Bug#493778: Insanely long package description for texlive-latex-extra
On Sb, 14 iun 14, 13:32:28, Beatrice Torracca wrote: I'd like to bring this subject to some attention again because I think the problem still stands. There are 2 (apparently, at the moment) conflicting issues: - package descriptions (all the texlive-* ones) are a nightmare to translate right now - from the user p-o-v it's very important to have a list of the CTAN packages included (possibly with a brief description). ... What about splitting the list in separate paragraphs, i.e. making each entry a new paragraph. DDTP works on a paragraph basis; that way we would have all not-changed entries already translated and we'll only have to add/translate/update the changed entries. Something like (an example from the beginning of texlive-lang-french, the first on hand): Description-en: TeX Live: French Support for French and Basque. . This package includes the following CTAN packages: . aeguill -- Add several kinds of guillemets to the ae fonts. . apprends-latex -- Apprends LaTeX! . babel-basque -- . babel-french -- Babel contributed support for French. . basque-book -- Class for book-type documents written in Basque ... This issue is not texlive specific, so I'd rather suggest the DDTP to treat formated list items the same as paragraphs. Then all packages using this will benefit from the solution, possibly after a one-time adjusting of the list. Unfortunately I can't help with patches to DDTP :( Kind regards, Andrei -- http://wiki.debian.org/FAQsFromDebianUser Offtopic discussions among Debian users and developers: http://lists.alioth.debian.org/mailman/listinfo/d-community-offtopic http://nuvreauspam.ro/gpg-transition.txt signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Bug#493778: Insanely long package description for texlive-latex-extra
On Sun, 29 Jun 2014, Andrei POPESCU wrote: This issue is not texlive specific, so I'd rather suggest the DDTP to treat formated list items the same as paragraphs. Then all packages using this will benefit from the solution, possibly after a one-time adjusting of the list. I agree, but for now I have adopted the method of separate paragraphs. Norbert PREINING, Norbert http://www.preining.info JAIST, Japan TeX Live Debian Developer GPG: 0x860CDC13 fp: F7D8 A928 26E3 16A1 9FA0 ACF0 6CAC A448 860C DC13 -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-bugs-dist-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org
Bug#493778: Insanely long package description for texlive-latex-extra
Hi, Norbert Preining prein...@logic.at wrote: Hi Beatrice, hi Joe, On Sun, 15 Jun 2014, Joe Dalton wrote: I have to agree on this one. perhaps a compromise could be reach, so at least lines with the same letter (a, b, c etc.) could be in one section. Hmm, as far as I understand Beatrice's explanations, this wouldn't help a lot, since still each paragraph would change with high probability, creating the need to re-translate it. I somehow like the idea of one package per paragraph, but I am scared that I will bombarded with bug reports and complains about the strange format for the description... I don't know what is the best - besides simply *not* translating this part of the description, but I guess this is not an option. What about simply listing the package names, without their description ... Like this one: --- This package includes the following CTAN packages: AkkTeX, ESIEEcv, HA-prosper, Tabbing, a0poster, --- ... You could add the description somewhere else, lets say in a file in the package and give a hint to that file in the package description. Or at http://www.tug.org/texlive/ and add that URL to the package description. Holger -- Created with Sylpheed 3.2.0 under the new D E B I A N L I N U X 7 . 0 W H E E Z Y ! Registered Linux User #311290 - https://linuxcounter.net/ -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-bugs-dist-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org
Bug#493778: Insanely long package description for texlive-latex-extra
On Mon, 16 Jun 2014, Holger Wansing wrote: What about simply listing the package names, without their description ... Not good - apt-cache search foobar would not help here. That *is* a very useful feature to search for particular CTAN packages without having to know the title. Norbert PREINING, Norbert http://www.preining.info JAIST, Japan TeX Live Debian Developer GPG: 0x860CDC13 fp: F7D8 A928 26E3 16A1 9FA0 ACF0 6CAC A448 860C DC13 -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-bugs-dist-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org
Bug#493778: Insanely long package description for texlive-latex-extra
I have to agree on this one. perhaps a compromise could be reach, so at least lines with the same letter (a, b, c etc.) could be in one section. aeguill -- Add several kinds of guillemets to the ae fonts. apprends-latex -- Apprends LaTeX! . babel-basque -- Den lør 14/6/14 skrev Beatrice Torracca beatri...@libero.it: Emne: Re: Bug#493778: Insanely long package description for texlive-latex-extra Til: debian-i...@lists.debian.org Cc: 493...@bugs.debian.org Dato: lørdag 14. juni 2014 13.32 On Wednesday 13 April 2011, at 23:18 +0200, Frank Küster wrote: Davide Prina davide.pr...