Re: [crossfire] Player creation bug
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 (resending to the list) On 22.02.2011 07:55, Mark Wedel wrote: On 02/13/11 03:47 AM, Tolga Dalman wrote: - - create new character: fire hatchling/monk - - maximize str, dex and con - - set remaining stats so that they are 1 in total - - distribute the remaining points to pow This will fail, because the stats are checked after applying the race (but not the class). The attached patch fixes this issue. I'm not quite sure if I understand the problem or not. I tried to do that, and got a message saying stat to low. That is correct behavior IMO. Why is that correct ? Having total stats with at least 1 point should not yield an error! The attached patch removes the first (and thus redundant) stat check. I also think this is needed for balance - if a class has a big stat penalty, you need to spend some points to offset that penalty. If one does not need to spend any points to offset penalties, then the penalties become a lot less meaningful (don't put any points, and the fact there is a -8 penalty doesn't mean anything) Agreed. However, this could be automated. Being on this topic, I have some suggestions for the crossfire-client. I think it is already pretty good, however for a normal user like me it is quite difficult to create a character in a sane way. So I suggest: 1. add descriptions for stats (e.g. tooltips). Already there - at least they work for me. Strange. Then this is considered a bug in the client :) 4. disallow negative unspent stat points. This should be a simple check in the '+' buttons. And conversely, on point #4, that compounds the issue. Eg, I select troll, it updates the stats to minimum values - now I have negative stat points. So now it goes and decreases the high stats to make things legal. If I go back to human, then those stat values are really nothing close to what I had put in before. I'm not 100% sure what is the best way here - each one has its pros and cons. My initial implementation of that was to make it very easy to experiment with different combos, which means it does allow illegal values when playing around. While it is great for a developer not to have automatic attribute adjustments, for a user it does not make any sense. 5. Choose starting map should be replaced by the actual drop-down menu with Scorn as default value. I had issues fitting the description in. I had also thought that maybe at some point, that even gets extended with an image of some sort representing the map choice. I understand. Why not add another button for detail information on the particular choice ? Thanke best regards Tolga Dalman -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v2.0.17 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/ iQEcBAEBAgAGBQJNY32jAAoJEI0vwg8AaIlUnLQH/RjGibZhwgCALAxhFufa4q3x N7z719Hr05Z6lCCWIS74mfETEMjFV3ml0Xe4hHwU9n+87SibRB3vVG/IgzPGBsEz vMn0FxETCmrZKCMvvvAC0tWg9f+x7z+WwuXb6AM8VCjIvSqKUe4CIGErzIRA4a1M lnxMH2mbEIdyXO4nWH35BfwG8/TgGpdMRjTRUzwYnTouR2hNtH3k5SXOnzRVdeHX tqBXbz5KEMKKZ3OP+ESs0WfLbjLDu9PG2IA0jMjr084GcR0KRQhfp/Zl45EosF6l 8LZcM9lf3kQENO41v+/7rhpch0KHndhkbYfsE++baroD/+/w6L5/xC0OAoMSJO4= =CqkP -END PGP SIGNATURE- ___ crossfire mailing list crossfire@metalforge.org http://mailman.metalforge.org/mailman/listinfo/crossfire
Re: [crossfire] Player creation bug
Hello. currently, the player creation in crossfire 1.60 is broken. cut This will fail, because the stats are checked after applying the race (but not the class). The attached patch fixes this issue. Thanks for the patch :) I'm no specialist of this part of the code, but my reading is that both the basic combo (race and modifiers) and the full combo (race, class and modifiers) should be valid for the character to be considered valid. Your patch removes the race+modifiers check. So I'm not sure it's totally correct, because shouldn't the character without its class be valid? Of course, the client interface may be bugged if it accepts such combos the server deems invalid :) Being on this topic, I have some suggestions for the crossfire-client. I think it is already pretty good, however for a normal user like me it is quite difficult to create a character in a sane way. So I suggest: 1. add descriptions for stats (e.g. tooltips). 2. make the stat number field read-only (this feature is actually not useful, but rather confusing and error-prone). 3. when selecting a race or class automatically update the stats to the required minimum values. Also, these values should become constraints, i.e. pushing the '-' should not yield in stats lower 1. 4. disallow negative unspent stat points. This should be a simple check in the '+' buttons. All those make sense, yes. 5. Choose starting map should be replaced by the actual drop-down menu with Scorn as default value. Well, it's nice to have a map description, which is why (I guess) there is a sub-dialog. Right now the description is basic, but if it is extended, a tooltip may prove to not be enough. Regards Nicolas -- Mon p'tit coin du web - http://nicolas.weeger.org signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part. ___ crossfire mailing list crossfire@metalforge.org http://mailman.metalforge.org/mailman/listinfo/crossfire
Re: [crossfire] Player creation bug
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On 2/13/11 5:47 AM, Tolga Dalman wrote: Being on this topic, I have some suggestions for the crossfire-client. I think it is already pretty good, however for a normal user like me it is quite difficult to create a character in a sane way. So I suggest: 1. add descriptions for stats (e.g. tooltips). I tested this under Ubuntu Lucid with the standard Gnome desktop, and tool tip summaries appeared for all the stats (Str, Dex, Con, et al.) I have not tested this under any other OS/Distro and desktop environment. Perhaps other list subscribers can and report their findings? -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.7 (Darwin) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/ iD8DBQFNYvnahHyvgBp+vH4RAu1aAKDLjQTQ0nuARkagpz22QSxI3IkyhQCfaUHc 2RnpU51XbJhqyAESMuUiqvc= =y1rN -END PGP SIGNATURE- ___ crossfire mailing list crossfire@metalforge.org http://mailman.metalforge.org/mailman/listinfo/crossfire
