Re: [CGUYS] Apple iOS or OS X
On Fri, Jun 25, 2010 at 9:47 AM, TJPA t...@tjpa.com wrote: Yes, and I think they will. I just do not see them abandoning OSX for iOS. In comparison iOS is a much smaller and easier to support product. Apple would have no need to abandon OSX and strategically it would lose them a lot of credibility. They need to have a real OS on some of their hardware. I agree. I think that they may well keep OS X around, but just for their highest end professional machines. IMacs and laptops, except perhaps for the heftiest of the laptops, could go with future versions of iOS. Steve * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Apple iOS or OS X
On Fri, Jun 25, 2010 at 12:15 AM, TJPA t...@tjpa.com wrote: I do not agree. There are of course those Apple-hating IT types who want to maintain their bloated staffs. But the Apple advantage will be so obvious that normally silent business managers will start to question the bad judgement of those misguided IT types. But, couldn't it be much easier for Apple to make some major inroads into the business computing world were they to put most of their efforts into suggesting a different type of computing platform for the workplace as opposed to what is in general use today? I speak here of the iPad and future versions of same. The iPad would not replace laptops or desktops in cubicles where sensitive Department of Defense code is being written. Such environments generally require Windows machines that are tightly controlled. However, I can see lawyers loving iPads, as well as anyone who needs mobility on the job such as air conditioning and heating technicians, plumbers and electricians, contractors of all sorts. Out with the Dell laptops and in with the iPads. Steve * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Apple iOS or OS X
Is is all a matter of volume. M$ is pounding my computer with a constant barrage of security updates. It is frequent and the number of updates I may get in a day is often larger than I wish to count. These are security updates, not giving me any new features. In contrast Apple will go for months without needing a security related update. Most of the updates I get from Apple are actually delivering new features. Sent from my iPad On Jun 25, 2010, at 12:30 AM, mike xha...@gmail.com wrote: Security updates via MS = idiot programmers Security updates via Apple = angelic programmers improving experience * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Apple iOS or OS X
Yes, and I think they will. I just do not see them abandoning OSX for iOS. In comparison iOS is a much smaller and easier to support product. Apple would have no need to abandon OSX and strategically it would lose them a lot of credibility. They need to have a real OS on some of their hardware. Sent from my iPad On Jun 25, 2010, at 7:08 AM, phartz...@gmail.com phartz...@gmail.com wrote: But, couldn't it be much easier for Apple to make some major inroads into the business computing world were they to put most of their efforts into suggesting a different type of computing platform for the workplace as opposed to what is in general use today? I speak here of the iPad and future versions of same. * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Apple iOS or OS X
Again, you view security updates from Apple as 'features'. Nice for you. On Fri, Jun 25, 2010 at 6:20 AM, TJPA t...@tjpa.com wrote: Is is all a matter of volume. M$ is pounding my computer with a constant barrage of security updates. It is frequent and the number of updates I may get in a day is often larger than I wish to count. These are security updates, not giving me any new features. In contrast Apple will go for months without needing a security related update. Most of the updates I get from Apple are actually delivering new features. Sent from my iPad On Jun 25, 2010, at 12:30 AM, mike xha...@gmail.com wrote: Security updates via MS = idiot programmers Security updates via Apple = angelic programmers improving experience * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** * * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Apple iOS or OS X
I could perhaps see Apple using iOS as an instant on option to check email etc and then OS X for full duty on laptops. On Wed, Jun 23, 2010 at 10:40 PM, TJPA t...@tjpa.com wrote: Not likely, though it may become available as an option. I can see power-mad IT types going for it as a way to totally control what is on the machine. IOS does not need the horsepower of a pro-line machine so I expect to see it on very different hardware. I am certainly impressed by the software (most of it free or a buck or two) that is available for iOS. My iPad looks like it is going to be a very productive little machine. Sent from my iPad On Jun 23, 2010, at 9:19 PM, phartz...@gmail.com phartz...@gmail.com wrote: A number of Apple developers think that Apple Corp. is going to begin melding iOS into OS X in the very near future, eventually replacing OS X with iOS in their line of laptop and desktop computers for general consumer use. * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** * * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Apple iOS or OS X
On Thu, Jun 24, 2010 at 1:40 AM, TJPA t...@tjpa.com wrote: Not likely, though it may become available as an option. I think it is highly likely. It is my personal belief, bolstered by recent Apple Corp. movement, that Apple is going in the direction of regarding computers, for marketing purposes, as being more akin to appliances than as professional tools. It is costly for Apple Corp. to have to maintain two separate operating systems, especially when their newest OS is the one that runs on the devices that are likely to be biggest sellers and money makers by far in Apple's history. Apple will cede the professional market to Windows (why not?) and focus on computing devices of all sorts that offer more of an everyperson experience as opposed to a niche market which has been their tradition for the most part. Apple will make devices that will satisfy all age groups, from toddlers to adults, neophytes to geeks. I think this was their aim with the iPad, the plans for which were being worked on well before the iPhone appeared. Steve * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Apple iOS or OS X