@gmail.com wrote: On 07/04/2011 01:59, Norbert Preining wrote: On Mi, 06 Apr 2011, Christian PERRIER wrote: Moreover, the nature of the list makes it constantly changing...or never up-to-date...which gives the same result : it is impossible to translate in the DDTP. But it is the list of packages included, and as Hauke said, the main aim is to allow people to easily search for a CTAN packages. Hi all! I'd like to bring this subject to some attention again because I think the problem still stands. There are 2 (apparently, at the moment) conflicting issues: - package descriptions (all the texlive-* ones) are a nightmare to translate right now - from the user p-o-v it's very important to have a list of the CTAN packages included (possibly with a brief description). a partially solution can be to include only the CTAN packages names and not the description (add a paragraph with: a detailed description can be found in the...). I think this might be something that can be implemented. Christian's suggestion (frozen base list) is much harder, since the list is generated, and we would have to copy the frozen list somewhere and check the source for generating new entries against that list. What about splitting the list in separate paragraphs, i.e. making each entry a new paragraph. DDTP works on a paragraph basis; that way we would have all not-changed entries already translated and we'll only have to add/translate/update the changed entries. Something like (an example from the beginning of texlive-lang-french, the first on hand): Description-en: TeX Live: French Support for French and Basque. . This package includes the following CTAN packages: . aeguill -- Add several kinds of guillemets to the ae fonts. . apprends-latex -- Apprends LaTeX! . babel-basque -- . babel-french -- Babel contributed support for French. . basque-book -- Class for book-type documents written in Basque ... Yes, the list will become even longer, but frankly I think the descriptions are in most cases so long right now that it won't be a big problem. The user will still have the complete list of packages with descriptions; us translators will have a much easier life translating the package descriptions. I do understand that the first goal of descriptions is not to make translators' life easier :) , but maybe this way that goal could be achieved without harming the need of the users which of course comes first. What do you think? Thanks, beatrice -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-bugs-dist-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org
Bug#493778: Insanely long package description for texlive-latex-extra
Hi Beatrice, hi Joe, On Sun, 15 Jun 2014, Joe Dalton wrote: I have to agree on this one. perhaps a compromise could be reach, so at least lines with the same letter (a, b, c etc.) could be in one section. Hmm, as far as I understand Beatrice's explanations, this wouldn't help a lot, since still each paragraph would change with high probability, creating the need to re-translate it. I somehow like the idea of one package per paragraph, but I am scared that I will bombarded with bug reports and complains about the strange format for the description... I don't know what is the best - besides simply *not* translating this part of the description, but I guess this is not an option. All the best Norbert PREINING, Norbert http://www.preining.info JAIST, Japan TeX Live Debian Developer GPG: 0x860CDC13 fp: F7D8 A928 26E3 16A1 9FA0 ACF0 6CAC A448 860C DC13 -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-bugs-dist-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org
Bug#493778: Insanely long package description for texlive-latex-extra
On Wednesday 13 April 2011, at 23:18 +0200, Frank Küster wrote: Davide Prina davide.pr...@gmail.com wrote: On 07/04/2011 01:59, Norbert Preining wrote: On Mi, 06 Apr 2011, Christian PERRIER wrote: Moreover, the nature of the list makes it constantly changing...or never up-to-date...which gives the same result : it is impossible to translate in the DDTP. But it is the list of packages included, and as Hauke said, the main aim is to allow people to easily search for a CTAN packages. Hi all! I'd like to bring this subject to some attention again because I think the problem still stands. There are 2 (apparently, at the moment) conflicting issues: - package descriptions (all the texlive-* ones) are a nightmare to translate right now - from the user p-o-v it's very important to have a list of the CTAN packages included (possibly with a brief description). a partially solution can be to include only the CTAN packages names and not the description (add a paragraph with: a detailed description can be found in the...). I think this might be something that can be implemented. Christian's suggestion (frozen base list) is much harder, since the list is generated, and we would have to copy the frozen list somewhere and check the source for generating new entries against that list. What about splitting the list in separate paragraphs, i.e. making each entry a new paragraph. DDTP works on a paragraph basis; that way we would have all not-changed entries already translated and we'll only have to add/translate/update the changed entries. Something like (an example from the beginning of texlive-lang-french, the first on hand): Description-en: TeX Live: French Support for French and Basque. . This package includes the following CTAN packages: . aeguill -- Add several kinds of guillemets to the ae fonts. . apprends-latex -- Apprends LaTeX! . babel-basque -- . babel-french -- Babel contributed support for French. . basque-book -- Class for book-type documents written in Basque ... Yes, the list will become even longer, but frankly I think the descriptions are in most cases so long right now that it won't be a big problem. The user will still have the complete list of packages with descriptions; us translators will have a much easier life translating the package descriptions. I do understand that the first goal of descriptions is not to make translators' life easier :) , but maybe this way that goal could be achieved without harming the need of the users which of course comes first. What do you think? Thanks, beatrice signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Bug#493778: Insanely long package description for texlive-latex-extra
Davide Prina davide.pr...@gmail.com wrote: On 07/04/2011 01:59, Norbert Preining wrote: On Mi, 06 Apr 2011, Christian PERRIER wrote: Moreover, the nature of the list makes it constantly changing...or never up-to-date...which gives the same result : it is impossible to translate in the DDTP. But it is the list of packages included, and as Hauke said, the main aim is to allow people to easily search for a CTAN packages. a partially solution can be to include only the CTAN packages names and not the description (add a paragraph with: a detailed description can be found in the...). I think this might be something that can be implemented. Christian's suggestion (frozen base list) is much harder, since the list is generated, and we would have to copy the frozen list somewhere and check the source for generating new entries against that list. Regards, Frank -- Dr. Frank Küster VCD Miltenberg, ADFC Aschaffenburg-Miltenberg B90/Grüne KV Miltenberg Debian Developer (TeXLive) -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-bugs-dist-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org
