Re: Zombie Patriots and other musings

2003-12-17 Thread John Kelsey
At 12:34 PM 12/14/03 -0800, Major Variola (ret) wrote: At 11:52 AM 12/13/03 -0500, John Kelsey wrote: .. One interesting property of the lone warriors is that they can't actually make peace. Good points, but not entirely true. For instance, we could stop the Jihad (tm) (including future Jihads by

Re: Zombie Patriots and other musings

2003-12-17 Thread Harmon Seaver
On Tue, Dec 16, 2003 at 06:59:59PM -0500, John Kelsey wrote: us. Maybe they will, maybe they won't, but our foreign policy ought to be made based on what is in our long-term best interest (our meaning American citizens); realistically, terrorist attacks are a fairly small part of that

Re: Zombie Patriots and other musings

2003-12-14 Thread Major Variola (ret)
(resend) At 11:52 AM 12/13/03 -0500, John Kelsey wrote: At 09:19 AM 12/12/03 -0800, Major Variola (ret) wrote: ... You need to think about the lone warrior scenario that the Gang worries about. McVeighs and Rudolphs. They were influenced by memes which were not immediately suppressed. One

Re: Patriot Ants (was: Re: Zombie Patriots and other musings)

2003-12-14 Thread Nostradumbass
From: Thomas Shaddack [EMAIL PROTECTED] On Sat, 13 Dec 2003, John Kelsey wrote: Of course, there's a more fundamental problem with surrendering to the lone warriors. Imagine that there's such a wave of pro-life terrorism that we finally agree to ban abortion. You're a fanatically

Patriot Ants (was: Re: Zombie Patriots and other musings)

2003-12-14 Thread Thomas Shaddack
On Sat, 13 Dec 2003, John Kelsey wrote: Of course, there's a more fundamental problem with surrendering to the lone warriors. Imagine that there's such a wave of pro-life terrorism that we finally agree to ban abortion. You're a fanatically committed pro-choice activist. What's your next

Re: Zombie Patriots and other musings

2003-12-13 Thread John Young
It was discovered a while back, check the archives, or Tim's FAQ, that all the remailers were compromised, with or without the operator's complicity with TLAs. After that discovery there was a turning of the covert control to re-direct it toward its implementer(s). That was soon re-turned by the

Re: Zombie Patriots and other musings

2003-12-13 Thread Harmon Seaver
On Sat, Dec 13, 2003 at 03:40:07AM +0100, Nomen Nescio wrote: Anonymous wrote: Nomen pondered: Why robbing banks? Aside from allowing the government to regulate them, what have they done to deserve being robbed Why not? Revolutionaries need money, and the financial sector

Re: Zombie Patriots and other musings

2003-12-13 Thread Anonymous
A question for the moment might well be how many if any of the remailers are operated by TLAs?

Re: Zombie Patriots and other musings

2003-12-13 Thread Thoenen, Peter Mr CN Sprint
does it matter? Anonymous wrote: A question for the moment might well be how many if any of the remailers are operated by TLAs?

Re: Zombie Patriots and other musings

2003-12-13 Thread John Kelsey
At 09:19 AM 12/12/03 -0800, Major Variola (ret) wrote: .. You need to think about the lone warrior scenario that the Gang worries about. McVeighs and Rudolphs. They were influenced by memes which were not immediately suppressed. One interesting property of the lone warriors is that they can't

Re: Zombie Patriots and other musings

2003-12-13 Thread Eugen Leitl
On Sat, Dec 13, 2003 at 06:49:15PM +0100, Anonymous wrote: A question for the moment might well be how many if any of the remailers are operated by TLAs? The community is small enough so that the fraction must be in low 10% at worst. What'd be interesting to know how secure the remailer

Re: Zombie Patriots and other musings

2003-12-12 Thread Nostradumbass
From: An Metet [EMAIL PROTECTED] The devil is in details. Given small numbers and absence of any other grouping factor there needs to be an obvious place for ZPs to refer to. Any obvious place that becomes even remotely attractive to ZPs will be immediately raided. If you mean a

