Re: current status of cypherpunks, tim may, etc. ??
On Sun, 11 Apr 2004, Riad S. Wahby wrote: 2. Was tim may being filtered from minder, or is he just gone now ? I talked to him a little bit after lne went down; he said he wasn't interested in posting to the list any more. Quite unfortunate, in my view. Apparently he's still to be found posting on various Usenet groups. Unfortunate? I don't know. Tim's gone a little whacko over the last few years, and it doesn't look like his meds are doing crap for him: NNTP-Posting-Date: Sat, 10 Apr 2004 01:59:43 -0500 Subject: Re: Details Magazine publishes outrageous anti-Asian, anti-gay feature Date: Fri, 09 Apr 2004 23:59:43 -0700 From: Tim May [EMAIL PROTECTED] Newsgroups: ba.general,la.general,nyc.general,soc.culture.asian.american,scruz.general,misc.survivalism Message-ID: [EMAIL PROTECTED] In article [EMAIL PROTECTED], Whitney McNally [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I decided to do something funny and hopefully constructive about the details magazine controversy. www.whitneymcnally.com Nigger, or Thief? Is there really a difference? Thirty years ago, even more, I was prepared to give the negro a chance. Now, so many years later, so many excuses later, so many crimes later, I say we ought to either give passage back to Biafra and Ruwanda and other hellholes for those negroes who request it, or charge those who remain for the benefits of white civilization we gave them over the past few hundred years. And for those who have been on welfare, or AFDC, or WICC, or any of the giveaway subsidies to the negro, they must pay back what they took from working people, with interest, or be sent up the chimneys. Their choice. The negro has stolen from the European for way too long. --Tim May
Re: current status of cypherpunks, tim may, etc. ??
J.A. Terranson [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Unfortunate? I don't know. Tim's gone a little whacko over the last few years, and it doesn't look like his meds are doing crap for him: [snip] It's true, Tim does seem to harbor an awful lot of anger towards certain groups, but while I don't agree with it, he's entitled to his opinion. The part I find unfortunate is that, along with his less tactful points, gone are his insightful ones. -- Riad Wahby [EMAIL PROTECTED] MIT VI-2 M.Eng
current status of cypherpunks, tim may, etc. ??
I wasn't paying attention when the lne node went away, and was a bit lost in my CP mailing list subscription for a few months... I subscribed to minder, but it was a _joke_ in terms of spam and bounces and all sorts of lameness in my cypherpunks folder _and_ my inbox. Further, I noticed I was no longer seeing any posts by Tim May - I might have been missing others as well, but he was conspicuously absent. So, I have unsubbed from minder and subbed to al-qeada.net - hopefully they will be closer to LNEs level of anti-spam excellence ... questions: 1. any comments on this level of spam and bounces, etc., I saw from minder - does al-qeada use a more LNE-like processor ? 2. Was tim may being filtered from minder, or is he just gone now ? thanks. __ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - File online by April 15th http://taxes.yahoo.com/filing.html
Re: current status of cypherpunks, tim may, etc. ??
Joe Schmoe [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: 1. any comments on this level of spam and bounces, etc., I saw from minder - does al-qeada use a more LNE-like processor ? Well, as the list maintainer I see a lot of bounces c, but (unless something is seriously wrong with my setup) no one else does. 2. Was tim may being filtered from minder, or is he just gone now ? I talked to him a little bit after lne went down; he said he wasn't interested in posting to the list any more. Quite unfortunate, in my view. Apparently he's still to be found posting on various Usenet groups. RAH knows more about this than I do. -- Riad Wahby [EMAIL PROTECTED] MIT VI-2 M.Eng
Re: Lazy network operators (fwd)
The source is almost as interesting as the quote. -- Forwarded message -- Date: 11 Apr 2004 03:41:48 + From: Paul Vixie [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: Lazy network operators [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Sean Donelan) writes: Should anonymous use of the Internet be eliminated so all forms of abuse can be tracked and dealt with? of course not. however, anonymity should be brokered by trusted doubleblinds; nonbrokered/nontrusted anonymity without recourse by recipients is right out. -- Paul Vixie
Re: Hierarchy, Force Monopoly, and Geodesic Societies - the internet is a tree.
