Hi
It's not usual in me to give up on something when I'm completely certain
that I'm right. I hope you appreciate that I'm doing a great personal
sacrifice here.
Ean said:
"Discussion of these issues in the shadow of Lenny warps people's minds
and makes sane discourse impossible."
I've b
On Mon, 12 Jan 2009, Robert Millan wrote:
> > This is one of the reasons why the vote was flawed;
>
> Again, if the vote was flawed (I don't think it was, but if the Secretary
> considers it flawed), the right thing would be to cancel it.
The constitution doesn't explicitely allow a vote to be ca
On Sat, Dec 20, 2008 at 06:05:09PM +, Jurij Smakov wrote:
>
> Another point is that most people are probably going to be pretty busy
> with holiday stuff over the last couple of weeks (I'm leaving for a
> two-week vacation myself tomorrow), so we'll have to get back to
> implementation deta
On Mon, Jan 12, 2009 at 08:37:06AM +0100, Robert Millan wrote:
> On Sun, Jan 11, 2009 at 08:22:58AM +0100, Robert Millan wrote:
> >
> > You're the Secretary. You're supposed to give answers, not speculation. If
> > the ballot was ambigous, or confusing, it is YOUR responsibility.
>
> Bdale,
>
Robert Millan (12/01/2009):
> And I lost count on how many times I repeated that, but will do as
> long as necessary.
We don't need that kind of behaviour *again*.
Mraw,
KiBi.
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Robert Millan writes:
> On Mon, Jan 12, 2009 at 01:45:04PM -0800, Russ Allbery wrote:
>> The fact that more people preferred 2 to 4 in this vote does not change
>> the fact that the release team is currently empowered to interpret the
>> DFSG and SC in their own work. That's what the constitutio
On Mon, Jan 12, 2009 at 01:45:04PM -0800, Russ Allbery wrote:
>
> > As I said in a separate mail, the developers just discredited this line of
> > reasoning by ranking option 2 above option 4.
>
> I disagree completely.
>
> The fact that more people preferred 2 to 4 in this vote does not change
On Monday 12 January 2009, Robert Millan wrote:
> Nope. You only got that impression because the ones supporting this
> interpretation are the ones making the most noise.
Could you please count the number of your posts and compare that to the
number of posts from anybody else?
Could you also pl
Neil McGovern writes:
> On Sun, Jan 11, 2009 at 09:29:41AM -0800, Mike Bird wrote:
> > Sadly, embarrassingly, nobody else has yet matched Manoj's level
> > of careful analysis. Robert Milan has at times come close but the
> > non-existent cabal apparently hates him as much as they hated
> > Manoj
On Mon, Jan 12, 2009 at 04:12:57AM -0500, Daniel Dickinson wrote:
> As for trying to bully people about consitution and the social contract
> et al, I think you need to remember that the Debian Project is a
> concept not an incorporated (or otherwise formally recognized by any
> government as an or
On Mon, Jan 12, 2009 at 12:42:12AM -0800, Steve Langasek wrote:
> On Mon, Jan 12, 2009 at 08:37:06AM +0100, Robert Millan wrote:
> > I know you didn't explicitly request being appointed Secretary; it sort of
> > happened "by accident", but you had the opportunity to refuse all the time,
> > so I m
Robert Millan writes:
> On Sun, Jan 11, 2009 at 09:25:37AM -0800, Russ Allbery wrote:
>> I don't feel the urge to constantly repeat it, but since I'm sending
>> the mail anyway: the release team made a delegate decision. That
>> decision was not overridden. Hence, the release continues. All el
On Mon, Jan 12, 2009 at 10:30:02PM +0100, Pierre Habouzit wrote:
> On Mon, Jan 12, 2009 at 09:26:20PM +, Robert Millan wrote:
> > On Sun, Jan 11, 2009 at 05:17:33PM +, Stephen Gran wrote:
> > > This one time, at band camp, Steve McIntyre said:
> > > > If things go much further we'll end up
On Sun, Jan 11, 2009 at 06:42:12PM +0200, Kalle Kivimaa wrote:
> Ean Schuessler writes:
> > Ironically, Bdale *is* warping the results of the vote and applying
> > an editorial voice to the interpretation of the results.
>
> Umm, why shouldn't Bdale have his opinion about the results? Nowhere
> d
On Sun, Jan 11, 2009 at 10:00:02AM -0800, Russ Allbery wrote:
> [...] Robert's constitutional interpretation is not
> going to be adopted at present.
There's nothing to be "adopted". The project as a whole thinks of the Social
Contract as a binding document. Having a vocal minority disagree with
On Mon, Jan 12, 2009 at 09:26:20PM +, Robert Millan wrote:
> On Sun, Jan 11, 2009 at 05:17:33PM +, Stephen Gran wrote:
> > This one time, at band camp, Steve McIntyre said:
> > > If things go much further we'll end up with enough seconds to force a
> > > vote to "hand Robert Millan a nice c
On Sun, Jan 11, 2009 at 09:25:37AM -0800, Russ Allbery wrote:
> Ben Finney writes:
>
> > Though there seem to be a number of people vocally wishing Robert
> > would go away or the like, I have yet to see any substantive response
> > to the questions he's raised in this thread.
>
> I made a subst
On Sun, Jan 11, 2009 at 05:17:33PM +, Stephen Gran wrote:
> This one time, at band camp, Steve McIntyre said:
> > If things go much further we'll end up with enough seconds to force a
> > vote to "hand Robert Millan a nice cup of STFU". I'm hoping that's not
> > what anybody actually wants, but
On Sun, Jan 11, 2009 at 04:41:51PM +, Steve McIntyre wrote:
> Robert, I appreciate that you believe you're doing the right thing
> here, but attempting to continue this discussion right now, just after
> the first vote that has already delayed Lenny, is not going to help
> you or anybody.
