Re: GTA02 PCB layout files found!

2015-04-13 Thread Norayr Chilingarian
okay now i was able to read the full thread and notice that it is the
same project.

04/13/15 01:08 -ին Norayr Chilingarianը գրել է.
 btw there is a free software cellular baseband project
 https://www.indiegogo.com/projects/free-software-cellular-baseband
 
 On Sat, 11 Apr 2015, Spacefalcon the Outlaw wrote:
 
 Nick openmoko-commun...@njw.me.uk wrote:

 Where does that leave the indiegogo campaign? Is the money not
 needed now?

 It is indeed no longer needed for the original purpose for which the
 campaign was started when the original PCB files were believed to have
 been lost.  The campaign page has been updated to reflect this new
 development.  However, if anyone would like to continue donating, the
 money would help me and Shannon - see the update at the bottom of the
 story page.

 Eventually you'll need more funds, presumably, for the
 production parts of the project.

 Yes, and I am not even considering production as in production for
 sale at all at this point - way too premature to even think about it.
 Instead, what the project may need money for in a few months will be
 physical production of the first lab prototypes.

 I am approaching this project in a very different way from how a
 business person would do it.  Business people always talk about what
 they call opportunity costs, and whenever they consider doing any
 project or venture, they always consider the option of *not* doing it.
 When they look at costs, they generally estimate the total cost upfront
 (the total cost to get to the end result), and decide whether or not
 to do the project based on that total cost among other factors.

 But I work differently: I concentrate all of my effort, energy and
 attention on whatever is the immediate next step at each given moment,
 and deliberately abstain from thinking about what costs or challenges
 lie ahead.  I deviate from the proper business way because in that
 proper business way the purpose of realistically estimating the
 total cost to the finish line is to decide whether or not to do the
 project at all, and for me not doing my project is NOT an option: I
 need this project in order to give my life purpose and meaning.
 Therefore, I keep my attention focused on the immediate next step, and
 simply hope for the best when it comes to future difficulties and/or
 costs further down the road.

 Right now the immediate next step is for me and my PCB layout partner
 to produce our own layout for the first prototype we seek to build,
 based on the just-recovered Openmoko one and other available references
 like the Pirelli DP-L10.  This step is pure desk work, i.e., editing
 design files on a computer with the appropriate software tools, so no
 money is needed for the project itself at this point - although my
 family could very much use any help given.

 After this step is done, the results of it will be publicly released:
 a PCB design file in a free EDA tool format and a set of gerbers which
 one can send to a fab to produce a physical board.  (In fact, all work
 is being done in a public source repository, so it's really in a state
 of continuous release, no need to wait for completion.)  Only after
 the design is complete and we have the gerbers for the first prototype
 will I start looking into how much it would cost to physically produce
 that first prototype board from those gerbers.  It will probably be
 several months from now, so hopefully by then my personal/family
 financial situation will improve (the current hardship is expected to
 last about 4 months), and I may be able to afford that step on my own
 - and if not, it'll be time for another crowdfunding campaign then.

 Speaking of which, are you planning
 to sell the phones you produce yourself, eventually? Or outsource
 it?

 I do plan on offering finished products (initially standalone modems
 for playful use with laptops etc, and later phones) up for retail sale
 to end users, but whenever someone complains about my asking price
 being too high, I'll point them to the freely released gerber, BOM etc
 files and invite them to try producing it themselves for less.

 VLR,
 SF

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Re: GTA02 PCB layout files found!

2015-04-13 Thread Norayr Chilingarian
btw there is a free software cellular baseband project 
https://www.indiegogo.com/projects/free-software-cellular-baseband


On Sat, 11 Apr 2015, Spacefalcon the Outlaw wrote:


Nick openmoko-commun...@njw.me.uk wrote:


Where does that leave the indiegogo campaign? Is the money not
needed now?


It is indeed no longer needed for the original purpose for which the
campaign was started when the original PCB files were believed to have
been lost.  The campaign page has been updated to reflect this new
development.  However, if anyone would like to continue donating, the
money would help me and Shannon - see the update at the bottom of the
story page.


Eventually you'll need more funds, presumably, for the
production parts of the project.


Yes, and I am not even considering production as in production for
sale at all at this point - way too premature to even think about it.
Instead, what the project may need money for in a few months will be
physical production of the first lab prototypes.

