[CTRL] Fwd: [cia-drugs] South America on brink of war

2008-03-05 Thread Roads End
-Caveat Lector- -Original Message- From: Vigilius Haufniensis [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Mon, 3 Mar 2008 8:21 pm Subject: [cia-drugs] South America on brink of war

[CTRL] Fwd: [cia-drugs] How to Say NO to a 'False Flag' Operation - Cambodia, 1966

2008-03-05 Thread Roads End
-Caveat Lector- -Original Message- From: Kris Millegan [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Mon, 3 Mar 2008 8:05 pm Subject: [cia-drugs] How to Say NO to a 'False Flag' Operation - Cambodia, 1966 http://911blogger.com/node/14180 How to Say NO

[CTRL] Fwd: [ctrl] Texas Paper Urges Probe of Houston Oil Sabotage

2008-03-05 Thread Roads End
-Caveat Lector- -Original Message- From: Captain May [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Mon, 3 Mar 2008 2:13 pm Subject: [ctrl] Texas Paper Urges Probe of Houston Oil Sabotage Texas Paper Urges Probe of Houston Oil

[CTRL] Fwd: Rudolph Diesel and Hemp oil

2008-03-05 Thread Roads End
-Caveat Lector- -Original Message- From: luxefaire [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tue, 4 Mar 2008 7:13 am Subject: Rudolph Diesel and Hemp oil Rudolph Diesel, inventor of the diesel engine, designed the diesel to operate on Hemp oil. The Hemp tree produces four times more

[CTRL] Fwd: RERUN -- radio communications utilizing the base of a striated barium plasma

2008-03-05 Thread Roads End
-Caveat Lector- -Original Message- From: luxefaire [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tue, 4 Mar 2008 12:26 pm Subject: RERUN -- radio communications utilizing the base of a striated barium plasma i like the part about nuclear explosion simulation the best 1978 FROM:

[CTRL] Fwd: [cia-drugs] The Queen of Kansas

2008-03-05 Thread Roads End
-Caveat Lector- -Original Message- From: Kris Millegan [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wed, 5 Mar 2008 9:10 am Subject: [cia-drugs] The Queen of Kansas http://www2.ljworld.com/weblogs/victor-lazlo/2008/mar/04/the-queen-of-kansas/ The Queen

[CTRL] Fwd: [cia-drugs] Fwd: McCain fortune traced to organized crime

2008-03-01 Thread Roads End
-Caveat Lector- -Original Message- From: Kris Millegan [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thu, 28 Feb 2008 8:44 pm Subject: [cia-drugs] Fwd: McCain fortune traced to organized crime -Original Message- From: don.stacey

[CTRL] Fwd: [cia-drugs] Cocaine galore! £7m of Colombia's finest washes up on Cornish beaches

2008-03-01 Thread Roads End
-Caveat Lector- -Original Message- From: Vigilius Haufniensis [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wed, 27 Feb 2008 8:25 pm Subject: [cia-drugs] Cocaine galore! £7m of Colombia's finest washes up on Cornish beaches

[CTRL] Fwd: [cia-drugs] American System vs. Anglo-Dutch System Dialogue

2008-03-01 Thread Roads End
-Caveat Lector- -Original Message- From: Vigilius Haufniensis [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Fri, 29 Feb 2008 10:21 pm Subject: [cia-drugs] American System vs. Anglo-Dutch System Dialogue I don't believe in sovereignty. ? ?

[CTRL] Fwd: [cia-drugs] Brzezinski Seizing Control Over US Policy In Slow-Motion Coup

2008-03-01 Thread Roads End
-Caveat Lector- -Original Message- From: Vigilius Haufniensis [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Fri, 29 Feb 2008 10:26 pm Subject: [cia-drugs] Brzezinski Seizing Control Over US Policy In Slow-Motion Coup

[CTRL] Fwd: [ctrl] White House column was copied | The Journal Gazette

2008-03-01 Thread Roads End
-Caveat Lector- -Original Message- From: Alamaine [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: CTRL [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Fri, 29 Feb 2008 1:18 pm Subject: [ctrl] White House column was copied | The Journal Gazette Last updated: February 29, 2008 2:38 p.m. Hide photos White House column