On Jun 24, 2010, at 9:01 AM, phartz...@gmail.com wrote: Apple will cede the professional market to Windows (why not?) and focus on computing devices of all sorts that offer more of an everyperson experience as opposed to a niche market which has been their tradition for the most part. This is just the Apple haters bringing out their Apple is going out of business drums. When the iPod was so very successful a few years ago they were claiming that Apple was going to get out of the computer business. They dream up the most damaging and wacky scenarios in the hopes that some gullible folks will buy a crappy PC instead of a Mac. * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Apple iOS or OS X
I think you hit the wrong 'I hate MS', 'I hate MS users', button script with this one. On Thu, Jun 24, 2010 at 8:20 AM, tjpa t...@tjpa.com wrote: This is just the Apple haters bringing out their Apple is going out of business drums. When the iPod was so very successful a few years ago they were claiming that Apple was going to get out of the computer business. They dream up the most damaging and wacky scenarios in the hopes that some gullible folks will buy a crappy PC instead of a Mac. * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** * * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Apple iOS or OS X
On Thu, Jun 24, 2010 at 11:20 AM, tjpa t...@tjpa.com wrote: On Jun 24, 2010, at 9:01 AM, phartz...@gmail.com wrote: Apple will cede the professional market to Windows (why not?) and focus on computing devices of all sorts that offer more of an everyperson experience as opposed to a niche market which has been their tradition for the most part. This is just the Apple haters bringing out their Apple is going out of business drums. When the iPod was so very successful a few years ago they were claiming that Apple was going to get out of the computer business. They dream up the most damaging and wacky scenarios in the hopes that some gullible folks will buy a crappy PC instead of a Mac. What I wrote was my personal opinion. I was not parroting what others have said in the paragraph that you quoted. I am not an Apple hater. I do not know of anyone, including myself, who is proclaiming that Apple is going out of the computer business, and I certainly indicated nothing along that line. Apple can cede the business desktop and laptop computing market to Windows without skipping a beat in terms of its income and stock value. Even as Apple has made some inroads in that business market, it will take them years and years to really make a truly noticeable dent in that sector at their current pace. What Apple can do very successfully, and very quickly, is to grab the consumer level computer market, and it happens to be my suspicion that is what they are going to focus on, and the iPad paves the way. Consumer level computer users want computers that work without any hassles, and Apple can provide that. However, even iMacs and MacBooks and Mini's are too daunting for many, perhaps even most folks. They'll want an iPad because any four year old can use it. Adults can use it too. It is an appliance, yet also a computer. Mr. Jobs sees the iPad as being the future of computing, and he would not be averse to having the iPad being labeled as an appliance as long as it is selling. Wait until he puts a phone in it. What the iPad does is what most folks want out of a computer. Why buy a MacBook Pro or an iMac or even a Mini when an iPad will do,? Apple can run iOS in most of their larger computers, sell all the software, and make millions upon millions of dollars doing so. Would Apple be guilty of dumbing down the computer market? Perhaps that could be said, but at the same time, there are countless millions of computer users and potential computer users out there in the world who are dumb about computers to begin with, and would be very happy to be able to do their simple tasks on a machine that any child can easily use. Steve * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Apple iOS or OS X
You are an Apple hater cause Tom says so...don't disagree with the Tom. On Thu, Jun 24, 2010 at 2:35 PM, phartz...@gmail.com phartz...@gmail.comwrote: What I wrote was my personal opinion. I was not parroting what others have said in the paragraph that you quoted. I am not an Apple hater. I do not know of anyone, including myself, who is proclaiming that Apple is going out of the computer business, and I certainly indicated nothing along that line. Apple can cede the business desktop and laptop computing market to Windows without skipping a beat in terms of its income and stock value. Even as Apple has made some inroads in that business market, it will take them years and years to really make a truly noticeable dent in that sector at their current pace. What Apple can do very successfully, and very quickly, is to grab the consumer level computer market, and it happens to be my suspicion that is what they are going to focus on, and the iPad paves the way. Consumer level computer users want computers that work without any hassles, and Apple can provide that. However, even iMacs and MacBooks and Mini's are too daunting for many, perhaps even most folks. They'll want