I do
On Mon, Jan 12, 2009 at 08:52:13PM +, Matthew Johnson wrote:
> On Mon Jan 12 19:34, Robert Millan wrote:
> > On Mon, Jan 12, 2009 at 07:13:57PM +0100, Michael Goetze wrote:
> > > Robert Millan wrote:
> > > > - Even if there's a general perception that everyone agrees not
> > > > to delay Le
On Sun, 2009-01-11 at 10:44 -0700, Bdale Garbee wrote:
> That's why I think the main outcome of this ballot was an assertion of
> desire by the voters that we release Lenny.
Actually, I ranked #1 first, and yet, I have a desire that we release
Lenny. However, I don't want a bad release, I want a
On Sun, 2009-01-11 at 11:35 +0100, Joerg Jaspert wrote:
> >> > Do you have any other idea in mind?
> > Btw, Joerg, that goes for you too. If you have something constructive to
> > say,
> > this would be a good time.
>
> How about you going elsewhere until Lenny is released, then coming back
> as
On Sun, 2009-01-11 at 10:32 +0100, Joerg Jaspert wrote:
> > So, I think you made a mistake, a very serious one, and when asked about it,
> > your explanation is completely unsatisfactory. How do we solve this?
> > Currently, the only solution I see is that we ask the developers what they
> > think
On Mon Jan 12 19:34, Robert Millan wrote:
> On Mon, Jan 12, 2009 at 07:13:57PM +0100, Michael Goetze wrote:
> > Robert Millan wrote:
> > > - Even if there's a general perception that everyone agrees not
> > > to delay Lenny at all costs, this should definitely be voted on
> > > and sanctioned
* Kurt Roeckx (k...@roeckx.be) [090112 18:39]:
> And Steve organised the vote to add Russ (which got approved),
> and propose Don to the DPL.
>
> Andreas said that with 3 of the 5 votes for proposing Don the vote
> is over. But I think it's only 3 of 6 at that point, and the DPL
> still needs to
Robert Millan dijo [Sun, Jan 11, 2009 at 08:22:58AM +0100]:
> (...)
> You're the Secretary. You're supposed to give answers, not speculation. If
> the ballot was ambigous, or confusing, it is YOUR responsibility. The
> way results stand, they say we make an exception for firmware. They don't
>
On Mon, Jan 12, 2009 at 07:13:57PM +0100, Michael Goetze wrote:
> Robert Millan wrote:
> > - Even if there's a general perception that everyone agrees not to delay
> > Lenny at all costs, this should definitely be voted on and sanctioned.
> > Not doing so creates a very bad precedent.
>
Robert Millan wrote:
> - Even if there's a general perception that everyone agrees not to delay
> Lenny at all costs, this should definitely be voted on and sanctioned.
> Not doing so creates a very bad precedent.
You think everyone must be voted on? What exactly do you think these
passa
On Mon, Jan 12, 2009 at 06:50:02PM +0100, Kurt Roeckx wrote:
>On Sun, Jan 11, 2009 at 11:57:31AM -0700, Bdale Garbee wrote:
>>
>> It gives me great pleasure to welcome Russ Allbery and Don
>> Armstrong as the newest members of the Technical Committee.
>
>If I understand things right, you can add
On Mon, 2009-01-12 at 18:50 +0100, Kurt Roeckx wrote:
> If I understand things right, you can add new members until
> the number reaches 6 and can then proposed new members to the
> DPL.
Since my invitations to the new members were issued after unanimous
agreement by the existing members of the t
On Sun, Jan 11, 2009 at 11:57:31AM -0700, Bdale Garbee wrote:
> Anthony Towns recently announced his decision to step down from
> the Debian Technical Committee:
>
> http://lists.debian.org/debian-ctte/2009/01/msg6.html
>
> I thank him on behalf of the rest of the committee and the
> proj
On Sun, Jan 11, 2009 at 10:17:52AM -0600, Ean Schuessler wrote:
> - "Robert Millan" wrote:
> > The majority of developers voted to make an exception for firmware in
> > Lenny. They did NOT vote to empower the Release Team to make exceptions
> > as they see fit. Results of GR 2008/003 are cry
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On Sun, Jan 11, 2009 at 09:29:41AM -0800, Mike Bird wrote:
> On Sun January 11 2009 08:17:52 Ean Schuessler wrote:
> > Ironically, Bdale *is* warping the results of the vote and applying an
> > editorial voice to the interpretation of the results. I say "ironically"
> > because Bdale's actions go f
Robert,
I'm not a DD but I have been watching the lists and I think you are
flogging a dead horse, one that has been buried in fact. Choose your
battles and you'll have more good will when you make constructive
proposal and actions post-lenny.
As for trying to bully people about consitution and
On Mon, Jan 12, 2009 at 12:42:12AM -0800, Steve Langasek wrote:
> On Mon, Jan 12, 2009 at 08:37:06AM +0100, Robert Millan wrote:
> > I know you didn't explicitly request being appointed Secretary; it sort of
> > happened "by accident", but you had the opportunity to refuse all the time,
> > so I m
On Mon, Jan 12, 2009 at 08:37:06AM +0100, Robert Millan wrote:
> I know you didn't explicitly request being appointed Secretary; it sort of
> happened "by accident", but you had the opportunity to refuse all the time,
> so I must take it that you accept it, at least temporarily.
This is not true.
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