Re: [coreboot] latest greatest thinkpad with coreboot
I see recommendations for a X230, but I disagree. If you really want the best, it's a W520 or a W530. In either, you can have 32G of Ram, and you can replace the default CPU with a Intel i7 3940XM cpu. But only on the W520 you will have a full size display port and (more important) an eSATAp connector. On thinkpads, you can usually have 3 drives: - a normal 2.5" SSD - another 2.5" in the optibay - a mSata in the WWAN port But with the eSATAp connector, you can have 4 drives, one of which will be external - either connected to the side of the laptop or to the dock. Useful for backups at proper SATA speeds. About the screen, the dock has extra display port connectors, and the internal LCD is 1920x1080, not high resolution but good enough. The CPU support vt-x and vt-d, so external displays can be used with qemu vfio (I don't have a dock yet, but I plan to do that soon) If we are talking about CPU, in theory, a modern P70 is faster. But if you overclock the 3940XM to 4.6 GHz, there is no faster thinkpad on the market. Cf the results from: https://thinkpad-forum.de/threads/199076-Projekt-quot-Das-Letzte-Thinkpad-quot (it requires a shell script to change the TDP and Turbo multipliers) The only issues with the W520 on coreboot is the power consumption, which I hope to fix when I will understand better how to talk to the EC to properly disable the NVidia GPU like the default bios does. With only the integrated 9 cell battery, I get about 4h, while putting my SSD into a similar W530 (same CPU) where I can do proper power management on the default bios, I get 7h (don't know how much precisely) Add a slice battery if you need more battery time (approx double) Charlotte On Thu, Dec 1, 2016 at 12:04 PM, ron minnich wrote: > what's the latest best one? What's the battery life like (can't be worse > than this mac pro that's always hot and now seems to have a life of 90 > minutes, always). How much dram/ssd can I jam in it? > > thanks > > -- > coreboot mailing list: coreboot@coreboot.org > https://www.coreboot.org/mailman/listinfo/coreboot > -- coreboot mailing list: coreboot@coreboot.org https://www.coreboot.org/mailman/listinfo/coreboot
Re: [coreboot] latest greatest thinkpad with coreboot
On 02.12.2016 10:18, kitestramuort wrote: > On Thu, 2016-12-01 at 23:53 +0100, Klemens Nanni wrote: >> On Thu, Dec 01, 2016 at 11:35:36AM -0700, Trammell Hudson wrote: >>> The major drawback is the low res screen. I've been considering >>> trying >>> these hacked x230 machines with 2560x1440 screens for 2559Y (about >>> $400?): >>> >>> https://item.taobao.com/item.htm?id=43820633263&toSite=main >>> http://forum.51nb.com/thread-1662397-1-1.html >> >> Interesting, I wonder how well these replacement screens would work >> with >> coreboot? I assume the proprietary VGA Option ROM won't work with >> those >> and native graphics initialisation still needs some work on the X230 >> either ways. > > > I have one of those. The dock DP lane is "hijacked" to fit the FHD eDP > screen. In the BIOS (and in Windows) the signal is duplicated between > the non-existent LVDS and DP, consuming more power. However it works > very well in Linux with a small patch to the i915 module that disables > the LVDS lane and forces DP-3 to be detected as eDP. > > I tried doing the same in coreboot, playing with the source code, but > couldn't figure out how to. It would be great to have the setup working > "natively" There's C code only for LVDS (nb/intel/sandybridge) and eDP (mb/google /link). No support for the PCH's DPs. There's Ada code now, that supports quite a lot (3rdparty/libgfxinit). It would require a small patch to make the panel power sequencing work along with the DP. I can help you with that if you want to try. Nico -- coreboot mailing list: coreboot@coreboot.org https://www.coreboot.org/mailman/listinfo/coreboot
Re: [coreboot] latest greatest thinkpad with coreboot
On Fri, 2016-12-02 at 10:07 +, Peter Stuge wrote: > kitestramuort wrote: > > However it works very well in Linux with a small patch to the i915 > > module that disables the LVDS lane and forces DP-3 to be detected > > as eDP. > > Could you pass me a link to this patch please? http://pastebin.com/WF6wdfpb -- coreboot mailing list: coreboot@coreboot.org https://www.coreboot.org/mailman/listinfo/coreboot
Re: [coreboot] latest greatest thinkpad with coreboot
kitestramuort wrote: > However it works very well in Linux with a small patch to the i915 > module that disables the LVDS lane and forces DP-3 to be detected > as eDP. Could you pass me a link to this patch please? Thanks a lot //Peter -- coreboot mailing list: coreboot@coreboot.org https://www.coreboot.org/mailman/listinfo/coreboot
Re: [coreboot] latest greatest thinkpad with coreboot