[CTRL] Fwd: [ctrl] An invention called 'the Jewish people'

2008-03-01 Thread Roads End
-Caveat Lector- -Original Message- From: Alamaine [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: CTRL [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Fri, 29 Feb 2008 1:18 pm Subject: [ctrl] An invention called 'the Jewish people' w w w . h a a r e t z . c o m http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/959229.html Last

[CTRL] Fwd: Re: There's an article on me on page 14 of REAL DETROIT

2008-02-09 Thread T Brennan
-Caveat Lector- Note: forwarded message attached. Looking for last minute shopping deals? Find them fast with Yahoo! Search. http://tools.search.yahoo.com/newsearch/category.php?category=shopping

[CTRL] Fwd: [GATA] Supermodel joins hedge fund managers in dumping dollars

2007-11-05 Thread RoadsEnd
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[CTRL] Fwd: [ctrl] Armageddonites Push for More War | Good Grief! Imus Is Back on AIr

2007-11-05 Thread RoadsEnd
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[CTRL] Fwd: Scorecard for Past Skirmishes between Israeli and American Interests

2007-11-05 Thread RoadsEnd
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[CTRL] Fwd: Neofeudalism

2007-11-05 Thread RoadsEnd
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[CTRL] Fwd: Crusades vs Jihad -- Bernard Lewis, Neocon Forefather

2007-11-05 Thread RoadsEnd
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[CTRL] Fwd: Rice, Hadley, Wolfowitz, other Neocons to be subpoenaed in AIPAC/Israel spy case

2007-11-04 Thread RoadsEnd
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[CTRL] Fwd: [SPY NEWS] Ex-Saudi ambassador: Kingdom could have helped U.S. prevent 9/11

2007-11-04 Thread RoadsEnd
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[CTRL] Fwd:   Planned American Dictatorship Has Started Creation of Their Thought Police

2007-11-04 Thread RoadsEnd
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[CTRL] Fwd: Les ROOTS -- Sarkozy, Israeli Mole

2007-11-04 Thread RoadsEnd
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[CTRL] Fwd: [cia-drugs] The Parts Left Out of the Good Shepherd

2007-11-04 Thread RoadsEnd
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[CTRL] Fwd: [cia-drugs] CIA Scofflaw Fred Thompson

2007-11-04 Thread RoadsEnd
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[CTRL] Fwd: Wall Street Resorting to DEATH THREATS to Prop Up Public Confidence in System

2007-11-04 Thread RoadsEnd
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[CTRL] Fwd: Sibel Edmonds Promises to Tell All, but No One in the MSM Wants to Hear It

2007-11-01 Thread RoadsEnd
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[CTRL] Fwd: Oilogarch Flees Russia with $3 Billion, Seeks Political Asylum in UK

2007-11-01 Thread RoadsEnd
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[CTRL] Fwd: Welcome to Stalin's America: Cruel Unusual Punishment for Antiwar Protestors

2007-11-01 Thread RoadsEnd
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[CTRL] Fwd: Check out Federal Contracts to BLACKWATER USA, FY 2000-2007, summary

2007-10-31 Thread RoadsEnd
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[CTRL] Fwd: Superpowers Meet to Debate Iran Strategy This Week

2007-10-31 Thread RoadsEnd
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[CTRL] Fwd: 10-30-07

2007-10-31 Thread RoadsEnd
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[CTRL] Fwd: Bush Fed Up with Congress, Decides to Rule by Fiat

2007-10-31 Thread RoadsEnd
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[CTRL] Fwd: Welcome to America -- European Visitors Forbidden, Illegal Aliens Welcome

2007-10-31 Thread RoadsEnd
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[CTRL] Fwd: Lost Book of Nostradamus -- More Pseudo-History from the History Channel

2007-10-31 Thread RoadsEnd
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[CTRL] Fwd: Confederate flag at New York club where Cheney went hunting (For WHO?)

2007-10-31 Thread RoadsEnd
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[CTRL] Fwd: Bush Scores High on ONE Online Poll ...

2007-10-31 Thread RoadsEnd
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[CTRL] Fwd: Wayne Madsen on Misguided Nukes -- US Military Wins Mini-Coup over Neocons

2007-10-31 Thread RoadsEnd
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[CTRL] Fwd: Kucinich had UFO encounter, wedded Star Babe -- New Age Candidate?