I am approaching this project in a very different way from how a
business person would do it.  Business people always talk about what
they call opportunity costs, and whenever they consider doing any
project or venture, they always consider the option of *not* doing it.
When they look at costs, they generally estimate the total cost upfront
(the total cost to get to the end result), and decide whether or not
to do the project based on that total cost among other factors.

But I work differently: I concentrate all of my effort, energy and
attention on whatever is the immediate next step at each given moment,
and deliberately abstain from thinking about what costs or challenges
lie ahead.  I deviate from the proper business way because in that
proper business way the purpose of realistically estimating the
total cost to the finish line is to decide whether or not to do the
project at all, and for me not doing my project is NOT an option: I
need this project in order to give my life purpose and meaning.
Therefore, I keep my attention focused on the immediate next step, and
simply hope for the best when it comes to future difficulties and/or
costs further down the road.

Right now the immediate next step is for me and my PCB layout partner
to produce our own layout for the first prototype we seek to build,
based on the just-recovered Openmoko one and other available references
like the Pirelli DP-L10.  This step is pure desk work, i.e., editing
design files on a computer with the appropriate software tools, so no
money is needed for the project itself at this point - although my
family could very much use any help given.

After this step is done, the results of it will be publicly released:
a PCB design file in a free EDA tool format and a set of gerbers which
one can send to a fab to produce a physical board.  (In fact, all work
is being done in a public source repository, so it's really in a state
of continuous release, no need to wait for completion.)  Only after
the design is complete and we have the gerbers for the first prototype
will I start looking into how much it would cost to physically produce
that first prototype board from those gerbers.  It will probably be
several months from now, so hopefully by then my personal/family
financial situation will improve (the current hardship is expected to
last about 4 months), and I may be able to afford that step on my own
- and if not, it'll be time for another crowdfunding campaign then.


Speaking of which, are you planning
to sell the phones you produce yourself, eventually? Or outsource
it?


I do plan on offering finished products (initially standalone modems
for playful use with laptops etc, and later phones) up for retail sale
to end users, but whenever someone complains about my asking price
being too high, I'll point them to the freely released gerber, BOM etc
files and invite them to try producing it themselves for less.

VLR,
SF

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Re: GTA02 PCB layout files found!

2015-04-11 Thread Nick
Hi Spacefalcon,

Quoth Spacefalcon the Outlaw: 
 I am overjoyed to announce that the original PCB layout files for
 Openmoko GTA02 have been located and published. 

This is fantastic news, I'm very pleased!

Where does that leave the indiegogo campaign? Is the money not 
needed now? Eventually you'll need more funds, presumably, for the 
production parts of the project. Speaking of which, are you planning 
to sell the phones you produce yourself, eventually? Or outsource 
it?

Anyway, great news, horrah :)

Nick

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Re: GTA02 PCB layout files found!

2015-04-11 Thread Spacefalcon the Outlaw
Nick openmoko-commun...@njw.me.uk wrote:

 Where does that leave the indiegogo campaign? Is the money not 
 needed now?

It is indeed no longer needed for the original purpose for which the
campaign was started when the original PCB files were believed to have
been lost.  The campaign page has been updated to reflect this new
development.  However, if anyone would like to continue donating, the
money would help me and Shannon - see the update at the bottom of the
story page.

 Eventually you'll need more funds, presumably, for the 
 production parts of the project.

Yes, and I am not even considering production as in production for
sale at all at this point - way too premature to even think about it.
Instead, what the project may need money for in a few months will be
physical production of the first lab prototypes.

I am approaching this project in a very different way from how a
business person would do it.  Business people always talk about what
they call opportunity costs, and whenever they consider doing any
project or venture, they always consider the option of *not* doing it.
When they look at costs, they generally estimate the total cost upfront
(the total cost to get to the end result), and decide whether or not
to do the project based on that total cost among other factors.

But I work differently: I concentrate all of my effort, energy and
attention on whatever is the immediate next step at each given moment,
and deliberately abstain from thinking about what costs or challenges
lie ahead.  I deviate from the proper business way because in that
proper business way the purpose of realistically estimating the
total cost to the finish line is to decide whether or not to do the
project at all, and for me not doing my project is NOT an option: I
need this project in order to give my life purpose and meaning.
Therefore, I keep my attention focused on the immediate next step, and
simply hope for the best when it comes to future difficulties and/or
costs further down the road.

