Re: US soldiers in Iraq held against their will

2003-08-20 Thread Paul Hart
On Wednesday, August 20, 2003, at 09:09  AM, Harmon Seaver wrote:
It seems that the military is claiming that we are in a national
emergency and they can do whatever they want, despite laws to the 
contrary.

You are in a national emergency.

http://www.whitehouse.gov/news/releases/2001/09/20010914-5.html



Re: US soldiers in Iraq held against their will

2003-08-20 Thread Harmon Seaver
On Wed, Aug 20, 2003 at 10:01:38AM -0400, Tyler Durden wrote:
 Peter Thonen wrote..
 
 On that same note, any weekend warrior who complains about being activated 
 has
 no sympathy from me.
  Take the devils coin, be prepared to do his work also.
 
 Well, what if the Devil stole that $ from you in the first place? What 
 level of subversion is appropriate in order to re-appropriate those $$$? 
 This case is clearly different from the true blue career war criminal, ehr 
 I mean career soldier. Here, these people have likely been paying taxes for 
 a while! So I don't mind too much if they're trying to dodge their 
 commitment in this context.
 

 I think also a great many of the young guys joined the National Guard in a
patriotic fervor right after 9/11, but by the time the crusade against Iraq got
started, quite a few had become well aware that Iraq had nothing to do with
9/11, that the invasion was all about oil, etc, and weren't willing to go. 
It seems that the military is claiming that we are in a national
emergency and they can do whatever they want, despite laws to the contrary.


-- 
Harmon Seaver   
CyberShamanix
http://www.cybershamanix.com



Re: US soldiers in Iraq held against their will

2003-08-20 Thread Tyler Durden
Peter Thonen wrote..

On that same note, any weekend warrior who complains about being activated 
has
no sympathy from me.
 Take the devils coin, be prepared to do his work also.

Well, what if the Devil stole that $ from you in the first place? What level 
of subversion is appropriate in order to re-appropriate those $$$? This case 
is clearly different from the true blue career war criminal, ehr I mean 
career soldier. Here, these people have likely been paying taxes for a 
while! So I don't mind too much if they're trying to dodge their commitment 
in this context.

-TD






From: Thoenen, Peter CIV Sprint  
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: Harmon Seaver [EMAIL PROTECTED]
CC: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: US soldiers in Iraq held against their will
Date: Mon, 18 Aug 2003 16:52:25 +0200

Harmon Seaver wrote:

  On Sun, Aug 17, 2003 at 10:37:15PM -0700, Major Variola (ret) wrote:
 
 At 02:33 PM 8/17/03 -0500, Harmon Seaver wrote:
 
   Just heard about this local guy who reluctantly went to Iraq because
 
 he was in the reserves, now his contract is up (as of 7/31) and they
 won't let him out.
 
 Did he reluctantly take the $$$ to be in the reserves, too?
 
 
 my
 enlistment contract ended and the I have been involuntarily extended.
 
 SOP.  Happened during the Yugo thang too.
On a semi related side note, how long has this guy been in (total length of
service)?  All personnel
when they join the US Military are quite clearly informed they have an 
8-year
commitment, regardless
of how long their initial enlistment is.  If your initial commitment is 
less
than 8 years, you are
moved into the Inactive Ready Reserve (IRR) for the remainder of the 8 
years.
(E.g. you enlist for 4
years active or ready reserve (weekend warriors); you will also spend 4 
years
in IRR).

While in the IRR you have no requirements other than to keep the government
informed of your current
contact information.  You have no drills and receive no benefits.  The US
Government though reserves
the right to call you up at whim any time during this period.  I am curious 
if
this person is still
within his 8-year commitment even though he completed his initial 
commitment.
If he is still within
this 8 year window, he doesnt have a leg to stand on nor my sympathy.

On that same note, any weekend warrior who complains about being activated 
has
no sympathy from me.
  Take the devils coin, be prepared to do his work also.  The few folk 
that
have my sympathy are
those IRR folk that have be activated.  I have a couple IRR buddies who
haven't so much as thought
about the military in years all of a sudden get activated for Iraq, now 
thats
something to complain
about.  4 years active, 3 years smoking dope in college, then a call from 
the
good old us army
ordering you to report to your IRR unit within 48 hours and go to Iraq.  
Those
are the folk I feel
sorry for.  They did their time, got out, and didn't continue to take the
devils coin ever 4th weekend.

 
 It hasn't, it only requires males to register.  So far.
 
 
How is that for some equally rights.  Women continue to whine and cry that
they are being
discriminated against in the military as the military refused to open up
certain all male MOS's (18
and 11 series to name a couple) yet I don't see them hounding congress for 
the
equal right to be
drafted.  Nothing like having your cake and getting to eat it to.

** OFFTOPIC: Anybody remember the exact saying (and who coined it) about if
you take the Devil's
coin, don't complain about doing the Devil's work.  I can not seem to find 
the
exact text **

-Peter

DISCLAIMER: Like always, this email is the personal opinion of Peter 
Thoenen
and not condoned by
Sprint or the US Army.

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Re: US soldiers in Iraq held against their will

2003-08-20 Thread Tyler Durden
Peter Thoenen wrote...

That is the same logic I use to justify to myself working as a defense 
contractor.  The amount uncle sam will pay me in my lifetime is greater than 
or equal to the amount I will ever actually pay him in taxes.  I win in the 
long run :) 

Just make sure those bombs you're building don't actually work! Otherwise, 
keep on bleeding the beast...

-TD





From: Thoenen, Peter CIV Sprint 
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: Tyler Durden [EMAIL PROTECTED]
CC: [EMAIL PROTECTED],  [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: US soldiers in Iraq held against their will
Date: Wed, 20 Aug 2003 19:20:15 +0200

Tyler Durden wrote:

Peter Thonen wrote..

On that same note, any weekend warrior who complains about being 
activated has
no sympathy from me.
 Take the devils coin, be prepared to do his work also.

Well, what if the Devil stole that $ from you in the first place? What 
level of subversion is appropriate in order to re-appropriate those $$$?

-TD

That is the same logic I use to justify to myself working as a defense 
contractor.  The amount uncle sam will pay me in my lifetime is greater 
than or equal to the amount I will ever actually pay him in taxes.  I win 
in the long run :)

-Peter
 attach3 
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