2007-10-31 Thread RoadsEnd
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[CTRL] Fwd: Joint Chiefs of Staff Try to Rein in CheneyBush on Iran Attack

2007-10-31 Thread RoadsEnd
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[CTRL] Fwd: Neocon Philosophy of Deception

2007-10-31 Thread RoadsEnd
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[CTRL] Fwd: Lieberman-Kyl Iran Amendment Offered, Tantamount to Declaration of War

2007-10-31 Thread RoadsEnd
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[CTRL] Fwd: Icke (Pronounced Icky) Holy (Reptilian) Blood Genealogy for George Bush

2007-10-31 Thread RoadsEnd
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[CTRL] Fwd: Konformist: Mother Teresa, John Paul II, and the Fast-Track Saints

2007-10-31 Thread RoadsEnd
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[CTRL] Fwd: Cross Dressing WA Republican  ca ught in gay sex scandal

2007-10-31 Thread RoadsEnd
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[CTRL] Fwd: [cia-drugs] Fw: Is eVerify the Solution?

2007-10-31 Thread RoadsEnd
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[CTRL] Fwd: Making Us Feel Secure in Hell on Earth

2007-10-31 Thread RoadsEnd
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[CTRL] Fwd: Dark-Gray Friday

2007-10-20 Thread RoadsEnd
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[CTRL] Fwd: BUSH Bagman Bankrolling Hillary

2007-10-20 Thread RoadsEnd
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[CTRL] Fwd: Next in Line at the Guillotine after Bush, PELOSI (and Save a Space for Hillary)

2007-10-20 Thread RoadsEnd
-Caveat Lector- Begin forwarded message: From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: October 18, 2007 7:27:00 PM PDT To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Next in Line at the Guillotine after Bush, PELOSI (and Save a Space for Hillary) Nancy Pelosi,

[CTRL] Fwd: [cia-drugs] Bush Quips He Might Stay in Power

2007-10-19 Thread RoadsEnd
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[CTRL] Fwd: Ron Paul: Republican or Revolutionary?

2007-10-19 Thread RoadsEnd
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[CTRL] Fwd: Expect Limited Surgical Strikes on Iran

2007-10-18 Thread RoadsEnd
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[CTRL] Fwd: In Case of Alien Invasion, Call Rudy

2007-10-18 Thread RoadsEnd
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[CTRL] Fwd: A Coup Has Occurred

2007-10-18 Thread RoadsEnd
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[CTRL] Fwd: For America's Political Class, It's a Small World

2007-10-18 Thread RoadsEnd
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[CTRL] Fwd: Over Our Dead Bodies

2007-10-18 Thread RoadsEnd
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[CTRL] Fwd: Inquiry into Hunt Oil contract in Iraq -- Bush ties

2007-10-18 Thread RoadsEnd
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[CTRL] Fwd: When America Went Fascist

2007-10-18 Thread RoadsEnd
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[CTRL] Fwd: Antiwar Protesters in FBI Criminal Database Forbidden to Leave the Country

2007-10-18 Thread RoadsEnd
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[CTRL] Fwd: NIST Admits Total Collapse Of Twin Towers Unexplainable

2007-10-18 Thread RoadsEnd
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[CTRL] Fwd: Homeland Security Building Stadium-Sized Nuclear Fallout Shelter in Alabama

2007-10-18 Thread RoadsEnd
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[CTRL] Fwd: Upping the Ante on Iran -- Asked about Putin, Bush Warns of World War III

2007-10-18 Thread RoadsEnd
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[CTRL] Fwd: Head of U.S. counterterrorism agency resigns -- Weak Knees?

2007-10-18 Thread RoadsEnd
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[CTRL] Fwd: In The Kingdom of Fear

2007-10-18 Thread RoadsEnd
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[CTRL] Fwd: The Real Iraq We Knew  (By 1 2 former Army Captains)

2007-10-18 Thread RoadsEnd
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[CTRL] Fwd: The Most Dreaded Enemy of Liberty

2007-10-18 Thread RoadsEnd
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[CTRL] Fwd: Meanwhile, on the LOWER End of the 9/11 Market ...