an iPad because any four year old can use it. Adults can use it too. It is an appliance, yet also a computer. Mr. Jobs sees the iPad as being the future of computing, and he would not be averse to having the iPad being labeled as an appliance as long as it is selling. Wait until he puts a phone in it. What the iPad does is what most folks want out of a computer. Why buy a MacBook Pro or an iMac or even a Mini when an iPad will do,? Apple can run iOS in most of their larger computers, sell all the software, and make millions upon millions of dollars doing so. Would Apple be guilty of dumbing down the computer market? Perhaps that could be said, but at the same time, there are countless millions of computer users and potential computer users out there in the world who are dumb about computers to begin with, and would be very happy to be able to do their simple tasks on a machine that any child can easily use. Steve * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** * * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Apple iOS or OS X
On Thu, Jun 24, 2010 at 5:38 PM, mike xha...@gmail.com wrote: You are an Apple hater cause Tom says so...don't disagree with the Tom. I did not think that he was calling me an Apple hater. I think he was referring to some Apple developers who are saying that Apple may be on the verge of supplanting OS X with iOS in their line of desktops and laptops. But, I could be wrong, although I do not know what would make Tom think that I hate Apple computers since they are all that I use. Steve * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Apple iOS or OS X
Correct, I wasn't, but you have just experienced another case of the same phenomena. Strange assertions designed to create discord. Sent from my iPad On Jun 24, 2010, at 6:01 PM, phartz...@gmail.com phartz...@gmail.com wrote: I did not think that he was calling me an Apple hater. * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Apple iOS or OS X
Actually, what iOS could do is sweep the business market. A locked down system is just what most IT managers want. A much larger iPad with a wireless keyboard may be the business computer of the future. After getting used to using an iPad it is somewhat frustrating to use an old fashioned computer that I can't control by directly interacting with the screen. Sent from my iPad On Jun 24, 2010, at 5:35 PM, phartz...@gmail.com phartz...@gmail.com wrote: Apple can cede the business desktop and laptop computing market to Windows without skipping a beat in terms of its income and stock value. Even as Apple has made some inroads in that business market, it will take them years and years to really make a truly noticeable dent in that sector at their current pace. What Apple can do very successfully, and very quickly, is to grab the consumer level computer market, and it happens to be my suspicion that is what they are going to focus on, and the iPad paves the way. * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Apple iOS or OS X
Not so locked down, with iOS 4, Apple released over 60 security updates, most to the web browser, many of which allowed remote execution of code...as in what allows remote users to take over the device. Now users of the first iphone and first gen touch wait to see if they will get the security fixes at least. On Thu, Jun 24, 2010 at 4:10 PM, TJPA t...@tjpa.com wrote: Actually, what iOS could do is sweep the business market. A locked down system is just what most IT managers want. A much larger iPad with a wireless keyboard may be the business computer of the future. After getting used to using an iPad it is somewhat frustrating to use an old fashioned computer that I can't control by directly interacting with the screen. Sent from my iPad On Jun 24, 2010, at 5:35 PM, phartz...@gmail.com phartz...@gmail.com wrote: Apple can cede the business desktop and laptop computing market to Windows without skipping a beat in terms of its income and stock value. Even as Apple has made some inroads in that business market, it will take them years and years to really make a truly noticeable dent in that sector at their current pace. What Apple can do very successfully, and very quickly, is to grab the consumer level computer market, and it happens to be my suspicion that is what they are going to focus on, and the iPad paves the way. * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** * * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Apple iOS or OS X
On Thu, Jun 24, 2010 at 6:58 PM, TJPA t...@tjpa.com wrote: Correct, I wasn't, but you have just experienced another case of the same phenomena. Strange assertions designed to create discord. I do not think that suppositions about what Apple Corp. may do in the future are indicative of attempts to create discordance. Discordance within which body of people? I think it would be wise for Apple to forget about continuing to take on Windows in a traditional business computing environment. Windows has, in my opinion, an insurmountable lead in that arena. Apple could, as you point out, make gains in business by introducing an alternative computing experience as per the iPad and future iterations of that device. But, I think that most businesses are sufficiently stodgy as to not be all that willing to change the look and feel of their cubicle worlds. See how resistant our conservative and business loving representatives in government are to moving from Blackberry's to iPhones. Apple would have a very difficult row to hoe. Think of the howling of most IT personnel! Apple can much more readily tap the consumer market with very simple machines. I constantly hear folks say that they have no desire whatsoever to have to learn how to do stuff on computers. For instance, those who want to blog, and they are legion these days, have no interest, for the most part, in having to learn HTML or anything else. They really just want to push a few buttons or make a few mouse clicks to get things done. They want the reality of the old saw, I thought all you had to do was click a few times and everything got done on a computer. This is where Mr, Jobs and his device that is suitable for all ages, four and up, comes into play. I'd almost bet that at least a million kids in the United States under the age of five get an iPad this coming Christmas. Let the inculcation begin. Steve * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Apple iOS or OS X
