 
 would be nice to see a patch that corrects the issue somehow so that 
 people don't have to use workarounds in the future. 
 -Shawn 

I don't think it is as complicated as that. I think it's merely the amount of 
charge the FR is able to negotiate when powered off. Depending on the level of 
'dead' determines how long you need to trickle charge it before anything 
useful occurs. 

I'd say battery maintenance and usage patterns may contribute also. 

From what I have seen on this list, I don't think this situation will change 
in a hurry, if ever. 

Sarton 

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Re: dead battery

2008-09-30 Thread Shawn prjktdtnt Thompson
Vince M. Clark wrote:
 As long as it eventually comes back on I'm fine. I didn't realize that 
 the wall charger would eventually get enough charge in the battery to 
 boot it. My impression from the other thread was that once the battery 
 was dead you were screwed without an external charger or extra battery.

 - Original Message -
 From: Sarton O'Brien [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 To: List for Openmoko community discussion 
 community@lists.openmoko.org
 Sent: Tuesday, September 30, 2008 5:52:32 PM (GMT-0700) America/Denver
 Subject: Re: dead battery

 On Wednesday 01 October 2008 09:45:08 Shawn prjktdtnt Thompson wrote:
  Odd. Sadly that is the only way I was able to get mine going again,
  would be nice to see a patch that corrects the issue somehow so that
  people don't have to use workarounds in the future.
  -Shawn

 I don't think it is as complicated as that. I think it's merely the 
 amount of
 charge the FR is able to negotiate when powered off. Depending on the 
 level of
 'dead' determines how long you need to trickle charge it before anything
 useful occurs.

 I'd say battery maintenance and usage patterns may contribute also.

 From what I have seen on this list, I don't think this situation will 
 change
 in a hurry, if ever.

 Sarton

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Nope, don't need the external, but if it is flat dead to where NOR won't 
start you'll be a few hours (charges at 50mA IIRC) before you can even 
try again.

-Shawn

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Re: dead battery

2008-09-30 Thread Vince M. Clark
Got it. Thanks. 

- Original Message - 
From: Shawn \prjktdtnt\ Thompson [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
To: List for Openmoko community discussion community@lists.openmoko.org 
Sent: Tuesday, September 30, 2008 5:58:57 PM (GMT-0700) America/Denver 
Subject: Re: dead battery 

Vince M. Clark wrote: 
 As long as it eventually comes back on I'm fine. I didn't realize that 
 the wall charger would eventually get enough charge in the battery to 
 boot it. My impression from the other thread was that once the battery 
 was dead you were screwed without an external charger or extra battery. 
 
 - Original Message - 
 From: Sarton O'Brien [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
 To: List for Openmoko community discussion 
 community@lists.openmoko.org 
 Sent: Tuesday, September 30, 2008 5:52:32 PM (GMT-0700) America/Denver 
 Subject: Re: dead battery 
 
 On Wednesday 01 October 2008 09:45:08 Shawn prjktdtnt Thompson wrote: 
  Odd. Sadly that is the only way I was able to get mine going again, 
  would be nice to see a patch that corrects the issue somehow so that 
  people don't have to use workarounds in the future. 
  -Shawn 
 
 I don't think it is as complicated as that. I think it's merely the 
 amount of 
 charge the FR is able to negotiate when powered off. Depending on the 
 level of 
 'dead' determines how long you need to trickle charge it before anything 
 useful occurs. 
 
 I'd say battery maintenance and usage patterns may contribute also. 
 
 From what I have seen on this list, I don't think this situation will 
 change 
 in a hurry, if ever. 
 
 Sarton 
 
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Nope, don't need the external, but if it is flat dead to where NOR won't 
start you'll be a few hours (charges at 50mA IIRC) before you can even 
try again. 

-Shawn 

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Re: dead battery

2008-09-30 Thread Sarton O'Brien
On Wednesday 01 October 2008 09:56:00 Shawn prjktdtnt Thompson wrote:
 What I had meant is that I hope they find away to allow 1000mA charging
 while powered off so that you don't have to let it tricle charge for the
 entire night to power it on at only partial power. Of all the phones
 I've owned none of them had this problem and it's probably the most
 annoying problem I can think of with the OpenMoko. Lucikly for me I'm
 the type to plug in my phone daily so it isn't a problem but I could see
 it becoming one in the future when more and more people start using the
 OpenMoko products

Yes, I understand. I got the impression it was a design flaw and not something 
that could be addressed,  that's all. I could be completely wrong though. 
Maybe the phone can go into some kind of holding pattern when close to flat or 
something, to mitigate the effect. If it's something a u-boot update can fix 
then that would awesome ... but I'm not holding my breath.

Sarton

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Re: dead battery

2008-09-30 Thread Sarton O'Brien
On Wednesday 01 October 2008 10:20:59 Shawn prjktdtnt Thompson wrote:
  Yes, I understand. I got the impression it was a design flaw and not
  something that could be addressed,  that's all. I could be completely
  wrong though. Maybe the phone can go into some kind of holding pattern
  when close to flat or something, to mitigate the effect. If it's
  something a u-boot update can fix then that would awesome ... but I'm not
  holding my breath.
 
  Sarton
 

 That is how I understood it too but that is something that if they're
 unable to address on 1973/FreeRunner they need to address before GTA03, IMO

Of course ... unless there's an 'intentional commercial suicide' department 
within openmoko ;)

Sarton

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Re: dead battery

2008-09-30 Thread Brock
On 2008.09.30.16.37, Shawn prjktdtnt Thompson wrote:
| When trying to get into NOR do you already have it plugged into your 
| charger? That is how I was able to finally get mine to boot, you only 
| need the actual OpenMoko charger until it starts up then you can use 
| whatever USB charger you prefer. Just plug into wall-socket and phone, 
| start NOR twice, viola.
| 
| -Shawn

As an added tip -- when I ran my battery dry I couldn't get it to boot.
I took out the sim and SD card and it booted (with NOR) instantly while
plugged in with the wall charger.

--Brock


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Re: Charging a Neo battery in a Nokia charger or phone (was: Re: dead battery)

2008-09-30 Thread Dale Schumacher
On Wed, Oct 1, 2008 at 5:11 AM, Michael Shiloh [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 Nokia devices (phones and stand-alone chargers) will not charge
 non-Nokia batteries, most likely because they can't be sure they have
 the correct charging parameters.

 Most after-market or no-name brands of Nokia-compatible chargers don't
 test the make of the battery, most likely because adding the capability
 to perform this test would add to the cost of the charger.

 Thus:

 * You can use a Nokia or Nokia-compatible BL-4C, BL-5C, or BL-6C in the Neo

 * You can charge the Neo battery in a Nokia-compatible charger that is
 not Nokia branded

 * You can NOT charge the Neo battery in a Nokia branded phone or charger

Added to http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Neo_FreeRunner_Battery#USB_charger

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Re: dead battery

2008-09-30 Thread Michael Shiloh

 Vince,
 When my battery died I plugged my phone into the OpenMoko supplied 
 charger, started it using NOR boot, leaving it at the boot menu until it 
 timed out (repeat that twice) then I was about to select boot from the 
 NOR menu and after a few extra seconds the phone booted.
 
 -Shawn


I'm confused. I thought that we didn't turn on the charger until we 
booted into Linux. Am I wrong? Do we charge in u-boot, even at a low rate?

Michael

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