It's a tree No, it's not a tree I thought we were sort of an autonomous collective! Watery marketers lobbing Powerpoints is no basis for a form of architecture Network engineers spend a lot of time making sure that their networks, and the Internet, are not trees. Multiple peering and transit relationships make the network robust - and cyclic. The core of the current Internet routing architecture in the US is a couple of dozen Tier 1 providers who almost all interconnect with each other, with each pair almost always connected in more than two places (usually an East Coast and a West Coast location plus others.) - Most of the Tier 2 providers are connected to at least two upstreams, either both Tier 1 or a Tier 1 and a Tier 2. - There's no well-defined boundary between Tier 2 and Tier 3, but the Tier 3 types of folks may not be as diverse. - Some big hosting companies are owned by Tier 1 carriers, and may just get connectivity from their parent company, but it usually still has physically diverse connections to diverse switches. - Many other hosting companies are independent of the carriers, and tend to have feeds from multiple carriers (usually multiple Tier 1 for the big players). - Many big end-user companies have multiple large internet feeds from multiple carriers; even small companies with a couple of T1s often try to get some diversity (in which case the ISP run by the local telco is often one of their providers.) - If you want physically diverse access to your building, you usually need to buy at least a couple of T3s - some local telcos will still do diverse T1 access, but most don't, or else they have it in their tariff rate but *your* street doesn't have it. As Jim and others have said, it's extremely not tree-like - we want to maximize the number of careless drunken backhoe drivers it takes to take down our circuits, as well as maximizing the number of equipment failures and operator mistakes it takes, and trying to minimize the damage any problem causes. DNS's namespace is tree-like, but the actual implementation of the DNS name server networks is very forested and meshy. The biggest problems are all at layer 9.
Re: Spy agency launches recruiting campaign
At 08:52 PM 4/10/2004, R. A. Hettinga wrote: http://www.mercurynews.com/mld/mercurynews/8403065.htm?template=contentModules/printstory.jsp Posted on Sat, Apr. 10, 2004 Spy agency launches recruiting campaign Associated Press WASHINGTON - The highly secretive National Security Agency is looking to hire 7,500 workers over the next five years in the spy agency's largest recruiting campaign since the 1980s. When I was in college, the NSA recruiting posted had a note somebody'd added to the bottom saying If you're interested, don't call us - we already know about you and somebody else's version of that was If you're interested, just phone your mom, and we'll get back to you.
Re: legally required forgetting
On Sat, Apr 10, 2004 at 10:33:39AM -0700, Major Variola (ret) wrote: Thanks for the distinction, however it still makes CC folks slaves of the State. Suppose Joe Badcredit finds a blank application and applies? The State then uses violence to coerce the CC into non-consensual transactions. No. AIUI the CC company is not obligated by the state to offer joe any credit at all in response to his application. They may reject him based on his nonpayment twenty years later. They simply may not attempt to collect the old debt. Also, in practice, the people who aggregate such information from other creditors will have a hard time reporting on the old default. But you are not obligated to extend any credit that you do not wish to extend.
Re: On Needing Killing
Major Variola (ret) (2004-04-11 16:42Z) wrote: Blacknet is a robust archive for words, immune to force (by State or private actors), but merely words. With all due respect to the principle of freedom of speech and all that, I think that cypherpunks, and people in general, give far too little respect to words, as if words are a vague, unimportant, and remote link in the chain of causation of acts or failure-to-acts. I don't see anything wrong with Orwell's view that words control the future's view of history. His certainly have. I think mass anonymity and cypherpunk-ish society aren't themselves motive forces on the level of the _contents_ of some anonymous speech that would be facilitated by those institutions. That's the whole point, right? What would be the use of cypherpunk society if the speech and data havens it allowed were merely words? I'm unconvinced that there isn't a deterministic component to the speech-action transition. Even though the results of some speech may be extraordinarily terrible, restrictions on free speech are artifacts of previous, equally terrible free speech that has achieved a foothold in government. -- You took my gun. It's just your word against mine! Not necessarily. -Bernie vs Tom, Miller's Crossing
Re: current status of cypherpunks, tim may, etc. ??