Re: Zombie Patriots and other musings

2003-12-12 Thread An Metet
The devil is in details. Given small numbers and absence of any other grouping factor there needs to be an obvious place for ZPs to refer to. Any obvious place that becomes even remotely attractive to ZPs will be immediately raided. Because ZPs have potential to be actually dangerous to the

Re: Zombie Patriots and other musings

2003-12-12 Thread Major Variola (ret)
At 10:12 PM 12/11/03 -0500, An Metet wrote: Given small numbers and absence of any other grouping factor there needs to be an obvious place for ZPs to refer to. Any obvious place that becomes even remotely attractive to ZPs will be immediately raided. Because ZPs have potential to be actually

Re: Zombie Patriots and other musings

2003-12-12 Thread R. A. Hettinga
At 9:19 AM -0800 12/12/03, Major Variola (ret) wrote: Look at Al Q, Inc: you don't need explicit instructions from the Boss to motivate folks to do things. You see who is the enemy, you see opportunity. You don't need permission. Yup. That's the way Reagan operated, too. I'm just finishing up

Re: Zombie Patriots and other musings

2003-12-12 Thread Nomen Nescio
Another excellent group of potential recruits are prisoners. Especially if you can create a new religious movement teaching them to stop the interracial, intergang fighting and concentrate on their true enemy, the Man. Teach that killing cops, soldiers, any type of government agent, is a holy

RE: Zombie Patriots and other musings [was: Re: (No Subject)]

2003-12-12 Thread John Kelsey
At 02:07 PM 12/11/03 -0500, Trei, Peter wrote: It's worth noting that despite over a decade of this rhetoric, not a single terminally ill American has done this, so far as I am aware. Well, I think for most terminal illnesses, by the time it's obvious you're really not going to live much longer,

Re: Zombie Patriots and other musings

2003-12-12 Thread Nostradumbass
Original Message From: Anonymous [EMAIL PROTECTED] Apparently from: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: Zombie Patriots and other musings Date: Fri, 12 Dec 2003 05:32:48 +0100 (CET) The devil is in details. Given small numbers and absence of any other

RE: Zombie Patriots and other musings [was: Re: (No Subject)]

2003-12-12 Thread Nostradumbass
From: John Kelsey [EMAIL PROTECTED] At 02:07 PM 12/11/03 -0500, Trei, Peter wrote: It's worth noting that despite over a decade of this rhetoric, not a single terminally ill American has done this, so far as I am aware. Well, I think for most terminal illnesses, by the time it's obvious

Re: Zombie Patriots and other musings

2003-12-12 Thread Anonymous
Nomen pondered: Why robbing banks? Aside from allowing the government to regulate them, what have they done to deserve being robbed Why not? Revolutionaries need money, and the financial sector has always been asshole buddies with the police, politicians, and other pigs.

RE: Zombie Patriots and other musings [was: Re: (No Subject)]

2003-12-12 Thread Anonymous
LEO John Kelsey whined: Well, I think for most terminal illnesses, by the time it's obvious you're really not going to live much longer, you're pretty damned sick. And until then, you'd probably like to make some personal use of what days or weeks you have left doing something like talking

Re: Zombie Patriots and other musings

2003-12-12 Thread Nomen Nescio
Anonymous wrote: Nomen pondered: Why robbing banks? Aside from allowing the government to regulate them, what have they done to deserve being robbed Why not? Revolutionaries need money, and the financial sector has always been asshole buddies with the police, politicians, and

Zombie Patriots and other musings [was: Re: (No Subject)]

2003-12-11 Thread Nostradumbass
From: J.A. Terranson [EMAIL PROTECTED] On Tue, 9 Dec 2003, Anatoly Vorobey wrote: On Tue, Dec 09, 2003 at 12:47:27AM +0100, edo wrote: With the USA becoming the world's most totalitarian state in disguise... That's a pretty silly thing to say. Sure you don't want to educate

RE: Zombie Patriots and other musings [was: Re: (No Subject)]

2003-12-11 Thread Trei, Peter
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Nothing less than a guerilla war seems necessary to restore something akin to the original constitutional balance in the U.S. But where to recruit these people? My suggestion: the terminally ill. Many TI come to the table with a 'gift', the certainty of