2007-10-18 Thread RoadsEnd
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[CTRL] Fwd: [cia-drugs] Daniel Estulin -- The True History of the Bilderberg Group

2007-10-17 Thread RoadsEnd
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[CTRL] Fwd: The Mother of all Pretexts

2007-10-16 Thread RoadsEnd
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[CTRL] Fwd: After the Deluge -- De-Bushification

2007-10-16 Thread RoadsEnd
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[CTRL] Fwd: US warns of disaster if Turks attack Iraq

2007-10-16 Thread RoadsEnd
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[CTRL] Fwd: Pentagon Procurer Found Dead

2007-10-16 Thread RoadsEnd
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[CTRL] Fwd: Diana's Car Hit by Another Vehicle Before It Crashed

2007-10-16 Thread RoadsEnd
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[CTRL] Fwd: Hackers and Drug Dealers in the Philippines

2007-10-16 Thread RoadsEnd
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[CTRL] Fwd: New Evidence That Dr David Kelly Was Suicided

2007-10-16 Thread RoadsEnd
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[CTRL] Fwd: [ctrl] The man who knew 2much-Barlow was thrown out disgraced when he blew the whistle on a US cover-up.

2007-10-16 Thread RoadsEnd
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[CTRL] Fwd: Media Ownership Deja Vu

2007-10-16 Thread RoadsEnd
-Caveat Lector- ** See what's new at http://www.aol.com www.ctrl.org DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substance—not soap-boxing—please! These are

[CTRL] Fwd: U.S. demands air passengers ask its permission to fly   [+ Orig.URL]

2007-10-15 Thread RoadsEnd
-Caveat Lector- ** See what's new at http://www.aol.com www.ctrl.org DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substance—not soap-boxing—please! These are

[CTRL] Fwd: [ctrl] REAL HISTORY - Palestine and Lord Rothschild's NEW Israel

2007-10-13 Thread RoadsEnd
-Caveat Lector- ** See what's new at http://www.aol.com www.ctrl.org DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substance—not soap-boxing—please! These are

[CTRL] Fwd: [ctrl] Family to Investigate Wealth Amassed in Third Reich

2007-10-13 Thread RoadsEnd
-Caveat Lector- ** See what's new at http://www.aol.com www.ctrl.org DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substance—not soap-boxing—please! These are

[CTRL] Fwd: F.B.I. to Participate in TOPOFF 4 Dirty Bomb Drill (et al.)

2007-10-13 Thread RoadsEnd
-Caveat Lector- ** See what's new at http://www.aol.com www.ctrl.org DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substance—not soap-boxing—please! These are

[CTRL] Fwd: THE LIST: American Tears

2007-10-13 Thread RoadsEnd
-Caveat Lector- ** See what's new at http://www.aol.com www.ctrl.org DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substance—not soap-boxing—please! These are

[CTRL] Fwd: THE LIST: American Tears

2007-10-13 Thread RoadsEnd
-Caveat Lector- ** See what's new at http://www.aol.com www.ctrl.org DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substance—not soap-boxing—please! These are

[CTRL] Fwd: [ctrl] Blackwater in Iraq- Killing for Profit

2007-10-13 Thread RoadsEnd
-Caveat Lector- ** See what's new at http://www.aol.com www.ctrl.org DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substance—not soap-boxing—please! These are

[CTRL] Fwd: Who's Working for Whom in Iraq?

2007-10-13 Thread RoadsEnd
-Caveat Lector- ** See what's new at http://www.aol.com www.ctrl.org DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substance—not soap-boxing—please! These are

[CTRL] Fwd: The List

2007-10-12 Thread RoadsEnd
-Caveat Lector- ** See what's new at http://www.aol.com www.ctrl.org DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substance—not soap-boxing—please! These are

[CTRL] Fwd: [cia-drugs] Hillary Confronted on Bilderberg in Oakland

2007-10-12 Thread RoadsEnd
-Caveat Lector- ** See what's new at http://www.aol.com www.ctrl.org DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substance—not soap-boxing—please! These are

[CTRL] Fwd: Bush's Torturers Follow Where the Nazis Led

2007-10-10 Thread RoadsEnd
-Caveat Lector- Begin forwarded message: From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: October 8, 2007 8:35:52 AM PDT To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Fwd: Bush's Torturers Follow Where the Nazis Led George Orwell would have been impressed by the phrase enhanced