Tim regularly and thoroughly jumped up my ass about my various ideological impurities Well, this was fairly annoying and I think made it harder to dig out the gold from Tim May's poop. And in a way, this was self-defeating from a topple-the-state point of view. My point was (and sometimes is) that our beliefs about Economics, capitalism, and politics are to some extent irrelevant in the light of a techno-determinist point of view (Riad Wahbi pointed this out a few posts ago). In that context, raising some questions about some of the accepted notions about capitalism wasn't (for me at least) necessarily an attempt to fight the crypto-anarchic view/goal/partyline May seemed bent on establishing, but rather to suggest that even groups or individuals with ostenibly very different goals might be able to embrace a crypto-approach towards achieving their aims. In other words, it should be considered a good thing if leftists or liberals or Jihadists utilize well-formed crypto...that can actually only accelerate whatever's down the pike. And opening the discussions up a bit for such not only keeps away the philosophical inbreeding of some lists, it might actually start something amongst adherents of that point of view. And hell, if there's a way to maintain a left-wing stance without that eventually resulting in me having to put in 14 hour days in People's Shoe Factory Number 14, then more power to 'emI think it's probably too late even for some 21st Century hyper-Stalin to sieze control of both wireline and wireless internet now... but again, who gives a crap. Crypto's probably already passed the point of no return, no matter what kind of State George Dubya continues to unleash on us. -TD So...how many years before it's possible for an online group to anonymously fun, order up and drop-ship weapons on a besieged people trying to maintain their national sovereignty? From: R. A. Hettinga [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: current status of cypherpunks, tim may, etc. ?? Date: Sun, 11 Apr 2004 15:40:50 -0400 -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 At 3:37 AM -0400 4/11/04, Riad S. Wahby wrote: Apparently he's still to be found posting on various Usenet groups. RAH knows more about this than I do. Obviously, Tim was on usenet long before he, Eric Hughes and John Gilmore started this list on toad.com after the first physical cypherpunks meeting 11 years ago last fall. Because some spam-defense techniques require the absence of usable email addresses, and because Tim has changed his addresses more than once over the last few years, you can go on groups.google.com and just search for Tim May in the author field -- don't forget the quote marks -- and see everything he's posting now. He's usually in the local Bay Area groups, and on Misc.Survivalism, though I haven't looked in about a month or so. As we just saw in a previous forward from usenet, most of the stuff he posts there makes me cringe, like his later stuff here, but, obviously, Tim's as smart and as creative as he's ever been. Even though when I showed up here, 10 years ago sometime in May to learn how to do cash transactions on the internet, Tim regularly and thoroughly jumped up my ass about my various ideological impurities and deep flaws in my character :-) (it was ever thus, I got used to it, and I hopefully learned to give back as good as I got), there was, invariably, something useful in almost all of his posts here. This, in spite of, to me at least, the increasing preponderance of deliberately provocative cruft he trolled around here, presumably in boredom, just to piss people off. Obviously, though more civil, and, frankly, productive, this list isn't the same since Tim left, not the least because this list was, for all intents and purposes, his creation, by dint of the sheer amount of time he put into it, if nothing else. As most people here know, I've long been interested in influence and reputation, and I once introduced Tim at a Mac_Crypto conference in terms of the magnitude of his influence, which is, frankly, much more considerable than people really understand. Tim thanked me for a nice introduction, and, while I was being quite cordial, this being one of the few times we got along, nice was pretty orthogonal to my point. Tim May, whether he likes it or not -- understands it completely or not -- has literally invented, discovered, a new form of emergent social order. More properly, in learning that property can be controlled by cryptography in a manner *independent* of biometric identity, he was the first person to understand that the control and market-auctioned transfer of property could be achieved without the need of the force-monopoly of the state. The result is something which is, by definition, anarchy. Tim called it crypto-anarchy, since it required the use of strong cryptography on public networks to happen, but I don't think even he understood just how far the idea could
Re: current status of cypherpunks, tim may, etc. ??
On Sun, 11 Apr 2004, Riad S. Wahby wrote: The part I find unfortunate is that, along with his less tactful points, gone are his insightful ones. This is the point I was trying to make (by reposting his latest insight). We all have those ghosts we'd like to see dead. Hell, I've got more than most, and maybe even as many as Tim, but if there isn't - even occasionally - another thought being expressed that Up the chimneys with X, what's the point of listening? CP is certianly less for the missing May. But the currently posting May isn't worth listening to. -- How do you change anything, except stand in one place and scream and scream and scream and then make more people come and stand in that place and scream and scream and scream? Sally Fields
Re: current status of cypherpunks, tim may, etc. ??
