Re: [PracticalSecurity] Anonymity - great technology but hardly used

2005-10-28 Thread Eugen Leitl
On Thu, Oct 27, 2005 at 11:28:42PM -0400, R.A. Hettinga wrote: The cypherpunks list is about anything we want it to be. At this stage in the lifecycle (post-nuclear-armageddon-weeds-in-the-rubble), it's more about the crazy bastards who are still here than it is about just about anything

Re: [PracticalSecurity] Anonymity - great technology but hardly used

2005-10-28 Thread cyphrpunk
On 10/26/05, Shawn K. Quinn [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Tue, 2005-10-25 at 23:40 -0500, Travis H. wrote: Many of the anonymity protocols require multiple participants, and thus are subject to what economists call network externalities. The best example I can think of is Microsoft Office

Re: [PracticalSecurity] Anonymity - great technology but hardly used

2005-10-28 Thread Shawn K. Quinn
On Thu, 2005-10-27 at 23:28 -0400, R.A. Hettinga wrote: RAH Who thinks anything Microsoft makes these days is, by definition, a security risk. Indeed, the amount of trust I'm willing to place in a piece of software is quite related to how much of its source code is available for review.

Re: [PracticalSecurity] Anonymity - great technology but hardly used

2005-10-28 Thread R.A. Hettinga
At 8:18 PM -0700 10/27/05, cyphrpunk wrote: Keep the focus on anonymity. That's what the cypherpunks list is about. Please. The cypherpunks list is about anything we want it to be. At this stage in the lifecycle (post-nuclear-armageddon-weeds-in-the-rubble), it's more about the crazy bastards

Re: [PracticalSecurity] Anonymity - great technology but hardly used

2005-10-28 Thread R.A. Hettinga
At 12:23 PM -0700 10/27/05, Major Variola (ret) wrote: Why don't you send her comma-delimited text, Excel can import it? But, but... You can't put Visual *BASIC* in comma delimited text... ;-) Cheers, RAH Yet another virus vector. Bah! :-) -- - R. A. Hettinga mailto: [EMAIL

Re: [PracticalSecurity] Anonymity - great technology but hardly used

2005-10-28 Thread cyphrpunk
The cypherpunks list is about anything we want it to be. At this stage in the lifecycle (post-nuclear-armageddon-weeds-in-the-rubble), it's more about the crazy bastards who are still here than it is about just about anything else. Fine, I want it to be about crypto and anonymity. You can

Re: [PracticalSecurity] Anonymity - great technology but hardly used

2005-10-28 Thread John Kelsey
From: Eugen Leitl [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Oct 27, 2005 3:22 AM To: Shawn K. Quinn [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [PracticalSecurity] Anonymity - great technology but hardly used .. It's never about merit, and not even money, but about predeployed base and interoperability

Re: [PracticalSecurity] Anonymity - great technology but hardly used

2005-10-28 Thread R.A. Hettinga
At 8:41 PM -0700 10/27/05, cyphrpunk wrote: Where else are you going to talk about this shit? Talk about it here, of course. Just don't expect anyone to listen to you when you play list-mommie. Cheers, RAH -- - R. A. Hettinga mailto: [EMAIL PROTECTED] The Internet Bearer

Re: [PracticalSecurity] Anonymity - great technology but hardly used

2005-10-28 Thread Shawn K. Quinn
On Thu, 2005-10-27 at 20:18 -0700, cyphrpunk wrote: This is off-topic. Let's not degenerate into random Microsoft bashing. Keep the focus on anonymity. That's what the cypherpunks list is about. Sorry, but I have to disagree. I highly doubt that Microsoft is interested in helping users of

Re: [PracticalSecurity] Anonymity - great technology but hardly used

2005-10-27 Thread Ben Laurie
Travis H. wrote: Part of the problem is using a packet-switched network; if we had circuit-based, then thwarting traffic analysis is easy; you just fill the link with random garbage when not transmitting packets. I considered doing this with SLIP back before broadband (back when my friend

Re: [PracticalSecurity] Anonymity - great technology but hardly used

2005-10-27 Thread Shawn K. Quinn
On Tue, 2005-10-25 at 23:40 -0500, Travis H. wrote: Many of the anonymity protocols require multiple participants, and thus are subject to what economists call network externalities. The best example I can think of is Microsoft Office file formats. I don't buy MS Office because it's the best

Re: [PracticalSecurity] Anonymity - great technology but hardly used

2005-10-27 Thread Eugen Leitl
On Wed, Oct 26, 2005 at 08:41:48PM -0500, Shawn K. Quinn wrote: 1) You have told your HR person what a bad idea it is to introduce a dependency on a proprietary file format, right? Telling is useless. Are you in a sufficient position of power to make them stop using it? I doubt it, because

Re: [PracticalSecurity] Anonymity - great technology but hardly used

2005-10-27 Thread Major Variola (ret)
At 08:41 PM 10/26/05 -0500, Shawn K. Quinn wrote: On Tue, 2005-10-25 at 23:40 -0500, Travis H. wrote: Many of the anonymity protocols require multiple participants, and thus are subject to what economists call network externalities. The best example I can think of is Microsoft Office file

Re: [PracticalSecurity] Anonymity - great technology but hardly used

2005-10-26 Thread Stephan Neuhaus
cyphrpunk wrote: The main threat to this illegal but widely practiced activity is legal action by copyright holders against individual traders. The only effective protection against these threats is the barrier that could be provided by anonymity. An effective, anonymous file sharing network

Re: [PracticalSecurity] Anonymity - great technology but hardly used

2005-10-26 Thread Travis H.
Part of the problem is using a packet-switched network; if we had circuit-based, then thwarting traffic analysis is easy; you just fill the link with random garbage when not transmitting packets. I considered doing this with SLIP back before broadband (back when my friend was my ISP). There are

Re: [PracticalSecurity] Anonymity - great technology but hardly used

2005-10-26 Thread J
--- Travis H. [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: [snip] Another issue involves the ease of use when switching between a [slower] anonymous service and a fast non-anonymous service. I have a tool called metaprox on my website (see URL in sig) that allows you to choose what proxies you use on a

Re: [PracticalSecurity] Anonymity - great technology but hardly used

2005-10-26 Thread Justin
On 2005-10-26T08:21:08+0200, Stephan Neuhaus wrote: cyphrpunk wrote: The main threat to this illegal but widely practiced activity is legal action by copyright holders against individual traders. The only effective protection against these threats is the barrier that could be provided

Re: [PracticalSecurity] Anonymity - great technology but hardly used

2005-10-26 Thread Alexander Klimov
On Wed, 26 Oct 2005, JЖrn Schmidt wrote: --- Travis H. [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: [snip] Another issue involves the ease of use when switching between a [slower] anonymous service and a fast non-anonymous service. I have a tool called metaprox on my website (see URL in sig) that allows

Re: [PracticalSecurity] Anonymity - great technology but hardly used

2005-10-26 Thread Hagai Bar-El
Hello, At 25/10/05 07:18, cyphrpunk wrote: http://www.hbarel.com/Blog/entry0006.html I believe that for anonymity and pseudonymity technologies to survive they have to be applied to applications that require them by design, rather than to mass-market applications that can also do

Re: [PracticalSecurity] Anonymity - great technology but hardly used

2005-10-25 Thread cyphrpunk
http://www.hbarel.com/Blog/entry0006.html I believe that for anonymity and pseudonymity technologies to survive they have to be applied to applications that require them by design, rather than to mass-market applications that can also do (cheaper) without. If anonymity mechanisms are