Re: [Computer-go] AlphaGo watch parties planned across U.S.

2017-05-22 Thread Hiroshi Yamashita
NicoNico movie shows Zen's evaluation. (In Japanese) http://live2.nicovideo.jp/watch/lv298444014 Zen thinks White(AlphaGo) 's winrate is 62% at 86th moves. Hiroshi Yamashita ___ Computer-go mailing list Computer-go@computer-go.org

Re: [Computer-go] AlphaGo watch parties planned across U.S.

2017-05-22 Thread Hiroshi Yamashita
I'll sometimes post Aya's evaluation. https://twitter.com/nhk_igo_15bai Thanks, Hiroshi Yamashita - Original Message - From: "Horace Ho" To: "computer-go" Sent: Tuesday, May 23, 2017 10:47 AM Subject: Re: [Computer-go] AlphaGo watch

Re: [Computer-go] mini-max with Policy and Value network

2017-05-22 Thread David Wu
Addendum: Some additional playing around with the same position can flip the roles of the playouts and value net - so now the value net is very wrong and the playouts are mostly right. I think this gives good insight into what the value net is doing and why as a general matter playouts are still

Re: [Computer-go] AlphaGo watch parties planned across U.S.

2017-05-22 Thread Horace Ho
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z-HL5nppBnM On Tue, May 23, 2017 at 8:27 AM, Hideki Kato wrote: > Live will start at 11:00 AM JST (GMT+0900). > https://events.google.com/alphago2017/ > > Hideki > > Stephen Martindale:

Re: [Computer-go] AlphaGo watch parties planned across U.S.

2017-05-22 Thread Hideki Kato
Live will start at 11:00 AM JST (GMT+0900). https://events.google.com/alphago2017/ Hideki Stephen Martindale: : >Interesting... but I don't see the links for "watch the games live", only >the schedule. I assume that the page

Re: [Computer-go] mini-max with Policy and Value network

2017-05-22 Thread Marc Landgraf
And talkig about tactical mistakes: Another game, where a trick joseki early in the game (top right) completely fools Leela. Leela here play this like it would be done in similar shapes, but then gets completely blindsided. But to make things worse, it finds the one way to make the loss the

Re: [Computer-go] mini-max with Policy and Value network

2017-05-22 Thread Marc Landgraf
Leela has surprisingly large tactical holes. Right now it is throwing a good number of games against me in completely won endgames by fumbling away entirely alive groups. As an example I attached one game of myself (3d), even vs Leela10 @7d. But this really isn't a onetime occurence. If you look

Re: [Computer-go] mini-max with Policy and Value network

2017-05-22 Thread Gian-Carlo Pascutto
On 22-05-17 17:47, Erik van der Werf wrote: > On Mon, May 22, 2017 at 3:56 PM, Gian-Carlo Pascutto > wrote: > > Well, I think that's fundamental; you can't be wide and deep at the same > time, but at least you can chose an algorithm that (eventually)

Re: [Computer-go] mini-max with Policy and Value network

2017-05-22 Thread Erik van der Werf
On Mon, May 22, 2017 at 3:56 PM, Gian-Carlo Pascutto wrote: > On 22-05-17 11:27, Erik van der Werf wrote: > > On Mon, May 22, 2017 at 10:08 AM, Gian-Carlo Pascutto > > wrote: > > > > ... This heavy pruning > > by the policy network

Re: [Computer-go] mini-max with Policy and Value network

2017-05-22 Thread Gian-Carlo Pascutto
On 22-05-17 15:46, Erik van der Werf wrote: > Oh, haha, after reading Brian's post I guess I misunderstood :-) > > Anyway, LMR seems like a good idea, but last time I tried it (in Migos) > it did not help. In Magog I had some good results with fractional depth > reductions (like in Realization

Re: [Computer-go] mini-max with Policy and Value network

2017-05-22 Thread Gian-Carlo Pascutto
On 22-05-17 14:48, Brian Sheppard via Computer-go wrote: > My reaction was "well, if you are using alpha-beta, then at least use > LMR rather than hard pruning." Your reaction is "don't use > alpha-beta", and you would know better than anyone! There's 2 aspects to my answer: 1) Unless you've

Re: [Computer-go] AlphaGo watch parties planned across U.S.