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 At 3:37 AM -0400 4/11/04, Riad S. Wahby wrote: Apparently he's still to be found posting on various Usenet groups. RAH knows more about this than I do. Obviously, Tim was on usenet long before he, Eric Hughes and John Gilmore started this list on toad.com after the first physical cypherpunks meeting 11 years ago last fall. Because some spam-defense techniques require the absence of usable email addresses, and because Tim has changed his addresses more than once over the last few years, you can go on groups.google.com and just search for Tim May in the author field -- don't forget the quote marks -- and see everything he's posting now. He's usually in the local Bay Area groups, and on Misc.Survivalism, though I haven't looked in about a month or so. As we just saw in a previous forward from usenet, most of the stuff he posts there makes me cringe, like his later stuff here, but, obviously, Tim's as smart and as creative as he's ever been. Even though when I showed up here, 10 years ago sometime in May to learn how to do cash transactions on the internet, Tim regularly and thoroughly jumped up my ass about my various ideological impurities and deep flaws in my character :-) (it was ever thus, I got used to it, and I hopefully learned to give back as good as I got), there was, invariably, something useful in almost all of his posts here. This, in spite of, to me at least, the increasing preponderance of deliberately provocative cruft he trolled around here, presumably in boredom, just to piss people off. Obviously, though more civil, and, frankly, productive, this list isn't the same since Tim left, not the least because this list was, for all intents and purposes, his creation, by dint of the sheer amount of time he put into it, if nothing else. As most people here know, I've long been interested in influence and reputation, and I once introduced Tim at a Mac_Crypto conference in terms of the magnitude of his influence, which is, frankly, much more considerable than people really understand. Tim thanked me for a nice introduction, and, while I was being quite cordial, this being one of the few times we got along, nice was pretty orthogonal to my point. Tim May, whether he likes it or not -- understands it completely or not -- has literally invented, discovered, a new form of emergent social order. More properly, in learning that property can be controlled by cryptography in a manner *independent* of biometric identity, he was the first person to understand that the control and market-auctioned transfer of property could be achieved without the need of the force-monopoly of the state. The result is something which is, by definition, anarchy. Tim called it crypto-anarchy, since it required the use of strong cryptography on public networks to happen, but I don't think even he understood just how far the idea could go. His concern was more immediate. Like freedom, privacy is an inherent good, and anything that maximizes both privacy and freedom maximizes the good in the world. All the structural possibilities that resulted were just gravy. It's probable that his hatred of the state came first, long before his discovery of cryptography as a means to that end, but the effect is the same whether, like me, the crypto changed his opinion of the state, or, as was probably Tim's case, his opinion of the state led to his discovery of crypto as a means to get what he wanted. One way or the other, Tim and other early cypherpunks really did discover a way to make physically real the yearnings of libertarians, anarcho-capitalists, and other free people throughout the ages, by using, for the first time in more than a thousand years, technology and markets instead of manifestos, politics, philosophy, or, in the case of libertarians, somehow-constrained government and monopolistic force. I think that this didn't happen fast enough for Tim, and he devolved to hoping for some disaster to force his new world into being, and failing even that, he began to advocate more, I suppose, traditional, methods of getting what he wanted: those involving force, without regard, unfortunately, to reason, much less economics. It was upsetting, infuriating, to watch, but, after a while, we realized that Tim was, after all, a free man. He could do what he wanted with his time and resources, and it wasn't our right to tell him to do otherwise, no matter how negative our opinions were of his behavior. As for the more personally repellant of his beliefs, we have to remember that he advocated something that most of us have come around to over time, something that many anarchocapitalists have talked about before Tim May did, that discrimination in transactions and hiring of *any* kind is a *right* of free people in markets, foolish consequences or not, and that it's only wrong when governments force that discrimination onto everyone, like they do in Jim Crow, Nazi Anti-Jewry, or Apartheid
