Re: The Sourceless software in the kernel source GR

2006-09-19 Thread Sven Luther
On Mon, Sep 18, 2006 at 10:27:12PM -0500, Manoj Srivastava wrote: Hi, Proponents of various various amendments to the GR should feel free to send me a couple of paragraphs in HTML markup to introduce/explain the resolutions they are proposing. Feel free to include external links

Re: The Sourceless software in the kernel source GR

2006-09-19 Thread Martin Schulze
On Mon, 18 Sep 2006 18:46:50 -0700, Don Armstrong [EMAIL PROTECTED] said: But just like the groundwork and foundation of a structure, the non-actionable content of a resolutions can contain information on how the actionable content is to be interpreted. As such, it is part of the

Re: Proposal: Source code is important for all works in Debian, and required for programmatic ones

2006-09-19 Thread Thomas Bushnell BSG
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 I second this proposal. Don Armstrong [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Because there appears to be some residual confusion[1][2][3] about what I actually proposed and its content, here is the proposal as it currently stands. The proposal is only the

Re: Proposal: Source code is important for all works in Debian, and required for programmatic ones

2006-09-19 Thread Alexander Wirt
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Don Armstrong schrieb am Montag, den 18. September 2006: I also second this clarified proposal. == BEGIN PROPOSAL = The Free Software movement is about enabling users to modify the works that they

Re: The Sourceless software in the kernel source GR

2006-09-19 Thread Don Armstrong
On Tue, 19 Sep 2006, Martin Schulze wrote: On Mon, 18 Sep 2006 18:46:50 -0700, Don Armstrong [EMAIL PROTECTED] said: But just like the groundwork and foundation of a structure, the non-actionable content of a resolutions can contain information on how the actionable content is to be

Re: The Sourceless software in the kernel source GR

2006-09-19 Thread Frank Küster
Martin Schulze [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Mon, 18 Sep 2006 18:46:50 -0700, Don Armstrong [EMAIL PROTECTED] said: But just like the groundwork and foundation of a structure, the non-actionable content of a resolutions can contain information on how the actionable content is to be

Re: Proposal: Source code is important for all works in Debian, and required for programmatic ones

2006-09-19 Thread René van Bevern
I second this proposal. == BEGIN PROPOSAL = The Free Software movement is about enabling users to modify the works that they use on their computer; about giving users the same information that copyright holders and upstream developers have. As

Re: The Sourceless software in the kernel source GR

2006-09-19 Thread Andreas Barth
* Debian Project Secretaru ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) [060918 20:56]: From: Frederik Schueler [EMAIL PROTECTED] Message-ID: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Wed, 30 Aug 2006 23:06:54 +0200 Good signature from EA7ED2A341954920 Frederik Schüler [EMAIL PROTECTED] , | 1. We affirm that our Priorities

Re: Proposal: Source code is important for all works in Debian, and required for programmatic ones

2006-09-19 Thread Marc 'HE' Brockschmidt
Hi, I second this proposal: Don Armstrong [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: == BEGIN PROPOSAL = The Free Software movement is about enabling users to modify the works that they use on their computer; about giving users the same information that copyright

Re: The Sourceless software in the kernel source GR

2006-09-19 Thread Manoj Srivastava
On Tue, 19 Sep 2006 08:40:08 +0200, Sven Luther [EMAIL PROTECTED] said: On Mon, Sep 18, 2006 at 10:27:12PM -0500, Manoj Srivastava wrote: Hi, Proponents of various various amendments to the GR should feel free to send me a couple of paragraphs in HTML markup to introduce/explain the

Filibustering general resolutions

2006-09-19 Thread Manoj Srivastava
Hi, Due to a loop hole in the constitution, any group of 6 Debian developers can delay any general resolution indefinitely by putting up their own amendment, and every 6 days, making substantiative changes in their amendment (they can just rotate between a small number of very

Re: Filibustering general resolutions

2006-09-19 Thread Thijs Kinkhorst
On Tue, 2006-09-19 at 10:09 -0500, Manoj Srivastava wrote: The project should decide how it wants to handle filibustering, if it feels like doing anything about it, of course. But now, any GR has a veto contingent of only 6 developers. How about we see how to solve that when it