Philipp Stanner wrote: > By the way: > > Is it true that coreboot consumes more power ( = shorter battery life) > than vendor bios? May be. coreboot supports a few hundred mainboards. It would be great if you help collect some data. It would be even greater if you find data points where coreboot *has* worse power consumption and then help us by researching exactly why that is. And in the end the easy part, please send patches. Thanks //Peter -- coreboot mailing list: coreboot@coreboot.org https://www.coreboot.org/mailman/listinfo/coreboot
Re: [coreboot] latest greatest thinkpad with coreboot
On Thu, 2016-12-01 at 23:53 +0100, Klemens Nanni wrote: > On Thu, Dec 01, 2016 at 11:35:36AM -0700, Trammell Hudson wrote: > > The major drawback is the low res screen. I've been considering > > trying > > these hacked x230 machines with 2560x1440 screens for 2559Y (about > > $400?): > > > > https://item.taobao.com/item.htm?id=43820633263&toSite=main > > http://forum.51nb.com/thread-1662397-1-1.html > > Interesting, I wonder how well these replacement screens would work > with > coreboot? I assume the proprietary VGA Option ROM won't work with > those > and native graphics initialisation still needs some work on the X230 > either ways. I have one of those. The dock DP lane is "hijacked" to fit the FHD eDP screen. In the BIOS (and in Windows) the signal is duplicated between the non-existent LVDS and DP, consuming more power. However it works very well in Linux with a small patch to the i915 module that disables the LVDS lane and forces DP-3 to be detected as eDP. I tried doing the same in coreboot, playing with the source code, but couldn't figure out how to. It would be great to have the setup working "natively" -- coreboot mailing list: coreboot@coreboot.org https://www.coreboot.org/mailman/listinfo/coreboot
Re: [coreboot] latest greatest thinkpad with coreboot
Trammell Hudson wrote: > Do we require any sort of VGA init if the payload has the kernel > framebuffer and mode support? As far as I know the answer for more recent kernels is "sortof". It used to be that i915 in the kernel was completely independent. It would initialize GPU and turn on the panel with native resolution. At some point in 4.x there was a change in i915 to make it depend on the VBT embedded into the VGA option ROM. coreboot may or may not be able to generate a satisfactory VBT on its own. In theory of course it could. I just don't expect the C code to be complete. I like Nico's approach a lot. I would not mind if we integrated that as the graphics init for relevant platforms, looking ahead maybe even expanding its coverage to further platforms. //Peter -- coreboot mailing list: coreboot@coreboot.org https://www.coreboot.org/mailman/listinfo/coreboot
Re: [coreboot] latest greatest thinkpad with coreboot
By the way: Is it true that coreboot consumes more power ( = shorter battery life) than vendor bios? Am 01.12.2016 um 18:04 schrieb ron minnich: > what's the latest best one? What's the battery life like (can't be > worse than this mac pro that's always hot and now seems to have a > life of 90 minutes, always). How much dram/ssd can I jam in it? > > thanks > > -- coreboot mailing list: coreboot@coreboot.org https://www.coreboot.org/mailman/listinfo/coreboot
Re: [coreboot] latest greatest thinkpad with coreboot
On Thu, Dec 01, 2016 at 11:20:00PM +, ron minnich wrote: > If people are trying native graphics init I still think it's worth trying > the SPARK stuff from nico at least once. I'm intrigued by the use of Ada and excited about applying more formal methods as well as safer languages to the firmware space. It would also be interesting to consider using sel4 or CertiKOS as a payload. Do we require any sort of VGA init if the payload has the kernel framebuffer and mode support? I should do some tests with that on the x230. On Thu, Dec 1, 2016 at 2:54 PM Klemens Nanni wrote: > >https://item.taobao.com/item.htm?id=43820633263&toSite=main > >http://forum.51nb.com/thread-1662397-1-1.html > > Interesting, I wonder how well these replacement screens would work with > coreboot? I assume the proprietary VGA Option ROM won't work with those > and native graphics initialisation still needs some work on the X230 > either ways. Based on the auto-translated Chinese forum post, I believe they have tapped into the docking station to get sufficient display lanes. I haven't tried using the docking station with coreboot, so I'm not certain how well it would work either. -- Trammell -- coreboot mailing list: coreboot@coreboot.org https://www.coreboot.org/mailman/listinfo/coreboot
Re: [coreboot] latest greatest thinkpad with coreboot
If people are trying native graphics init I still think it's worth trying the SPARK stuff from nico at least once. It seems more complete to me than teh stuff I started. On Thu, Dec 1, 2016 at 2:54 PM Klemens Nanni wrote: > On Thu, Dec 01, 2016 at 11:35:36AM -0700, Trammell Hudson wrote: > >The major drawback is the low res screen. I've been considering trying > >these hacked x230 machines with 2560x1440 screens for 2559Y (about $400?): > > > >https://item.taobao.com/item.htm?id=43820633263&toSite=main > >http://forum.51nb.com/thread-1662397-1-1.html > Interesting, I wonder how well these replacement screens would work with > coreboot? I assume the proprietary VGA Option ROM won't work with those > and native graphics initialisation still needs some work on the X230 > either ways. > > -- > coreboot mailing list: coreboot@coreboot.org > https://www.coreboot.org/mailman/listinfo/coreboot > -- coreboot mailing list: coreboot@coreboot.org https://www.coreboot.org/mailman/listinfo/coreboot
