On Fri, Aug 28, 2015 at 10:06:17AM +0200, Vincent Bernat wrote:
> ❦ 28 août 2015 08:22 +0100, Philip Hands :
>
> >>> Or alternatively, by packaging the minifier that is being used with the
> >>> package
> >>> that needs it. Yes, that's a horrible idea with lots of code
> >>> duplication, but
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❦ 28 août 2015 17:37 +0100, Steve McIntyre :
>>The problem is that this *is* usable for nearly all the people who
>>currently use it, who just run one command to install it and have all
>>those dependencies pulled from a remote repo for them. Because the
>>dependency installation process is so
On Fri, Aug 28, 2015 at 04:33:04PM +0100, Steve McIntyre wrote:
> Hi folks,
>
>
> (Non-free) Firmware in Debian
> =
>
> Background
> --
>
> Our users are finding problems with current common hardware - much of
> it depends on loadable firmware. Much (most?) o
On Fri, Aug 28, 2015 at 4:12 PM, Jean-Michel Vourgère
wrote:
Vincent Bernat wrote:
> > (...)
> > It has already been said numerous time in the past, for some Javascript
> > code, we don't really have the tools in Debian to easily go from the
> > source to the minified version. It's possible, but
On Fri, Aug 28, 2015 at 4:12 PM, Jean-Michel Vourgère
wrote:
Vincent Bernat wrote:
> > (...)
> > It has already been said numerous time in the past, for some Javascript
> > code, we don't really have the tools in Debian to easily go from the
> > source to the minified version. It's possible, but
2015-08-28 6:03 GMT+02:00 Michael Meskes :
> > Having just read this entire thread, and been affected by this once, it
> > occurs to me that the likely answer has been offered, but I suspect you
> > may have thought Matthias' reference to “GNOME Software” to be a generic
> > answer (apologies if I
Steve McIntyre writes:
> Depressingly, it seems a lot of the same web typists don't have any
> problems with doing the equivalent of "curl http://some.site/install.sh
> | sudo bash" . That doesn't mean we have to do the same in Debian. If
> there's no sensible way to do controlled web development
Russ Allbery wrote:
>Neil Williams writes:
>
>> Usable software needs usable tools.
>
>The problem is that this *is* usable for nearly all the people who
>currently use it, who just run one command to install it and have all
>those dependencies pulled from a remote repo for them. Because the
>dep
Neil Williams writes:
> I still find it hard to believe that *so* much code is required to
> minify JS. The excuse that JS is "moving fast" is nonsense. The reality
> would appear to be that nobody actually *cares* about the mess, they
> just use it.
This is almost certainly correct.
> Usable s
Hi folks,
As promised, here's a quick summary of what was discussed at the
Firmware discussion session in Heidelberg. This was not recorded on
video, so I can't provide a link for that.
I've taken a copy of the Gobby notes too [1], and the nice folks at
LWN even included a write-up in this week's
On 28.08.2015 08:10, Geert Stappers wrote:
> On Fri, Aug 28, 2015 at 06:14:05AM +0200, Michael Meskes wrote:
>>> Is this enough to go on to move this to a report against gnome-software?
>>
>> Bug reported btw.
>
> Where? ( "Where to follow the bugreport?" )
#797135
Seems you were faster than th
Vincent Bernat wrote:
> (...)
> It has already been said numerous time in the past, for some Javascript
> code, we don't really have the tools in Debian to easily go from the
> source to the minified version. It's possible, but without the
> appropriate tools, it's painful.
I've been using yui-com
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Dmitry Smirnov writes:
> On Monday 24 August 2015 13:54:21 Simon Josefsson wrote:
>> I believe the blog post below has relevance to Debian's stance on
>> including minified JavaScript in packages:
>>
>> https://zyan.scripts.mit.edu/blog/backdooring-js/
>
> Thank you for a nice argument against m
❦ 28 août 2015 12:03 +0200, Samuel Thibault :
> I wonder why mere gzip compression is not used. Don't all browsers
> support Accept-Compress: gzip?
Minification saves some additional bytes. About 10% (when gzipped).
--
If you tell the truth you don't have to remember anything.
Neil Williams, le Fri 28 Aug 2015 10:32:52 +0100, a écrit :
> On Fri, 28 Aug 2015 10:45:16 +0200
> Samuel Thibault wrote:
>
> > Vincent Bernat, le Fri 28 Aug 2015 10:06:17 +0200, a écrit :
> > > Maybe it can be trimmed a bit more, but that's still 239 unique
> > > dependencies.
> >
> > Note that
❦ 28 août 2015 10:32 +0100, Neil Williams :
> I still find it hard to believe that *so* much code is required to
> minify JS. The excuse that JS is "moving fast" is nonsense. The reality
> would appear to be that nobody actually *cares* about the mess, they
> just use it.
It's a feature. The JS
On Fri, 28 Aug 2015 10:45:16 +0200
Samuel Thibault wrote:
> Vincent Bernat, le Fri 28 Aug 2015 10:06:17 +0200, a écrit :
> > Maybe it can be trimmed a bit more, but that's still 239 unique
> > dependencies.
>
> Note that you don't have to make that 239 debian packages, you could
> as well just s
On Monday 24 August 2015 13:54:21 Simon Josefsson wrote:
> I believe the blog post below has relevance to Debian's stance on
> including minified JavaScript in packages:
>
> https://zyan.scripts.mit.edu/blog/backdooring-js/
Thank you for a nice argument against minification.
During packaging I a
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Vincent Bernat, le Fri 28 Aug 2015 10:48:28 +0200, a écrit :
> ❦ 28 août 2015 10:29 +0200, Samuel Thibault :
>
> >> What will happen is that maintainers will fallback to the second less
> >> horrible solution and cripple the package (by using an older version of
> >> the JS lib for example) to a
❦ 28 août 2015 10:29 +0200, Samuel Thibault :
>> What will happen is that maintainers will fallback to the second less
>> horrible solution and cripple the package (by using an older version of
>> the JS lib for example) to allow it to stay in main.
>
> Why would they want to stay in main?
[...
Vincent Bernat, le Fri 28 Aug 2015 10:06:17 +0200, a écrit :
> Maybe it can be trimmed a bit more, but that's still 239 unique
> dependencies.
Note that you don't have to make that 239 debian packages, you could as
well just ship them all in one package, as long as the whole code passes
NEW, i.e.
Vincent Bernat, le Fri 28 Aug 2015 07:42:42 +0200, a écrit :
> > Yes, that is a danger. I think putting those things in contrib should be a
> > good solution if rebuilding is such a big problem. Because if it is, the
> > code
> > really really doesn't belong in main.
>
> What will happen is tha
❦ 28 août 2015 08:22 +0100, Philip Hands :
>>> Or alternatively, by packaging the minifier that is being used with the
>>> package
>>> that needs it. Yes, that's a horrible idea with lots of code duplication,
>>> but
>>> if I understand the problem, every JS file must be minified with the exa
Vincent Bernat writes:
> 28 août 2015 01:46 GMT, Bas Wijnen :
>
>> Or alternatively, by packaging the minifier that is being used with the
>> package
>> that needs it. Yes, that's a horrible idea with lots of code duplication,
>> but
>> if I understand the problem, every JS file must be minif
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