2017-05-22 Thread Hideki Kato
Three hours earlier, DeepMind twitted: >The Future of Go Summit begins tomorrow. Catch all #AlphaGo17 >matches live from 23-27 May at https://goo.gl/pVjexr Check https://twitter.com/search?q=%23AlphaGo17 ! Hideki Hideki Kato: <59228e17.7176%hideki_ka...@ybb.ne.jp>: >Probably here.

Re: [Computer-go] mini-max with Policy and Value network

2017-05-22 Thread Gian-Carlo Pascutto
On 22-05-17 11:27, Erik van der Werf wrote: > On Mon, May 22, 2017 at 10:08 AM, Gian-Carlo Pascutto > wrote: > > ... This heavy pruning > by the policy network OTOH seems to be an issue for me. My program has > big tactical holes. > > > Do

Re: [Computer-go] mini-max with Policy and Value network

2017-05-22 Thread Erik van der Werf
On Mon, May 22, 2017 at 11:27 AM, Erik van der Werf < erikvanderw...@gmail.com> wrote: > On Mon, May 22, 2017 at 10:08 AM, Gian-Carlo Pascutto > wrote: >> >> ... This heavy pruning >> by the policy network OTOH seems to be an issue for me. My program has >> big tactical holes. >

Re: [Computer-go] mini-max with Policy and Value network

2017-05-22 Thread Brian Sheppard via Computer-go
My reaction was "well, if you are using alpha-beta, then at least use LMR rather than hard pruning." Your reaction is "don't use alpha-beta", and you would know better than anyone! Yes, LMR in Go has is a big difference compared to LMR in chess: Go tactics take many moves to play out, whereas

Re: [Computer-go] mini-max with Policy and Value network

2017-05-22 Thread Erik van der Werf
On Mon, May 22, 2017 at 10:08 AM, Gian-Carlo Pascutto wrote: > > ... This heavy pruning > by the policy network OTOH seems to be an issue for me. My program has > big tactical holes. Do you do any hard pruning? My engines (Steenvreter,Magog) always had a move predictor (a.k.a.

Re: [Computer-go] AlphaGo watch parties planned across U.S.

2017-05-22 Thread Stephen Martindale
Interesting... but I don't see the links for "watch the games live", only the schedule. I assume that the page will be updated when the games actually start... or are about to. Yours Faithfully, *Stephen Martindale* +49 162 577 2166 stephen.c.martind...@gmail.com On 22 May 2017 at 09:07, Hideki

Re: [Computer-go] mini-max with Policy and Value network

2017-05-22 Thread Gian-Carlo Pascutto
On 20/05/2017 22:26, Brian Sheppard via Computer-go wrote: > Could use late-move reductions to eliminate the hard pruning. Given > the accuracy rate of the policy network, I would guess that even move > 2 should be reduced. > The question I always ask is: what's the real difference between MCTS

Re: [Computer-go] AlphaGo watch parties planned across U.S.

2017-05-22 Thread Hideki Kato
Probably here. http://events.google.com/alphago2017/ "Below, you can find out the game schedule, watch the games live or replay the highlights." Hideki Joshua Shriver:

Re: [Computer-go] AlphaGo watch parties planned across U.S.

2017-05-22 Thread Joshua Shriver
Where can it be viewed online? -Josh On Sun, May 21, 2017 at 9:09 PM, Ray Tayek wrote: > http://www.usgo.org/news/2017/05/alphago-watch-parties-planned-across-u-s/ > > looks like 10:30 pm monday. > > thanks > > -- > Honesty is a very expensive gift. So, don't expect it from