Bug#862980: update homepage
Hi, sorry for not responding, real life got to me after four weeks of holiday and DebConf. I spend some additional hours searching for old bugs and suggestions on the frontpage and also on the debian-about page [1]. On 21/08/17 17:13, Paul Wise wrote: > On Mon, Aug 21, 2017 at 4:10 AM, Laura Arjona Reina wrote: > >> I like your proposal. > Likewise, however a couple of things Clara and I forgot when preparing > it are the social contract, the constitution and the code of conduct, > I wonder if we should mention them in the introduction somehow? > > https://www.debian.org/code_of_conduct > https://www.debian.org/social_contract > https://www.debian.org/devel/constitution So i think there should be a couple of sentences that are catchy and encourage to read more about debian and give a generall information. Like a mix of the abstract of a paper (from science) and an elevator pitch (from marketing). > >> The part of the kernel I would change it a bit, >> because we have ports based on other kernels too. > In practice these aren't widely used though. > >> Debian is ported to many devices with different computer architectures, >> using the https://www.kernel.org/";>Linux kernel or others > I think this might be too technical and that it would be very hard to > convey to non-technical people exactly what a Debian "port" is. > Perhaps this would work though: yes port is defenitly to technical, type is good. > > Debian can be used on many types of devices and > is based on the Linux kernel, other kernels and over > other packages of > software bundled up in a nice format for easy installation on your > machine. > > I thought about choosing "computers" to de-emphasise things like > tablets/smartphones/watches, which we cannot yet support in any sane > way. OTOH "devices" would be future-proof if the situations around > those or other devices like cars/tractors/fridges/etc change for the > better. > > I think the phrase "packages of" makes the sentence more > understandable since it relates the word "packages" to the real-world > non-software use of that word. > > In case we don't want to mention other kernels, we could replace "the > Linux kernel, other kernels" with just "Linux" as many people who have > heard of "Linux" will not know what a kernel is or that Linux is a > kernel. package is good and it is important to introduce the word device i like better than computer, because it still is useable in the future and good to understand i think the idea with Linux and other kernels is good - 1) nowbody will be angry, that the other kernels are not mentioned, 2) people who know what linux is, and are not further interested will just read over the phrase kernel, 3) people who know what Linux is and are interested can read about "what is a kernel", "which other kernels are supported", 4) and finally people who don't know what linux is, can find out via the link > >> Notes: >> (1) I'm not sure if it's good to link to the www.d.o/ports page in the >> word "ported" or not, because that link appears later in the page, in >> the "Getting Started" section. > It should be fine to link words in the intro to links that appear > later, for folks who like to click while reading. The list of links is > useful to those who prefer an organised list. > > I also think the ports section is very technical and the text needs > some rewriting but maybe it is OK to link to it now and improve it > later. I would also link more than less about the technical, some page need work in this part, but i would link them now and then go from page to page with changing ;-) > >> (2) While in the beginning of Linux distributions Debian really made a >> difference because of the easiness of installing packages (hence the >> mention "software bundled up in a nice format for easy installation on >> your machine"), I think nowadays everybody takes that for granted (both >> in Linux distributions and in other operating systems, look at the app >> stores in mobile OS for example). Maybe it's time to change that >> sentence for another "killer"-feature(s) that we provide, related to >> packages? I'm thinking for example in that we provide source packages >> for... the whole archive? (I'm not sure), or that a major part of our >> archive builds reproducibly. Difficult to shrink those in a sentence, >> but I'd like to know opinions about this, and if we decide that's the >> way to go, later we can try to find the correct wording. > Source packages and reproducible builds are fairly common now though, > at least in the FLOSS world. > > Mentioning killer features is also not future proof, we would need to > update it often as Debian takes on new projects and ideas. > I don't know if "Linux" itself has still the widely spread preconception to be complecated. A lot of my colleges still think that Linux in generall is only for "computer professional". I like about the centence, that it explains that the packages are the smal parts which in total mak
Bug#862980: update homepage
On Mon, Aug 21, 2017 at 4:10 AM, Laura Arjona Reina wrote: > I like your proposal. Likewise, however a couple of things Clara and I forgot when preparing it are the social contract, the constitution and the code of conduct, I wonder if we should mention them in the introduction somehow? https://www.debian.org/code_of_conduct https://www.debian.org/social_contract https://www.debian.org/devel/constitution > The part of the kernel I would change it a bit, > because we have ports based on other kernels too. In practice these aren't widely used though. > Debian is ported to many devices with different computer architectures, > using the https://www.kernel.org/";>Linux kernel or others I think this might be too technical and that it would be very hard to convey to non-technical people exactly what a Debian "port" is. Perhaps this would work though: Debian can be used on many types of devices and is based on the Linux kernel, other kernels and over other packages of software bundled up in a nice format for easy installation on your machine. I thought about choosing "computers" to de-emphasise things like tablets/smartphones/watches, which we cannot yet support in any sane way. OTOH "devices" would be future-proof if the situations around those or other devices like cars/tractors/fridges/etc change for the better. I think the phrase "packages of" makes the sentence more understandable since it relates the word "packages" to the real-world non-software use of that word. In case we don't want to mention other kernels, we could replace "the Linux kernel, other kernels" with just "Linux" as many people who have heard of "Linux" will not know what a kernel is or that Linux is a kernel. > Notes: > (1) I'm not sure if it's good to link to the www.d.o/ports page in the > word "ported" or not, because that link appears later in the page, in > the "Getting