Re: Hierarchy, Force Monopoly, and Geodesic Societies
Jim Dixon wrote: The term is used because most or all trees in the region where the English language originated are shaped just like that: they have a single trunk which forks into branches which may themselves fork and so on. These branches do not connect back to one another. I believe the real issue here is one of being able to stretch your mind into seeing things from different points of view. This is the reason I brought in the quasi-mystical quote about the sphere whose center is everywhere. To see if you'd be able to go beyond your already rich knowledge and gain new benefit from another way of looking at it. (IMHO, it's important to be able to change POV's at will, it keeps you flexible and able to learn new ways of dealing with data by conversion.) In real life, the roots of a tree resemble it's branches buried underground, in an almost mirror image. A tree that terminates where the trunk meets the ground would fall. The only real tree resembling this, is one where logger's saw was applied. :) So we're already not discussing a real tree. The idealized mathematical definition of a tree doesn't quite a real tree any more than do B-Trees, B+/-Trees, nor red/black trees, or our debated friend, the internet. The Internet doesn't resemble a tree at all. It is characterized by many cross-connections, which form cycles. These are introduced deliberately by network engineers, because tree-like networks are unreliable. Of course. It's called redundancy and its goal is to eliminate as many single points of failure as possible. But from the point of view of one node talking to another, these aren't considered, I'll explain why. Firstly, don't confuse cycles with redundancy for high availability. These are two different things. Let's explain why we have multiple connections and what types of these you can expect. There are two common types of multiple connections: A) Two links to the same ISP: In terms of redundancy for the purposes of being fault tolerant, only one of the multiple links is ever used. With most ISP's, when you negotiate a contract for a backup connection, it's with the understanding that you'll only use it when the main one goes down. B) You have multiple connections to different ISP's (possibly with peering contracts, etc.) In this case when a node at your location tries to contact some other node on the internet, it's traffic doesn't go over ALL of your connections - it takes only a single path. [Ok, if your routers are correcting for an outage, then perhaps you'll see different paths being taken, but this is just the routing tables/routers settling or converging.] If both case A and case B, a single node in your location will see the entire internet as a tree with the root of that tree being the default gateway. (i.e. go back to doing traceroutes.) In the case of a multi-homed machine, or machine that participates in routing, it itself becomes the root of the tree. There are other cases but those are rare, and likely flawed. Now on to cycles and the whole reason for this debate: The whole point of many/most routing algorithms is to GET RID OF cycles. After you've done this, you're left with a tree. Loops/cycles are so anathema to the workings of tcp/ip, that one of the fields in IP packets has been added to help eliminate: the TTL. The only reason for a TTL value is to prevent packets that are going around in circles from congesting all the routers involved in the loop. (Only later did traceroute exploit this into helping provide you with a map of where your packets went.) This is why EIGRP, RIP, etc. use various mechanisms to explicitly prevent routing loops (and BGP to aggregate routes.) Routing loops are damage, they are by definition not desirable. At the data link layer (switches/hubs), this is why you want to use the Spanning Tree Protocol. Notice that name: Spanning *TREE* Protocol. After STP is done, you're left with a data link layer -TREE - not a cyclical graf. STP is even more important for LAN's than on the internet since there's no TTL on ethernet frames: a single broadcast, were it to be allowed to loop, could saturate your switches to the point of killing your LAN! What all this says to me is that a cycle is a circle, and that failover/ parallel links should be collapsed (and are by routing protocols) to a single link. Once you eliminate cycles, and you do so in real life, you go back to a tree. You only see the alternate paths used when failover or routing errors occur. Yes, I agree with you, if your POV is The Big Picture above from space, which includes all links, even the unused redundant ones, it's certainly not a tree. At the same time, I also disagree with you. If your POV is a single host, it sees the internet as a tree. In fact, one of the properties of trees is that you pick up any leaf node and designate it as the root. (Doesn't work too well on a B+Tree when you're