Bug#493778: Insanely long package description for texlive-latex-extra
Quoting Norbert Preining (prein...@logic.at): On Mi, 06 Apr 2011, Christian PERRIER wrote: Moreover, the nature of the list makes it constantly changing...or never up-to-date...which gives the same result : it is impossible to translate in the DDTP. But it is the list of packages included, and as Hauke said, the main aim is to allow people to easily search for a CTAN packages. Hello Norbert, thanks for your quick answer. Sure. That's an argument. Please forgive the insanely word. I was a little bit annoyed yesterday after spending about 30 minutes proofreading the still partial French translation we have in the DDTP (we reached letter e). I was also influenced by the lack of comments in the bug report (which was surprising to me as I know the good level of maintenance that you put in LaTeX packages). Your fast answer shows me that you probably just missed the bug report, which I understand, given the probably high number of BR received by LaTeX packages. Anywaywe now have this discussion, which is good. Please move that crazy list to README.Debian and give a decent description to the package. What do you consider decent? I consider useful as decent. Sure, things are tricky. And I understand the usefulness of keeping the list in the description. Could we settle for a kind of compromise: the current list becomes frozen. In case a new component is added to the package, it does in an extra list (indeed a new paragraph in the package description in debian/control). At the minimum, this would preserve the work already done by translators (for instance the Italian team)and give a guarantee that a small update (which I assume to be potentially frequent) will not fuzzy current work. Splitting the list would be nice, but that would need an update for existing work and the DDT* is not well suited for this. signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Bug#493778: Insanely long package description for texlive-latex-extra
On 07/04/2011 01:59, Norbert Preining wrote: On Mi, 06 Apr 2011, Christian PERRIER wrote: Moreover, the nature of the list makes it constantly changing...or never up-to-date...which gives the same result : it is impossible to translate in the DDTP. But it is the list of packages included, and as Hauke said, the main aim is to allow people to easily search for a CTAN packages. a partially solution can be to include only the CTAN packages names and not the description (add a paragraph with: a detailed description can be found in the...). Something like this: The following CTAN packages are included: . CTAN1, CTAN2, CTAN3, ..., CTANn. . a detailed description can be found in the /.../README and at http://ctan.debian.org/more.html In that way the package description can be translated very easy and a user can find the package that include the CTAN he are searching for. Ciao Davide -- Dizionari: http://linguistico.sourceforge.net/wiki Elenco di software libero: http://tinyurl.com/eddgj GNU/Linux User: 302090: http://counter.li.org Non autorizzo la memorizzazione del mio indirizzo su outlook -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-bugs-dist-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org
Bug#493778: Insanely long package description for texlive-latex-extra
I agree with Holger Wansing, who reported this bug about 3 years ago. This package has a way too long description. Moreover, the nature of the list makes it constantly changing...or never up-to-date...which gives the same result : it is impossible to translate in the DDTP. Please move that crazy list to README.Debian and give a decent description to the package. -- signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Bug#493778: Insanely long package description for texlive-latex-extra
On Wed, Apr 06, 2011 at 10:24:00PM +0200, Christian PERRIER wrote: I agree with Holger Wansing, who reported this bug about 3 years ago. This package has a way too long description. Moreover, the nature of the list makes it constantly changing...or never up-to-date...which gives the same result : it is impossible to translate in the DDTP. I have to at least partly disagree here. Having the actual CTAN package names in the description of a collection package makes searching for them possible in a sane way: apt-cache search $whatever-i-am-missing Of course, there is apt-file but this is a way worse interface considering how files are often named. I do agree about the very long description, though. A better solution would be nice. Hauke -- .''`. Jan Hauke Rahm j...@debian.org www.jhr-online.de : :' : Debian Developer www.debian.org `. `'` Member of the Linux Foundationwww.linux.com `- Fellow of the Free Software Foundation Europe www.fsfe.org signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Bug#493778: Insanely long package description for texlive-latex-extra
On Mi, 06 Apr 2011, Christian PERRIER wrote:
Moreover, the nature of the list makes it constantly changing...or
never up-to-date...which gives the same result : it is impossible to
translate in the DDTP.
But it is the list of packages included, and as Hauke said, the main
aim is to allow people to easily search for a CTAN packages.
Often people will get the hint: Install the LaTeX package foobar.
Now, how to find out where it is contained? Now it is an easy apt-cache
call. Otherwise there is no way.
Please move that crazy list to README.Debian and give a decent
description to the package.
What do you consider decent?
I consider useful as decent.
Best wishes
Norbert
Norbert Preiningpreining@{jaist.ac.jp, logic.at, debian.org}
JAIST, Japan TeX Live Debian Developer
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