Re: Request for suggestions of DFSG-free documentation licences

2007-06-08 Thread MJ Ray
Jordi Gutierrez Hermoso [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On 05/06/07, MJ Ray [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Small excerpts (e.g. an Emacs reference card from the Emacs info docs) are probably covered under Fair Use. [...] This is England calling. Would the FSF have to sue under US law or UK law an

Re: Request for suggestions of DFSG-free documentation licences

2007-06-08 Thread Ben Finney
MJ Ray [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Jordi Gutierrez Hermoso [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: What do you want to fix? The reasons for why free software needs free documentation or would you like to fix the suggestions on how to give funds to the FSF? You think you know better than the FSF what

Re: Request for suggestions of DFSG-free documentation licences

2007-06-07 Thread Jordi Gutierrez Hermoso
On 05/06/07, MJ Ray [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Small excerpts (e.g. an Emacs reference card from the Emacs info docs) are probably covered under Fair Use. [...] This is England calling. Would the FSF have to sue under US law or UK law an offender in the UK? I'm genuinely ignorant about this

Re: Request for suggestions of DFSG-free documentation licences

2007-06-07 Thread Michael Poole
Jordi Gutierrez Hermoso writes: On 05/06/07, MJ Ray [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Small excerpts (e.g. an Emacs reference card from the Emacs info docs) are probably covered under Fair Use. [...] This is England calling. Would the FSF have to sue under US law or UK law an offender in the UK?

Re: Request for suggestions of DFSG-free documentation licences

2007-06-07 Thread Anthony W. Youngman
In message [EMAIL PROTECTED], Jordi Gutierrez Hermoso [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes On 05/06/07, MJ Ray [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Small excerpts (e.g. an Emacs reference card from the Emacs info docs) are probably covered under Fair Use. [...] This is England calling. Would the FSF have to sue

Re: Request for suggestions of DFSG-free documentation licences

2007-06-05 Thread MJ Ray
Jordi Gutierrez Hermoso [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: [...] Kinda, but not really. It seems that Debian's objections against the GFDL are highly academic and unlikely to arise in practice. I mean, how many of those objections have actually worked against Wikipedia, the largest collection of

Re: Request for suggestions of DFSG-free documentation licences

2007-06-05 Thread Francesco Poli
On Tue, 5 Jun 2007 12:10:36 +0100 (BST) MJ Ray wrote: Jordi Gutierrez Hermoso [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: [...] [...] Not even RMS or the FSF calls the FDL a Free Software licence. Indeed: see the last sentence of http://lists.debian.org/debian-legal/2003/09/msg01221.html [...] FSF:

Re: Request for suggestions of DFSG-free documentation licences

2007-06-04 Thread Jordi Gutierrez Hermoso
On 03/06/07, Don Armstrong [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Sun, 03 Jun 2007, Jordi Gutierrez Hermoso wrote: Debian decided to make it a problem for itself and for its users. the maintainer (and the developers) recognized that users may need or want such documentation, even though it does not meet

Re: Request for suggestions of DFSG-free documentation licences

2007-06-04 Thread Don Armstrong
On Mon, 04 Jun 2007, Jordi Gutierrez Hermoso wrote: On 03/06/07, Don Armstrong [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: the maintainer (and the developers) recognized that users may need or want such documentation, even though it does not meet the DFSG, so the documentation was made available in non-free.

Re: Request for suggestions of DFSG-free documentation licences

2007-06-03 Thread Adam Borowski
On Sat, Jun 02, 2007 at 07:16:30PM -0500, Jordi Gutierrez Hermoso wrote: Kinda, but not really. It seems that Debian's objections against the GFDL are highly academic and unlikely to arise in practice. I mean, how many of those objections have actually worked against Wikipedia, the largest

Re: Request for suggestions of DFSG-free documentation licences

2007-06-03 Thread Jordi Gutierrez Hermoso
On 03/06/07, Adam Borowski [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Sat, Jun 02, 2007 at 07:16:30PM -0500, Jordi Gutierrez Hermoso wrote: Kinda, but not really. It seems that Debian's objections against the GFDL are highly academic and unlikely to arise in practice. I mean, how many of those objections

Re: Request for suggestions of DFSG-free documentation licences

2007-06-03 Thread Don Armstrong
On Sun, 03 Jun 2007, Jordi Gutierrez Hermoso wrote: I have yet to see a practical example of a situation that actually happened that justifies Debian's concerns against the GFDL. The practical example is the fact that we cannot make extracts of GFDLed documentation even for manpages without

Re: Request for suggestions of DFSG-free documentation licences

2007-06-03 Thread Jordi Gutierrez Hermoso
On 03/06/07, Don Armstrong [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Sun, 03 Jun 2007, Jordi Gutierrez Hermoso wrote: I have yet to see a practical example of a situation that actually happened that justifies Debian's concerns against the GFDL. The practical example is the fact that we cannot make extracts