Re: [coreboot] latest greatest thinkpad with coreboot
On Thu, Dec 01, 2016 at 11:35:36AM -0700, Trammell Hudson wrote: The major drawback is the low res screen. I've been considering trying these hacked x230 machines with 2560x1440 screens for 2559Y (about $400?): https://item.taobao.com/item.htm?id=43820633263&toSite=main http://forum.51nb.com/thread-1662397-1-1.html Interesting, I wonder how well these replacement screens would work with coreboot? I assume the proprietary VGA Option ROM won't work with those and native graphics initialisation still needs some work on the X230 either ways. -- coreboot mailing list: coreboot@coreboot.org https://www.coreboot.org/mailman/listinfo/coreboot
Re: [coreboot] latest greatest thinkpad with coreboot
On 01.12.2016 18:50, Klemens Nanni wrote: > On Thu, Dec 01, 2016 at 05:04:36PM +, ron minnich wrote: >> what's the latest best one? What's the battery life like (can't be worse >> than this mac pro that's always hot and now seems to have a life of 90 >> minutes, always). How much dram/ssd can I jam in it? > X230 if you'd ask me: 16G RAM, 12M ROM. runs fine with reduced (830K) ME > and has a powerful Ivy Bridge CPU. USB3.0, miniDisplayPort as well as > docking station has been working just fine for me although handling > suspend/resume as well as mounted external storage *can* be somewhat > tricky (in some scenarios the X230 would instantly resume from suspend > after having been docked once). > > Battery life under linux has been somewhere around 8 hours for me, > OpenBSD gets about 5-6 out of it but YMMV. > The problem with the X series is that the UI degraded with every gene- ration. Keyboard layout got worse with every generation. X220/X230: only 1366x768 pixels, from X230 on: chiclet keyboard, X240: no track- point buttons!!! The X250 was the first fully usable again, but sup- posedly with BootGuard enabled :-/ If you can't live with the 1366x768 resolution (I couldn't), you can look for a T430s with 1600x900 screen, optionally with a replacement keyboard (the oldest that fits). Everything Klemens said about the X230 should also apply to the T430s. It's just 14" instead of 12". > The X series never features more than one disk bay, but this again > depends on your use case: I'm totally fine with an 120G SSD, other > people prefer a RAID on their W/T model ThinkPads. Any 2.5" (7mm height) SATA drive should fit. Nico -- coreboot mailing list: coreboot@coreboot.org https://www.coreboot.org/mailman/listinfo/coreboot
Re: [coreboot] latest greatest thinkpad with coreboot
On Thu, Dec 01, 2016 at 06:50:13PM +0100, Klemens Nanni wrote: > On Thu, Dec 01, 2016 at 05:04:36PM +, ron minnich wrote: > >what's the latest best one? [...] > > X230 if you'd ask me: 16G RAM, 12M ROM. runs fine with reduced (830K) ME You can also retrofit the proper x220 keyboard into the x230 chassis without any major hassle. The major drawback is the low res screen. I've been considering trying these hacked x230 machines with 2560x1440 screens for 2559Y (about $400?): https://item.taobao.com/item.htm?id=43820633263&toSite=main http://forum.51nb.com/thread-1662397-1-1.html As far as I can tell, all of the T450/550 machines have Bootguard profile 4 enforcing verified boot. I wish they had used the measured boot mode instead. -- Trammell -- coreboot mailing list: coreboot@coreboot.org https://www.coreboot.org/mailman/listinfo/coreboot
Re: [coreboot] latest greatest thinkpad with coreboot
On Thu, Dec 01, 2016 at 05:04:36PM +, ron minnich wrote: what's the latest best one? What's the battery life like (can't be worse than this mac pro that's always hot and now seems to have a life of 90 minutes, always). How much dram/ssd can I jam in it? X230 if you'd ask me: 16G RAM, 12M ROM. runs fine with reduced (830K) ME and has a powerful Ivy Bridge CPU. USB3.0, miniDisplayPort as well as docking station has been working just fine for me although handling suspend/resume as well as mounted external storage *can* be somewhat tricky (in some scenarios the X230 would instantly resume from suspend after having been docked once). Battery life under linux has been somewhere around 8 hours for me, OpenBSD gets about 5-6 out of it but YMMV. The X series never features more than one disk bay, but this again depends on your use case: I'm totally fine with an 120G SSD, other people prefer a RAID on their W/T model ThinkPads. Best regards, kl3 -- coreboot mailing list: coreboot@coreboot.org https://www.coreboot.org/mailman/listinfo/coreboot