Whoops, the last post should have had this subject line. Sorry. * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Apple iOS or OS X
That would be a great idea. I've read about fast boot computers that would launch a minimal version of Linux for basic use while WIndows continues to launch in the background. I don't know if anyone ever got past the concept phase into a commercial product though. You'd think that it would be easier to do something similar for the Mac, since iOS is basically a stripped down version of OS X, so you don't really need to run two different OSs. A future OS X could just have an iOS subset that always resides in memory for instant on use while expanding gracefully to the full OS X. Right now though, the idea seems more like a solution in search of a problem, since OS X already launches pretty quickly. Another idea I've heard bandied about that I would like much more is an iOS runtime for OS X that would let you run your iPhone/iPad apps on your mac. It seems that this would be easy to accomplish especially for laptops since they already have a multitouch trackpad and Apple already has considerable experience at this kind of thing, such as with Classic for running OS 9 apps in OS X and Rosetta for running PowerPC apps on intel. Maybe the hardware on current laptops isn't compatible enough though to do something similar for iOS. The experience might be too frustrating, since for example any app that needs orientation sensors wouldn't work very well, if at all. Maybe this is a direction that hardware for future laptops will take? On Jun 24, 2010, at 8:44 PM, COMPUTERGUYS-L automatic digest system wrote: From:mike xha...@gmail.com Subject: Re: Apple iOS or OS X I could perhaps see Apple using iOS as an instant on option to check email etc and then OS X for full duty on laptops. On Wed, Jun 23, 2010 at 10:40 PM, TJPA t...@tjpa.com wrote: Not likely, though it may become available as an option. I can see power-mad IT types going for it as a way to totally control what is on the machine. IOS does not need the horsepower of a pro-line machine so I expect to see it on very different hardware. I am certainly impressed by the software (most of it free or a buck or two) that is available for iOS. My iPad looks like it is going to be a very productive little machine. Sent from my iPad On Jun 23, 2010, at 9:19 PM, phartz...@gmail.com phartz...@gmail.com wrote: A number of Apple developers think that Apple Corp. is going to begin melding iOS into OS X in the very near future, eventually replacing OS X with iOS in their line of laptop and desktop computers for general consumer use. * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** * * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Apple iOS or OS X
Somehow in Mike's twisted logic, making improvements is a bad thing. Sent from my iPad On Jun 24, 2010, at 7:21 PM, mike xha...@gmail.com wrote: Not so locked down, with iOS 4, Apple released over 60 security updates, * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Apple iOS or OS X
I do not agree. There are of course those Apple-hating IT types who want to maintain their bloated staffs. But the Apple advantage will be so obvious that normally silent business managers will start to question the bad judgement of those misguided IT types. Sent from my iPad On Jun 24, 2010, at 8:44 PM, phartz...@gmail.com phartz...@gmail.com wrote: I think it would be wise for Apple to forget about continuing to take on Windows in a traditional business computing environment. Windows has, in my opinion, an insurmountable lead in that arena. * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Apple iOS or OS X
Security updates via MS = idiot programmers Security updates via Apple = angelic programmers improving experience On Thu, Jun 24, 2010 at 9:10 PM, TJPA t...@tjpa.com wrote: Somehow in Mike's twisted logic, making improvements is a bad thing. Sent from my iPad On Jun 24, 2010, at 7:21 PM, mike xha...@gmail.com wrote: Not so locked down, with iOS 4, Apple released over 60 security updates, * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** * * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
Re: [CGUYS] Apple iOS or OS X
Not likely, though it may become available as an option. I can see power-mad IT types going for it as a way to totally control what is on the machine. IOS does not need the horsepower of a pro-line machine so I expect to see it on very different hardware. I am certainly impressed by the software (most of it free or a buck or two) that is available for iOS. My iPad looks like it is going to be a very productive little machine. Sent from my iPad On Jun 23, 2010, at 9:19 PM, phartz...@gmail.com phartz...@gmail.com wrote: A number of Apple developers think that Apple Corp. is going to begin melding iOS into OS X in the very near future, eventually replacing OS X with iOS in their line of laptop and desktop computers for general consumer use. * ** List info, subscription management, list rules, archives, privacy ** ** policy, calmness, a member map, and more at http://www.cguys.org/ ** *