BBC: File-sharing to bypass censorship
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/technology/3611227.stm File-sharing to bypass censorship By Tracey Logan BBC Go Digital presenter The net could be humming with news, rather pop, swappers By the year 2010, file-sharers could be swapping news rather than music, eliminating censorship of any kind. This is the view of the man who helped kickstart the concept of peer-to-peer (P2P) file-sharing, Cambridge University's Professor Ross Anderson. In his vision, people around the world would post stories via anonymous P2P services like those used to swap songs. They would cover issues currently ignored by the major news services, said Prof Anderson. Currently, only news that's reckoned to be of interest to Americans and Western Europeans will be syndicated because that's where the money is, he told the BBC World Service programme, Go Digital. But if something happens in Peru that's of interest to viewers in China and Japan, it won't get anything like the priority for syndication. If you can break the grip of the news syndication services and allow the news collector to talk to the radio station or local newspaper then you can have much more efficient communications. 'Impossible to censor' To enable this, Prof Anderson proposes a new and improved version of Usenet, the internet news service. If there's material that everyone agrees is wicked, like child pornography, then it's possible to track it down and close it down Ross Anderson, Cambridge University But what of fears that the infrastructure that allows such ad hoc news networks to grow might also be abused by criminals and terrorists? Prof Anderson believes those fears are overstated. He argued that web watchdogs like the Internet Watch Foundation, which monitors internet-based child abuse, would provide the necessary policing functions. This would require a high level of international agreement to be effective. The effect of peer-to-peer networks will be to make censorship difficult, if not impossible, said Prof Anderson. If there's material that everyone agrees is wicked, like child pornography, then it's possible to track it down and close it down. But if there's material that only one government says is wicked then, I'm sorry, but that's their tough luck. Political obstacles Commenting on Prof Anderson's ideas, technology analyst Bill Thompson welcomed the idea of new publishing tools that will weaken the grip on news of major news organisations. Such P2P systems, he said, would give everybody a voice and allow personal testimonies to come out. But the technology that makes those publishing tools accessible to everyone and sufficiently user-friendly will take longer to develop than Prof Anderson thinks, added Mr Thompson. Prof Anderson's vision underestimates the political obstacles in the way of such developments, he said, and the question of censorship had not been clearly thought through. Once you build the technology to break censorship, you've broken censorship - even of the things you want censored, said Mr Thompson. Saying you can then control some parts of it, like images of child abuse, is being wilfully optimistic. And that's something that peer to peer advocates have to face. -- Eugen* Leitl a href=http://leitl.org;leitl/a __ ICBM: 48.07078, 11.61144http://www.leitl.org 8B29F6BE: 099D 78BA 2FD3 B014 B08A 7779 75B0 2443 8B29 F6BE http://moleculardevices.org http://nanomachines.net pgp0.pgp Description: PGP signature
Spy agency launches recruiting campaign
http://www.mercurynews.com/mld/mercurynews/8403065.htm?template=contentModules/printstory.jsp Posted on Sat, Apr. 10, 2004 Spy agency launches recruiting campaign Associated Press WASHINGTON - The highly secretive National Security Agency is looking to hire 7,500 workers over the next five years in the spy agency's largest recruiting campaign since the 1980s. A release posted on the agency's Web site said NSA plans to hire 1,500 workers by September, and another 1,500 in each of the next four years. Those with specialties in foreign languages, especially Arabic and Chinese, were encouraged to apply. NSA said it was boosting its staff to meet the increasing needs of the ever-changing intelligence community. The agency, an element of the Defense Department based at Fort Meade in Maryland, conducts electronic wiretapping and signals gathering for foreign intelligence purposes. NSA and other intelligence agencies came under scrutiny after the Sept. 11 terror attacks for apparent failures and missteps that critics say might have prevented officials from unraveling the hijacking plot. A joint congressional inquiry report released last summer faulted the intelligence agencies for being unprepared to handle the challenge it faced in translating the volumes of foreign language counterterror intelligence it collected. Law enforcement officials have said that among the millions of intercepts the NSA gathered on Sept. 10, 2001, were two Arabic-language messages that warned of a major event the next day. The Arabic messages were not translated until Sept. 12. ON THE NET National Security Agency: http://www.nsa.gov © 2004 AP Wire and wire service sources. All Rights Reserved. http://www.mercurynews.com -- - R. A. Hettinga mailto: [EMAIL PROTECTED] The Internet Bearer Underwriting Corporation http://www.ibuc.com/ 44 Farquhar Street, Boston, MA 02131 USA ... however it may deserve respect for its usefulness and antiquity, [predicting the end of the world] has not been found agreeable to experience. -- Edward Gibbon, 'Decline and Fall of the Roman Empire'
