Re: Please restore pages you deleted unilaterally

[Jonathan Dowland]

Hi Thomas,

On Sat Nov 29, 2025 at 4:34 PM GMT, Thomas Lange wrote:

at the end of September I've proposed the transparent solution to use
chronicles.debian.org for the old pages, so there will be no change for
the user beacause the old URLs will still work.
But unfortunately neither you nor Jonathan had implemented this until
now. Jonathan said on Nov 2nd that he would work on Debian things
soon, but nothing had happended so far.


To be clear, I have begun work to support the removal of news from 2022. 
The first step is to get that content built and added to the Chronicles 
site, after which, I would work on the HTTP redirects.


I have hit some problems in generating the site content: The Chronicles 
site is forked from the main website source.  My next intended step was 
to reach out to you/your team for advice on getting past the problems I 
have hit, and to understand what kind of fixes or improvements you would 
accept to the webwml repository (the problems I am hitting are all from 
that repository). For the delta for a recent rebuild (of exactly the 
same content as the last time I built it) has newly missing translations
and lots of timestamp changes (build time) which I would like to not 
have. Were it welcome, I'd also like to move further away from recursive 
makefiles, so Make's dependency tracking could be more useful, and 
there'd be fewer serialisation/blocker points for parallel building.


I have not begun to work on supporting the removal of Release team 
content, because it was abundantly clear (to me) that Cyril did not want 
that content removed anyway, and until a resolution was found there, I 
didn't feel it was appropriate to be involved.



--

👱🏻  Jonathan Dowland
✎j...@debian.org
🔗   https://jmtd.net

Re: Please restore pages you deleted unilaterally

[Holger Wansing]

Hello,

Am 29. November 2025 17:34:34 MEZ schrieb Thomas Lange :
>Hi Cyril, hi all
>
>at the end of September I've proposed the transparent solution to use
>chronicles.debian.org for the old pages, so there will be no change for
>the user beacause the old URLs will still work.
>But unfortunately neither you nor Jonathan had implemented this until
>now. Jonathan said on Nov 2nd that he would work on Debian things
>soon, but nothing had happended so far.

If that is the plan, why not wait until Jonathan has finished his work, or at 
least is prepared to start?
Just remove the pages and hope/wait that others catch the ball afterwards 
doesn't look as the best solution.


Holger



-- 
Sent from /e/ OS on Fairphone3

Re: Please restore pages you deleted unilaterally

[Cyril Brulebois]

Thomas Lange  (2025-11-29):
> at the end of September I've proposed the transparent solution to use
> chronicles.debian.org for the old pages, so there will be no change for
> the user beacause the old URLs will still work.

At the end of September you engaged in some kind of ultimatum through
private mails instead of reaching out to an actual team, putting
pressure on individuals, which is not OK, and which you've been called
out on. That wasn't brought up on public lists afterwards.

You've been asked at that time, again, not to remove anything. And yet,
you removed contents anyway.

> But unfortunately neither you nor Jonathan had implemented this until
> now. Jonathan said on Nov 2nd that he would work on Debian things
> soon, but nothing had happended so far.

And even if something had been done on the chronicles side, removing
things would definitely not be OK either:

For now this is an early stages, experimental service! Please do not
rely on it just yet.

> The web team wants to get rid of old news, and there's a solution to
> keep those pages online, so please consider cooperating with us.

I'm not sure who “the web team” is. As someone who's been contributing
to the website for a number of years, I thought I was also part of it.
And I certainly do not wish *useful* contents to be removed! Quite the
opposite.

Please consider listening to other people, and accepting no as an
answer.


Cheers,
-- 
Cyril Brulebois (k...@debian.org)
D-I release manager -- Release team member -- Freelance Consultant


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Re: Please restore pages you deleted unilaterally

[Thomas Lange]

Hi Cyril, hi all

at the end of September I've proposed the transparent solution to use
chronicles.debian.org for the old pages, so there will be no change for
the user beacause the old URLs will still work.
But unfortunately neither you nor Jonathan had implemented this until
now. Jonathan said on Nov 2nd that he would work on Debian things
soon, but nothing had happended so far.

The web team wants to get rid of old news, and there's a solution to
keep those pages online, so please consider cooperating with us.

-- 
best regards Thomas

Re: Please restore pages you deleted unilaterally

[Holger Wansing]

Hi all,

Cyril Brulebois  wrote (Sat, 29 Nov 2025 13:04:45 +0100):
> 
> You went ahead and deleted a lot of debian-installer pages despite being
> asked not to. This makes absolutely no sense to me. Please restore those
> pages and stop your history deletion campaign.

I have expressed my unhappiness with these campaigns in the past already.
And in this case, Cyril is referring to the ../devel/debian-installer/ part
of the website, for which my understanding is, that this was under the
responsibility of the installer team in the past.

So, how to proceed here in the future?


Holger



-- 
Holger Wansing 
PGP-Fingerprint: 496A C6E8 1442 4B34 8508  3529 59F1 87CA 156E B076