Re: [crossfire] Player creation bug
On 02/13/11 03:47 AM, Tolga Dalman wrote: -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Hi, currently, the player creation in crossfire 1.60 is broken. You can reproduce it by doing the following with the crossfire-client 1.60: - - create new character: fire hatchling/monk - - maximize str, dex and con - - set remaining stats so that they are 1 in total - - distribute the remaining points to pow This will fail, because the stats are checked after applying the race (but not the class). The attached patch fixes this issue. I'm not quite sure if I understand the problem or not. I tried to do that, and got a message saying stat to low. That is correct behavior IMO. The old rolled method would allow for class combos where the minimum stats were not meant - that is no longer allowed, and that was an intentional change - since the player can distribute points, they can more easily make sure they meet the minimum values. I also think this is needed for balance - if a class has a big stat penalty, you need to spend some points to offset that penalty. If one does not need to spend any points to offset penalties, then the penalties become a lot less meaningful (don't put any points, and the fact there is a -8 penalty doesn't mean anything) Being on this topic, I have some suggestions for the crossfire-client. I think it is already pretty good, however for a normal user like me it is quite difficult to create a character in a sane way. So I suggest: 1. add descriptions for stats (e.g. tooltips). Already there - at least they work for me. 2. make the stat number field read-only (this feature is actually not useful, but rather confusing and error-prone). Entering stat numbers by hand works (I presume you mean the base attribute value). Maybe it was just my testing, but I often would just enter the numbers directly vs using the spin wheels. 3. when selecting a race or class automatically update the stats to the required minimum values. Also, these values should become constraints, i.e. pushing the '-' should not yield in stats lower 1. 4. disallow negative unspent stat points. This should be a simple check in the '+' buttons. #3 is perhaps reasonable - I'll defer that to the community. My initial thought was that if one wanted to look through the different races and classes, one might want to be able to see those different choices without it messing with the values one set. For example, one might be making up a barbarian, and current has human. Given this is a barbarian, str, dex, con are maxed, remaining points in cha, and int,wis,pow are minimum. I might then decide I want to see what things would look like if I did a troll instead. If select troll increases the base stat values, it means I just can not go back and select human (after deciding I don't like troll) and get those same values back. And conversely, on point #4, that compounds the issue. Eg, I select troll, it updates the stats to minimum values - now I have negative stat points. So now it goes and decreases the high stats to make things legal. If I go back to human, then those stat values are really nothing close to what I had put in before. I'm not 100% sure what is the best way here - each one has its pros and cons. My initial implementation of that was to make it very easy to experiment with different combos, which means it does allow illegal values when playing around. 5. Choose starting map should be replaced by the actual drop-down menu with Scorn as default value. I had issues fitting the description in. I had also thought that maybe at some point, that even gets extended with an image of some sort representing the map choice. ___ crossfire mailing list crossfire@metalforge.org http://mailman.metalforge.org/mailman/listinfo/crossfire
[crossfire] Player creation bug
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Hi, currently, the player creation in crossfire 1.60 is broken. You can reproduce it by doing the following with the crossfire-client 1.60: - - create new character: fire hatchling/monk - - maximize str, dex and con - - set remaining stats so that they are 1 in total - - distribute the remaining points to pow This will fail, because the stats are checked after applying the race (but not the class). The attached patch fixes this issue. Being on this topic, I have some suggestions for the crossfire-client. I think it is already pretty good, however for a normal user like me it is quite difficult to create a character in a sane way. So I suggest: 1. add descriptions for stats (e.g. tooltips). 2. make the stat number field read-only (this feature is actually not useful, but rather confusing and error-prone). 3. when selecting a race or class automatically update the stats to the required minimum values. Also, these values should become constraints, i.e. pushing the '-' should not yield in stats lower 1. 4. disallow negative unspent stat points. This should be a simple check in the '+' buttons. 5. Choose starting map should be replaced by the actual drop-down menu with Scorn as default value. I hope these suggestions are helpful :) Thanks and best regards Tolga Dalman -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v2.0.17 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/ iQEcBAEBAgAGBQJNV8TcAAoJEATLYSm2cxP9t9QH/jVFZTnVNZJUOwLpjp7nNhQO j9oh9KJaH2Ur1bhgvUVsuUw0OicK0vsiAOfpT5v6WOer0ORsE7Sl+vH6M85u4fs5 mJZzAGcCI9/G7qbi/AjDdxuwuXV8PRxOP1SAOKLCbjVZW7H1PfJdszGW64Gv51+u Ah07nVGoNHC/w77I2rDzLiZ3jQBXOXybjY36OyOF3e2drJf8v9p/5/YMnCmBqi5l GCCyavUwFOMwwIlLMaxagdRCbK3brqRgLWgkOchI6w2NAsOrY+JdRb4PtR2OWOnl psjiHxuHIcc5vt/I3m27885pL9geSp0ysEAbeRmXur/9mXOgEtJvY5ROLnjXiEQ= =Rtb2 -END PGP SIGNATURE- Index: player.c === --- player.c(revision 14309) +++ player.c(working copy) @@ -1388,9 +1388,6 @@ */ add_statbonus(op); -/* Checks that all stats are greater than 1 */ -if (!allowed_class(op)) return 1; - object_update(op, UP_OBJ_FACE); op-stats.hp = op-stats.maxhp; op-stats.sp = op-stats.maxsp; ___ crossfire mailing list crossfire@metalforge.org http://mailman.metalforge.org/mailman/listinfo/crossfire