Right now the immediate next step is for me and my PCB layout partner
to produce our own layout for the first prototype we seek to build,
based on the just-recovered Openmoko one and other available references
like the Pirelli DP-L10.  This step is pure desk work, i.e., editing
design files on a computer with the appropriate software tools, so no
money is needed for the project itself at this point - although my
family could very much use any help given.

After this step is done, the results of it will be publicly released:
a PCB design file in a free EDA tool format and a set of gerbers which
one can send to a fab to produce a physical board.  (In fact, all work
is being done in a public source repository, so it's really in a state
of continuous release, no need to wait for completion.)  Only after
the design is complete and we have the gerbers for the first prototype
will I start looking into how much it would cost to physically produce
that first prototype board from those gerbers.  It will probably be
several months from now, so hopefully by then my personal/family
financial situation will improve (the current hardship is expected to
last about 4 months), and I may be able to afford that step on my own
- and if not, it'll be time for another crowdfunding campaign then.

 Speaking of which, are you planning 
 to sell the phones you produce yourself, eventually? Or outsource 
 it?

I do plan on offering finished products (initially standalone modems
for playful use with laptops etc, and later phones) up for retail sale
to end users, but whenever someone complains about my asking price
being too high, I'll point them to the freely released gerber, BOM etc
files and invite them to try producing it themselves for less.

VLR,
SF

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Re: gta02 pcb layout

2014-05-13 Thread joerg Reisenweber
On Tue 13 May 2014 23:49:13 mobi phil wrote:
 Hi,
 
 after years, was for scientific :) reasons wanted to give a new life to
 the gta02 I own. Opened it, and the usb connector was enough fragile. Tried
 to resolder it but the pcb couper line broke. Cannot see precisely to which
 resistor that line connected. So need a very good magnified photo or the
 pcb. Anybody can help?

schematics 
http://people.openmoko.org/joerg/schematics/GTA02/Schematics_Freerunner-GTA02_A5-A7cumulative_public_RC0.pdf
together with component placement 
http://people.openmoko.org/joerg/schematics/GTA02/lindi-searchable/
should go a long way for this. Usually ti's just a question to find the right 
one of two ends of a 0402 resistor or capacitor. The other (wrong) end is 
usually connected to another similar 0402 component (or GND, or Vdd) so by 
testing for 4 conductance aka 0R connections from both ends of component A to 
both ends of component B you should be able to spot the wrong end. The other 
one is the right end then, which you want to use to connect your bridging wire 
to.

If you need more help, just holler.
/j
-- 
()  ascii ribbon campaign - against html e-mail 
/\  www.asciiribbon.org   - against proprietary attachments
(alas the above page got scrapped due to resignation(!!), so here some 
supplementary links:)
http://www.georgedillon.com/web/html_email_is_evil.shtml  
http://www.nonhtmlmail.org/campaign.html
http://www.georgedillon.com/web/html_email_is_evil_still.shtml
http://www.gerstbach.at/2004/ascii/ (German)


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Re: gta02 pcb layout

2014-05-13 Thread mobi phil
hi!

that was a lovely quick answer.. .found the schematics, but was not finding
the pcb layout.

it looks that I broke the one toward the gps unit, that is towards the
ground, which is normaly not used... or .. is it used on gta02?


On Wed, May 14, 2014 at 12:07 AM, joerg Reisenweber jo...@openmoko.orgwrote:

 On Tue 13 May 2014 23:49:13 mobi phil wrote:
  Hi,
 
  after years, was for scientific :) reasons wanted to give a new life to
  the gta02 I own. Opened it, and the usb connector was enough fragile.
 Tried
  to resolder it but the pcb couper line broke. Cannot see precisely to
 which
  resistor that line connected. So need a very good magnified photo or the
  pcb. Anybody can help?

 schematics
 
 http://people.openmoko.org/joerg/schematics/GTA02/Schematics_Freerunner-GTA02_A5-A7cumulative_public_RC0.pdf
 
 together with component placement
 http://people.openmoko.org/joerg/schematics/GTA02/lindi-searchable/
 should go a long way for this. Usually ti's just a question to find the
 right
 one of two ends of a 0402 resistor or capacitor. The other (wrong) end is
 usually connected to another similar 0402 component (or GND, or Vdd) so by
 testing for 4 conductance aka 0R connections from both ends of component A
 to
 both ends of component B you should be able to spot the wrong end. The
 other
 one is the right end then, which you want to use to connect your bridging
 wire
 to.