Started" section. It should be fine to link words in the intro to links that appear later, for folks who like to click while reading. The list of links is useful to those who prefer an organised list. I also think the ports section is very technical and the text needs some rewriting but maybe it is OK to link to it now and improve it later. > (2) While in the beginning of Linux distributions Debian really made a > difference because of the easiness of installing packages (hence the > mention "software bundled up in a nice format for easy installation on > your machine"), I think nowadays everybody takes that for granted (both > in Linux distributions and in other operating systems, look at the app > stores in mobile OS for example). Maybe it's time to change that > sentence for another "killer"-feature(s) that we provide, related to > packages? I'm thinking for example in that we provide source packages > for... the whole archive? (I'm not sure), or that a major part of our > archive builds reproducibly. Difficult to shrink those in a sentence, > but I'd like to know opinions about this, and if we decide that's the > way to go, later we can try to find the correct wording. Source packages and reproducible builds are fairly common now though, at least in the FLOSS world. Mentioning killer features is also not future proof, we would need to update it often as Debian takes on new projects and ideas. -- bye, pabs https://wiki.debian.org/PaulWise
Bug#862980: update homepage
Hello Clara Thanks for working on this! I like your proposal. The part of the kernel I would change it a bit, because we have ports based on other kernels too. This is my proposal, based on yours: --- https://www.debian.org/";>Debian is a free https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operating_system";>operating system for computers, provided and maintained by a diverse community of https://contributors.debian.org/";>volunteers, the Debian Project. Debian is ported to many devices with different computer architectures, using the https://www.kernel.org/";>Linux kernel or others, and provides over packages: software bundled up in a nice format for easy installation on your machine. If you want to know more, check the links below and the About Debian page. --- Notes: (1) I'm not sure if it's good to link to the www.d.o/ports page in the word "ported" or not, because that link appears later in the page, in the "Getting Started" section. (2) While in the beginning of Linux distributions Debian really made a difference because of the easiness of installing packages (hence the mention "software bundled up in a nice format for easy installation on your machine"), I think nowadays everybody takes that for granted (both in Linux distributions and in other operating systems, look at the app stores in mobile OS for example). Maybe it's time to change that sentence for another "killer"-feature(s) that we provide, related to packages? I'm thinking for example in that we provide source packages for... the whole archive? (I'm not sure), or that a major part of our archive builds reproducibly. Difficult to shrink those in a sentence, but I'd like to know opinions about this, and if we decide that's the way to go, later we can try to find the correct wording. Best regards -- Laura Arjona Reina https://wiki.debian.org/LauraArjona El 12/08/17 a las 20:18, ClaraTrT escribió: > Hi, > I want to help to make the Debian website and wiki more welcoming and > started with a suggestion for the frontpage. > I read the links of the bugreport and wrote the suggestion below. > I think the frontpage should be nice facts in easy sentences (as it > already was) but add the mentioning of Linux (as many people will know > what it is but might not link it to Debian), mention the Debian Project > as a community and add a link to the diversity statement to show > newcomers and interested people that this is important for the community > to include everyone and last but not least make the links below more > visible because i didn't relly see them for quite some time (just after > looking up the Debian help page for like the hundriethed time I found > this nice link). > > In https://lists.debian.org/debian-devel/2017/05/msg00134.html it is > mentioned to sell debian more, this i would put into the Debian about > page. So that the text on the frontpage stays nice and compact as it is > and if you want to know more about "what is debian", "how to get > debian", "how to get involved" and so on, you will find more information > in the links. > > looking forward to comments on this suggestion > Cheers > Clara > > > https://www.debian.org/";>Debian; is a > free > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operating_system";>operating > system for computers, > provided and maintained by a diverse > community of https://contributors.debian.org/";>volunteers;, > The Debian Project. > Debian is based on the https://www.kernel.org/";>Linux > kernel and > provides over packages, > which is software bundled up in a nice format for easy installation on > your machine. > > > If you want to know more, check the links below and the href="intro/about">About Debian page. >
Bug#862980: update homepage
Hi, I want to help to make the Debian website and wiki more welcoming and started with a suggestion for the frontpage. I read the links of the bugreport and wrote the suggestion below. I think the frontpage should be nice facts in easy sentences (as it already was) but add the mentioning of Linux (as many people will know what it is but might not link it to Debian), mention the Debian Project as a community and add a link to the diversity statement to show newcomers and interested people that this is important for the community to include everyone and last but not least make the links below more visible because i didn't relly see them for quite some time (just after looking up the Debian help page for like the hundriethed time I found this nice link). In https://lists.debian.org/debian-devel/2017/05/msg00134.html it is mentioned to sell debian more, this i would put into the Debian about page. So that the text on the frontpage stays nice and compact as it is and if you want to know more about "what is debian", "how to get debian", "how to get involved" and so on, you will find more information in the links. looking forward to comments on this suggestion Cheers Clara https://www.debian.org/";>Debian is a free https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operating_system";>operating system for computers, provided and maintained by a diverse community of https://contributors.debian.org/";>volunteers, The Debian Project. Debian is based on the https://www.kernel.org/";>Linux kernel and provides over packages, which is software bundled up in a nice format for easy installation on your machine. If you want to know more, check the links below and the About Debian page.