Re: Proposal: Source code is important for all works in Debian, and required for programmatic ones

2006-09-19 Thread Sven Luther
On Mon, Sep 18, 2006 at 10:07:18PM -0700, Don Armstrong wrote: Because there appears to be some residual confusion[1][2][3] about what I actually proposed and its content, here is the proposal as it currently stands. The proposal is only the content between BEGIN PROPOSAL and END PROPOSAL. I

Re: Filibustering general resolutions

2006-09-19 Thread Andreas Barth
Hi, * Manoj Srivastava ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) [060919 17:57]: Due to a loop hole in the constitution, any group of 6 Debian developers can delay any general resolution indefinitely by putting up their own amendment, and every 6 days, making substantiative changes in their amendment

Re: Proposal: Source code is important for all works in Debian, and required for programmatic ones

2006-09-19 Thread Kurt Roeckx
On Mon, Sep 18, 2006 at 10:07:18PM -0700, Don Armstrong wrote: D. Requests that vendors of hardware, even those whose firmware is not loaded by the operating system, provide the prefered form for modification so that purchasers of their hardware can exercise their freedom to

Re: Proposal: Source code is important for all works in Debian, and required for programmatic ones

2006-09-19 Thread Kari Pahula
Seconded. On Mon, Sep 18, 2006 at 10:07:18PM -0700, Don Armstrong wrote: == BEGIN PROPOSAL = The Free Software movement is about enabling users to modify the works that they use on their computer; about giving users the same information that

Re: Filibustering general resolutions

2006-09-19 Thread Florian Weimer
* Andreas Barth: perhaps we should, independend of current GRs, consider how to change the GR procedure so that it doesn't happen to be as painful as it is now. Perhaps pain is highly subjective in this case. I guess it's less bizarre if you've been exposed to Robert's Rules of Order. (But

Re: Filibustering general resolutions

2006-09-19 Thread Don Armstrong
On Tue, 19 Sep 2006, Thijs Kinkhorst wrote: On Tue, 2006-09-19 at 10:09 -0500, Manoj Srivastava wrote: The project should decide how it wants to handle filibustering, if it feels like doing anything about it, of course. But now, any GR has a veto contingent of only 6 developers.

Re: Proposal: Source code is important for all works in Debian, and required for programmatic ones

2006-09-19 Thread Don Armstrong
On Tue, 19 Sep 2006, Sven Luther wrote: On Mon, Sep 18, 2006 at 10:07:18PM -0700, Don Armstrong wrote: C. Reaffirms its continued support of users whose hardware (or software) requires works which are not freely licensed or whose source is not available by making such works

Re: The Sourceless software in the kernel source GR

2006-09-19 Thread Russ Allbery
Manoj Srivastava [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Since it has been decreed that the secretary has no discretion in putting up properly proposed and seconded text, this request is now moot. We do have an issue now with people seconding extraneous text, including signatures and

Re: Filibustering general resolutions

2006-09-19 Thread Pascal Hakim
On Tue, Sep 19, 2006 at 10:09:04AM -0500, Manoj Srivastava wrote: Hi, Due to a loop hole in the constitution, any group of 6 Debian developers can delay any general resolution indefinitely by putting up their own amendment, and every 6 days, making substantiative changes in their

Re: The Sourceless software in the kernel source GR

2006-09-19 Thread Branden Robinson
On Tue, Sep 19, 2006 at 09:54:17AM +0200, Frank Küster wrote: Umh, then I need to ask why the resolution is not clear enough so that it does not need the preamble to know in which way the author has intended its interpretation? As Manoj pointed out already, courts look at the resolution

Re: Filibustering general resolutions

2006-09-19 Thread Manoj Srivastava
On Wed, 20 Sep 2006 10:15:14 +1000, Pascal Hakim [EMAIL PROTECTED] said: On Tue, Sep 19, 2006 at 10:09:04AM -0500, Manoj Srivastava wrote: Hi, Due to a loop hole in the constitution, any group of 6 Debian developers can delay any general resolution indefinitely by putting up their own