Re: [CoTyroneMailingList] Matilda Jane Dunbar Co Tyrone

2018-04-30 Thread Pat H 
Hi Alex

This might be relevant but there is a book called "Newtownstewart
Remembered" by Billy Dunbar. The names Dunbar, McCrossan and Smyth are
mentioned in the book.

Regards

Pat

On Mon, Apr 30, 2018 at 9:00 AM, Boyd Gray  wrote:

> Hi Alex,
>
> Well, to start with, Matilda cannot be born in 1859 and get married in
> 1867.  Aged 8?  First we need to sort out who is who.
>
> Okay, so let's assume that you have the right marriage and the birth is
> spurious, this is her:
>
> Civil Marriage Record
> Date of Marriage: 09-May-1867
> Parish / District: STRABANE County: TYRONE
> Husband Wife
> Name: David Dumbar Matilda Smyth
> Address: Letterbrat Ballynamallaght
> Occupation: FARMER
> Age: 22 22
> Status: Bachelor (Previously unmarried) Spinster (Previously unmarried)
> Husband's Father Wife's Father
> Name: John Dumbar James Smyth
> Address:
> Occupation: FARMER FARMER
> Husband's Mother Wife's Mother
> Name:
> Address:
> Occupation:
> Witness 1 Witness 2
> Name: James Robert Tynan William Smyth
> Address:
> Notes:
> DUNAMANA PRESBYTERIAN CHURCH  PARISH OF DONAGHADY.BOTH AGES GIVEN AS
> FULL OVER 21.
>
> If this is accurate, she was born before 1845, so there will be no civil
> birth record (they began in 1864).
>
> This is her father, he held Plot 13, a 1 acre farm in Ballynamallght in
> the Parish of Donaghedy in 1859:
>
> Griffith's Valuation Record Information
> Tenant
> Family Name 1 SMYTH
> Forename 1 JAMES
> Landlord
> Family Name 2 OGILBY
> Forename 2 JAMES
> Location
> County TYRONE
> Barony STRABANE, LOWER
> Union GORTIN
> Parish DONAGHEDY
> Townland BALLYNAMALLAGHT
> Place Name BALLYNAMALLAGHT
> Place Type TOWNLAND
> Publication Details
> Position on Page 40
> Printing Date 1859
> Act 15&16
> Sheet Number 6
> Map Reference 13 A,B
>
> This is his death:
>
> Name JAMES SMYTH
> Year of Death 1904
> Group Registration ID 3452678
> SR District/Reg Area Strabane
> Deceased Age at Death 96
> Image
> Son, Jacob, also of Ballynamallaght, was present at death
>
> This is her in 1901:
>
> 1901 Census:
> Residents of a house 18 in Letterbrat (Plumbridge, Tyrone)
> Surname Forename Age Sex Relation to head Religion Birthplace Occupation
> Literacy Irish Language Marital Status Specified Illnesses
> Dunbar David 59 Male Head of Family Presbyterian Co Tyrone Farmer Read
> and write - Married -
> Dunbar Matilda Jane 52 Female Wife Presbyterian Co Tyrone - Read and write
> - Married -
> Dunbar Sarah Ann 20 Female Daughter Presbyterian Co Tyrone General Read
> and write - Not Married -
> Dunbar Maggie 18 Female Daughter Presbyterian Co Tyrone General Read and
> write - Not Married -
> Dunbar David 16 Male Son Presbyterian Co Tyrone General Read and write - Not
> Married -
>
> That gives a YoB of 1849 but this census is often wrong.
>
> And here she is in 1911:
>
> 1911 Census:
> Residents of a house 7 in Letterbrat (Plumb Bridge, Tyrone)
> Surname Forename Age Sex Relation to head Religion Birthplace Occupation
> Literacy Irish Language Marital Status Specified Illnesses Years Married 
> Children
> Born Children Living
> Dunbar Matilda Jane 65 Female Head of Family Presbyterian Co Tyrone - Read
> and write - Widow - 44 8 7
> Dunbar James 32 Male Son Presbyterian Co Tyrone Farmer Read and write -
> Single -
>
> This gives her age as 1846, which is more or less what I guessed from her
> marriage, so forget 1959.  And probably Upper Badoney. unless you know
> different.
>
> This is the death of David which you already have, it seems:
>
> Name DAVID DUNBAR
> Year of Death 1907
> Group Registration ID 3561946
> SR District/Reg Area Strabane
> Deceased Age at Death 68
> Image
>
> He was a farmer from Letterbrat and his daughter, Sarah, was present at
> his death.
>
> This is very probably her death but YOU need to buy the death cert from
> GRONI to be sure.  It costs only £2.50:
>
> D/1923/220/1027/12/173 Jane Dunbar 25th December 1922 77 Female 
> Strabane(pre-1973
> Q4)
>
> Where did you get the 1851 census?!  And her mother's name?
>
> They will be buried in the nearest Presbyterian church.
>
> Hope this helps,
>
> Regards,
>
> Boyd
>
> https://www.facebook.com/westulstergenealogy/
>
> http://familytrees.genopro.com/boydgray26/Boyd/
>
> https://boydgray26.wixsite.com/westulstergenealogy
>
>
> On 29 April 2018 at 20:37, alex carlisle 
> wrote:
>
>> Hi my name is Alex Carlisle I live in England and I'd be really grateful
>> if someone would be able to help me please, i'm trying to trace my
>> family ancestors in Co Tyrone, in particular my Grt Grt Gran Matilda Jane
>> Dunbar Nee Smyth, born 1859 Glencoppogagh townland upper Badney Parish, I
>> do not know when she died or where she is buried.  Matilda married David
>> Dunbar in Donemana Presbyterian Church in 1867, David died in Letterbrat in
>> Upper Badney in 1907. Also her father, James Smyth, her mother Matilda nee
>> McCrossan this is all I found on the 1851 census.  i'd be most grateful
>> for any help if

Re: [CoTyroneMailingList] Matilda Jane Dunbar Co Tyrone

2018-04-29 Thread Boyd Gray 
Hi Alex,

Well, to start with, Matilda cannot be born in 1859 and get married in
1867.  Aged 8?  First we need to sort out who is who.