[CTRL] Fwd: Cardinal calls for Jews to stop calling Jesus a bastard

2007-10-10 Thread RoadsEnd
-Caveat Lector- Begin forwarded message: From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: October 10, 2007 10:54:24 AM PDT To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Cardinal calls for Jews to stop calling Jesus a bastard Cardinal calls for Jews to stop calling

[CTRL] Fwd: Latest Buzz, 10-10-07

2007-10-10 Thread RoadsEnd
-Caveat Lector- Begin forwarded message: From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: October 10, 2007 1:43:12 PM PDT To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Latest Buzz, 10-10-07 http://coverthistory.blogspot.com/ Bill Maher on Controlled Demolition

[CTRL] Fwd: Paradise Poisoned by Depleted Uranium

2007-10-10 Thread RoadsEnd
-Caveat Lector- Begin forwarded message: From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: October 10, 2007 10:58:34 AM PDT To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Paradise Poisoned by Depleted Uranium Hawaiian Islands Contaminated With Ballistic Uranium

[CTRL] Fwd: Bohemian Grove Human Sacrifice Ritual Re-Enacted on CARTOON Network

2007-10-10 Thread RoadsEnd
-Caveat Lector- Begin forwarded message: From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: October 10, 2007 10:46:56 AM PDT To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Bohemian Grove Human Sacrifice Ritual Re-Enacted on CARTOON Network

[CTRL] Fwd: [cia-drugs] Oil bourse update: Japanese to pay Iran in Yen

2007-10-10 Thread RoadsEnd
-Caveat Lector- Begin forwarded message: From: Vigilius Haufniensis [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: October 10, 2007 10:19:28 AM PDT To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED], cia- [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [cia-drugs] Oil bourse update: Japanese to pay Iran in Yen Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]

[CTRL] Fwd: Pelosi Badmouths War Protestors

2007-10-10 Thread RoadsEnd
-Caveat Lector- Begin forwarded message: From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: October 10, 2007 2:41:32 PM PDT To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Pelosi Badmouths War Protestors http://www.buzzflash.net/story.php?id=27653#comment-5 We have to

[CTRL] Fwd: SITE Gets Sore Eyes

2007-10-10 Thread RoadsEnd
-Caveat Lector- Begin forwarded message: From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: October 10, 2007 3:04:28 PM PDT To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: SITE Gets Sore Eyes White House Leak to Fox News Severed a Link to Al-Qaeda's Secrets

[CTRL] Fwd: [cia-drugs] Insidious new trojan worm/bot Storm

2007-10-08 Thread RoadsEnd
-Caveat Lector- Begin forwarded message: From: palcat [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: October 8, 2007 1:58:54 AM PDT To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [cia-drugs] Insidious new trojan worm/bot Storm Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] If this is for real, it's pretty scary.

[CTRL] Fwd: Toe-Tappin' Republican #2

2007-10-08 Thread RoadsEnd
-Caveat Lector- Begin forwarded message: From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: October 8, 2007 12:58:38 PM PDT To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Fwd: Toe-Tappin' Republican #2 See what's new at AOL.com and Make AOL Your Homepage. From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]

[CTRL] Fwd: 1984's News Today

2007-10-08 Thread RoadsEnd
-Caveat Lector- Begin forwarded message: From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: October 8, 2007 1:16:55 PM PDT To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: 1984's News Today http://www.legitgov.org/index.html#breaking_news links at site

[CTRL] Fwd: Eat a strawberry, mutate your DNA

2007-10-08 Thread RoadsEnd
-Caveat Lector- Begin forwarded message: From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: October 8, 2007 12:17:36 PM PDT To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Fwd: Eat a strawberry, mutate your DNA See what's new at AOL.com and Make AOL Your Homepage. From: [EMAIL

[CTRL] Fwd: Sticky-Fingers Sandy Berger Now Advising Hillary Clinton (!)

2007-10-08 Thread RoadsEnd
-Caveat Lector- Begin forwarded message: From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: October 8, 2007 1:08:28 PM PDT To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Sticky-Fingers Sandy Berger Now Advising Hillary Clinton (!) He's back ... Sandy Berger now

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