Re: VPN VoIP
On Saturday 2004 April 10 12:12, Eugen Leitl wrote: Should I stick with Linux (there's /dev/random and VPN support in current kernels for the C3 Padlock engine, right?) with SELinux or try OpenBSD for a firewall type machine with hardware crypto support? For a firewall, I'd recommend OpenBSD over just about anything else. Unless of course, there is hardware you need to use that isn't supported under OpenBSD. -- Shawn K. Quinn
Re: On Needing Killing
Justin writes: With all due respect to the principle of freedom of speech and all that, I think that cypherpunks, and people in general, give far too little respect to words, as if words are a vague, unimportant, and remote link in the chain of causation of acts or failure-to-acts. I don't see anything wrong with Orwell's view that words control the future's view of history. His certainly have. Words depend greatly on context. The meaning of words here on the Cypherpunks list, is different than their meaning in the New York Times. If someone said up the chimneys with the inner-city welfare mutants in the New York Times, there would be mass rioting in the streets. I find this with a lot of my stuff that gets taken from this list and posted in places that I would have written it much differently for, had those places been its original destination. So - what happened to Tim? Can I be the list's new Crusty Retired Engineer now? -- Eric Michael Cordian 0+ O:.T:.O:. Mathematical Munitions Division Do What Thou Wilt Shall Be The Whole Of The Law
Re: On Needing Killing
Eric Cordian wrote... Can I be the list's new Crusty Retired Engineer now? Why, did you retire recently? -TD From: Eric Cordian [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: On Needing Killing Date: Sun, 11 Apr 2004 12:58:50 -0700 (PDT) Justin writes: With all due respect to the principle of freedom of speech and all that, I think that cypherpunks, and people in general, give far too little respect to words, as if words are a vague, unimportant, and remote link in the chain of causation of acts or failure-to-acts. I don't see anything wrong with Orwell's view that words control the future's view of history. His certainly have. Words depend greatly on context. The meaning of words here on the Cypherpunks list, is different than their meaning in the New York Times. If someone said up the chimneys with the inner-city welfare mutants in the New York Times, there would be mass rioting in the streets. I find this with a lot of my stuff that gets taken from this list and posted in places that I would have written it much differently for, had those places been its original destination. So - what happened to Tim? Can I be the list's new Crusty Retired Engineer now? -- Eric Michael Cordian 0+ O:.T:.O:. Mathematical Munitions Division Do What Thou Wilt Shall Be The Whole Of The Law _ Get rid of annoying pop-up ads with the new MSN Toolbar FREE! http://toolbar.msn.com/go/onm00200414ave/direct/01/
Re: BBC: File-sharing to bypass censorship
Eugen Leitl pastes: File-sharing to bypass censorship By Tracey Logan BBC Go Digital presenter If there's material that everyone agrees is wicked, like child pornography, then it's possible to track it down and close it down Ross Anderson, Cambridge University I think the problem here is that material which John Ashcroft, Jerry Falwell, and Pat Robertson think is wicked, may not be what Ross Anderson or I think is wicked. After all, to some people Howard Stern is disgusting and obscene. To others, he is merely witty and slightly burlesque. Prof Anderson believes those fears are overstated. He argued that web watchdogs like the Internet Watch Foundation, which monitors internet-based child abuse, would provide the necessary policing functions. Well, it's good to know Professor Anderson values the opinion of an organization that won't even use the term child pornography to refer to the things that offend Ashcroft, Falwell, and Robertson, but demands everyone use terms like pictures of children being abused and child abuse pictures. As those who flog the Sex Abuse Agenda are well aware, 90% of successful propaganda is owning the vocabulary. I am reminded of the changing of the term statutory rape to child rape a few years ago, which I am sure we will