Re: Request for suggestions of DFSG-free documentation licences

2007-06-03 Thread Don Armstrong
On Sun, 03 Jun 2007, Jordi Gutierrez Hermoso wrote: On 03/06/07, Don Armstrong [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Sun, 03 Jun 2007, Jordi Gutierrez Hermoso wrote: I have yet to see a practical example of a situation that actually happened that justifies Debian's concerns against the GFDL. The

Re: Request for suggestions of DFSG-free documentation licences

2007-06-02 Thread Jordi Gutierrez Hermoso
On 26/05/07, Ben Finney [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Jordi, please follow the code of conduct for the mailing lists URL:http://www.debian.org/MailingLists/#codeofconduct. Specifically, don't send a separate copy of list messages to me, as I haven't asked for that. Oops, sorry. I forget. Other

Re: Request for suggestions of DFSG-free documentation licences

2007-06-02 Thread Ben Finney
Jordi Gutierrez Hermoso [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: In practice, the GFDLed docs can be copied and modified as much as they need to be The DFSG requires that *any* modification be allowed to the work, and that the result be redistributable under the license. This is not the case for the FDL, and

Re: Request for suggestions of DFSG-free documentation licences

2007-05-28 Thread Adam Borowski
On Sun, May 27, 2007 at 10:15:06AM +1000, Ben Finney wrote: The document author, by placing only *some* parts of the work under the GPL, is essentially determining for the recipient what parts they will find useful to combine with other parts of the software. Prose descriptive parts could be

Re: Request for suggestions of DFSG-free documentation licences

2007-05-27 Thread Ben Finney
Ben Finney [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: The GPL also requires that any derivative work that one distributes must be licensed under the GPL terms. This is incompatible with taking part of a work under a different license and combining it with the GPL work to distribute. This is true only, of

Re: Request for suggestions of DFSG-free documentation licences

2007-05-26 Thread Jordi Gutierrez Hermoso
On 25/05/07, Ben Finney [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The lot of complex clauses ... that would be cumbersome and unnecessary is greatly outweighed by the huge simplification that comes from having *all* software in a package -- programs, documentation, data -- licensed the same way, as already

Re: Request for suggestions of DFSG-free documentation licences

2007-05-26 Thread Ben Finney
Jordi, please follow the code of conduct for the mailing lists URL:http://www.debian.org/MailingLists/#codeofconduct. Specifically, don't send a separate copy of list messages to me, as I haven't asked for that. Jordi Gutierrez Hermoso [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I keep hearing about how

Re: Request for suggestions of DFSG-free documentation licences

2007-05-25 Thread Shriramana Sharma
Thanks for all your feedback, but the GPL also has some clauses that are not applicable to documentation as pointed out at: http://www.gnu.org/licenses/gpl-faq.html#WhyNotGPLForManuals I thought of using the Boost license: http://boost.org/LICENSE_1_0.txt but it is not listed at:

Re: Request for suggestions of DFSG-free documentation licences

2007-05-25 Thread Ben Finney
Shriramana Sharma [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Thanks for all your feedback, but the GPL also has some clauses that are not applicable to documentation as pointed out at: http://www.gnu.org/licenses/gpl-faq.html#WhyNotGPLForManuals If you re-read that section, it mostly addresses the FSF's

Re: Request for suggestions of DFSG-free documentation licences

2007-05-24 Thread Marco d'Itri
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I remember reading that the GFDL is not DFSG-free (due to some clauses regarding invariant sections or something) so I would like to know what As long as you do not use these optional clauses it is free like any other DFSG license. OTOH, you should ask yourself what is

Re: Request for suggestions of DFSG-free documentation licences

2007-05-23 Thread MJ Ray
Shriramana Sharma [EMAIL PROTECTED] asked: I remember reading that the GFDL is not DFSG-free (due to some clauses regarding invariant sections or something) so I would like to know what is a DFSG-free license for documentation, since a project I am working on wants to license its

Request for suggestions of DFSG-free documentation licences

2007-05-22 Thread Shriramana Sharma
Hello list. I remember reading that the GFDL is not DFSG-free (due to some clauses regarding invariant sections or something) so I would like to know what is a DFSG-free license for documentation, since a project I am working on wants to license its documentation in a DFSG-free way. Thanks.

Re: Request for suggestions of DFSG-free documentation licences

2007-05-22 Thread Wesley J. Landaker
On Tuesday 22 May 2007 08:09:33 Ben Finney wrote: The consensus (not unanimous, but consensus nonetheless) of debian-legal is that the DFSG, regardless of which of its clauses are exercised, is non-free for any software, including documentation. (I assume you meant GFDL here instead of DFSG.)