Okay, so let's assume that you have the right marriage and the birth is
spurious, this is her:

Civil Marriage Record
Date of Marriage: 09-May-1867
Parish / District: STRABANE County: TYRONE
Husband Wife
Name: David Dumbar Matilda Smyth
Address: Letterbrat Ballynamallaght
Occupation: FARMER
Age: 22 22
Status: Bachelor (Previously unmarried) Spinster (Previously unmarried)
Husband's Father Wife's Father
Name: John Dumbar James Smyth
Address:
Occupation: FARMER FARMER
Husband's Mother Wife's Mother
Name:
Address:
Occupation:
Witness 1 Witness 2
Name: James Robert Tynan William Smyth
Address:
Notes:
DUNAMANA PRESBYTERIAN CHURCH  PARISH OF DONAGHADY.BOTH AGES GIVEN AS
FULL OVER 21.

If this is accurate, she was born before 1845, so there will be no civil
birth record (they began in 1864).

This is her father, he held Plot 13, a 1 acre farm in Ballynamallght in the
Parish of Donaghedy in 1859:

Griffith's Valuation Record Information
Tenant
Family Name 1 SMYTH
Forename 1 JAMES
Landlord
Family Name 2 OGILBY
Forename 2 JAMES
Location
County TYRONE
Barony STRABANE, LOWER
Union GORTIN
Parish DONAGHEDY
Townland BALLYNAMALLAGHT
Place Name BALLYNAMALLAGHT
Place Type TOWNLAND
Publication Details
Position on Page 40
Printing Date 1859
Act 15&16
Sheet Number 6
Map Reference 13 A,B

This is his death:

Name JAMES SMYTH
Year of Death 1904
Group Registration ID 3452678
SR District/Reg Area Strabane
Deceased Age at Death 96
Image
Son, Jacob, also of Ballynamallaght, was present at death

This is her in 1901:

1901 Census:
Residents of a house 18 in Letterbrat (Plumbridge, Tyrone)
Surname Forename Age Sex Relation to head Religion Birthplace Occupation
Literacy Irish Language Marital Status Specified Illnesses
Dunbar David 59 Male Head of Family Presbyterian Co Tyrone Farmer Read and
write - Married -
Dunbar Matilda Jane 52 Female Wife Presbyterian Co Tyrone - Read and write -
Married -
Dunbar Sarah Ann 20 Female Daughter Presbyterian Co Tyrone General Read and
write - Not Married -
Dunbar Maggie 18 Female Daughter Presbyterian Co Tyrone General Read and
write - Not Married -
Dunbar David 16 Male Son Presbyterian Co Tyrone General Read and write - Not
Married -

That gives a YoB of 1849 but this census is often wrong.

And here she is in 1911:

1911 Census:
Residents of a house 7 in Letterbrat (Plumb Bridge, Tyrone)
Surname Forename Age Sex Relation to head Religion Birthplace Occupation
Literacy Irish Language Marital Status Specified Illnesses Years
Married Children
Born Children Living
Dunbar Matilda Jane 65 Female Head of Family Presbyterian Co Tyrone - Read
and write - Widow - 44 8 7
Dunbar James 32 Male Son Presbyterian Co Tyrone Farmer Read and write -
Single -

This gives her age as 1846, which is more or less what I guessed from her
marriage, so forget 1959.  And probably Upper Badoney. unless you know
different.

This is the death of David which you already have, it seems:

Name DAVID DUNBAR
Year of Death 1907
Group Registration ID 3561946
SR District/Reg Area Strabane
Deceased Age at Death 68
Image

He was a farmer from Letterbrat and his daughter, Sarah, was present at his
death.

This is very probably her death but YOU need to buy the death cert from
GRONI to be sure.  It costs only £2.50:

D/1923/220/1027/12/173 Jane Dunbar 25th December 1922 77 Female
Strabane(pre-1973
Q4)

Where did you get the 1851 census?!  And her mother's name?

They will be buried in the nearest Presbyterian church.

Hope this helps,

Regards,

Boyd

https://www.facebook.com/westulstergenealogy/

http://familytrees.genopro.com/boydgray26/Boyd/

https://boydgray26.wixsite.com/westulstergenealogy


On 29 April 2018 at 20:37, alex carlisle  wrote:

> Hi my name is Alex Carlisle I live in England and I'd be really grateful
> if someone would be able to help me please, i'm trying to trace my family
> ancestors in Co Tyrone, in particular my Grt Grt Gran Matilda Jane Dunbar
> Nee Smyth, born 1859 Glencoppogagh townland upper Badney Parish, I do not
> know when she died or where she is buried.  Matilda married David Dunbar in
> Donemana Presbyterian Church in 1867, David died in Letterbrat in Upper
> Badney in 1907. Also her father, James Smyth, her mother Matilda nee
> McCrossan this is all I found on the 1851 census.  i'd be most grateful
> for any help if finding where /when they died or where they are buried.
>
> kind regards & many thanks
>
> Alex
>
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