 If you need more help, just holler.
 /j
 --
 ()  ascii ribbon campaign - against html e-mail
 /\  www.asciiribbon.org   - against proprietary attachments
 (alas the above page got scrapped due to resignation(!!), so here some
 supplementary links:)
 http://www.georgedillon.com/web/html_email_is_evil.shtml
 http://www.nonhtmlmail.org/campaign.html
 http://www.georgedillon.com/web/html_email_is_evil_still.shtml
 http://www.gerstbach.at/2004/ascii/ (German)

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-- 
rgrds,
mobi phil

being mobile, but including technology
http://mobiphil.com
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Re: gta02 pcb layout

2014-05-13 Thread joerg Reisenweber
On Wed 14 May 2014 00:27:11 mobi phil wrote:
 hi!
 
 that was a lovely quick answer.. .found the schematics, but was not finding
 the pcb layout.

The PCB layout is an 8-layer (iirc, maybe 10)  which is pretty hard to publish 
in any useful representation other than the layout program's own one.
Anyway you don't need PCB layout to solve your problem.

 
 it looks that I broke the one toward the gps unit, that is towards the
 ground, which is normaly not used... or .. is it used on gta02?

Please send (link to) a number of macro snapshots illustrating your problem in 
a way so I can look up a solution for you.

cheers
jOERG
-- 
()  ascii ribbon campaign - against html e-mail 
/\  www.asciiribbon.org   - against proprietary attachments
(alas the above page got scrapped due to resignation(!!), so here some 
supplementary links:)
http://www.georgedillon.com/web/html_email_is_evil.shtml  
http://www.nonhtmlmail.org/campaign.html
http://www.georgedillon.com/web/html_email_is_evil_still.shtml
http://www.gerstbach.at/2004/ascii/ (German)


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Re: gta02 pcb layout

2014-05-13 Thread mobi phil
I wanted to see only the surface pcb. But it looks that I am lucky. Broke a
pin that is usually marked as not used ... soldering mission completed
successfully... could connect with cdc ethernet... thanks a lot!


On Wed, May 14, 2014 at 12:59 AM, joerg Reisenweber jo...@openmoko.orgwrote:

 On Wed 14 May 2014 00:27:11 mobi phil wrote:
  hi!
 
  that was a lovely quick answer.. .found the schematics, but was not
 finding
  the pcb layout.

 The PCB layout is an 8-layer (iirc, maybe 10)  which is pretty hard to
 publish
 in any useful representation other than the layout program's own one.
 Anyway you don't need PCB layout to solve your problem.

 
  it looks that I broke the one toward the gps unit, that is towards the
  ground, which is normaly not used... or .. is it used on gta02?

 Please send (link to) a number of macro snapshots illustrating your
 problem in
 a way so I can look up a solution for you.

 cheers
 jOERG
 --
 ()  ascii ribbon campaign - against html e-mail
 /\  www.asciiribbon.org   - against proprietary attachments
 (alas the above page got scrapped due to resignation(!!), so here some
 supplementary links:)
 http://www.georgedillon.com/web/html_email_is_evil.shtml
 http://www.nonhtmlmail.org/campaign.html
 http://www.georgedillon.com/web/html_email_is_evil_still.shtml
 http://www.gerstbach.at/2004/ascii/ (German)

 ___
 Openmoko community mailing list
 community@lists.openmoko.org
 http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community




-- 
rgrds,
mobi phil

being mobile, but including technology
http://mobiphil.com
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Re: gta02 pcb layout

2014-05-13 Thread joerg Reisenweber
On Wed 14 May 2014 01:12:00 mobi phil wrote:
 I wanted to see only the surface pcb. 

On component placement you see the surface layer of PCB, incl all copper 
traces.

/j

-- 
()  ascii ribbon campaign - against html e-mail 
/\  www.asciiribbon.org   - against proprietary attachments
(alas the above page got scrapped due to resignation(!!), so here some 
supplementary links:)
http://www.georgedillon.com/web/html_email_is_evil.shtml  
http://www.nonhtmlmail.org/campaign.html
http://www.georgedillon.com/web/html_email_is_evil_still.shtml
http://www.gerstbach.at/2004/ascii/ (German)


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