all agree is a less than accurate description of a 20 year old who has consensual sex with a streetwise 17 year old crack whore. I think Hakin Bey's suggestion that plastering pictures of naked children everywhere is a great form of political theatre has merit. All the right wing crackpots will have to hide in their homes to avoid having strokes, and the well-balanced representatives of the Forces of Reason can finally live their lives in peace and quiet. Perhaps we can have Public Service Announcements by the Coalition for a Prude-Free AmeriKKKa. This is Timmy. This is TImmy's cock. This is Timmy's cock in Billy's mouth. Any questions? -- Eric Michael Cordian 0+ O:.T:.O:. Mathematical Munitions Division Do What Thou Wilt Shall Be The Whole Of The Law
Re: BBC: File-sharing to bypass censorship
Harmon Seaver (2004-04-11 20:05Z) wrote: This is insane -- on what basis, under what Constitutional authority, does the state get to decide that the christer marriage vows are sacred and legal, and a pagan or indig taking to wife isn't? This is one nation under God (the Christian God), or haven't you noticed? If the Christian Right thinks God doesn't like something, it's not Constitutionally protected. -- You took my gun. It's just your word against mine! Not necessarily. -Bernie vs Tom, Miller's Crossing
Re: BBC: File-sharing to bypass censorship
On Sun, Apr 11, 2004 at 12:41:03PM -0700, Eric Cordian wrote: As those who flog the Sex Abuse Agenda are well aware, 90% of successful propaganda is owning the vocabulary. I am reminded of the changing of the term statutory rape to child rape a few years ago, which I am sure we will all agree is a less than accurate description of a 20 year old who has consensual sex with a streetwise 17 year old crack whore. Or even his 17 year old virgin girlfriend. I really have a hard time understanding how we reached this point -- it wasn't even 100 years ago when girls of 17 were considered in danger of becoming old maids if they weren't married already. In fact, when I was growing up, the legal age for marriage in Mississippi was 12 for girls and 14 for boys, with parents permission. Without, it was 14 and 16. Many, many states had similar laws. And, in fact, back then at least one state, Maryland IIRC, had a statutory rape age of 8. So, while on the one hand, more young teens are having sex fairly openly, and at younger and younger ages, even in preteen, some as young as 10 from what I read in the press; the laws are becoming more and more repressive. And not just the law, also the prosecutors -- in Racine, WI a month or so ago it was announced that prosecutors had charged a girl and boy, both 15, with having sex with a child -- each other. WTF is going on? What else is this but religious oppression? Look, I can marry a girl (with parents okay) on her 16th birthday here in WI, but if I just have her come live with me, I could spend probably most of the rest of my life in prison. This is insane -- on what basis, under what Constitutional authority, does the state get to decide that the christer marriage vows are sacred and legal, and a pagan or indig taking to wife isn't? -- Harmon Seaver CyberShamanix http://www.cybershamanix.com Hoka hey!
Re: BBC: File-sharing to bypass censorship
Justin wrote: This is one nation under God (the Christian God), or haven't you noticed? If the Christian Right thinks God doesn't like something, it's not Constitutionally protected. Even worse, I've once heard a coworker explain to me why Bush doesn't give a rats ass about the environment: just like the impromptu pilots who learned how to fly, but not land, Bush and Crew believe that this world is theirs to do with as they wish, and that pollution isn't important - so what if thousands die of cancer, so long as they earn a place in their idea paradise. Yes, between the flat-earther's, witch burners, jihadists, and other nuts, religion certain has had a wonderful influence on humanity.
Re: On Needing Killing
At 12:58 PM -0700 4/11/04, Eric Cordian wrote: So - what happened to Tim? Can I be the list's new Crusty Retired Engineer now? Crusty retired pervert is more like it. ..and, no, I don't want to know what the crust is made of... :-/ Cheers, RAH -- - R. A. Hettinga mailto: [EMAIL PROTECTED] The Internet Bearer Underwriting Corporation http://www.ibuc.com/ 44 Farquhar Street, Boston, MA 02131 USA ... however it may deserve respect for its usefulness and antiquity, [predicting the end of the world] has not been found agreeable to experience. -- Edward Gibbon, 'Decline and Fall of the Roman Empire'
Altered phone cards?
Anybody heard of this before, or know how it's done? And Mr Tanaka has good reason to be wary. He and his three friends are illegally selling phone cards that have been altered so they can be re-used. http://english.aljazeera.net/NR/exeres/671844D1-95C9-4BEF-903C-155B2E948C59.htm -- Harmon Seaver CyberShamanix http://www.cybershamanix.com Hoka hey!
